BajaNomad - Residente card and automobiles

Residente card and automobiles

oxxo - 2-10-2014 at 05:26 PM

I just had a conversation with the guy who processes my Residente card application. He is an immigration officer by day and runs a processing business in his off hours.

I asked him about residente cards and the requirement for Mexican drivers license and driving a US plated car. He said if you have a Residente card you are required to have a Mexican drivers license. If you have a Mexican drivers license, you cannot drive a non-Mexican plated car. He said it makes no difference if it is a temporary residente card or permanent residente card - the requirements are the same. I asked how anyone is going to know. He said there is talk in the immigration office that all non-Mexican citizens are going to be required to carry their papers on them at all times! He said he is concerned that the police are now going to require "foreigners" to produce papers when pulled over in a traffic stop. Immigration reform retaliation?

Currently, I drive a California plated car with a California drivers license. I am going to monitor this situation closely. My immigration buddy will keep me posted on increased surveillance. The time is approaching when I will need to import my car.

DavidE - 2-10-2014 at 05:42 PM

Can you hear the Carpenter's Tune in the background....?

"We've only just begun..."

Nothing definitive, but...

Mulegena - 2-10-2014 at 08:45 PM

I was just in the Aduana office in Sta. Rosalia this afternoon. This particular office does not handle permanent import, i.e. nationalization, of vehicles they did not venture to offer an opinion yea or ney with regards to my car and my particular situation.

The Aduana offices in La Paz, Ensenada and Tijuana are the only offices on the peninsula that can answer these questions definitively.

An importer located in La Paz: Agencia Solis, 612-122-0635 or 612-128-9469.

[Edited on 2-11-2014 by Mulegena]

CortezBlue - 2-10-2014 at 09:12 PM

It's pretty simple

If you get pulled over, you don't give them your Perm Resident card. I have never been asked for my card, ever.

In Mexico, it is nearly impossible for the country to keep track of most everything, and everyone is worried about the plates on an auto?

Hardly anything to keep me up at night.

oxxo - 2-11-2014 at 05:51 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by CortezBlue
It's pretty simple

If you get pulled over, you don't give them your Perm Resident card. I have never been asked for my card, ever.

I agree, I have never been asked for I.D. either. But that MAY be changing. If you don't produce a Residente card you might be asked to produce your tourist visa.

Quote:

In Mexico, it is nearly impossible for the country to keep track of most everything, and everyone is worried about the plates on an auto?

I agree. I'm not saying this is definitely going to happen, I am just giving a "heads up" that the Government has been discussing it in official circles. They have been noticing all the South Dakota plates too.

Quote:

Hardly anything to keep me up at night.

Finally, I agree, but forewarned is forearmed.

oladulce - 2-11-2014 at 11:29 AM

Thanks for the info oxxo. This will greatly impact us also. I think our main vehicle is still too "new" to import.

Do you have to forfeit your US plates when you import your vehicle to Mexico?

MitchMan - 2-11-2014 at 12:05 PM

Did some research on importing my regular cab no frills standard shift 1998 SD registered 4wd 2.7L Tacoma. I am guessing that it may cost $2,000 USD (best info available, but not at all certain of this amount); the vehicle has a blue book value of $5,000 USD. If I have to drive it to the border to import it, that's another$700 USD for the round trip. The question is, when should I start the process?

I am waiting to hear of several reliable first hand witnessed reports with specific information and knowledge of actual current confiscations in the Baja before I consider importation of my truck. I am just hoping it won't be me who experiences the confiscation.

One alternative is to take the truck back to USA and sell it in southern California after I switch the registration from SD to Calif. I think that I can get $7000 to $8000 USD. BUT, and this is a big BUT, don't know if I can purchase a comparable and validly registered Mexican Tacoma for said $7,000 USD (my Tacoma only has 135,000 miles and drives like new).

[Edited on 2-11-2014 by MitchMan]

pacsur - 2-11-2014 at 12:23 PM

I have imported all my vehicles over the years, it makes life easier with Mexican plates for me.
Last year I imported a 2001 Toyota 4wd crew cab, it was under $1200 usd and completed in 1 day in Tijuana, for another $500p I received nacional plates instead of frontera.
My liability insurance is about $2100p and covers the USA also.
Do some research before choosing an importer, there are some bad ones that produce forged documents, I believe only the aduanas and camino federales can verify what is real?

gnukid - 2-11-2014 at 12:29 PM

If one were to believe the the rantings of some nomads, you would be unable to drive the same vehicle under the same plate and license from California to Baja and back having a temp or perm residency would only be an impossible burden.

DavidE - 2-11-2014 at 12:51 PM

Unrant the ranters gnukid. What say you about plates, and licenses?

weebray - 2-11-2014 at 01:03 PM

Can't believe nomads still whipping this horse. If you insist on asking aduana over and over and over this same question it eventually is going to get the attention of someone with the power to do something about it and you're gonna get the answer you're looking for. It really peees me off cuz your meddling is going to affect a bunch of people, and not in a good way. Stuff it back in your briefcase and wait instead of prodding the dragon. Geez us chrest.

oxxo - 2-11-2014 at 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by weebray
Can't believe nomads still whipping this horse. If you insist on asking aduana over and over and over this same question it eventually is going to get the attention of someone with the power to do something about it and you're gonna get the answer you're looking for. It really peees me off cuz your meddling is going to affect a bunch of people, and not in a good way. Stuff it back in your briefcase and wait instead of prodding the dragon. Geez us chrest.

