BajaNomad - lockin n loaden border

lockin n loaden border

Nye - 3-14-2014 at 08:25 AM

Keepin up with local border news we see protesters either deported or "anchor baby" now in U.S services webnews afterpost-sayin no amnesty they r the intuders - so now why again r we here n Baja not
intruding here?

[Edited on 3-14-2014 by Nye]

[Edited on 3-14-2014 by Nye]

Ateo - 3-14-2014 at 08:32 AM

I'm for humans being able to traverse borders, and the sharing of cultures. I think the bashing stuff you see on tv and hear on radio is meant to sell advertising.

Hook - 3-14-2014 at 09:02 AM

I like borders. Without them, everything would be the same.

dtbushpilot - 3-14-2014 at 09:11 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Hook
I like borders. Without them, everything would be the same.

Exactly. We couldn't go anywhere because we would already be there.. :biggrin:

gnukid - 3-14-2014 at 09:13 AM

In the us protestors are not deported based on free speech, they only be deported in the case of criminal activity that is demonstrated and provable or by their own admission. Many cities are sanctuary cities and people can not be asked for proof of immigration for no cause of suspicion.

Families with US born children are treated differently than individuals without children.

Mexicans who state they arrived as children and attended school can be granted amnesty.

Many other cases for amnesty exist as well.

On the other hand there are record number of deportations, apparently.

Look up constitutional court cases in california and you'll see many cases of illegal stops, illegal confiscation of vehicles by tow companies apparently giving kickbacks, including a recent case of 5-6 SF police charged with robbing immigrants as well as recent rape charges against police for raping immigrants.

Police may not impound cars of non-licensed drivers
http://www.mv-voice.com/print/story/2011/02/18/off-the-hook-...

Police with robbing immigrant
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/crime/san-francisco-cops-cha...

Police charged with raping immigrant
http://www.mercurynews.com/crime-courts/ci_25318637/san-jose...

absinvestor - 3-14-2014 at 09:23 AM

Based on my limited data it does seem that the US makes it really difficult for Mexicans to visit the US vs the ease Mexico makes it for us. For example the daughter of a very successful motel/restaurant owner here in Huatabampito was denied a visa because she was single?? Eventually when her parents decided to visit and they applied as a family she was approved. I know several other legal Mexicans working in the US that have similar stories where a family member living and working in Mexico (with no desire to relocate to the US) can't can't a visa to visit relatives in the US. We have to find the answer for illegal immigration but I'm not sure that denying visas to those who want to visit/vacation in the US helps.

David K - 3-14-2014 at 09:46 AM

If you lived near the border or work in the landscape industry, it isn't hard at all to understand why the rules are different for each country.

Not all, but a large percentage of:

Americans going south into Mexico:
1) Use the legal border crossing
2) Bring enough money or supplies to support themselves in Mexico
3) Bring additional money to spend at Mexican businesses

Mexican going north into the USA:
1) Cross illegally and avoid or attack the border patrol
2) Have little or no money for what they need.
3) Need to work at American businesses to survive and send money back to Mexico.

Not saying I agree or disagree, I am saying the reason why the rules are harder on the good, legal Mexicans... the bad apples spoil it for the good ones!

absinvestor - 3-14-2014 at 09:56 AM

David K- I agree. It just seems like sometimes the people making the decisions don't use a lot of common sense.

David K - 3-14-2014 at 10:05 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by absinvestor
David K- I agree. It just seems like sometimes the people making the decisions don't use a lot of common sense.

Exactly... so when do we (as a nation) once again elect people that have common sense? Have a great day! :light:

DENNIS - 3-14-2014 at 10:29 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ateo
I'm for humans being able to traverse borders, and the sharing of cultures.

When our economies are similar, that may be possible. Do you think all these Mexicans are coming to the states because they like us? Their motto may as well be, "The best part of the Red, White and Blue, is Green."

.

