BajaNomad

They're at it again, they want to commercialize the Dorado!

flyfishinPam - 5-19-2011 at 07:56 AM

This is very Baja related because if the protected status of the Dorado changes, all citizens in Baja California Sur will be severely affected.

I am only one person in BCS who has been working for the last week and a half to prepare representatives from my area to go to Lazaro Card##as, Michoacan for the upcoming convocotoria that will discuss the iniciative to legalize the dorado commercial fishery. There are many more like me around the state who worked around the clock to recruit and prepare our local reps for this trip.

I request that those of you who love Baja and love Mexico and that understand that the future we have for tourism, keep these good men and women in their thoughts. The big meeting starts tomorrow at 9am.

A little background: these meetings have been taking place mostly last year in BCS, BC, SON, SIN then they just stopped abruptly, and we assumed that the diputados actually gave thought to the fact that to obliterate the dorado fishery would severely hurt tourism and the entire economy of the nation. At the meetings on the mainland, only a handful of tourism reps were present, while the commercial interests bussed in people from all over the country who proceeded to intimidate, boo and heckle speakers in the tourism industry that were presenting their case. Lazaro Card##as is the largest shipping port on the west coast of Mexico. We find it very unfair (I find it angering) that these venues are taking place in cities such as Lazaro Card##as because this law affects negatively the tourism sectors not the commercial or industrial sectors.

I will translate the iniciative, it is one sided, based in horrible pseudoscience and promises the earth, they even state that to commercialize the dorado will save the Mexican economy. It is that rediculous. It is also an insult on all of our intelligence that our diputados would even consider a document such as this, it does not reflect on them very well at all.

Lazaro Card##as is not an easy place to get to, flights on puddle jumpers are costly. What our team from BCS is doing right now is flying from La Paz to Guadalajara where they will rent a vehicle and drive the 540km to Lazaro Card##as and check into their hotel. Tomorrow is the big day. Please send positive energy their way so that they not only give great presentations but also return home safely. My husband is one of the reps so I won't sleep until he returns.

After the event I will post the translated iniciative, and the ponencia (presentations) on behalf of Loreto and some of the other places like Cabo, San Jose, La Paz, San Carlos, Mazatlan, PV, ZIH, etc..

I have to thank the new government of BCS for funding the trips for these reps. All expressed the desire to go but the lack of funds to do so. Although it was like pulling teeth as they were very reluctant to release the funds up to the last minute, Minerva from Cabo San Lucas was able to pull it off, she deserves a medal of honour.

[Edited on 5-19-2011 by flyfishinPam]

mulegemichael - 5-19-2011 at 08:32 AM

thanks for all you do for this fishery, pam...we ALL appreciate it!

Russ - 5-19-2011 at 08:50 AM

I'm always thinking of your efforts and those of your compradres that fight the fight. We've had a couple of commercial boats at the deep water drop off outside our islands the last week or two fishing at night. I can't say for fact they're targeting dorado but that's my guess. Once the schools show up in any numbers I suspect we'll see more boats. I hope your efforts are golden and there is money for the enforcement agencies to make a difference!

Cypress - 5-19-2011 at 09:16 AM

flyfishinPam, Good luck. Thanks for your efforts in support of the sportsfishing industry. The clock is running out on the diminishing fish stocks the Sea of Cortez.

htnfool - 5-19-2011 at 11:25 AM

Pam,

From the bottom of my empty fish box

Thank you

Hook - 5-19-2011 at 11:30 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Russ
"........and there is money for the enforcement agencies to make a difference!


There is ALREADY money for the enforcement agencies. It comes from the fishing industry for them to look the other way. :lol:

Of course, I understand your point, Russ.

The cynical side of me wonders if it will be any different if the commercial ban is actually rescinded. They already fish for them with impunity. Were there any reported boardings and confiscations of dorado last year, at all? I cant recall any.

Still, one must fight the good fight..........


Imagine there's no longlines.
It's easy if you try.
No purse seiners or spotter planes,
above us only sky.

Imagine all do-rad-o-o-oh
caught on rod and reel.

Ah-haaa-aah-aah-ahh.

