BajaNomad

Papers for Grandkids

paranewbi - 10-7-2012 at 03:05 PM

Pulling two grandkids out of school for a few days at Gonzaga. We're either crossing at Tecate or Otay...know how to do the adult paper thing...need to know if I have to have passports for the kids or will just school ID and or Birth Certs do for the re-entry and Mex side.

Will the mexican side require them to have visa's also? Or will the wifes and mine do for all of us.

The kids are 10 and 15.
Good ones, plan for now is to bring em back with us :)

Bob and Susan - 10-7-2012 at 03:19 PM

if you ask...you can attach the kids to your tourist visas...avoid extra payment

i'd get them passports for comfort if something happens

Mulegena - 10-7-2012 at 03:24 PM

How about a statement from their parents giving permission for their kids to be with you in Mexico and you have the authority to act in their behalf, including seeking medical treatment? They might want to date, sign and notarize this and have it written in both English and Spanish.

[Edited on 10-7-2012 by Mulegena]

woody with a view - 10-7-2012 at 04:02 PM

^^^WINNER!^^^

Sallysouth - 10-7-2012 at 04:04 PM

Like what Woody said!!!:yes:

Bob and Susan - 10-7-2012 at 04:06 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Mulegena
How about a statement from their parents giving permission for their kids to be with you in Mexico and you have the authority to act in their behalf, including seeking medical treatment? They might want to date, sign and notarize this and have it written in both English and Spanish.


that is a good idea...
but i think its not required
a made up rule by americans

travel and communication is FAST nowdays
not like the OLD days

woody with a view - 10-7-2012 at 04:51 PM

like when YOUR grandkid needs blood NOW and you want to rely on the tortilla telegraph?

Sra Mulegena has it. close this thread...

Bob and Susan - 10-7-2012 at 05:22 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by woody with a view
like when YOUR grandkid needs blood NOW and you want to rely on the tortilla telegraph?

Sra Mulegena has it. close this thread...



nope...not required in baja...just $$$

the rule is made up

What we do..............

mcfez - 10-7-2012 at 05:51 PM

Have a letter signed and notarized by BOTH parents giving permission for international travel.

On the same document......get the rights to make emergency medical decisions.

Get two current photos of each kid (we do the same for the adults too). Put these in the glove compartment. Take the second set and email them to yourself. This is in case one gets lost.......or worst.

Most important.............toys, games, and junk food snacks in the car !!!!!!!

BTW.....I take our kids, grand kids....their friends....to Baja all the time. Not afraid of the issues going on down there....which we have yet seen :-) Have fun.

mtgoat666 - 10-7-2012 at 06:06 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Bob and Susan
Quote:
Originally posted by Mulegena
How about a statement from their parents giving permission for their kids to be with you in Mexico and you have the authority to act in their behalf, including seeking medical treatment? They might want to date, sign and notarize this and have it written in both English and Spanish.


that is a good idea...
but i think its not required
a made up rule by americans


made up rule? what is your basis for your saying the rule does not exist? :?::?::?:

Sallysouth - 10-7-2012 at 06:33 PM

It seems to me that it is common sense to do what mcfez suggested.Why not be careful and avoid possible problems if something should happen?When I have my G-kids for a good amount of time I try to get at least the medical authority for them if the parents are on a vacation and out of reach.

paranewbi - 10-8-2012 at 05:23 AM

Thanks for all the info on permission/medical concerns!!
Got that covered...well seasoned on all of those matters as we have 5 kids and 11 grandkids. Last family outing was several years ago to Guadelupe hot springs with all of them plus stragglers (21 total!). That before the new rules.

Grandma's a nurse (cardiac, although she's the only one who needs that specialty when one of the gkids bleeds and she gets really upset that I make them pose for a photo before they can get any medical attention from grandma...funny, they always stop crying when I tell them to say 'cheese', with a tooth thru their lip).

I was just concerned about any issues with kids not having passport on either side of the border. Looking for a little advice from those like McFez as I have read of his bringing plenty of little ones in the past. I know he's got trusted advice since his fishing bait recipe worked great last time in Gonzaga!