[Edited on 3-14-2014 by DENNIS]

J.P. - 3-14-2014 at 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by David K

Quote:

Originally posted by absinvestor
David K- I agree. It just seems like sometimes the people making the decisions don't use a lot of common sense.

Exactly... so when do we (as a nation) once again elect people that have common sense? Have a great day! :light:

By Who's definition do we certify their common sense?

DJL - 3-14-2014 at 11:15 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by absinvestor
Based on my limited data it does seem that the US makes it really difficult for Mexicans to visit the US vs the ease Mexico makes it for us.

This is fact . My best Friend is a Mexican from La Ribera ... and we cannot get him up here for a visit without undue hoop-jumping .

I find the xenophobes who rant and scream for a wall to be built between us and Mexico seem to be overlooking something - while illegals are an issue .... what about the seemingly millions of LEGAL immis' coming in from Eastern Europe ? Every day , there's another Airplane load of folks coming in .... sponsored by whatever church . The Russian/Ukraine population in the greater Sacramento area is well over 60,000 currently , and the local job market isn't what I would call thriving . Lots of the new arrivals are quite elderly and on the dole . I've no ill will against them (or anyone looking for a better life) , but cannot help but wonder - are they here because they're White ?

It would seem to be a bit of a double-standard .

D.~

DavidE - 3-14-2014 at 11:32 AM

When I did a solar installation near Tecate CA. I wondered why the "indocumentos" insisted on vandalizing the well pump and generator as they passed through. Every day the area was strewn with Oxxo drink cups and Gigante shopping bags so the individuals were not from the US.

We left the uphill pipe spigot in place which allowed the flow of around 300 gallons, but that does not explain broken spark plugs and distributor caps, and panels ripped off the generator. My customer's son was a Special Forces staff sergeant. He brought some illumination flares and trip wire flash-bank-like grenades. That night after him spending several hours rigging the trap I was awakened a few minutes after midnight by a tremendous concussion.

The vandalism stopped at least for the following nine days. The house is at least a quarter mile from the well. The grenade (tied way the hell and gone up an oak tree), and the flash grenade tied to the 20' high derrick over the well seemed to work. It takes just a few punks to give great ammunition to the anti indocumentos crowd.

But fleeing Mexican justice is not a small nor an insignificant matter. Too many scumbags cross into the USA. There are no easy answers IMHO.

David K - 3-14-2014 at 11:35 AM

My best Mexican friend in Mexico comes here all the time for purchasing supplies and electronics for his business in Mexico. Obviously, he did what was required to get the visa needed for this.

sancho - 3-14-2014 at 11:43 AM

A few weeks back, standing in the Ped Line coming back
to the US at TJ, was a young guy, Mex National who was
using his new Border crossing card, took him 7 yrs. to
get. No borders, can't get behind that

apple - 3-14-2014 at 11:45 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Nye
Keepin up with local border news we see protesters either deported or "anchor baby" now in U.S services webnews afterpost-sayin no amnesty they r the intuders - so now why again r we here n Baja not
intruding here?

Can someone please translate that to English for me?

Cisco - 3-14-2014 at 12:01 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ateo
I'm for humans being able to traverse borders, and the sharing of cultures. I think the bashing stuff you see on tv and hear on radio is meant to sell advertising.

That's a total BS statement Jon and I'm surprised to hear it from you.

There are too many documented incidents of abuse for you to have a closed mind on this subject.

BP agents not charged because the people they killed died in another country, one, unarmed, with six shots IN THE BACK are just two examples. I could give you two hundred and you know it.

"The addiction to the pleasure and excitement of power and authority is far more heinous to all humans than any drug. Those who exercise their inimical addiction to power and authority are committing acts of destruction on the entire nation.

Cops are addicted to the (find) they have tunnel vision and get a heavy dopamine and adrenalin rush when they find something in your car or on you. Like money, drugs or what ever. They are very, very sick people with a need for control and to dominate over any satiation they force themselves into."