Uhhhhhhh, my amigo in the immigration office brought it up to me, I didn't bring it up to him. The dragon is already out of the bottle. I'm sure if we ignore the obvious, it will just go away.

Mulegena - 2-11-2014 at 07:50 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by oxxo
I just had a conversation with the guy who processes my Residente card application. He is an immigration officer by day and runs a processing business in his off hours...The time is approaching when I will need to import my car.

I believe Immigration deals with people, not cars.

Aduana is the office that deals with the law regarding cars.

A couple of thoughts:
Your "processing guy" knows all this above.

It seems a conflict of interest to hire an immigration officer to process your Mexican visa.
He is already being paid by the government to do so. Why do you pay him, too?

If he advises you to import your car will you hire him to process that transaction, too?

who better to hire

akshadow - 2-11-2014 at 09:14 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mulegena
A couple of thoughts:
Your "processing guy" knows all this above.

It seems a conflict of interest to hire an immigration officer to process your Mexican visa.
He is already being paid by the government to do so. Why do you pay him, too?

If he advises you to import your car will you hire him to process that transaction, too?

He is not paid to process your Mexican visa. He is paid by government during day to follow their rules, by night you get the benefit of knowing what will be approved.

Mulegena - 2-11-2014 at 09:55 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by akshadow

Quote:

He is not paid to process your Mexican visa. He is paid by government during day to follow their rules, by night you get the benefit of knowing what will be approved.

Fair enough statement. Whoever wishes to hire someone to act as their representative in the immigration office has the right to do so. There are no restrictions as to who can act in this advisory position, anyone can do so. Hiring someone is optional.

However, at the immigration office each applicant is given an itemized list of requirements which he has to fulfill; the federal employee on duty verbally advises the person seeking the visa of each and every requirement that must be fulfilled. An application will not be accepted until these requirements are met-- yes, they do check the paperwork before submitting it for processing. This list is also available on-line. It's no secret.

Additionally, Aduana not Migracion, is the separate and distinct agency that handles the importation of cars. Yes, the federal government creates the rules, but the rules of automobile importation are reported to Aduana.

apple - 2-11-2014 at 10:32 PM

The more people bug the authorities about this the more likely it is that they'll realize that maybe they should be cracking down on it.

Mulegena - 2-11-2014 at 10:47 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by apple
The more people bug the authorities about this the more likely it is that they'll realize that maybe they should be cracking down on it.

Ahha, my point is in your statement. The "authorities" on the topic of this thread, I believe, is the office of Aduana, not Migracion.

I wouldn't go to Aduana to get my visa nor would I go to Migracion to import my car nor go to the electric company to pay my water bill.

stanburn - 2-12-2014 at 05:48 AM

Those of us living on the mainland have already been through this. Resident temporales can drive a foreign plated vehicle. Permanente can not. Federales here always ask for your visa and will confiscate the car. But that is here on the mainland, Manzanillo area to be exact.

Bob and Susan - 2-12-2014 at 05:50 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by pacsur
I have imported all my vehicles over the years, it makes life easier with Mexican plates for me.
Last year I imported a 2001 Toyota 4wd crew cab, it was under $1200 usd and completed in 1 day in Tijuana, for another $500p ...My liability insurance is about $2100p and covers the USA also.

so who did you use last year that takes ONLY one day
and who is your insurance with that covers mexico AND the USA

Tacodawgtim - 2-12-2014 at 06:32 AM

It seems that this is a bigger problem on mainland Mexico.. Becoming a problem in Baja Sur, and not much of a problem at all in Baja Norte. I think it relates more to the fact that in Baja Norte a visa is not required..because of the tourism near the border.
I just got my permanent residence card last year. I was told that it was ok to drive my us plated vehicle but if I went on to become imagrado, then it required a Mexican drivers license and Mexican plated vehicle.
I would think that the recent changes in the visa program is leading to this confusion..
Who really know for sure. Even getting the permanent residence card requirements vary depending on where you are living...

pacsur - 2-12-2014 at 07:01 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bob and Susan

Quote:

so who did you use last year that takes ONLY one day
and who is your insurance with that covers mexico AND the USA

Importer-Tijuana-(664) 623-8044 Sr Osuna

Tijuana insurance
ABA Seguros
Blvd. Agua Caliente 1854 Col. Aviación
Tijuana, B. C, 22410
Baja California / México
Tel. (664) 6863387 (664) 6863926
www.abaseguros.com

I'm now using insurance in Los Cabos with ABA
Off. Ph. (624) 143-1212, Ext.0
Fax: (624) 130-4083
US Toll free:1 (866) 376 22 89
front.desk@caboinsurance.com
www.caboinsurance.com

The last couple of cars I have bought in CA I never registered in the US, just take the pink and give them your id info how you want it titled.

[Edited on 2-12-2014 by pacsur]

Hook - 2-12-2014 at 07:17 AM

What many are describing are the all-to-familiar instances of a Mexican bureaucracy (take your pick, INM or Aduana) that doesnt train their employees very well on the latest, letter of the law. And so, we are left with many INTERPRETATIONS of the law; from office to office, employee to employee.

Maybe we should lighten up on fellow Nomads who are just trying to make some sense of the regular non-sense that IS Mexican bureaucracy. And alert the rest of us.

And I really DOUBT that asking questions of these employees is going to kick in some blanket "get-the-gringo" movement. It's already here; look at all that the new administration has implemented in the short time it's been in office. It's directed from on-high; not some grass-roots movement by employees.