So...ask to have them added to our visa? We'll have the Bcerts and School ID's along as well as extra photos...we also always leave current photos of the vehicle we are traveling in with our family here.

mtgoat666 - 10-8-2012 at 06:01 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by paranewbi
So...ask to have them added to our visa? We'll have the Bcerts and School ID's along as well as extra photos...


if you "ask" but don't have passports, i suspect they will follow the "rules" which say passport required, so perhaps you should not ask.

i think people here are telling you that you can enter mexico via foot or via car w/o passport if you don't ask, don't tell the immigration agents...

nbacc - 10-8-2012 at 06:34 AM

have fun with your grand kids. Like everything else in Mexico it is better to be prepared as they never ask until they ask until it is your turn. We have already discussed the dog food thing here but it is a good example. Nancy

Ken Bondy - 10-8-2012 at 06:48 PM

paranewbi
Between 1978 and 1998 I made over 50 trips to Baja by private aircraft, accompanied by from 1 to 3 of my 3 biological children. During that time I was divorced from their mother. Before I started this odyssey I physically went to the Mexican Consulate office in Los Angeles, and asked them what paperwork was required in order for the kids to travel with me into Mexico. They told me I would need, for each child, a birth certificate (passports hadn't been invented yet :)) and a signed and notarized letter from the other parent giving me permission to take the child into Mexico. I carefully prepared and gathered these papers, and they were with me on every trip. In all those years I was asked for the papers exactly once, in Mexicali. My point is not to advise you what is currently required, I am sure things have changed in the last 35 years. My point is to advise you to get this information directly from the Mexican government, as I did. You are getting some sincere and well-meaning advice here, but this is something you don't want to rely on unofficially. It is a tremendous risk. Go to, or contact a local Mexican consulate and get the straight story from them, and do exactly what they tell you.

desertcpl - 10-8-2012 at 06:59 PM

you might want to ask how much young blonde kids are going for on the open market

just asking :?::?::?:

Ken Bondy - 10-8-2012 at 07:02 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by desertcpl
you might want to ask how much young blonde kids are going for on the open market

just asking :?::?::?:


I did. Decided to keep 'em anyway.

From the US State Dept

bajaguy - 10-8-2012 at 07:16 PM

http://mexico.usembassy.gov/eng/eacs_sheet.html

Entry Requirements for Mexico

As of March 1, 2010, all U.S. citizens – including children -- must present a valid passport, book or card, for travel beyond the “border zone” into the interior of Mexico. Entry by any means, for example by plane or car, is included in this requirement. The “border zone” is generally defined as an area between 20 to 30 kilometers of the border with the U.S., depending on the location. Stays of less than 72 hours within the border zone do not require a visa or tourist card.

Unaccompanied Minors Departing Mexico

In order to combat international child abduction or the exploitation of minors, Article 215 of Mexico’s Ley General de Población requires that minor non-Mexican children leaving Mexico must be accompanied by both parents or guardians or be prepared to present written authorization to travel from the absent parent or parents.

This document must include:
the name(s) of the authorizing parent(s),
the name of the child,
the name(s) of the adult(s) accompanying the child, and
the notarized signature(s) of the absent parent(s)

The child must be carrying the original letter – not a faxed or scanned copy – as well as proof of the parent/child relationship (usually a birth certificate) – and an original custody decree, if applicable.

If there is only one custodial parent, the accompanying adult should be prepared to present documentation to that effect (e.g, a court order granting sole custody to one parent, a death certificate for the absent parent, etc.).

David K - 10-8-2012 at 07:16 PM

I started traveling to Baja without my parents when I was 16... and went with other friends also under 18... that was in 1974/5... They DID require and ask for notarized permission slips from our parents then.

In the early 2000's when my son took a school-friend on one of our camping trips (twice)... I had a permission slip from his parents... but was NEVER asked to show it.

As with the tourist card... BETTER TO HAVE IT and NOT NEED IT, THEN to need it and not have it!!!

paranewbi - 10-9-2012 at 04:40 AM

Thanks for all the info! We'll let you know how we did.

Figured the easiest way to do it is to kick em out of the car and let them run across both ways...meet up on the other side :O

Bob and Susan - 10-9-2012 at 01:37 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by bajaguy
In order to combat international child abduction or the exploitation of minors, Article 215 of Mexico’s Ley General de Población requires that minor non-Mexican children
leaving Mexico
must be accompanied by both parents or guardians or be prepared to present written authorization to travel from the absent parent or parents.

The child must be carrying the original letter – not a faxed or scanned copy – as well as proof of the parent/child relationship (usually a birth certificate) – and an original custody decree, if applicable.



this is NOT the mexican law...its the usa website with THEIR understanding
and
it has to do with "leaving mexico" not entering OR vacationing

have you ever been stopped by the mexicans when leaving the country : )

again...a made up rule by people in the usa

notarized stuff from the usa means nothing in mexico:light:

David K - 10-9-2012 at 06:15 PM

Bob, I am sorry to disagree here with you, but anything notarized does carry more weight,... and since I used to have these permit slips as part of going to Baja, mine were for the Mexican immigration, entering Mexico... IF ASKED FOR. The Americans coming home didn't need anything from us because we were minors.