Imagine there's no trawlers,
wrecking ha-bi-tat,
nothing but pangas and sporties,
and the occasional 'yak.

Imagine all do-rad-o-o-oh
livin' to reee-pro-duce.

You-hooo-oo--oo-oo,

You may saaaaay, that we are dreamers,
giving dodos a fighting chance.
We hope some day we will all see,
dorado in-iiiiiiiii-in abundance.


OK, so I'm NOT the walrus.................help me out here, Osprey.

Skipjack Joe - 5-19-2011 at 11:50 AM

I, too, applaud what you're doing, Pam.

It seems to me that this issue can be solved numerically and convincingly.

One side claims that dorado revenue is greater from the sale of it's flesh and the other from the dollars that tourism brings in.

Since the price of dorado and the amount being harvested is known you should be able to come up with a number. The amount of money spent by fishing tourists can also be quantified. Just compare the two values instead of making gradiose statements and exaggerations. Numbers don't lie. They can't ignore you if you have the numbers.

Maybe I'm missing something.

Cypress - 5-19-2011 at 12:37 PM

The commercial guys will under-report their catch if possible, in order to pay lower taxes and competition will be discouraged. On the east coast of the US they're imposing a "catch share" program, sort of a quota, based an average of previous years total catch. When the boat catches it's limit, they're done for the season.

flyfishinPam - 5-19-2011 at 01:08 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Skipjack Joe
I, too, applaud what you're doing, Pam.

It seems to me that this issue can be solved numerically and convincingly.

One side claims that dorado revenue is greater from the sale of it's flesh and the other from the dollars that tourism brings in.

Since the price of dorado and the amount being harvested is known you should be able to come up with a number. The amount of money spent by fishing tourists can also be quantified. Just compare the two values instead of making gradiose statements and exaggerations. Numbers don't lie. They can't ignore you if you have the numbers.

Maybe I'm missing something.


what you are missing is that this has been done before yet to no avail. how many times do we say the same things for them to finally get it? our folks from BCS are pointing out the illegality of the iniciative and the really really bad "science" it is based in. Loreto's talk will be delivered by a captain (my husband) who originates from la costa chica and has the southern Mexico accent to boot. his words will hopefully speak beyond the diputados and dignitaries and be directed to those paid off hecklers, pointing out their lost opportunities that have been and yet again are being taken away by these greedy criminals called lawmakers and unelected functionaries, what else can we do? the other talks from other areas may garner outrage and bad blood unfortunately, this was not my intent when I wrote the presentation. and I had to beg and plead with conapesca yesterday to allow Loreto the chance to give even this 5 minute speech, after we were promised two speeches by them and that I had submitted. our guys are still traveling, coming from a very long way, yet we are given such a small opportunity to plead our case. our government really is stuck on stupid for sure.

LaloinBaja - 5-19-2011 at 03:10 PM

To miss that strike from the dorado and the tail flipping fight...We can't lose this aspect of the sportfisherie in Baja....anything I can do...Let me know...Lalo...

Osprey - 5-19-2011 at 03:34 PM

Pam, did you try to get Wildcoast and Seawatch reps to attend, to lend support, $ and otherwise? They were so very active in La Paz with the pistolero ban we would all hope they could help you and others on this even more worthy effort.

flyfishinPam - 5-19-2011 at 03:44 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Osprey
Pam, did you try to get Wildcoast and Seawatch reps to attend, to lend support, $ and otherwise? They were so very active in La Paz with the pistolero ban we would all hope they could help you and others on this even more worthy effort.


honestly osprey, I tried they are unfortunately full of hot air all talk no real action

Pescador - 5-19-2011 at 03:45 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Hook
Quote:
Originally posted by Russ
"........and there is money for the enforcement agencies to make a difference!


There is ALREADY money for the enforcement agencies. It comes from the fishing industry for them to look the other way. :lol:

Of course, I understand your point, Russ.

The cynical side of me wonders if it will be any different if the commercial ban is actually rescinded. They already fish for them with impunity. Were there any reported boardings and confiscations of dorado last year, at all? I cant recall any.

Still, one must fight the good fight..........


Imagine there's no longlines.
It's easy if you try.
No purse seiners or spotter planes,
above us only sky.