Questioning them is good, especially if you have knowledge that regs are being enforced DIFFERENTLY in other parts of the country. Individual offices make mistakes in interpretation of the regs, especially when the regs are new. Our Guaymas office was off base on qualifications when the new residente cards came out. People pointed it out, based on information they were getting from other areas of Mexico. It changed. But it might have taken longer if people hadnt questioned the regs.

Often it was done through information on the internet.

Often this was done through these paid representatives. And why not? They deal with these bureaucracies for a living. And they speak Spanish better than most of us.

Mexico is changing. It's not the lack-of-regulation country it used to be. Might as well be a voice in the change. It might make a difference.

Look at the whole boating TIP fiasco. The Mexican government has come out and admitted they made mistakes in how they handled it. Their agents in that new bureaucracy under Hacienda were unfamiliar with the TIP program, as it related to boats. Many didnt realize there was a difference between hull numbers and VINs. Or that there was, originally, no separate TIP for boats and RVs. But people complained, questioned, used the internet and they backed down.

According to one of the marina owners over here, the Mexican Government is convening a meeting of marina owners in Mexico City to ask for input on a better way of enforcing TIPS with boaters. Questioning authority might have worked this time.

oladulce - 2-12-2014 at 08:26 AM

In our isolated area of Central Pacific BCS, and even on trips to La Paz, we'll occasionally see another car with South Dakota plates but it's a novelty. Holy Cow!- we drove through Cabo recently and it seems like every 5th car you see has SD plates.

As oxxo mentioned, it's really in your face when your driving around down there. Pretty sure that draws attention to the issue more than asking questions and internet discussions by ex-pats.

oxxo - 2-12-2014 at 08:51 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mulegena

It seems a conflict of interest to hire an immigration officer to process your Mexican visa.
He is already being paid by the government to do so. Why do you pay him, too?

It is not a conflict of interest for me to do so and it makes my life easier. I will let you be the morality police in Mexico. He gives me the latest "heads up" with regard to internal memos to INM from Mexico City. He told me that South Dakota plates and driving a US plated car with a Residente card are now on the radar at INM in Mexico City. He warned me to be careful. I wanted to share that bit of information with Nomads but I see that was a mistake. So if you don't like the information, please disregard.

Quote:

If he advises you to import your car will you hire him to process that transaction, too?

He already advised me to import my car to be in compliance with the law and my residente card. I may hire him if he offers that service and I decide to import. Why shouldn't I? Otherwise I will ask him for a recommendation for someone who can do it for me. Or maybe I will just do it myself. Should I run my decision through you first for permission? :?:

Pescador - 2-12-2014 at 09:00 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Tacodawgtim
It seems that this is a bigger problem on mainland Mexico.. Becoming a problem in Baja Sur, and not much of a problem at all in Baja Norte. I think it relates more to the fact that in Baja Norte a visa is not required..because of the tourism near the border.
I just got my permanent residence card last year. I was told that it was ok to drive my us plated vehicle but if I went on to become imagrado, then it required a Mexican drivers license and Mexican plated vehicle.
I would think that the recent changes in the visa program is leading to this confusion..
Who really know for sure. Even getting the permanent residence card requirements vary depending on where you are living...

There is no more inmigrado. Residente temporal or residente permanente. If you have Residente permanente, you can apply for naturalization, which would make you a citizen of Mexico.

Hook - 2-12-2014 at 09:08 AM

I thought that, too, Jim, but there are people who are still inmigrado from the previous set of rules. I dont believe they have had to get a permanente card. They are just..........inmigrado.

What have those people done, under the new rules, over in your neck of the woods? The ones I know are just laying low, not wanting to spend the bucks for permanente status.

Mulegena - 2-12-2014 at 09:35 AM

Now we're getting someplace, friends.
I've added this thread to Favorites.

Some really good information is coming from the various members, thank you all.

Oxxo I was not intending to challenge you personally, and don't feel that I addressed you with any disrespect, certainly none was intended. I do appreciate you starting this thread and your input in it.

Oxxo, another question please.
Would you be willing to share the name and contact information with the agent who is assisting you and his areas of expertise? Perhaps others in your locale would be interested in hiring him, too.

Again, thanks everyone for your input.

DavidE - 2-12-2014 at 10:17 AM

My new SD plates should be coming back with Celso. And I have no plans to visit Cabo San Locos. For the moment, the PFP does not seem interested in any paperwork except if the registration of the vehicle you are driving has the name of anyone in the car on it, and if your valid driver license is valid.

As stanburn pointed out so well above, when car regulations are adopted for the peninsula it will mean retenes de PFP. EVERYONE STOPS. Mexican drivers will be cited for license and registration infracciones. Residentes permanentes had better have their car with placas nacionales or the car gets towed to the corralon AND YOU WALK away. Visitors with 180 day FMM's will get their car and papers AUDITED. The 180-day temporary import permit is meticulously examined line-by-line, the VIN number of the car had better match EXACTLY the VIN number as posted on the 180-day car permit. Your driver license expiration date will determine whether or not you get 180-days. Fail to turn in your TIP for the car and you instantly lose 200-400 dollar deposit the day after the permit expires. You can not under any circumstance get another car permit until the violating vehicle is returned to the ADUANA/Banjercito inspection station, the hologram is scraped off by an Aduanero, and a huge fine is paid. I got an email from a Person living in Silver City New Mexico who complained Banjercito fined him more than 6,000 pesos, and after ALL THAT was cleared, Aduana stopped him at the border and refused to let him go through until 3-1/2 hours of phone calls to Aduana in Mexico City were made and "special permission" was given. He tried again, this year, was refused again, and got peeed off and returned home. Mexico has a huge problem with computers. Their programmers and the people who use them are untrained novices. This scream STOP! VIOLATOR! at the drop of a hat and have a hell of time correcting the information -- it is a freakin' zoo. On top of all that on the mainland HUNDREDS of nacionalized cars have been seized so far for having counterfeited federal paperwork. States issue license plates to car owners with counterfeit paperwork (importation papers), highway checkpoints by the PFP are linked by WiFi to Mexico's national import database, and if the car is not on it, ADIOS MF. If nacionalacion takes place DO NOT use a broker that is not on the official ADUANA list. Cars with USA or Canadian plates have to be processed at ADUANA through an agencia aduanal at the border.