Myself and two friends (16, 16 and 17 years of age) entered at Mexicali and were asked our ages... then we were told "you are too young to be in Mexico"...

I responded "We have the necessary papers!".
The officer replied: "You have the necessary papers?"
... and I responded, "Yes, we have the necessary papers!"
The officer smiled real big and said "PASA, HAVE A GOOD TIME!!"
It was one of those special moments that make Baja a happy place for me... At least I didn't say: "Papers? We don't need no stinking papers!"

Of course, he never actually asked to see our 'necessary papers', but we had them! :light:

norte - 10-9-2012 at 06:27 PM

And DavidK. what year was that? and might it be irrelevant now?

Oggie - 10-9-2012 at 06:51 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Bob and Susan
Quote:
Originally posted by bajaguy
In order to combat international child abduction or the exploitation of minors, Article 215 of Mexico’s Ley General de Población requires that minor non-Mexican children
leaving Mexico
must be accompanied by both parents or guardians or be prepared to present written authorization to travel from the absent parent or parents.

The child must be carrying the original letter – not a faxed or scanned copy – as well as proof of the parent/child relationship (usually a birth certificate) – and an original custody decree, if applicable.



this is NOT the mexican law...its the usa website with THEIR understanding
and
it has to do with "leaving mexico" not entering OR vacationing

have you ever been stopped by the mexicans when leaving the country : )

again...a made up rule by people in the usa

notarized stuff from the usa means nothing in mexico:light:

Bob,
Two years ago my wife and I towed a boat down to BOLA. The boat and truck belonged to a friend of mine. We had Insurance, truck registration, a letter giving me permission to drive in Baja, but we did not have the boat registration. the mexicans made us go thru the gate on the left and re-enter the US, where they made us go to secondary and they wanted to conficate all of our food. We got the boat registration and re-entered mexico. the mexicans checked all my paper work again and said because the permission letter was not notarized they wanted to send us back to the US again.

So, I am assuming they do respect US notary and that children would be more important the property.

mcfez - 10-9-2012 at 07:32 PM

Most banks, if you are a client, notarized forms are free.

Better safe than sorry.....regardless of the law.

bajario - 10-9-2012 at 07:57 PM

So are Tourist Visas needed for our own children or just us legal beer drinkers?

mtgoat666 - 10-9-2012 at 10:11 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Bob and Susan
Quote:
Originally posted by bajaguy
In order to combat international child abduction or the exploitation of minors, Article 215 of Mexico’s Ley General de Población requires that minor non-Mexican children
leaving Mexico
must be accompanied by both parents or guardians or be prepared to present written authorization to travel from the absent parent or parents.

The child must be carrying the original letter – not a faxed or scanned copy – as well as proof of the parent/child relationship (usually a birth certificate) – and an original custody decree, if applicable.



this is NOT the mexican law...its the usa website with THEIR understanding
and
it has to do with "leaving mexico" not entering OR vacationing

have you ever been stopped by the mexicans when leaving the country : )

again...a made up rule by people in the usa

notarized stuff from the usa means nothing in mexico:light:


we have a choice. behind door 1 is internet forum info based on 3rd- and 4th-hand anecdotes. behind door 2 is the guidance listed on Mexican govt website, the US State dept website, most cruise lines and most airlines. it's a free country, your choice!

desertcpl - 10-10-2012 at 06:34 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by norte
And DavidK. what year was that? and might it be irrelevant now?




yes Dk
lets talk about today,, the whole world was different then,,

David K - 10-10-2012 at 08:30 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by David K
I started traveling to Baja without my parents when I was 16... and went with other friends also under 18... that was in 1974/5... They DID require and ask for notarized permission slips from our parents then.

In the early 2000's when my son took a school-friend on one of our camping trips (twice)... I had a permission slip from his parents... but was NEVER asked to show it.

As with the tourist card... BETTER TO HAVE IT and NOT NEED IT, THEN to need it and not have it!!!



For those who keep asking what year was that... the above was posted in THIS thread, so all you need to do is look up...