Imagine all do-rad-o-o-oh
caught on rod and reel.

Ah-haaa-aah-aah-ahh.

Imagine there's no trawlers,
wrecking ha-bi-tat,
nothing but pangas and sporties,
and the occasional 'yak.

Imagine all do-rad-o-o-oh
livin' to reee-pro-duce.

You-hooo-oo--oo-oo,

You may saaaaay, that we are dreamers,
giving dodos a fighting chance.
We hope some day we will all see,
dorado in-iiiiiiiii-in abundance.


OK, so I'm NOT the walrus.................help me out here, Osprey.


Unlike the US, the game wardens in boats are not likely in the immediate future nor would they be very effective in enforcing laws that would be violated by their friends and family anyway. But, one thing is for certain, at least in our area, and that is the wholesale fish buyers will not touch a Dorado for love or money and several pangueros who have caught Dorado were confiscated when an overlimit was found.

The problem in San Carlos and Guaymas was that they had a ready buyer for the illegally caught fish.

flyfishinPam - 5-19-2011 at 04:12 PM

then Loretanos need to steer clear of this pescaderia in the future:
it is across the street from the prepatoria called sebape on the glorietta (traffic circle) off the segundo cali and the futbol field
this photo was taken summer 2009





if I see anything this blatant at any other one I will also post that image. Same goes for restaurants, I'll photo their menus and post. I don't think any of them can afford to lose business now. b-stards

shari - 5-19-2011 at 04:54 PM

Oh Pam...so sorry you guys have to do this all over again...it is so disheartening and draining. Thank you from the bottom of my heart for fighting the good fight and putting so much energy into this issue...you must be proud of your esposo...any chance of video taping the presentation so we can all see it?

Russ - 5-19-2011 at 05:11 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by flyfishinPam
Quote:
Originally posted by Osprey
Pam, did you try to get Wildcoast and Seawatch reps to attend, to lend support, $ and otherwise? They were so very active in La Paz with the pistolero ban we would all hope they could help you and others on this even more worthy effort.


honestly osprey, I tried they are unfortunately full of hot air all talk no real action


That's too bad! I will no longer support their program.:(

Hook - 5-19-2011 at 05:17 PM

Osprey, I am confused. I thought a pistolero was a gunman. What would Seawatch or Wild Coast have to do with that?

Or, is pistolero slang for something else?

Russ - 5-19-2011 at 05:54 PM

Spear gun

Secretario

GordoyFeo - 5-19-2011 at 06:02 PM

toma notas. No quieron que nuestros gente pescan nuestros peces.
Solos ellos de Baja tienen derechos a nuestros dorados.

Good luck but Mexico doesn't give a hoot about Baja, never has never will, jmho of course.

http://seawatch.org/en/Resource-Library/75/pistoleros-are-ki...

woody with a view - 5-19-2011 at 06:06 PM

every organization can't please everyone who comes along.

that said, GIVE THEM HELL PAM! we will be sending good thoughts......

flyfishinPam - 5-19-2011 at 06:27 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by GordoyFeo
toma notas. No quieron que nuestros gente pescan nuestros peces.
Solos ellos de Baja tienen derechos a nuestros dorados.

Good luck but Mexico doesn't give a hoot about Baja, never has never will, jmho of course.

http://seawatch.org/en/Resource-Library/75/pistoleros-are-ki...


toma notas, chinga sus madres nuestros "lideres" estan usando los marginalizados para coninuar su traicion, la peninsula magnifico es casi lo unico esperanza que tiene la gente de esta pais, puede ser un ejemplo para todos, estos P-nches ladrones que chupan de la teta del dinero de contribuyente, el petrolio y de narco estan quitando todo los oportunidades que la gente nunca van a realizar, son corruptos pueden quemar en el inferno y voy a miar sobre sus tombas y tiro pedos en su direccion en general

Russ - 5-19-2011 at 06:46 PM

:spingrin:

Ken Bondy - 5-19-2011 at 07:34 PM

Saludos Pam. Buena suerte.