Bob53 - 3-14-2014 at 12:03 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by apple

Quote:

Can someone please translate that to English for me?

haha

rts551 - 3-14-2014 at 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by absinvestor
Based on my limited data it does seem that the US makes it really difficult for Mexicans to visit the US vs the ease Mexico makes it for us. For example the daughter of a very successful motel/restaurant owner here in Huatabampito was denied a visa because she was single?? Eventually when her parents decided to visit and they applied as a family she was approved. I know several other legal Mexicans working in the US that have similar stories where a family member living and working in Mexico (with no desire to relocate to the US) can't can't a visa to visit relatives in the US. We have to find the answer for illegal immigration but I'm not sure that denying visas to those who want to visit/vacation in the US helps.

So true.... I know people who have been denied for being single as well, even though they were students or had a good job.

rts551 - 3-14-2014 at 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by David K
If you lived near the border or work in the landscape industry, it isn't hard at all to understand why the rules are different for each country.

Not all, but a large percentage of:

Americans going south into Mexico:
1) Use the legal border crossing
2) Bring enough money or supplies to support themselves in Mexico
3) Bring additional money to spend at Mexican businesses

Mexican going north into the USA:
1) Cross illegally and avoid or attack the border patrol
2) Have little or no money for what they need.
3) Need to work at American businesses to survive and send money back to Mexico.

Not saying I agree or disagree, I am saying the reason why the rules are harder on the good, legal Mexicans... the bad apples spoil it for the good ones!

what a BS statement. There are more legal crossers going North than illegal...just sit in line at the border

and I know of more than a few illegal crossers going south (as we all do).

Lets use some common sense here :lol:

Cisco - 3-14-2014 at 12:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sancho
A few weeks back, standing in the Ped Line coming back
to the US at TJ, was a young guy, Mex National who was
using his new Border crossing card, took him 7 yrs. to
get. No borders, can't get behind that

Sancho, I posted before that for seven years I tried to get a green card for our iive-in Nanny (She was with us for 14 years total, until the kids grew up) and was unsuccessful.

I owned three businesses in San Diego, was active politically in my community and was well known in San Diego and T.J.

It was not until my wife and I were at a house party in T.J. and I had a chance to talk to the American Consul who was also there. He said all the paperwork, all the delay,...was because 'we' (U.S.) did not want Mexican immigration at that time.We wanted asian tech people.

Well, my wife and his wife got tight together (still are friends) and two weeks later a diplomatic car pulls up at my office and I was handed (without explanation) a green card for my Nanny's kid in Michoacan,

We had him up here in three days.

Yea, life's not fair.

EDIT: Should read our live-in Nanny's Son. She was already in.

[Edited on 3-14-2014 by Cisco]

sancho - 3-14-2014 at 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by rts551

and I know of more than a few illegal crossers going south (as we all do).

I suppose those Gringos crossing illegally into Mex, without
Mex immigration approval, I suppose, are a drain to
the Republic of Mex? Spending $ in many shapes and forms,
excuse me if I misread you and you are being sarcastic

David K - 3-14-2014 at 02:16 PM

I said "large percentage", compared to Americans legally going south, not a 'majority'. Silly Ralph, words are for reading!

Illegal crossers going south? Really... like in the desert near Ocotillo? There is a wall... and Americans going south do so in trucks and SUVs and not with just the shirt on their backs and a bag.

David K - 3-14-2014 at 02:20 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sancho

Quote:

Originally posted by rts551

and I know of more than a few illegal crossers going south (as we all do).

I think we all know that nobody crosses south illegally... CROSSING.

What can happen and its by design for lack of working systems, is that Americans stay in Mexico near the border more than 3 days without tourist cards or they drive south of the border zone without tourist cards... but that isn't crossing illegally.

No signs, no immigration checkpoint at Maneadero or San Felipe, nothing to let Americans know or to sell them new tourist cards.

