BajaNomad - Bad news for SF

Bad news for SF

baja1943 - 3-1-2012 at 07:28 AM

http://tinyurl.com/7mpqend

Diver - 3-1-2012 at 07:44 AM

Last week we had our septic tank pumped out.
When I jokingly asked my wife how she liked the smell, she said it reminded her of Baja !

I'm rather impressed that someone in Mexico actually tests the water.

Udo - 3-1-2012 at 07:46 AM

Those beaches should have closed long ago. The water quality has JUST NOW been deemed contaminated.

Has anyone been to the water area at low tide?

The stench is pretty bad, and has been bad since the seventies!

bacquito - 3-1-2012 at 08:24 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Udo
Those beaches should have closed long ago. The water quality has JUST NOW been deemed contaminated.

Has anyone been to the water area at low tide?

The stench is pretty bad, and has been bad since the seventies!

ugh

Oddjob - 3-1-2012 at 08:54 AM

Going into the water at San Felipe is like jumping into a sewage settlement pond.

tripledigitken - 3-1-2012 at 08:56 AM

Love the fish tacos though.

Oddjob - 3-1-2012 at 08:59 AM

As long as the fish comes from far away.

mcfez - 3-1-2012 at 09:13 AM

This happens all the time to the southern California beaches as well. Northern beaches too.....Santa Cruz area for sure. I remember a newspaper accounting of when Huntington Beach had syringes and needles washing up on the shoreline.

So what's the point of this topic? The article DID NOT state the number of MPN levels of enterococci. was it 201? 204? What number?

"....The criteria for considering a beach risky based on the amount of enterococci MPN/100 ml water beach these are determined as follows: 0 to 200 suitable for recreational use; Over 200 Not for recreational use".

Yes...post some warning signs on the beach....

This issue as the issues in California....is temporary and will be resolved. Visit San Felipe. It's a great town.

Hook - 3-1-2012 at 09:15 AM

So, how will they stop this? Are the homes in SF proper on a municipal sewer system or are most homes on septic or a simple leech line near the beach? (guacala!)

Naw, probably just wait for the next extreme tides to wash it out, test it, and then declare the situation safe.

I often wonder about all the homes in the campos south of SF and how they contain effluents. Many are right on the sand. Sand is not a good barrier to the ocean, I wouldnt think. Traps solids but not microorganisms. If they are using the ubiquitous cement vaults or cinder block vaults, I imagine the salt water under them has done a real number on the Mexican mortar in them. It doesnt stand up long to continued exposure to hard fresh water, much less salt water.

[Edited on 3-1-2012 by Hook]

Not the same as SoCal

Hook - 3-1-2012 at 09:22 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by mcfez
This happens all the time to the southern California beaches as well. Northern beaches too.....Santa Cruz area for sure. I remember a newspaper accounting of when Huntington Beach had syringes and needles washing up on the shoreline.

So what's the point of this topic? The article DID NOT state the number of MPN levels of enterococci. was it 201? 204? What number?

"....The criteria for considering a beach risky based on the amount of enterococci MPN/100 ml water beach these are determined as follows: 0 to 200 suitable for recreational use; Over 200 Not for recreational use".

Yes...post some warning signs on the beach....

This issue as the issues in California....is temporary and will be resolved. Visit San Felipe. It's a great town.

What's the point of the topic? Seemed clear to me. It aint safe to go in the water in parts of SF right now.

Well, having lived in SoCal for over 45 years, I think the situation is quite different. Effluents in SoCal are either caused by 1-heavy rains that clean out the arroyos after a long dry period, or 2-the occasional spill from a sewage treatment plant. That last one can occur ANYWHERE.

No, this sounds more like a lack of any real infrastructure for dealing with this or an infrastructure that has been compromised. It occured at two places that are separated by miles.

elgatoloco - 3-1-2012 at 09:29 AM

muy malo :barf:

mtgoat666 - 3-1-2012 at 09:39 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Diver
Last week we had our septic tank pumped out.

...and where does the truck driver dump his tank?

CortezBlue - 3-1-2012 at 09:41 AM

Translated

San Felipe beaches closed by pollution
PDF | Print | E-mail
Tuesday, February 28, 2012 7:45

Mexicali, BC-Beaches in the north and south of San Felipe, were closed by the Ministry of Health of Baja California, because according to surveys of water quality, pose a risk to bathers by high levels of enterococci.

Zamarrón Ricardo Guevara, head of the COPEPRIS in Baja California, said it is Bonita Beach and the beach at the Marina Resort and the monitor were detected exceeding the standard values and jeopardize the health of bathing in entering these waters.