TheColoradoDude - 5-19-2011 at 07:58 PM

Hello,

I encourage you to get in touch with Vince Radice. He lives in San Carlos in the Mexican state of Sonora. He is a strong activist against the commercialization of Dorado. He has some very valuable information. Here is a link with a video about his work.

http://forum.sancarlosmexico.com/forum2/9587.html

Paula - 5-19-2011 at 09:08 PM

We'll be thinking about Francisco tomorrow, sending good thoughts--
Paula and Don

GordoyFeo - 5-20-2011 at 02:27 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by flyfishinPam
tiro pedos en su direccion en general

:lol: Suete al Cuervo!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FWBUl7oT9sA

flyfishinPam - 5-20-2011 at 01:28 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by GordoyFeo
Quote:
Originally posted by flyfishinPam
tiro pedos en su direccion en general

:lol: Suete al Cuervo!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FWBUl7oT9sA


YOU got it! I am a Monty Python fan from way back and proudly know most of the words to Quest for the Holy Grail.

Thanks for the kindness and the thoughts, they may still be in the meeting and I'll find out how they did not from my husband but from Minerva.

Also Vince and I have known each other since he put out his dorado film in august 2009. When I responded to it, he immediately phoned me, never expected that. His Thassala France TV3 film was dubbed into Spanish and shown at this meeting, would like to have been a fly on the wall and seen the faces on Ramon Corral and the dips and sens when they saw Mr. Botello take the bait the French dudes fed him, maaan that was good! Vince didn't go for the same reason that I didn't go, we are gringos with bad Spanish accents and they would have thrown rotten coconuts at our faces if we got up there and made any presentation. That wasn't the venue for us in particular. We did meet and dine with a real live diputado from Veracruz in Cabo when this forum took place there, we also both presented and he filmed all of it. Dunno what he did with the film. By the way Robin Wade who authors for WON has really been a good ear to listen to me and gather information about these goings on, she wants to put out the word too. Vince and I are working on something that we'll announce soon, that everyone with an interest in fishing in English or Spanish will check into daily. comin' soon gotta run, thanks all!

for all of you who want to adhere to the law and want some laffs, here's Monty Python's "Fish License"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pnq96W9jtuw

Cypress - 5-20-2011 at 02:01 PM

Courage! Hang tuff! Dig in and swing away.:D

SOUNDS LIKE SPORTFISHING JUST WON!!!!!

flyfishinPam - 5-20-2011 at 04:55 PM

(in my e-mail a few minutes ago!)

Hola Vince and Pam:

I just spoke with the team from BCS and Enrique said it went great! The FORO was 2 to 1 in favor of Sport fishing and 1/3 in favor of the INICIATIVA.
Enrique said they did so well that the Diputado Leon Perrea who is seeking to commercialize the Dorado actually said, "well sport fishing won this round"
They are happy and on their way to Guadalajara and will talk more when they arrive tomorrow. Enrique also mentioned that Jesus Valdez did a very nice ponencia too!

Okay more to follow tomorrow,

Minerva

shari - 5-20-2011 at 05:13 PM

oh that is just fantastic Pam...worth a celebratory c-cktail!!! way to go everyone...the prayers helped!!!! Let's hope to win the next rounds or knock em out!!!

Cypress - 5-20-2011 at 05:29 PM

The sports fishing won this one? No, this win was for the Dorado and all the panga fishermen that fish the Sea of Cortez. :bounce:

Skipjack Joe - 5-20-2011 at 05:39 PM

From the video I got the impression that sportfishing had won long ago. The commercial guys just aren't paying any attention to it.

flyfishinPam - 5-21-2011 at 08:45 AM

Video? what video? the "fish license" video? well if you liked that you'll LOVE this one

Monty Python: Confuse a Cat
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B2Je1CEPkUM

flyfishinPam - 5-21-2011 at 09:05 AM

"Foozle a Funcionario"
"Sedate a Senador"
"Embriol an Inginero"
"Muddle a middleman"
"Puzzle a Politico"
etc.

jeezus I think it may work!

Pescador - 5-22-2011 at 01:52 PM

This just in from Robin Wade and it looks like things went very well. The next thing everyone needs to do is to click on the link for the survey and get your information listed. This is really important if you want your voice to be heard. Robin is doing a great job at Western Outdoor News and has her ear to the ground in terms of what is going on in Baja.