Bajahowodd - 3-14-2014 at 04:59 PM

I understand additionally, that a substantial fee is required when filing an application for a visa to enter the US. That fee is not refundable if they deny your request.

bajaguy - 3-14-2014 at 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by David K
..........No signs, no immigration checkpoint at Maneadero or San Felipe, nothing to let Americans know or to sell them new tourist cards........

David..........I don't think it's up to Mexico to post signs. If you visit a foreign country, it is up to you as the visitor to know the rules........do some research before you go

willardguy - 3-14-2014 at 05:43 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Cisco

Quote:

Originally posted by Ateo
I'm for humans being able to traverse borders, and the sharing of cultures. I think the bashing stuff you see on tv and hear on radio is meant to sell advertising.

yup. looks we got us another dirty one.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/03/14/dead-border-agent-k...

sancho - 3-15-2014 at 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bajaguy

I don't think it's up to Mexico to post signs. If you visit a foreign country, it is up to you as the visitor to know the rules

Yes it is, it s the responsibility of the Tourist to know and
obey the Laws/Regs beforehand. It can be cumbersome, vague, and misinformation abounds. At times it can be ALMOST impossible to comply. Howerver that does not
change the fact is is the Visitors obligation to comply.
Fmm's, Fishing License, etc

David K - 3-15-2014 at 04:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bajaguy

Quote:

Originally posted by David K
..........No signs, no immigration checkpoint at Maneadero or San Felipe, nothing to let Americans know or to sell them new tourist cards........

David..........I don't think it's up to Mexico to post signs. If you visit a foreign country, it is up to you as the visitor to know the rules........do some research before you go

There used to be... 1960s, 70's and 80's... Very informative for non-Mexicans to stop at the migra station in Maneadero.

bajaguy - 3-15-2014 at 04:20 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by David K

Quote:

Originally posted by bajaguy

Quote:

Originally posted by David K
..........No signs, no immigration checkpoint at Maneadero or San Felipe, nothing to let Americans know or to sell them new tourist cards........

David..........I don't think it's up to Mexico to post signs. If you visit a foreign country, it is up to you as the visitor to know the rules........do some research before you go

There used to be... 1960s, 70's and 80's... Very informative for non-Mexicans to stop at the migra station in Maneadero.

This is 2014, the age of the internet. People can do their research on-line and get all the information they need.

Doing that now for trips to Ireland and Italy.

If someone gets dinged in Mexico for not having the proper INM documents it's their own fault, not Mexico's.

David K - 3-15-2014 at 04:46 PM

Not saying it is a fault... I am saying it takes away excuses... and gives Mexico more taxed money!

Another plus to having a station at the southern end of the 'Border Zone' is folks who are in Ensenada for the weekend and decide to visit Santo Tomás one afternoon... Will they drive 140 miles round trip to the border to get the FMM? Nope... (say the Ensenada office is closed when they decide, it is closed more than it is open and really there for boaters, anyway)... Mexico loses bucks.

It is 2014, so you have to ask why there is less service than 25-50 years ago.. and the FMM was FREE back then, too!

shari - 3-15-2014 at 04:46 PM

I am always amazed how many visitors to Mexico DONT have their visas to be here and so are illegal in the country.

It is prohibitively expensive to get a tourist visa for a Mexican...you must pay $100 US dollars just to book the interview appointment which you need to do months in advance...and there is only a very very small percentage that actually are granted a visa. The president of a fishing cooperativa couldn't even get one!!!!

You really need a great reason for visiting the states, like taking a course or having a spouse that is american and a destination contact, letters of support, full time job as well as a ton of paperwork too...forget about just going to visit as a tourist. This is why there are so many illegal crossings.

Bajahowodd - 3-15-2014 at 04:57 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by shari
I am always amazed how many visitors to Mexico DONT have their visas to be here and so are illegal in the country.

It is prohibitively expensive to get a tourist visa for a Mexican...you must pay $100 US dollars just to book the interview appointment which you need to do months in advance...and there is only a very very small percentage that actually are granted a visa. The president of a fishing cooperativa couldn't even get one!!!!