Zamarrón Guevara, recommended that people refrain from visiting these beaches and threatening their health.

The measure will be withdrawn until you have results that do not pose a health risk it is important to mention that you are working in coordination with the committee clean beach of San Felipe to issue these recommendations to the public and service providers in the area.

The criteria for considering a beach risky based on the amount of enterococci MPN/100 ml water beach these are determined as follows: 0 to 200 suitable for recreational use; Over 200 Not for recreational use.

Enterococci are used as indicator, as are the cause of gastrointestinal illness occur.

Another criterion to consider a risky beach is the knowledge of a point source of pollution on the beach, or an incident that impacts water quality to not be confirmed by results of a sample.

The mixture of wastewater effluents untreated can pose a risk to the bather, since an infectious dose of microorganisms can be transmitted not only by swallowing water but to get it in contact with skin, ears, eyes, nasal cavity or upper respiratory tract causing minor illnesses such as skin irritation, ear infections, eye and respiratory irritation, upset stomach and diarrhea due to gastrointestinal infections.

The purpose of providing information to the public about the risks they are exposed is to prevent damages in their health.

jadams - 3-1-2012 at 09:44 AM

every time it rains in San Diego, the beaches are posted due to the runoff in the storm gutter system.

mtgoat666 - 3-1-2012 at 09:44 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by mcfez
This issue as the issues in California....is temporary and will be resolved.

in CA problems only occur after rains. in san felipe, appears to be persistent problem during rain or dry periods.

mcfez: why do you think it is "temporary?" who is resolving it? what actions are they taking to resolve? i am skeptical!

Nearly 4000 beach closings and swimming advisories were issued by state and local governments

mcfez - 3-1-2012 at 09:46 AM

Ah.....it is so. Waters in southern Ca is polluted at times....just like in Baja.

Not the same as SoCal? :
Poche Beach in San Clemente and Newport Bay at Garnet Avenue, however, received Fs, and pollution-plagued Doheny State Beach in Dana Point earned a D.
http://articles.latimes.com/2010/sep/30/local/la-me-0930-oce...

Not the same as SoCal?
http://water.epa.gov/type/oceb/beaches/pollution.cfm

Quote:

Originally posted by Hook

Quote:

[Edited on 3-1-2012 by mcfez]

Hook - 3-1-2012 at 09:56 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Diver
Last week we had our septic tank pumped out.
When I jokingly asked my wife how she liked the smell, she said it reminded her of Baja !

I'm rather impressed that someone in Mexico actually tests the water.

I wonder if they DARE test it when the temps are actually swimmable. What an outcry there would be from the business community.

Oddjob - 3-1-2012 at 10:06 AM

The problem is that there is no sewage treatment in SF. What do you think happens when you flush a toilet along the shore in the area? I remember staying in the casitas at the El Cortez Hotel, and the toilets wouldn't flush at high tide. :?:

The waters off of the California coast may be polluted after a storm from runoff or an occasional sewage spill, but San Felipe's water has been unhealthy at all times for decades. The town of San Felipe is a dump and that is the reason that tourism is way down.

David K - 3-1-2012 at 10:13 AM

"The town of San Felipe is a dump and that is the reason that tourism is way down."

Tourism is way down because we in the USA are broke and those who aren't are scared of getting killed after all the bad press Mexico gets. The town is not a dump, it is no different than most towns that size in Baja.

Oddjob - 3-1-2012 at 10:18 AM

You may be broke, but most folks aren't. To say that San Felipe is no different than most towns that size in Baja shows that you spend very little time there.

mtgoat666 - 3-1-2012 at 10:21 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by David K
"The town of San Felipe is a dump and that is the reason that tourism is way down."

The town is not a dump, it is no different than most towns that size in Baja.

everybody has an opinion! my opinion is that the town is a bit dumpy, and the beaches are not very enticing (mudflats don't do much for me). much better beaches and town on pac side or further south in baja!

David K - 3-1-2012 at 10:23 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Oddjob
You may be broke, but most folks aren't. To say that San Felipe is no different than most towns that size in Baja shows that you spend very little time there.

Yah... only go there 2-4 times a year since 1965... what do I know!? :lol:

Oddjob - 3-1-2012 at 10:40 AM

You know everything David KIA.

David K - 3-1-2012 at 10:43 AM

Not possible... but thanks for the compliment :light:

I try to share facts about Baja... and calling San Felipe a dump is not very factual or fair when the place is so hard hit by the lack of tourism.