Saturday, May 21, 2011
Mexico wins conservation battle
Commercial vs. recreational dorado deal 'done'




BY ROBIN WADE

WON Staff Writer


CABO SAN LUCAS-- In a long drawn out battle between the commercial and sportfishing industries, yesterday in Michoacán, Mexico, the government met in a third round of public forums to decide the fate of the sportfishing industry but amending Article 68. Guess what-we won!





“The Department of Mexican Fisheries decided to violate their own laws by allowing the commercial fishing industry to illegally harvest dorado,” Vince Radice, producer of the El Oro de Cortez (The Gold of Cortez) documentary said. You may remember WON ran an article about the video depicting the greed and corruption of a few, helping to destroy the last relatively abundant fish in the Sea of Cortes. If you missed it, here is a link to the latest version http://sancarlos.tv/portfolio/a-fish-made-of-gold/





“Twenty five years ago, some far-sighted Mexican legislators decided that tourism and sportfishing jobs were more sustainable and lucrative than commercial fishing jobs and created Article 68 in the general law of the Mexican fisheries,” Radice said. “This made it illegal to commercially fish six species of fish in Mexico; sailfish, marlin, roosterfish, swordfish, sabalo, and dorado.”






The less than stellar oversight of the commercial fishermen’s efforts created a decline in their catches and they turned their attention to the wanton take of dorado. There is a very lucrative, illegal market in the United States for them and both governments seemed to look the other way.






“I have filed a Freedom of Information Act with NOAA through lawyers from the Center for Biological Diversity out of San Franciscoto receive documents regarding their investigations related to dorado crossing into the U.S.,” Radice said. “Once we have these documents we will know what our options are against the U.S. Feds. and make America close the border to dorado imports. They have to enforce the Lacey Act as long as Article 68 remains intact.”






It’s long and complicated but the jest of it is there were “language loop holes” based on the fact that in some areas, there is no enforcement available, and given the bad economy, “needy commercial fishermen” werelegally allowed to fish for dorado. What the findings turned up during the public forums though, was that only a few (and none of the needy) were benefiting from the loop holes.





So onto Friday’s victory! Victory number one: Based on his “poor performance,” the Fisheries Commission voted to request Federal Legislators to ask Ramon Corral, Head of the National Commission of Fisheries to step down.






Victory number two: After hearing testimony and presentations regarding the alleged “economical benefits of commercial dorado take” to the coastal communities, it was determined that only a few were reaping any rewards from NOM 029 and the words “social justification” were stripped from the amendment.


“This victory is truly amazing considering we only heard of the forum two weeks ago,” Minerva Saenz, President of the Los Cabos Sportfishing Union said. “Representation from many distant areas of Mexico rallied together with a single e-mail, and attended the forum creating an incredible united front against the commercialization of dorado. In attendance were sportfishing leaders from Manzanillo, Culiacan, Loreto, the East Cape, Mazatlan, Puerto Vallarta, Mexico City and many other areas,” Saenz said.






Of the many representatives there Friday, 85 percent voted in favor of supporting the sportfishing industry over the commercial industry. “It's a well deserved victory for all of Mexico’s sportfishing interests, anglers from everywhere, boat owners, charter companies, airlines, hotels, marinas, fuel docks, and an endless list of trickle down benefits,” Cortez Yacht Charters said.






Anglers are reminded there are still ways to continue to protect Mexico’s sportfishing. One is to go online and take the national survey called “Angler Economic Survey” after they return from trips here. These statistics will be compiled to scientifically prove the importance of the angler dollar. http://surveys.questionpro.com/akira/TakeSurvey?id=1751677&a...





And before you come down if anywhere in the state of Baja Sur is your destination, don’t buy your license online. Baja Sur is the only state in Mexico where a special Marina Resources fund (FORMA) is set up. This special “pool of funds” allows the licensing money to stay within the state for resource management and funding marine law enforcement, such as gas for patrols. Every area has licenses available locally, usually through your outfitter, so please consider this option when you can.