You really need a great reason for visiting the states, like taking a course or having a spouse that is american and a destination contact, letters of support, full time job as well as a ton of paperwork too...forget about just going to visit as a tourist. This is why there are so many illegal crossings.

And as I mentioned, the fee is NOT refundable.

That said, there have been a few think tank studies that basically state that if the US were to have some form of amnesty, it would be a boost to the economy. That's because it would allow the government to obtain much more tax revenues for work that has thus far been done under the table.

Mexican citizens, legal or not, have been a large piece of the US economy for many decades. In fact, one of the prime beneficiaries of their presence has been the corporate farmers.

There is a new movie that just premiered at the South By Southwest festival in Texas dealing with Cesar Chavez. It's worth a look.

bajaguy - 3-15-2014 at 05:01 PM

Excuses are like noses, everybody has one, and it is amazing how many people WHO KNOW (like some Nomads who advertise the fact) the rules, ignore them.

The Ensenada INM office may serve boaters, but it is not "really there for them anyway"....it is there to serve the population of the Municipality...it is apparent that you don't spend enough time in the Ensenada INM office to see what their business really is. I have been in there about 12 times for FM-3/FM-2 renewals and issuance of the RP card..........didn't see any boaters..........

I'm just saying know before you go and follow the rules.

Yup, 2014 and not much is free anymore anywhere

Quote:

Originally posted by David K
Not saying it is a fault... I am saying it takes away excuses... and gives Mexico more taxed money!

Another plus to having a station at the southern end of the 'Border Zone' is folks who are in Ensenada for the weekend and decide to visit Santo Tomás one afternoon... Will they drive 140 miles round trip to the border to get the FMM? Nope... (say the Ensenada office is closed when they decide, it is closed more than it is open and really there for boaters, anyway)... Mexico loses bucks.

It is 2014, so you have to ask why there is less service than 25-50 years ago.. and the FMM was FREE back then, too!

David K - 3-15-2014 at 05:12 PM

Why is it on the wharf at the harbor if not designed to serve boaters???

No problem Baja Guy, I am all for making it easier for the people of Mexico to be rewarded by a happy tourist or traveler looking for fun and adventure.

Make it hard to have the proper papers, then the people of Mexico lose the benefit of travels... It really could be easy to do, and not scold tourists for not researching the details and stopping at the border... Happiness, not punishment should be what people who go to Baja experience! Happy people spend more money than people who are fined or extorted or blamed.

bajaguy - 3-15-2014 at 05:18 PM

The Ensenada INM office is NOT "on the wharf at the harbor", and I rest my case.

Quote:

Originally posted by David K
Why is it on the wharf at the harbor if not designed to serve boaters???

willardguy - 3-15-2014 at 05:18 PM

I'd like to see a virtual immigration office! one you could visit from the comfort of your own baja man cave. you could photoshop a picture of yourself in front of the office, one shaking hands with a virtual agent, maybe one of the virtual taco you're about to eat. you could fill out a virtual FMM, print it and put it on the wall with the rest of your memorabilia, never having to ACTUALLY cross the border!
perfect for the quasi aficionado! :yes:

rts551 - 3-15-2014 at 05:27 PM

Not very hard to get the proper paper work to go to Baja last time I checked.

It probably aught to be little harder to keep some of the rif raf out.

David K - 3-15-2014 at 05:51 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by willardguy
I'd like to see a virtual immigration office! one you could visit from the comfort of your own baja man cave. you could photoshop a picture of yourself in front of the office, one shaking hands with a virtual agent, maybe one of the virtual taco you're about to eat. you could fill out a virtual FMM, print it and put it on the wall with the rest of your memorabilia, never having to ACTUALLY cross the border!
perfect for the quasi aficionado! :yes:

You mean as easy as it is to buy Mexican Auto Insurance on BajaBound.com ? :light:

Since a passport is now required by Mexico to get an FMM, that may be an issue the Internet won't help!