Keep an eye out for any new construction, or improvements to existing highway structures south of Ensenada. When work begins or re-initiates it's time to start thinking about the possibility of temporary car permits coming soon. They need good microwave (WiFi) connectivity at such a structure.

I hate this krappola!

gnukid - 2-12-2014 at 11:46 AM

DavidE, IT appears much of your statement does not represent fact. At this point in time PR may drive US plated vehicle in BC and BCS. Until such time when the rules change that is the fact. I drive in BCS all over, I have recently been stopped and passed inspections by Federal Police on Federal property who asked for my drivers license, visa (PR) and checked the reg and it was fine. Also my friends are recently trained Aduana, one just returned from training today and they are also certain that RP in BC and BCS may drive valid US plated vehicles with US license.

More than likely these sort of arcane rules currently enforced on the mainland are set to go away since they are impractical for people who wish to invest and transit from USA to MX.

[Edited on 2-12-2014 by gnukid]

DavidE - 2-12-2014 at 11:55 AM

You need to brush up on your reading comprehension skills. What I wrote applies to the mainland. RULES there are tightening not becoming looser. Your last sentence, frankly amazes me. Those basic TIP RULES have been in force for TWENTY FOUR YEARS. Are set to go away? Jeez I wish they would not keep making them stricter. You are living in a dream bubble amigo. Lo Siento.

gnukid - 2-12-2014 at 12:30 PM

David, please stop with the hyperbole and nonsense. There is no threat or risk today for PR driving US plated cars in BC and BCS. You post the same innuendo and nonsense every week.

Imagine if you follow your logic, it would be impossible for anyone with PR to drive a car from USA to BAJA since they couldn't legally. The goals of the administration is to make it possible for more people to legally cross, invest, travel and interact across the border.

Bob and Susan - 2-12-2014 at 12:45 PM

you never have a problem if you have a big bag of money with you...

of course davidE doesn't have the "bag"

oxxo - 2-12-2014 at 12:58 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by gnukidit would be impossible for anyone with PR to drive a car from USA to BAJA since they couldn't legally.

Yes, that is the current situation, but apparently is not currently being enforced in Baja. If you are permanent resident you are supposed to drive your Mexican plated car to the US and drive it back. INM says that if you have a RP card, you are stating that you are a permanent resident of Mexico. You may return to the US for a short vacation or business, but while in Mexico, which your RP cards states is most of the time, you must drive a Mexican plated car. That rule is apparently being enforced more vigorously on the mainland than in Baja at this time, but the information I am getting from my INM amigo, the situation MAY change soon in Baja.

I have a backup plan (suggested by my "conflict of interest" INM amigo, off the record) that I intend to implement that will make me, INM, aduana, policia, and Federales all happy.

Quote:

The goals of the administration is to make it possible for more people to legally cross, invest, travel and interact across the border.

Where did you hear that? Apparently the goals of the US administration is to make it MORE difficult for Mexican people to legally cross, invest, work, travel, and interact across the border. Payback is a biotch.

[Edited on 2-12-2014 by oxxo]

gnukid - 2-12-2014 at 01:05 PM

This is silly, TODAY RP may drive US plated vehicles in BAJA.

There has been no official statement, law, or suggestion otherwise.

If the law changes, people will respond and adapt. Please stop posting about the threat of impounded vehicles in BAJA for RP visa holders.

DavidE - 2-12-2014 at 01:29 PM

Again, this SUBJECT is designed to alert folks to the fact that the nacionaliacion of cars in Baja Sur is inevitable. The question is WHEN. Sure wait until official notification comes through the one that says ONLY FRONTERA PLATE CARS CAN BE NATIONALIZED. This is what happened in northern states on the mainland. If you were driving a car with extraneous plates YOU WERE SCREWED. Is that plain enough? There will be a system where FRONTERA plate cars will allowed to be nationalized.

The MEXICAN GOVERNMENT DOES NOT ANNOUNCE PLANS FOR CARS FAR IN ADVANCE. How much time was given for Passport requirements? You can BET YOUR ASSSSS that advance warnings for INELIGIBILITY of extraneous cars to be FRONTERA plated will be 1/100th as long. Why should Baja California be any different than Sonora, Chihuahua, Tamaulipas...etc?

This isn't scare tactics gnukid, it is a head's up. INTELLIGENT people will take it no other way than a simple alert. Read mainland forums, there were/are plenty of people there just like you. You should hear them scream. No, it isn't funny to me. I feel sorry for them. If you choose to ignore discussion this is YOUR CHOICE AND NO ONE ELSE'S. The harder you scream about this the more people are going to remember your position when you scream again about not finding a car to buy. Think the delay of nationalizing a Frontera car is not going to look like a Chinese fire drill?