Osprey - 5-22-2011 at 02:37 PM

Would it be safe to assume that Corral stepping down might be bigger, better news than the defeat of the bill?

I'll alert all the fishermen in this area about the victory. It truly is a great day for the fishery and we all owe a debt of thanks to those who went to the ends of the earth to make a proper argument and won the day.

Hook - 5-23-2011 at 12:10 AM

I'm with Skipjack Joe.

What have we really won? The commercials ignore the existing law. The existing law hasnt changed.

Corral may be gone. But Corral hasnt been in office for the entire 25 years that Article 68 has been on the books. These species have been commercially fished for 25 years. Will his successor be any different than his predecessors?

I'm cautiously optimistic, I guess. But even that's hard when you fish Saturday and are already running into long lines that are loaded with dorado and marlin.

BTW, why should we target license monies to Baja CA Sur IF, as some claim, the majority of the violations are from the mainland? That seems counterproductive to me.

[Edited on 5-23-2011 by Hook]

Osprey - 5-23-2011 at 06:42 AM

Some of your posts, like this one, seem counterproductive to me.

Hook - 5-23-2011 at 08:03 AM

You didnt like my version of Imagine, either, I guess. :biggrin: After reading it again, I guess some people may have interpreted it as being against the cause. It most certainly was not, as I intended it.

I just dont think this is the time to celebrate. Wont there be another vote in Mazatlan later that could still overturn this Article?

That's why I'm cautiously optimistic.

That survey is REALLY important. And this new website that Pam and others are working on will be REALLY important.

What about the logic of fees going to BCS, Osprey? WILL BCS fees be used to police all the way over here IF that's where the problem is?

Osprey - 5-23-2011 at 08:13 AM

No use b-tching about where the fees go. I believe Fonmar is making a difference all over Mexican waters but:

Travel club license money goes to DF
Tackle shop money goes to DF
Perhaps Conapesca online money goes to DF

When Mexico runs out of licenses (often) (one time for almost 2.5 years) fishermen were forced to buy licenses previously sold to the travel clubs by Mexico and that money, for certain, goes to DF.

It's like asking "Does Nebraska license money all go to help Nebraska fisheries? Is it money well spent? Are they effective, honest?"

Best we can do is support Mexico's efforts, when and where we can, cross our fingers and toes, hold good thoughts, drink more Pacificos.

flyfishinPam - 5-23-2011 at 09:02 AM

Cautiously optimistic is better than being totally f-ed like we almost were.

There are many fronts that are being fought on right now and really, this last meeting brought sport fishing interests from all over Mexico together for the first time. Keep in mind our natural competitiveness we have with each other just competing for market share. Conapesca and the commercials have been counting on this....but their plans have unraveled.

I understand Hook's sentiments, Sonora is the largest commercial fishing state, he sees things we do not see. I could go on, but I won't. We in BCS see that Sonorans and Sinaloenses come here to rape our waters because they have extracted just about everything they have. We are using technology to our advantage. We can present words and figures, stats etc until we are blue in the face, but there's no denying the videos that have already been made. also we are learning the complaint procedures now and this is something that has eluded us before.

I don't have to do this, Vince doesn't have to do this, either does Minerva, Dr. Villavicencio, Enrique, Margaro, Francisco, etc. but we have a great disdain for injustice so we are fighting it.

You see, conapesca and those paid off by them are using the tactic that they are trying to uplift the poor ribereños when in fact the poor ribereños will remain poor nomatter what. This goes beyond commercial and sport fishing conflicts, it boils down to the sell off of our nation's resources under the guise of making things better for the poor. It is a lie, and we have just started to prove this to our diputados, who live in a bubble and do not understand.

I will need to sign off for awhile but when I come back I will be announcing our united bilingual super-blog that will continue to tell the story and educate our citizens. It will allow their participation and hopefully conserve our natural resources so the nation (people) benefits, not just the coyotes and paid off funcionarios, but the real owners....all of us!