I have a TOYOTA, not a KIA... :lol:

desertcpl - 3-1-2012 at 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by mtgoat666

Quote:

Originally posted by Diver
Last week we had our septic tank pumped out.

...and where does the truck driver dump his tank?

this has been an on going problem for years in SF, it has been reported many times before,

SFandH - 3-1-2012 at 11:08 AM

Water quality standards for declaring a health risk:

Mexico: 200 enterococci per 100 milliliters (1)

San Diego: 104 enterococci per 100 milliliters (single sample), with a 30 day mean no greater than 35 enterococci per 100 milliliters (2)

San Diego is following latest EPA recommendations. (3)

So it looks like Mexican waters can be polluted by US standards but still be considered safe by Mexican standards.

(1) http://www.jornada.unam.mx/2011/07/22/sociedad/043n1soc - 4th paragraph

(2) http://www.swrcb.ca.gov/rwqcb9/water_issues/programs/tmdls/d...

(3) https://www.federalregister.gov/articles/2011/12/21/2011-326...

sancho - 3-1-2012 at 11:25 AM

I've always been warey of SF water in front of town, I think
if you go no. or so. of town it is much better. I
kayak in front of SF , but do not get in the sea. There have
been published reports on water quality re: several
Mex towns, which generally show acceptable quality,
however I assume you can find high levels fo contamination
off the beach in many/all towns of any size

mcfez - 3-1-2012 at 11:29 AM

Many folks are watching their bucks......much of their personal budgetary cuts have been on vacations, eating out...and such. San Felipe tourism has been hard hit due to these facts. Yes...some shops have closed.....same as Sacramento Ca or Anytown USA.

Many folks goes to San Felipe due to it's lack of violence. See the map below.

http://tinyurl.com/4jerr7u
Drugs war murders mapped: every dot represents a town where a drugs war murder has taken place. The large red markers show places with over 70 deaths. Click on each dot to get the details - with captions for the worst places. You can go to the full screen version

Septic systems with leeching systems are ample throughout Baja....Mexico mainland....and a host of other worldwide locations. Let's take the communities of Santa Cruz Ca.....up in the upper mountain areas. Most farms, ranches and homes... are on septic with leeching fields.....fact is....the creeks there are polluted way worst that any beach in Baja. I know....my brother lived there for years.

San Felipe has issues like any other town...full of great folks....great outdoors sports to do....cozy and safe.

Quote:

Originally posted by Oddjob
You may be broke, but most folks aren't. To say that San Felipe is no different than most towns that size in Baja shows that you spend very little time there.

ElCap - 3-1-2012 at 11:40 AM

Remember the old saying 'the solution to pollution is dilution' - it's pretty much true. While San Felipe may get some extreme tides, it really does not get much flushing - the Colorado River input isn't what it used to be. :no:

I'd really like to see some bacteria monitoring results from along the coast from TJ down to Ensenada, but I don't think it would help that already suffering 'tourist corridor'. Other than the international treatment plant at the border (financed by the US), is there any infrastructure along that highly populated coast? I imagine Ensenada must have some treatment plants - does anyone know where the outfall is?

durrelllrobert - 3-1-2012 at 12:06 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ElCap
Remember the old saying 'the solution to pollution is dilution' - it's pretty much true. While San Felipe may get some extreme tides, it really does not get much flushing - the Colorado River input isn't what it used to be. :no:

BN bajadoc this map of Ensenada sewage treatment facilities on his web site:
bajadock.wordpress.com / ... / bay - sewage - tre ...

desertcpl - 3-1-2012 at 12:15 PM

second. Only 40.2% of Mexico’s wastewater is treated before being dumped.

A COFEPRIS report on Mexican beaches for 2010 shows that of the 21 Baja California beaches tested, 17 exceeded the US standard during at least one test in 2010. All of the beaches tested in Tijuana, Rosarito and San Felipe failed at least once during 2010. One beach in San Felipe, showed a whopping 631 enterococcus per 100 milliliters, 18 times US federal clean water standards.

There is a continuing problem with raw sewage water flowing into the ocean in San Felipe. Authorities suspect that septic cleaning services which pump out septic tanks are clandestinely dumping the wastewater into the arroyos, which flow into the ocean. The Comisión Estatal de Servicios Públicos de Mexicali (CESPM), which operates San Felipe's sewage treatment plant, reports they only receive 30 tanker truck loads of effluent per day, which is far less than the amount of sewage generated in San Felipe.

[Edited on 3-1-2012 by desertcpl]

Hook - 3-1-2012 at 12:57 PM

So, the sewage treatment plant in SF is only set up to accept pump out from septics? Are there no municipal lines in SF?