Some folks thought it hilarious, ludicrous, and worthy of denouncement when I wrote about the upcoming change to documentation requiring passports to get FMT's. Almost a year in advance. Yeah that was hilarious not, when they screamed about how long it was taking to get a passport. Darwin is harsh, keep it in mind...

DavidE - 2-12-2014 at 01:33 PM

To Oxxo,

My compliments. Now THAT is thinking and taking the smart path.

chippy - 2-12-2014 at 01:43 PM

DavidE is right about mainland Mexico. They are cracking down bigtime not lightening up as gnu implied. In the last two weeks I´ve been stopped twice and my wife once by the feds and they were very thorough with their inspection. The local transito has gotten in on the action and is loading up on mordida pesos.

gnukid - 2-12-2014 at 01:46 PM

DavidE,

Funny how you are certain about the inevitable certainty of your predictions...

gnukid - 2-12-2014 at 01:57 PM

The laws across Mexico and across North America are being homogenized to make interactions between the countries more seamless, that doesn't suggest there is lightening up on enforcement.

Whatever does happen, I'll be sure to read the law carefully myself and share facts when it does.

Remember, that no one is forced to have a permanent resident card and you can turn it in whenever you want. As problems go this isn't on the map.

[Edited on 2-12-2014 by gnukid]

Hook - 2-12-2014 at 02:20 PM

Well, I just got back from a US Consulate sponsored meeting in San Carlos, Sonora.

The Consulate did a good job of organizing it.

The Mexican representative for Comercia Exterior, a branch of Aduana, pretty much had his head up his ...............

Easily the most popular topic was what happens when you have a Permanente card and you drive a foreign plated vehicle? Nothing, according to him. In the free zone, in the rest of Mexico, it doesn't matter. It's legal..............or so he thought.

He did a quick back track when audience members informed him that people with PR cards are being denied All of Mexico permits. It was news to him.......but he promised to get back to all of us via email. :rolleyes:

Also mentioned was the new procedure on the mainland where Aduana is now issuing a permit that gives you FIVE DAYS to return your car to the border IF you have become a RP card holder and have a foreign plated vehicle. Bottom line: you cannot drive a foreign plated vehicle outside of the free zone with an RP. But this poor employee just found that out, today..........from gringos. :lol:

I spoke with our US Consulate after the meeting and he confirmed that persons with RP cards are having trouble all over the mainland with their foreign plated cards. He also reiterated that, at other meetings with other Aduana officials, the story is different than what we heard today.

Other "highlights" from the meeting..........

1-according to this same quasi-Aduana guy, you do NOT need to keep your US boat registration current IF you have a current 10 year, importation permit on the boat. But a land based RV must be kept current.

2-the visitante permit (the 180 day one that has been called an FMT, FMM in the past) IS renewable, consecutively. Or, if you leave before 180 days, you can apply for a new 180 day permit. No limit within a year, according to an INM representative. Of course they did say it should be turned in when you leave the country. No one I know does that, when leaving by land. They continue to reuse it until such time as it is close to, or expired. Remember, many of us over here are not vacationers like most Nomads seem to be.

3-IF you lose your RP or RT card within Mexico, you need to file a police report and you can then apply for re-issuance of a new one. No mention of the cost. If you lose it in a foreign country, you need to inform the Mexican consulate in that country and apply there.

4-as most already know, you have to initiate the application for a RP or an RT OUTSIDE Mexico, unless you are on the progression track by virtue of already having had an FM3. But if you miss your renewal deadline along the way, YOU START OVER AT THE BEGINNING.

[Edited on 2-12-2014 by Hook]

[Edited on 2-12-2014 by Hook]

Funny How

DavidE - 2-12-2014 at 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by gnukid
DavidE,

Funny how you are certain about the inevitable certainty of your predictions...

Funny How I Chat With A DELAGADO FEDERAL Regularly

DavidE - 2-12-2014 at 02:29 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by gnukid
DavidE,

Funny how you are certain about the inevitable certainty of your predictions...

Who travels between xxxxxxx and Mexico regularly. The proof is in the pudding. When this "Plays Out" we'll all know, won't we. The horselaughers about the need for a passport refused to respond when that law was enacted. FUNNY how life is. Keep in mind my "prediction" actually encourages the use of common sense. Maybe I should change it to UNcommon sense in some cases.

Mulegena - 2-12-2014 at 02:43 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by pacsur

Quote:

Originally posted by Bob and Susan

Quote:

so who did you use last year that takes ONLY one day
and who is your insurance with that covers mexico AND the USA

Excellent information, pacsur, Sir!

Thank you!!

DaliDali - 2-12-2014 at 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Hook

4-as most already know, you have to initiate the application for a RP or an RT OUTSIDE Mexico, unless you are on the progression track by virtue of already having had an FM3. But if you miss your renewal deadline along the way, YOU START OVER AT THE BEGINNING.

[Edited on 2-12-2014 by Hook]

That may not be completely accurate in regards to going RP in MX and using the progression track from FM3/FM2/RP. Perhaps on what location one is using and whom your dealing with may be different.

Personal experience......my FM2 expired last August 2013.
The local Migra official told me 3 times......a person has 6 months from the expiration date of the FM2 to begin the RP process.

Sure enough that was the case for me. FM2 expired in August....RP was started in October and RP in hand about 5 weeks later without a hitch or hiccup.