A word about FONMAR and fishing licenses:
ANY person fishing in the state of BCS needs to purchase their fishing license in the state under the FONMAR program. Yes it is less convienent but in the case of BCS, which is unique, ALL of the funds stay in the state. The Federacion will soon be receiving solicitations from Loreto and our proposal is that we receive a high percentage of these funds to operate. Trips to these meetings need to be paid for by someone, lawyers to fight this, filming of violations, enforcement, etc. all needs funding. Prior to FONMAR, all moneys collected went to DF where they were spent on who knows what. Now at least we have some control. Past threads of fishing licenses where even those who claim to be sudcalifornianos gave advice to purchase them through travel clubs or through conapesca's website (or BCN's) made my stomach turn. I hope this is the last advice I need to give on this, I have given it before, now its up to the buyer of the license to do the right thing.

shari - 5-23-2011 at 09:23 AM

EXCELLENT NEWS PAM!!!
We have a real dilema here with obtaining licenses. No one sell them here so for example to buy one, you have to call the fisheries guy in Bahia Tortugas, find out if he is around...which he often isnt....go to Turtle Bay, hope to find the guy and pay for it. Most fishermen wont do this...imagine if you want to fish in La Bocana...you have to drive more than 8 hours on a terrible road to buy a license...not gonna happen...which is why anglers get their license online.

I have begged our fisheries officer here to please try to get permission to sell licenses but nothing happens. We would love to be able to get them here. I will attach the link to the questionaire to our website as everyone should do who is involved with sportsfishing.

thanks again everyone for your efforts.

Pescador - 5-23-2011 at 09:52 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Hook
You didnt like my version of Imagine, either, I guess. :biggrin: After reading it again, I guess some people may have interpreted it as being against the cause. It most certainly was not, as I intended it.

I just dont think this is the time to celebrate. Wont there be another vote in Mazatlan later that could still overturn this Article?

That's why I'm cautiously optimistic.

That survey is REALLY important. And this new website that Pam and others are working on will be REALLY important.

What about the logic of fees going to BCS, Osprey? WILL BCS fees be used to police all the way over here IF that's where the problem is?


Hook, I don't know how to make this issue any clearer. If you live in Sonora, as you do, please make sure to buy your fishing license locally, in Sonora, and those of us who live in BCS need to buy our licenses locally, not from some stupid travel club or online, which is sponsored by Ensenada and Baja California Norte.

durrelllrobert - 5-23-2011 at 11:58 AM

This from today's news:

Commercial fishing of dorado would be the final blow to BC Sur.'s economy
by Baja Daily News (BDN) on 05/23/11

Los Cabos, Baja California Sur .- The deputy chairman of the Committee on Fisheries of the State Congress, Ernesto Ibarra Loreto Montoya and Deputy Oropeza Villalejo Dora Elda came the port of Lazaro Card##as Michoacan, with the third forum for consultation on the reforms to Article 68 of the General Law on Sustainable Fisheries and Aquaculture, which analyzes the opening the waters to commercial fishing.

Both said that Baja California Sur open to commercial fishing of the dorado and other species for recreational fishing would be the final blow to its economy, social development and growth, as most of the population depends on fishing, and the tourism it generates.

In a forum organized by the Committee on Fisheries of the House of Representatives, lawmakers Baja California Sur made a presentation separately, which showed that South Baja California sportfishing beneficially impact its economy and society by creating jobs for tourism collateral services such as transportation, lodging, food, boat rentals and taxidermy, among others, that allow major foreign exchange earnings that in turn generate and infrastructure works on docks, marinas, and construction of hotels.

Ernesto Ibarra Montoya said that it is false the argument of some federal deputies from Sonora and Sinaloa, to promote this initiative in the sense that this reform aims to encourage coastal fishermen, and that experience large predators of the seas are Mexican commercial fishing industry, those with large fleets of tall ships, as well as dealers and smugglers.

Skipjack Joe - 5-23-2011 at 01:40 PM

If someone could provide a link to any study of baja dorado migration patterns throughout their life span I would greatly appreciate it.

Osprey - 5-23-2011 at 02:01 PM

Igor, I don't have the whole pattern but you can ask around down here and you'll learn that whether they are coming up the SOC or going back out, as they pass Palmas Bay, they have little predation from Jorge. Most fishing days they could make the limit one and I would probably not exceed that. (might be under it)

Skipjack Joe - 5-23-2011 at 02:25 PM

BTW, the thread you provided on the research on humbolt squid by the Stanford guy proved to be very interesting. That led to many links and a trove of reading material.