Bajaguy, if they moved it from the harbor, and you want Nomads to use it, maybe it would be great if you shared that wisdom?

bajaguy - 3-15-2014 at 06:06 PM

Nomads shouldn't need to know where it is....they need to get their FMM at the border. The local ex-pat community knows where it is, and has been for 9 years. But for a public service, it is on Blvd Teniente Azueta.

Sharing my "wisdom"......The INM office directions:

At the first stoplight as you come into Ensenada Centro on HWY 1, before the fish taco stands on your right, make a right turn at the light (Teniente Azueta).....go about a half block, INM is on your right next to the Port Captain's office and CONAPESCA - where you get a fishing license

Quote:

Originally posted by David K

Bajaguy, if they moved it from the harbor, and you want Nomads to use it, maybe it would be great if you shared that wisdom?

[Edited on 3-16-2014 by bajaguy]

Bajaboy - 3-15-2014 at 06:26 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by David K
Why is it on the wharf at the harbor if not designed to serve boaters???

No problem Baja Guy, I am all for making it easier for the people of Mexico to be rewarded by a happy tourist or traveler looking for fun and adventure.

Make it hard to have the proper papers, then the people of Mexico lose the benefit of travels... It really could be easy to do, and not scold tourists for not researching the details and stopping at the border... Happiness, not punishment should be what people who go to Baja experience! Happy people spend more money than people who are fined or extorted or blamed.

Why not make it easier for the Mexican tourist :?:

rts551 - 3-15-2014 at 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bajaboy

Quote:

Why not make it easier for the Mexican tourist :?:

Why not make the requirements the same? I have been asked by many of my neighbors that exact same question.

Bajaboy - 3-15-2014 at 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by David K
Zac, ask Obama why.
Bajaguy that sounds like the harbor wharf location where it has been. Thanks.

David, why should I ask President Obama? Does he write immigration law? Of course not. But he would like to discuss it but the racist party does not want to play.

bajaguy - 3-15-2014 at 08:01 PM

David.....it's not a wharf....ships don't dock there. It's a street with cars and trucks. Next time you pass through Ensenada I'll show you the difference, then you can buy me a Pacifico

Quote:

Originally posted by David K
Bajaguy that sounds like the harbor wharf location where it has been. Thanks.

UnoMas - 3-15-2014 at 08:37 PM

Anyone know what it takes to get a visa for Mexicans to come visit the U.S. There is a family in B.C.S. that I would like to come visit us here but have been told that they have to go to Tijuana to get the visa that could take days if not weeks to obtain. If true it is very difficult for them, the expense to go back and forth for their visa would make it very difficult. Anyone know for sure or have had experience with this?

Ateo - 3-15-2014 at 08:47 PM

Quote:

EXACTLY.

vgabndo - 3-15-2014 at 08:56 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bajaboy

Quote:

Originally posted by David K
Zac, ask Obama why.
Bajaguy that sounds like the harbor wharf location where it has been. Thanks.

David, why should I ask President Obama? Does he write immigration law? Of course not. But he would like to discuss it but the racist party does not want to play.

Hear Hear, A tiny little part of the Tpublican obstructionism includes the IDEA of discussing immigration reform. Progressive people and immigrants favor immigration reform, for PURELY political reasons the minority party is doing anything in their power to insure the President gets no credit for doing the will of the people at a cost of votes for the GOP. There is nothing in this about doing what is best for America. Our ability to get on with the necessary business of reform is being held hostage by cynical electioneering on the right.
No need to ask Obama, he's trying.

The political sniping monitor is now off duty for the evening and I'm going outside to watch an outrageous Baja moon over the Pacific and listen to the music (imported band!) coming from the big dance over at the ballpark. :coolup:

Bajahowodd - 3-17-2014 at 05:00 PM

All I can say is that for those of you who continually visit Baja, but do not support immigration reform, you are hypocrites. If you spend weeks and weeks frolicking SOB and still are against immigration reform, then shame on you. You are interacting with folks that think you are their friend, but, obviously, you are not. You are merely an opportunist.

Ateo - 3-17-2014 at 05:19 PM

Bajahowodd: I like your statement.

absinvestor - 3-17-2014 at 05:33 PM

Bajahowodd- I am for immigration reform but I disagree with your premise that if I was against that I would be a hypocrite. When I travel to Mexico I play by the rules. I get Mexican car insurance and must agree to keep my US insurance in force so I'm paying for coverage that one of which I can't use. I get my FMM and don't overstay the 180 day maximum. When I travel past the free zone on the mainland I get a car import permit and in addition to paying the import fee I put up the $300 required deposit to insure that I'll bring the car back to the US. I return my car to the US as required which of course means I have to pay for a new import fee the next time I enter Mexico with intentions to visit past the free zone. Also, Mexico tells me that with a few exceptions I can't work in Mexico and if I start a business I have to hire only Mexicans. If the rules I agree to when traveling to Mexico were agreed to and abided by Mexicans traveling to the US there would be far fewer Mexicans trying to get into the US. Again, I say I am for immigration reform but not because I would be a hypocrite if I was against it.

DavidE - 3-17-2014 at 05:43 PM

Trouble is many rules include the use of what most emigres do not have - money.

Even years ago landlords would not rent to non English speaking individuals. So they found those that did, and pay 800 dollars a month for a tiny apartment meant for 2 and pack 11 people into it. Get a driver license without a birth certificate these days? No license, no insurance NO COVERAGE. Get back and forth to work. how?

Wanna pay 20 dollars an hour to get your lawn mowed legally?

The USA is a nation of "I GOTTA HAVE THAT!" individuals and then they turn around rearrange their face and then shout "BUT NOT IN MY BACK YARD!"

There never has been an "easy" answer for this and there never will be. Mexico has to be as attractive place to work as the USA. You want to pay twenty bucks for a plate of tacos and a hundred bucks for a hotel room?

Be slow to condemn and fast to compassion when it comes to dashing dreams

Ateo - 3-17-2014 at 05:48 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DavidE

Wanna pay 20 dollars an hour to get your lawn mowed legally?

That made me LOL.

Or how about a car wash in the USA for $30?

absinvestor - 3-17-2014 at 07:12 PM

I don't see any easy answers. For example how do we explain to the 1000's of Mexicans that are trying to get to the US legally- they have invested a lot of money and are patiently waiting in line that now, those that broke the law and entered illegally are going to be rewarded for their illegal entry. On the other hand I believe that we as a country encouraged illegals by winking and looking the other way and doing nothing for years to discourage the behavior..I'm not excusing those that are here illegally but I think that we have to own up to the fact that we created this mess by looking the other way for so many years.

woody with a view - 3-17-2014 at 07:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by gnukid
In the us protestors are not deported based on free speech, they only be deported in the case of criminal activity that is demonstrated and provable or by their own admission.

i shouldn't even wade in here, but i saw the movie Dirty Wars on Netflix yesterday about our Special Forces being the 5th arm of the military who report directly to the Pres. almost like his personal army. you guys might have heard of a cat named Anwar Al Alaki who was a US citizen. i'm not saying he was an angel but he basically got himself on a list for using his free speech. it was hateful speech condemning America but it was his right to speak this crap. Special Forces took him out with a Hellfire missile. soon afterward, Special Forces took out his 16 year old son (who by birth was also a US citizen), why i have no idea. maybe they were worried about what he might become?

anyway, humans basically suck, no matter which side of the border you are on. no one is innocent...... :light:

Ateo - 3-17-2014 at 07:38 PM

It is a total mess and it needs to be cleaned up.

I agree that there are no easy answers.

I, Ateo, would issue an Executive Order granting amnesty with some good firm rules.

Then I would have a kick ass guest worker program.

The sky wouldn't fall.

Nye - 3-18-2014 at 07:35 AM

Wow Im amazed at the response this post got, my wife is Mexican(from Mexico) and she is a U.S citizen which took us a bit o $$ n time but shes lucky and is a dual citizen. She has her own cleaning co,teaches zumba and choreographs quincenaras. She has a better work ethic then me and we hv never received any public assistance. That said I lived in Mx for 7 yrs "illegally" and never had a problem. Hv a great day and thx 4 the responses.

motoged - 3-18-2014 at 04:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DavidE
......You want to pay twenty bucks for a plate of tacos and a hundred bucks for a hotel room?....

Nope....that's why I stay out of Cabo..... :biggrin:

Bajahowodd - 3-18-2014 at 04:52 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by motoged

Quote:

Originally posted by DavidE
......You want to pay twenty bucks for a plate of tacos and a hundred bucks for a hotel room?....

Nope....that's why I stay out of Cabo..... :biggrin:

That's kind of funny. But outside of the hotels, it is not the case. When we stay at hotels in Cabo, we never eat there. We patronize the locals, and $20 tacos are nowhere to be found.

sancho - 3-19-2014 at 02:47 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bajahowodd
All I can say is that for those of you who continually visit Baja, but do not support immigration reform, you are hypocrites. If you spend weeks and weeks frolicking SOB and still are against immigration reform, then shame on you.

I fail to see where Tourists from the US, who for the most
part, visit Mex on a VERY temp basis, bascially vacation,
can be used to compare them to, or use that position
as a basis for arguing for Immigration Reform in the US.
Mex Immigrants are
looking for perm residence in the US. US Tourists visit
many Countries, does that warrant giving those
Countries citizens grant them access to come live in the US? In the
case of Mexico, beacuse
US Tourists go fishing in Cabo and drink a few Pacificos?
That logic escapes me, and I'm the exact opposite of a GOP
Racist, and support some Immigration Reform,
but I don't get comparing week long US Tourists to Mex,
as somehow a justification/reason for
US Immigration reform, for the wahtever number
of Mex Immigrants in the US without proper US Immigration approval

rts551 - 3-19-2014 at 03:06 PM

Sancho, you would, of course, encourage the Mexican officials to properly enforce Mexican immigration law...and support equal penalties for those that violate those laws.

Right?

DavidE - 3-19-2014 at 03:39 PM

The FIRST thing (that means number one) that has to happen, is judicial reform in Mexico. So an individual convicted of armed robbery, aggravated assault or child molestation has his mug shots and fingerprints (dream on about DNA) entered into a national database that can be accessed by US authorities federal state and local. Documented or not, violent crime criminals should be exported FAST right into the hands of Mexican justice.

Same thing for US citizens going to Mexico. The only restriction I am aware of is the restriction of felons against obtaining a US passport. Andrew Lustre was a good example of a scumbag escaping justice.

Too many ex-pats who brag "I HAVE NOT SET FOOT INTO THE USA (or CANADA) IN XX YEARS" would be greeted at the border with "Here, slip into these here handcuffs".

Bajahowodd - 3-19-2014 at 05:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sancho

Quote:

History notes that the so-called godfather of the Republican party signed a general amnesty bill into law. Of course, he was probably suffering from dementia from he day he first took office. But that means that back in those days, there was a general consensus among the governing elite that amnesty was the right thing to do.

From that amnesty have come many doctors and lawyers and scientists that benefit the US society.

Today, the Republicans are all about securing a border that is already a joke around the rest of the world, in that probably the only more fortified and militarized border in the entire world is between the two Koreas. We must be crazy.

Terry28 - 3-19-2014 at 05:14 PM

David, convicted felons can get a passport.....I actually know a few..

woody with a view - 3-19-2014 at 05:55 PM

i know a few who still vote....

woody with a view - 3-19-2014 at 05:56 PM

Quote:

YEP!