DavidE - 2-12-2014 at 03:47 PM

X2 Kudos pacsur

Riom - 2-12-2014 at 07:18 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mulegena

and who is your insurance with that covers mexico AND the USA

Both my previous ABA policy, and my current Qualitas policy (on my Mexican plated car) cover Mexico, USA (excl. Alaska) and Canada for both coverage and liability. For Canada, you need to ask the insurer to give you a copy of a Canadian proof of insurance card (no charge). The USA paperwork comes as standard with the policy.

Mulegena - 2-12-2014 at 07:43 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Riom

Quote:

Originally posted by Mulegena

and who is your insurance with that covers mexico AND the USA

Would you tell us why you switched from ABA to Qualitas?

Riom - 2-12-2014 at 10:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mulegena
Would you tell us why you switched from ABA to Qualitas?

My broker suggested the change as it was cheaper, for similar coverage. Not a vast difference (ABA was reasonable as well), but no need to pay more than I have to...

This year the policy was just under 7000 MXN (US$525) for a full year. Damage and theft (US$ 7000 car value), 3 million pesos liability in Mexico, 1.2 million pesos in US/Canada, plus some medical, legal and travel assistance. The premium goes down each year as the car declines in value. Might be worth switching to liability-only eventually, but even for full coverage for all three countries it's only $10 a week.

Mulegena - 2-13-2014 at 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Riom

Quote:

Originally posted by Mulegena
Would you tell us why you switched from ABA to Qualitas?

Excellent! Thank you so much.

gnukid - 2-15-2014 at 07:30 AM

http://colectivopericu.net/2014/02/14/avala-la-policia-feder...

Here is news related to this topic. The article states that Federal Police may not impound vehicles in the free zone, and that drivers of non-imported vehicles who comply with the basic requirements may choose a legal path and use Anapromex laminated stickers in the window instead of importation to legally drive throughout Baja's free zone.

Let's hear of reports.

gilmarlin - 2-21-2014 at 08:53 PM

I bought a house in San Felipe, I had an FM3, but I allowed it to lapse over a year ago because of all the confusion regarding the renewal of it. I was advised this time to apply for PR card at the Consulate in Calexico. Now I'm confused and wonder if I really want that if it is going to mean registering my car in Mexico. Is there another status that I should apply for as a property owner? I was advised that I needed some kind of resident card in case I have any legal disputes regarding my property. Thanks for any information...

PaulW - 2-22-2014 at 09:54 AM

I read that the free zone had been canceled after the last election. if there is a free zone what area does it include.
PW

gilmarlin - 2-22-2014 at 10:28 AM

Evidently, nothing is "Free"...

DavidE - 2-22-2014 at 04:38 PM

gilmarlin, you have EVERY derecho with an FMM as you so with a permanente card. Because I am a citizen I can (and do) own land in the Federal Zone.

It's folks way the hell and gone deep in Mexico that sweated the residente carro nacional issue. You are so close to the border it should be a minor issue for you.

gilmarlin - 2-22-2014 at 04:45 PM

Thanks for the reply David, are you saying that an FM3(temporary resident) or an FM2 (permanent resident) card is what I should try and get? I'm going to San Felipe on Monday and want to try and start the process at the Consulate in Calexico on my way down...

New Cards

bajaguy - 2-22-2014 at 05:00 PM

There are no more FM-3 (now Residente Temporal) or FM-2 (now Residente Permante). It is my understanding that you can only do up to 4 years as a Residente Temporal before you are required to upgrade to a Residente Permante. Might as well go for the Residente Permante as it will save you money on the Residente Temporal renewals..........however, YMMV

Quote:

Originally posted by gilmarlin
Thanks for the reply David, are you saying that an FM3(temporary resident) or an FM2 (permanent resident) card is what I should try and get? I'm going to San Felipe on Monday and want to try and start the process at the Consulate in Calexico on my way down...

DavidE - 2-22-2014 at 05:13 PM

If you cross the border often, then why not go for the FMM twice a year? The residente permanente gives you no additional land rights. Hell I don't think my citizenship gives me additional rights over an FMM except as I wrote the ability to own a deed minus a fideicomiso. My home in Michoacan is 5 solid days of driving from the frontera and two trips a year would be hideously expensive and inconvenient. I do NOT trust this administration as far as I can hurl it. If they go through with their plans for placas nacionales, then it's going to complicate things a lot. Returning to the border every 5th year would be a pain for me. A 4,000 mile round trip. 145 dollars in tolls each way and higher-than-hell hotel rates. A multi-day stay in the USA? Ni Modo.

I would stick with the FMM personally. Rules change and noses snot up pretty suddenly these days.

Foreign Plated Vehicules -PR-FMT

thefishaholic - 2-22-2014 at 09:56 PM

At a dinner party last nite here in Cabo someone said a local Federale got in a screaming match and threatened to confiscate a PR's car because of South Dakota Plates???

Turns out the PR fly's back and forth from the USA and leaves his car here. Others said they do the same.
I always thought that you cannot leave a foreign plated RV, Car or boat without the proper importation or TIP but if you are driving back and forth in the vehicle you were OK.

In speaking with a local semi official he stated that since we are PR and go back and forth in our Car it is OK?

Wondering if this leaving your vehicle here and the non payment of fees is what the PR issue is really all about.

Going to get interesting.

FMM and border crossings

akshadow - 2-23-2014 at 09:18 AM

I asked migration official at the Mexicali East crossing if we are supposed to turn in the FMM when we leave Baja. He said yes.
I then asked, if only for a day or two to get medicines etc.? He then said no need to turn it in for very short trips out of Baja.