The numbers make the difference

wessongroup - 3-1-2012 at 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by SFandH
Water quality standards for declaring a health risk:

Mexico: 200 enterococci per 100 milliliters (1)

San Diego: 104 enterococci per 100 milliliters (single sample), with a 30 day mean no greater than 35 enterococci per 100 milliliters (2)

San Diego is following latest EPA recommendations. (3)

So it looks like Mexican waters can be polluted by US standards but still be considered safe by Mexican standards.

(1) http://www.jornada.unam.mx/2011/07/22/sociedad/043n1soc - 4th paragraph

(2) http://www.swrcb.ca.gov/rwqcb9/water_issues/programs/tmdls/d...

(3) https://www.federalregister.gov/articles/2011/12/21/2011-326...

That is an important point... what defines "contamination" ..

As for Dana Point.. it is down stream from the water treatment plant which can not handle the load ... Saddleback Valley has gotten a bit larger than what it was 40 years ago .. much like SF

Liked Dana Point back when ya could only get down to the beach with the one road ... and there was NO harbor ... just saying

Oddjob - 3-1-2012 at 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by David K
Not possible... but thanks for the compliment :light:

I try to share facts about Baja... and calling San Felipe a dump is not very factual or fair when the place is so hard hit by the lack of tourism.

I have a TOYOTA, not a KIA... :lol:

Just because San Felipe has been hit hard by the lack of tourism is no reason to sugarcoat the place. Tourism has been effected in Mexico by more than economics and the threat of violence. It is no longer a bargain to travel in Baja. The prices for groceries, lodging, restaurants and other needs are often as high or higher than in the US. Adding in the police corruption, scamming and the rampant theft occurring on all levels plays a big part in the downturn.

mrfatboy - 3-1-2012 at 04:21 PM

Is playa bonita the beach right in front of Kiki's?

Udo - 3-1-2012 at 05:44 PM

I was trying to study this angle also, because California and Mexican standards are so different. However, SFandH hit the nail right on the head!

Thanks, buddy!

Quote:
Originally posted by SFandH
Water quality standards for declaring a health risk:

Mexico: 200 enterococci per 100 milliliters (1)

San Diego: 104 enterococci per 100 milliliters (single sample), with a 30 day mean no greater than 35 enterococci per 100 milliliters (2)

San Diego is following latest EPA recommendations. (3)

So it looks like Mexican waters can be polluted by US standards but still be considered safe by Mexican standards.

(1) http://www.jornada.unam.mx/2011/07/22/sociedad/043n1soc - 4th paragraph

(2) http://www.swrcb.ca.gov/rwqcb9/water_issues/programs/tmdls/d...

(3) https://www.federalregister.gov/articles/2011/12/21/2011-326...

desertcpl - 3-1-2012 at 06:09 PM

does brown trout come to mind

Ateo - 3-1-2012 at 06:14 PM

A little contamination is good for ya!!! :spingrin:

I'll never forget surfing at Baja Malibu after a big rain. Logs in the lineup.

As long as you wash the brown water down with a shot of Jimador, all will be well.

JK!

desertcpl - 3-1-2012 at 07:12 PM

:lol:

Woooosh - 3-1-2012 at 07:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ElCap
I'd really like to see some bacteria monitoring results from along the coast from TJ down to Ensenada, but I don't think it would help that already suffering 'tourist corridor'. Other than the international treatment plant at the border (financed by the US), is there any infrastructure along that highly populated coast? I imagine Ensenada must have some treatment plants - does anyone know where the outfall is?

I do know the tourist beach in Rosarito is regularly tested and the results published in a beach certification program "Playas Limpias":

Link to the PLAYAS LIMPIAS program PDF File which has the info and results for all Baja.

http://www.revistatlaloc.mx/articulos%20edi%2047/art_01_edi4...

[Edited on 3-2-2012 by Woooosh]

Oddjob - 3-1-2012 at 07:39 PM

At least Rosarito Beach gets a good flushing on the Pacific side. The upper Sea Of Cortez is like a big toilet.

Woooosh - 3-1-2012 at 08:17 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Oddjob
At least Rosarito Beach gets a good flushing on the Pacific side. The upper Sea Of Cortez is like a big toilet.

True. I'll bet it is even worse in SF when the water gets warm.

desertcpl - 3-2-2012 at 08:06 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Woooosh

Quote:

Originally posted by Oddjob
At least Rosarito Beach gets a good flushing on the Pacific side. The upper Sea Of Cortez is like a big toilet.

True. I'll bet it is even worse in SF when the water gets warm.

when it warms up thats when the brown trouts spawn