Bob and Susan - 10-10-2012 at 10:44 AM

americans HAVE to remember a notary is different in mexico

an american notary is NOT the same as a mexican notary

regular american notarized papers are not legal in mexico

DK if you find the mexican law...then post it...
otherwise its just another "urban myth"

Ken Bondy - 10-10-2012 at 12:13 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Bob and Susan
americans HAVE to remember a notary is different in mexico

an american notary is NOT the same as a mexican notary

regular american notarized papers are not legal in mexico

DK if you find the mexican law...then post it...
otherwise its just another "urban myth"


Bob and Susan

I am very puzzled by this. Perhaps things have changed in 35 years, but when I went to the Mexican consulate to ask about this, they didn't tell me that there was a difference between notaries in the US and in Mexico. They just said a "notarized letter" was required from the other parent, giving me permission to take the kids into Mexico. I assumed that the notarized letter could be prepared in the US by an American notary, and that's what I did. Admittedly, it was only checked once in twenty years, but that time it was checked VERY carefully on entry in Mexicali, and I was with all three kids. The Mexican immigration guy who checked it at the airport had no problem with the fact that it was in English and it was notarized by an American notary. After carefully looking at all three notarized letters and all three of the kid's birth certificates, they sent us on our way. Do you think that things have now changed and a Mexican notary is required??

Heather - 10-10-2012 at 12:47 PM

In regards to tourist visas needed, or if children can just be added to parents. If you are flying then everyone needs one. We drove down once, and at the border, they didn't issue one for my 5 year old...leaving SJD by air, it was a big hassle, because we needed to purchase the visa there.

I believe rules have changed about traveling with permission, etc. I used to have a notarized letter from hubby, if he wasn't making the trip with us. The last two times, the girls and I have flown down, and no permission was required in either direction. We do all have passports now, but no on cared where daddy was.

Mula - 10-10-2012 at 01:14 PM

Going back and forth in the 70's to Mazatlan with my son, I had to always have his dad's death certificate on me. And it was frequently checked!

Bob and Susan - 10-10-2012 at 03:19 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Ken Bondy
Do you think that things have now changed and a Mexican notary is required??


no i'm not saying you need to have a mexican notario do paperwork for you...not at all

i say the "notarizied permission letter" is not required or even necessary for vacationers in baja
the perception of a need is just an "urban myth" passed on from gringo to gringo

as for the visas...if you ask and the children are young...
the child may be attached to the adults visa
saving the cost of a visa for that child

if you drive across and fly back ALL should have a visa
each FLYER needs a visa to board a plane
check with the imn person at the airport early

more urban myths... truth or fiction????

mtgoat666 - 10-10-2012 at 04:24 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Bob and Susan
Quote:
Originally posted by Ken Bondy
Do you think that things have now changed and a Mexican notary is required??


i say the "notarizied permission letter" is not required or even necessary for vacationers in baja
the perception of a need is just an "urban myth" passed on from gringo to gringo



from Hillary Clinton herself: http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/cis/cis_970.html

"Minors: Mexican law requires that any non-Mexican citizen under the age of 18 departing Mexico must carry notarized written permission from any parent or guardian not traveling with the child to or from Mexico. This permission must include the name of the parent, the name of the child, the name of anyone traveling with the child, and the notarized signature(s) of the absent parent(s). The State Department recommends that the permission should include travel dates, destinations, airlines and a brief summary of the circumstances surrounding the travel. The child must be carrying the original letter – not a facsimile or scanned copy – as well as proof of the parent/child relationship (usually a birth certificate or court document) – and an original custody decree, if applicable. Travelers should contact the Mexican Embassy or the nearest Mexican consulate for current information."

also see: http://www.inm.gob.mx/index.php/page/pagina_principal/en.htm...

FINALLY, here is text from a mexican consulate website:

MINORS

Any person under 18 years of age is considered a minor. There are very strict govern regulations for minors traveling into Mexico.
If traveling alone, the minor must have a notarized * consent form , signed by both parents.
If traveling with only one parent, the minor must have a notarized * letter of consent signed by the parent not traveling.• If traveling with only one parent and the other parent is deceased or the child has only one legal parent, you must bring the Divorce Court Resolution, showing who has the custody of the child, a notarized * statement must be obtained as proof.
Airlines will also require the name, address and phone number of the person meeting the unaccompanied minor upon arrival in Mexico.
In all above cases children should have An American Passport or Birth certificate plus a photo ID. The I.D. can be obtained at the child school or at the Department of Public Safety (D.P.S.). If the school does not issue a photo identification, is acceptable a letter with the school letterhead, stating that the child is their student and it MUST contain a picture of the child, with the school stamp consealing the photo and the paper.
* The notary seal has to be current by the day of travel

see it online at: http://www.sre.gob.mx/austin/Documentacion/visas_FMT_eu_cand...


p.s. for you who still doubt, you can try calling the Embassy of Mexico at 1911 Pennsylvania Avenue NW, Washington, DC 20006, telephone (202) 736-1600, or any Mexican consulate in the United States.

[Edited on 10-10-2012 by mtgoat666]