Not sure what real answer is, but I guess like many things it is the what the official standing in front of you believes it is.

Hook - 2-23-2014 at 09:46 AM

I dont know how this relates to all this but a person applying for a new Visitante card had it bar code scanned after being issued it. The person asked if these were now being computerized and the answer was YES.

But several INM officials have reiterated that you CAN get consecutive Visitantes and/or multiple ones within a year.

I really think I am going back to the visitante, rather than going for RP. Just not worth it for someone who is only about 5 hours from the border. My cars are no longer importable according to the LATEST rumor I heard on qualifying vehicles. What am I supposed to do; buy a beaten up car down here if I want to travel south on the mainland? No thanks. Unless you buy a used car down here from a gringo, they are unmaintained pieces of chit.

monoloco - 2-23-2014 at 10:04 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DavidE
If you cross the border often, then why not go for the FMM twice a year? The residente permanente gives you no additional land rights. Hell I don't think my citizenship gives me additional rights over an FMM except as I wrote the ability to own a deed minus a fideicomiso. My home in Michoacan is 5 solid days of driving from the frontera and two trips a year would be hideously expensive and inconvenient. I do NOT trust this administration as far as I can hurl it. If they go through with their plans for placas nacionales, then it's going to complicate things a lot. Returning to the border every 5th year would be a pain for me. A 4,000 mile round trip. 145 dollars in tolls each way and higher-than-hell hotel rates. A multi-day stay in the USA? Ni Modo.

I would stick with the FMM personally. Rules change and noses snot up pretty suddenly these days.

You are absolutely correct, the ONLY reason to get a RP or RT is if you reside full time in Mexico and want to avoid having to drive up to the border to get a new tourist card twice a year, or are gainfully employed in Mexico. Other than that, I can see absolutely no benefit to having it.

gilmarlin - 2-23-2014 at 10:08 AM

It says right on the tourist card that you must surrender it when leaving the country (I know, you've never had to do it in the past), but these days if their computer system works they could refuse to issue a new one if they haven't received the old one.

You can mail your immigration form to the State Secretariat of Tourism P.O. Box #2448 Chula Vista Ca. Zip. 91912 and they will return it to Mexican Immigration.

I don't think that the tourist card every 6 months is what I want, so I need to find out if I'm stuck starting over with a Temporary Resident of if I can just get the Permanent Resident. As far as having to get Mexican Plates, my friend in San Felipe who has a business said that his car insurance is cheaper, so that's one good thing... :lol:

gnukid - 2-23-2014 at 10:37 AM

To change status, one should generally apply in your home state, city mexican consulate, for example, San Diego, CA. You can read the requirements by visiting mexconnect.com and check on translated versions of the requirements and suggestions.

Retirees may qualify by income of about $3000US monthly or by a bank balance of some amount approx 120k/US or by point system that takes into account your cultural contribution and background in mexico, mexican family connections, ability to speak spanish, level and type of education.

At your home mexican consulate you will pay a fee of about $26 to apply and if you receive approval you must visit your mexican home IMN and submit the approved application with 6 months of issue and within 10 days or arrival in Mexico. The local INM may not override the decision of the consulate and must act on the decision if the information you provide is consistent with the application.

One can be a PR and then choose to no longer be PR later or you can keep it forever and never apply again. Your choice. It's not the end of the world in any case. Good luck

monoloco - 2-23-2014 at 10:42 AM

If you don't currently have some kind of residency status, you must start the process at the Mexican consulate in your home country.

gnukid - 2-23-2014 at 10:57 AM

Generally any change in status requires you apply at the mexican consulate closest to your home country address. For example FM3 to PR, Temp to Perm, FMM to Perm. If you are on the correct track with FM-3 in the final renewal or with FM-2 then and you want to be PR it is not necessarily required to go to the consulate since sit is not a change in status. Other cases may also apply at IMN for example married to a mexican etc... professional in sciences, honorary person etc...

MitchMan - 2-23-2014 at 11:39 AM

I don't buy the argument that there is no difference in rights between FMM, RT and RP. Distinctions are ONLY legal. FMM is for "visitors" and by definition, that means the individual is only visiting which is by all perspectives temporary and limited to 180 consecutive days.

My Mexican attorney told me that a holder of an FMM may not leave tangible personal property (TPP) behind when they leave Mexico, but that RPs can leave certain TPP behind when they leave the country. Also, I was told that if you have real estate in Mexico by way of a fido, if you are a holder of an FMM, you have no standing in Mexican courts to assert your rights to defend your interest in the real estate if it is challenged since you are merely a visitor with no residency rights. Makes sense to me.

Also, if you have a casita by way of a fido, you can take TPP furnishings for the casita from the USA to your casita and 'leave it there' in the casita. Not sure what the 'technical legal' situation is with regard to leaving TPP furnishings behind in a casita is if you hold and FMM and have a fido casita. My guess is that an FMM holder probably cannot legally take furnishings from USA to his/her fido casita and leave them there. Just because many FMMs have done it doesn't mean it is technically legal.

It seems to be an accepted way of life in Baja to live with technical illegalities, especially since knowledge and enforcement of Mexican law at all levels of government is so haphazard, slipshod, and inconsistent.