BajaBlanca - 5-23-2011 at 02:48 PM

good going Pam and husband !! fighting such a fight takes real courage. so glad the dorado won this round.

I also see your Spanish is even better than mine, I may stop by for some classes in getting the point across FAST

:biggrin:

all kidding aside, congrats on a job well done !

Osprey - 5-23-2011 at 03:25 PM

Here's an interesting article on the Pompano dorado we catch down here sometimes.

http://www.mexfish.com/fish/pompdor/pompdor.htm

Cardon Man - 5-23-2011 at 03:57 PM

Super interesting. I've known about this specie for a long time now but I can't say I've ever been present for one being caught. How about you Osprey?

Osprey - 5-23-2011 at 04:08 PM

Local charter guys target them for bait for billfish sometimes for big time tourneys. They jig for them with Lucky Joes around shark buoys.

I think a lot are caught, nobody bothers to I D and they are throwbacks. That's why their numbers are growing -- the very same with the white marlin that have made their way over here.

Cardon Man - 5-23-2011 at 05:06 PM

White marlin? In the Pacific?

Osprey - 5-23-2011 at 05:50 PM

Cardon, many white marlin here in East Cape. U2U me and I'll fill you in. Many old threads on here about it if you search.

flyfishinPam - 5-24-2011 at 09:50 PM

"...one of the most fascinating things that came out of the meeting in Lazaro Card##as, was the curiosity on the part of the Diputados regarding “catch and release fishing”. If you can read Spanish, and you read part two of our economic and social impact on Loreto testimony, you will see that Captain Francisco explained how light tackle and fly fishing “catch and release excursions” are not only popular but are becoming the norm. The Diputados were very interested in this dark-skinned captain who originally from the Costa Chica in Guerrero state and had the southern Mexico accent, explained that he arrived in Loreto 30 years ago “with nothing” and now he is “prospering”. He explained that “thanks to the experience he has gained from his years of being an artesan* fishermen”, he has been able to apply it to the field of sport fishing and has created an opportunity for himself...."

Taken from my perspective of the situation and hopefully it will help you to understand the situation better-
http://www.bajabigfish.com/?p=1847

The iniciative and our testimonials are available to download there as well.

someone wanted a Dorado study? I can e-mail CIBNOR's study in .pdf it is over 200 pages long and in spanish. It was written to support commercializing the dorado and to help strengthen the iniciative. Believe it or not all of their data was taken from the illegal dorado fishing fleets in sonora (black market). that ought to send up a red flag, anyway, contact me via my website and I'll be happy to send it to ya.

I'll be back when we're ready to announce the new blog address.

flyfishinPam - 5-24-2011 at 10:06 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by shari
EXCELLENT NEWS PAM!!!
We have a real dilema here with obtaining licenses. No one sell them here so for example to buy one, you have to call the fisheries guy in Bahia Tortugas, find out if he is around...which he often isnt....go to Turtle Bay, hope to find the guy and pay for it. Most fishermen wont do this...imagine if you want to fish in La Bocana...you have to drive more than 8 hours on a terrible road to buy a license...not gonna happen...which is why anglers get their license online.

I have begged our fisheries officer here to please try to get permission to sell licenses but nothing happens. We would love to be able to get them here. I will attach the link to the questionaire to our website as everyone should do who is involved with sportsfishing.

thanks again everyone for your efforts.


To address your specific situation. It will soon change. FONMAR is now allowing us to sell fishing licenses in our shops, hotels, and places of business, and if you're a tour operator like me directly to the buyers. You will apply for a certain number of blank licenses (howevr many you need) and then give them the receipts and the money. Ask your local FONMAR office or e-mail me and I will put you in touch with the Loreto office for more information. for the first time ever they are making it easy to buy them, its about time. This is BCS only.

shari - 5-25-2011 at 10:08 AM

most excellent news...thanks Pam...we will get right on that and hopefully for this season will be the proud bearers of fishing permits for sale here.