[Edited on 2-23-2014 by MitchMan]

gilmarlin - 2-23-2014 at 01:09 PM

That's a good point concerning personal property, if and when I obtain permanent status, I have 6 months to import my household to Mexico without any fees... Here's a link to a site that is full of translated, up to date info...

http://yucalandia.com/answers-to-common-questions/new-rules-...

monoloco - 2-23-2014 at 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by MitchMan
I don't buy the argument that there is no difference in rights between FMM, RT and RP. Distinctions are ONLY legal. FMM is for "visitors" and by definition, that means the individual is only visiting which is by all perspectives temporary and limited to 180 consecutive days.

My Mexican attorney told me that a holder of an FMM may not leave tangible personal property (TPP) behind when they leave Mexico, but that RPs can leave certain TPP behind when they leave the country. Also, I was told that if you have real estate in Mexico by way of a fido, if you are a holder of an FMM, you have no standing in Mexican courts to assert your rights to defend your interest in the real estate if it is challenged since you are merely a visitor with no residency rights. Makes sense to me.

Also, if you have a casita by way of a fido, you can take TPP furnishings for the casita from the USA to your casita and 'leave it there' in the casita. Not sure what the 'technical legal' situation is with regard to leaving TPP furnishings behind in a casita is if you hold and FMM and have a fido casita. My guess is that an FMM holder probably cannot legally take furnishings from USA to his/her fido casita and leave them there. Just because many FMMs have done it doesn't mean it is technically legal.

It seems to be an accepted way of life in Baja to live with technical illegalities, especially since knowledge and enforcement of Mexican law at all levels of government is so haphazard, slipshod, and inconsistent.

[Edited on 2-23-2014 by MitchMan]

I was involved in a court case to defend my rights in a matter concerning a lease, I was never asked for anything but a passport, and there was never any inquiry as to my immigration status. I am certain if there was any possibility that it would have made a difference in the outcome, the opposing lawyer would have been all over it.

CortezBlue - 2-24-2014 at 07:23 PM

When we update our FM2 in 2012, we were told that RP was our only option because we were home owners in Mexico. We were also told that there are no limitations or rules around "Full Time" in Mexico. We were told we could come and go as we please.

I don't think that this issue around having a Mexico plated vehicle is valid. I am going to talk to the lady who did my RP and ask her about it and will update what I find out.

I may license my 88 bronco that I leave at my casa in San Felipe just because I really like the Baja plate!!

Russ - 2-24-2014 at 08:57 PM

Remember there are restrictions on importing an older car. Don't know what the limits are.

Plates

bajaguy - 2-24-2014 at 09:25 PM

OK, so if this is a big deal (RP's and importing cars), what about the ziillion Mexican Nationals whom I assume are permanent residents driving cars with expired US plates..........anybody going after them???

Importing Cars IN Cabo

thefishaholic - 2-25-2014 at 02:25 PM

Just got this from a friend in Cabo.

"Anyone need to import their car? Get in touch with me, I have a friend who is going to be doing a 'mass importing' soon for a very reasonable price and you don't have to take your vehicle to Tijuana. NO bribes, real importation!"

After I warned of possible consequences he stated that he knew the guy and that the guy has been putting this together for a while and trusted him.

DavidE - 2-25-2014 at 02:40 PM

ah jeez, go to a mainland forum

"I am Prince Najeebeebooboo and my father was poisoned by FSB Agents with Polonium. I selected your name from a list of faithful religious followers and have decided to entrust you with 108,532 tons of Nigerian Platinum. But we need to charter a freighter".

Been There Done That Got The Tee Shirt And Secret Whistle.

Go to secgob ADUANA and ask them about the legitimacy if this quackery. After the guy pries himself off the floor and wipes his eyes dry he will explain to you the reality of the more than three thousand "nacionalizados" that were phony but still managed to get state license plates. You'll find the vehicles scattered throughout a few dozen corralones federales throughout Mexico.

ViajeraGal - 3-4-2014 at 05:15 PM

there's a lot of talk about the importation of foreign plated vehicles in BajaSur as mentioned.

ONLY vehicles older than 5 years and not as old as 10 years fall under this law; unfortunately my vehicle falls within that timeframe, being a 2008.

Currently I am in Rosarito and was originally considering doing the import thing, but don't really want to, and was talking with my lawyer here on other matters, and so I queried him about this and he said he believes that it is NOT necessary unless and until one attains Mexican CITIZENSHIP. Obviously, one needs to have up-to-date vehicle registration and current US/Canada driver's license, otherwise you would be at risk for it being impounded.
I have heard from the guys who charge down south to take vehicles north for the importation process, that there are a lot of impounded vehicles at the San Jose' del Cabo AIRPORT----but I tend to think that IF that is true, they were not current on rego or license, or something else. I think they stir up a lot of fear in this regard to get business; but I would be really wary of

that's my 2 bits for what it's worth. We have always done our best to be legal and fit in with the local culture etc., but know it's best not to make waves, as also aforementioned.

gilmarlin - 3-5-2014 at 10:16 AM

I went to the Consulate in Calexico again with all the documents that they had asked for in November. The person at the Consulate was not interested in any of them except for my bank statements and copies of my passport. :no:

They didn't accept the bank statements that showed 3-4 thousand dollars per month of deposits. They wanted to see where they came from. I told them they were direct deposits for consulting fees that I receive, still the answer was no. I explained that I am not the typical retired person that receives a pension or social security so I don't know how else to prove that I am financially solvent. She said that if I could show investments totaling $125,000 dollars for 12 months , that would work. I mentioned that I had brought in copies of my savings in November which showed just that, and that they had refused to accept them then. She said the Consulate had changed personnel since then and the rules had changed... :lol: