BajaNomad

Permanent resident status question

tmtuttle - 1-28-2021 at 09:22 AM

Hello,

My wife and I bought property in Baja (Todo Santos area) and have a time frame of five to nine years before we move there mostly year round. I want to start my permanent resident status now. I've been communicating with the Mexican consulate here in my home city and state of Boise, ID and have a good idea of what I have to do north of the border. My question is, how difficult is it to exchange the visa I get from the consulate here in Boise to a permanent resident card? My Spanish is adequate for day to day living but once it gets deeper than that, I get left behind. I'm wondering if there are 'fixers' who offer their services to help the process along.

Any info is much appreciated.

Tim

Here's the info I received form my consulate contact here in Boise:

The visa is issued on the same day of the consular interview. However, it is possible that the process could extend from 2 to 10 business days.

The visa is valid for 6 months, is only for one entry to Mexico, you need to go to Mexico before the visa expires.

Once you enter to Mexico you will have up to 30 days to go to the nearest Migration Office of your address and exchange the Visa for the Permanent Resident Card, once you start the procedure for the Resident Card it takes around 2-4 weeks to receive the card.

tmtuttle - 1-28-2021 at 09:24 AM

One thing I forgot to ask, for those of you in the Todos Santos area, where is the nearest migration office? I'm assuming La Paz.

Bajazly - 1-28-2021 at 09:46 AM

The whole process was relatively painless. Go to the consulate for interview and get the visa. Cross the border in the time frame allowed and exchange the visa for the free 30 day FMM or whatever it is they give you. When you get to you hometown, go to the nearest office and do some paperwork. In a week or two go back for fingerprints and photos then wait a couple weeks for the card. There is a certain amount of time you "can't" leave the country but for me that was only maybe a week until some paperwork got to Mexicali.



I wouldn't stress about getting it done this far in advance because it really doesn't take that long to do. Actual time dealing with everything was maybe 3 to 4 hours over 5 weeks and Xmas and New Years was in the middle of that. They were closed for I believe 2 weeks for the holidays too.

[Edited on 1-28-2021 by Bajazly]

pacificobob - 1-28-2021 at 10:26 AM

we used the consulate in boise as well. a relaxed and enjoyable interview.
we used a service in CSL called Mexico paperwork...or maybe paperwork mexico.
the process was painless and expedient. it was interesting to see a room full of sweating gringos wait forever to speak with indifferent immigration personnel. we were in and out in under 10 minutes.
if citizenship is the ultimate goal, get this done in order to get the 5 year clock ticking.

Cancamo - 1-28-2021 at 10:52 AM

Painless process compared to what it used to be. The green books, the stamps for exit and entry, FM2, FM3, extended time frame, etc....what a pain in the.

Overnight it became easy.

Note: If you address the Immigration official in Spanish, they will often respond in English. Not so if you try English first, a universal respect thing here SOB.

capitolkat - 1-28-2021 at 11:03 AM

Hi, I've got kids in Boise so I feel some connection. We live most of the year in La Paz and dealt with Bajalegals.com to get our RP. They charge a little more than doing it yourself but we found it worth it as they do all the interaction with the immigration office in La Paz. They complete the paperwork for your submission, keep in touch with the immigration office in La Paz (they know all the agents) , make sure your submissions are correct, brief you on when you need to return to the office and accompany you each time. If you send me a PM I'll give you the email address for Sara who handled my application. Norm

del mar - 1-28-2021 at 11:05 AM

smart move to get it done now who knows what the future might hold, if you decide to use a "fixer" folks are very happy with this lady.....
https://www.facebook.com/bajaexpatservices/

capitolkat - 1-28-2021 at 11:17 AM

I'm sure bajaexpatservice are fine folks but it looks like they are mainly in the northern baja areas( Ensenda, Rosarito) and the request is for the La Paz area. You can look up baja legal services on facebook and you will see a large number of people that have been helped in the La Paz area with their RP.

joel - 1-28-2021 at 11:21 AM

Just make sure that when you enter Mexico you don't get a tourist FMM! Make sure to show them the visa in your passport!

BajaUtah - 1-28-2021 at 11:45 AM

Quote: Originally posted by joel  
Just make sure that when you enter Mexico you don't get a tourist FMM! Make sure to show them the visa in your passport!


Not quite correct. You do get the FMM flying in or at the border. You DO not check tourism in Tipo de Viaje. You check other. You can then use the Citizen line at the airport coming in. If you use the tourist line they get snappy and send you over to the citizen's line anyway.

FMM shown in this link -
https://movetomexicoguide.com/mexico-immigration-programs-pr...


Also, when flying out of Mexico you get the same FMM from Mexican Immigration at the Airport and again check "other". You give the bottom portion to the airlines and keep the upper portion for your return. Driving across no one at Immigration seems to care in either direction. I've tried to give my upper copy to immigration southbound at both Mexicali crossings and they look at me like I have 3 heads and just point down the road.

Of course, this is Mexico and my experiences having RT for 4 years and RP for 3 might have nothing to do with your experience.

El Jefe - 1-28-2021 at 01:25 PM

From our experience, use "a fixer" like the Paperworks. It is so worth the little bit extra you pay. Make sure you allow some time in country for the process to happen. Five weeks might be about right. Start the process in Mex as soon as you arrive. If you have to fly north before the process is finished you may have to get a "get out of town" letter from the immigration folks. Just more complication that you don't need.

And don't lose your card! Paula lost hers after having it a few years and had to go through the whole process all over again. Applying for a duplicate card is not a thing.

For the non bi lingual speakers

Howard - 1-28-2021 at 01:26 PM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yKIE3IUkkp8

tmtuttle - 1-28-2021 at 03:31 PM

Thanks for all the great information. I think I'll use a fixer (gestor).

Question for the couples in the crowd, do you recommend that my wife and I apply as a couple or individually?

pacificobob - 1-28-2021 at 05:39 PM

both...the PR is issued to an individual. you get one ...the MRS gets one

surabi - 1-28-2021 at 07:20 PM

Quote: Originally posted by joel  
Just make sure that when you enter Mexico you don't get a tourist FMM! Make sure to show them the visa in your passport!


It can just confuse people when an FMM is used synonomously with "tourist visa".

An FMM is just a migratory form which everyone aside from citizens fill out when entering the country, regardless of whether you are entering as a tourist, a temporary resident, a permanent resident, or in process, as the OP will be.

It's how you fill out the form that's crucial, and that the immigration official is clear as to what your status is.

Bajazly - 1-28-2021 at 09:29 PM

Quote: Originally posted by surabi  

An FMM is just a migratory form which everyone aside from citizens fill out when entering the country, regardless of whether you are entering as a tourist, a temporary resident, a permanent resident, or in process, as the OP will be.



So a PR needs to have an FMM as well?

RnR - 1-28-2021 at 11:19 PM

Quote: Originally posted by Bajazly  
Quote: Originally posted by surabi  

An FMM is just a migratory form which everyone aside from citizens fill out when entering the country, regardless of whether you are entering as a tourist, a temporary resident, a permanent resident, or in process, as the OP will be.



So a PR needs to have an FMM as well?


Yes, a PR has to have an FMM to LEAVE Mexico.

The top half is turned in when you leave and the bottom half is collected when you return to Mexico. (Or maybe it is the other way - it has been a couple of years since I flew in and out of Mex)

This is not enforced at land crossings but is definitely enforced when leaving by air.

SJD has an IMM office for just this purpose. Go to the IMM booth and get your FMM before going to the gate. Top half is collected by the gate attendant as you board the plane and the bottom half is collected by Aduana/IMM when you return.

Not sure what happens if you drive out without getting an FMM (which is standard practice) and then return by air without a prreviously stamped FMM ....??

[Edited on 1-29-2021 by RnR]

surabi - 1-29-2021 at 12:54 AM

Quote: Originally posted by Bajazly  
Quote: Originally posted by surabi  

An FMM is just a migratory form which everyone aside from citizens fill out when entering the country, regardless of whether you are entering as a tourist, a temporary resident, a permanent resident, or in process, as the OP will be.



So a PR needs to have an FMM as well?


It's not a matter of "having" one. It's something you fill out when you fly in and out of the country.

On the mainland most PRs also fill them out and hand them in when driving.If you ever want to become a citizen, it's crucial to do this, as you have to document your time inside the country over the past years.

Tourists are handed back the bottom half of the card when they enter Mexico, it says how long they are allowed to be in the country and they hand it back in to immigration when they leave.

Residents do the opposite. They fill out the form when they are leaving Mexico, and hand the other half back in when they return. But Mexican INM doesn't seem to care if you lose the other half while out of the country- you just fill out a new one. If a tourist loses the half they are supposed to retain while in Mexico, they get charged the tourist tax again before leaving.

So as a resident, no part of that form is something you'd ever be asked to produce while you're in Mexico, and you wouldn't even have it to produce, as the second half is taken from you when you return. It's your residency card that's your status document here.




[Edited on 1-29-2021 by surabi]

Permanent Residence Status

ch47pilot - 1-30-2021 at 01:37 PM

I do not believe that you can get a Residente Permanente without having a Residente Temporal for two years. I have had my RP for several years and my wife just got her Residente Temporal based on being permanent residents and my having the RP.

pacificobob - 1-30-2021 at 02:53 PM

we never had a temp ,only PR

Hook - 1-30-2021 at 05:50 PM

When they first instituted the RP, many were told that you had to go through 3-4 years of RT, just to be able to qualify for the RP. It ended up being several thousand pesos to get to the RP status and then there was the cost of the RP.

Within a year, Mexico issued guidelines that allowed one to prove a level of income/wealth that allowed one to qualify for RP without the RT transition.

What's the status now? If you can qualify directly with a certain level of "wealth", what are the economic requirements?

Personally, I would wait until you are ready to move south for good. Things change. If you ever wanted to take a US plated vehicle to the mainland, it's not possible if you both have RP. But if one of you do, that person can get a permit for doing that. That's what my wife and I have done.

And I guess it's conceivable that they could dissolve the vehicle permit exemption for Baja and northern Sonora (and some area in the way south). It's been "threatened" before. If they did, you would have to import your vehicle (if eligible and very expensive) or buy a Mexican plated car (and get a Mexican driver's license).

There is also some conflicting info about how long an RP lasts. I have heard "forever" and 10 years.

PaulW - 1-30-2021 at 06:42 PM

These days
No temp just Perm
For sure wait until you are in Baja then visit Migration and get the latest info.
Hopefully you can get an address with an electric bill on your 6 month FMM and do it during that period. Makes it easier.

surabi - 1-30-2021 at 07:03 PM

Quote: Originally posted by Hook  


There is also some conflicting info about how long an RP lasts. I have heard "forever" and 10 years.


What you've "heard" is immaterial. Nowhere in INM's information is stated anything about it being valid for 10 years. That's just some uninformed gringo chatter.

The word "permanent"has a universally understood definition. So unless INM changes their policies, RP is permanent. Perhaps you'd be questioned if you were out of the country for 8 years and then tried to reenter on your PM, but that's hypothetical.

Bajazly - 1-30-2021 at 08:06 PM

Quote: Originally posted by PaulW  
These days
No temp just Perm



If you don't have the income/wealth Hook spoke about you do need to do the RT for 4 or 5 years or that is the way the agent I talked to here described it. I just asked for RP up front and with all the docs I provided they granted it right off.

Bajazly - 1-30-2021 at 08:10 PM

Quote: Originally posted by surabi  
Perhaps you'd be questioned if you were out of the country for 8 years and then tried to reenter on your PM, but that's hypothetical.



But how would they know how long you were out of the country? They wouldn't know if you had crossed north the day before and were returning home, if you even got stopped and they scanned your card.

Hook - 1-30-2021 at 10:15 PM

Quote: Originally posted by surabi  
Quote: Originally posted by Hook  


There is also some conflicting info about how long an RP lasts. I have heard "forever" and 10 years.


What you've "heard" is immaterial. Nowhere in INM's information is stated anything about it being valid for 10 years. That's just some uninformed gringo chatter.

The word "permanent"has a universally understood definition. So unless INM changes their policies, RP is permanent. Perhaps you'd be questioned if you were out of the country for 8 years and then tried to reenter on your PM, but that's hypothetical.


I think the term permanent means you INTEND to stay in Mexico permanently. I don't think it was intended to mean the document was PERMANENTLY valid.

BTW, the question about a 10 year expiration was not gringo chatter. It was from an INM agent at the Guaymas office in Sonora. She claimed that you would be forced to get a new one because they want an updated photo every ten years.

:?:

Bajazly - 1-30-2021 at 10:34 PM

Quote: Originally posted by Hook  
Quote: Originally posted by surabi  
Quote: Originally posted by Hook  


There is also some conflicting info about how long an RP lasts. I have heard "forever" and 10 years.


What you've "heard" is immaterial. Nowhere in INM's information is stated anything about it being valid for 10 years. That's just some uninformed gringo chatter.

The word "permanent"has a universally understood definition. So unless INM changes their policies, RP is permanent. Perhaps you'd be questioned if you were out of the country for 8 years and then tried to reenter on your PM, but that's hypothetical.


I think the term permanent means you INTEND to stay in Mexico permanently. I don't think it was intended to mean the document was PERMANENTLY valid.

BTW, the question about a 10 year expiration was not gringo chatter. It was from an INM agent at the Guaymas office in Sonora. She claimed that you would be forced to get a new one because they want an updated photo every ten years.

:?:


You need to re up your green card in the US every 10 years so not out of line to redo a PR card every 10 years.

surabi - 1-31-2021 at 01:22 AM

Quote: Originally posted by Bajazly  
Quote: Originally posted by surabi  
Perhaps you'd be questioned if you were out of the country for 8 years and then tried to reenter on your PM, but that's hypothetical.



But how would they know how long you were out of the country? They wouldn't know if you had crossed north the day before and were returning home, if you even got stopped and they scanned your card.


Well, I said perhaps and that it's hypothetical. If you fly in and out, then there is a record of your entries and exits. Driving, not so much unless you stop at INM and check in and out. Which those who consider that they might want to apply for Mexican citizenship in the future would be wise to do.

surabi - 1-31-2021 at 01:31 AM

Quote: Originally posted by Hook  
Quote: Originally posted by surabi  
Quote: Originally posted by Hook  


There is also some conflicting info about how long an RP lasts. I have heard "forever" and 10 years.


What you've "heard" is immaterial. Nowhere in INM's information is stated anything about it being valid for 10 years. That's just some uninformed gringo chatter.

The word "permanent"has a universally understood definition. So unless INM changes their policies, RP is permanent. Perhaps you'd be questioned if you were out of the country for 8 years and then tried to reenter on your PM, but that's hypothetical.


I think the term permanent means you INTEND to stay in Mexico permanently. I don't think it was intended to mean the document was PERMANENTLY valid.

BTW, the question about a 10 year expiration was not gringo chatter. It was from an INM agent at the Guaymas office in Sonora. She claimed that you would be forced to get a new one because they want an updated photo every ten years.

:?:


What one INM agent in Guaymas claimed can hardly be taken as some sort of fact. And there is no expiry date on the PR card. So if a new one was needed every 10 years, wouldn't it stand to reason that there would be an expiry date, like there is on a driver's license, a passport or a temporary residency permit?

[Edited on 1-31-2021 by surabi]

[Edited on 1-31-2021 by surabi]

ch47pilot - 1-31-2021 at 06:38 AM

Now I am confused, I also did not have a Temporal card I went from FM3 to PR. We have no income problems but Paperworks did our processing for my wife and last week she got a very nice Residente Temporal card and Immigration said she would get her Permenante in two years. This is in Cabo.

brucedog - 1-31-2021 at 08:01 AM

Do you know if your consulate is open for appointments for RP? I looked it up in Portland, OR last summer and they said they were not scheduling appointments because of the pandemic. Would love to get it done this summer

PaulW - 1-31-2021 at 09:29 AM

Wow what a bunch of wild speculation.
Let me repeat with real factual info
These days --- No temp just Perm
For sure wait until you are in Baja then visit local Baja Migration office and get the latest info.
Hopefully you can get an address with an electric bill on your 6 month FMM and do it during that period. Makes it easier.

Yes you can do all the forms yourself with help of Google translator.
My son and his wife just did it. It took 3 tries, and the local Migration official was very impressed and she helped him with his typos. Quite an experience. He used his phone to translate and the laptop for the forms both at the same time. At our San Felipe location. Internet connection required.
Based on his experience I recommend hiring an implementer to do the paperwork like I and my wife did. It was pretty painless except for the cost which was not too bad.

gnukid - 1-31-2021 at 11:48 AM

This site is helpful to provide TR/PR process links and info

https://yucalandia.com/answers-to-common-questions/new-rules...

Hook - 1-31-2021 at 02:32 PM

Quote: Originally posted by surabi  
Quote: Originally posted by Hook  
Quote: Originally posted by surabi  
Quote: Originally posted by Hook  


There is also some conflicting info about how long an RP lasts. I have heard "forever" and 10 years.


What you've "heard" is immaterial. Nowhere in INM's information is stated anything about it being valid for 10 years. That's just some uninformed gringo chatter.

The word "permanent"has a universally understood definition. So unless INM changes their policies, RP is permanent. Perhaps you'd be questioned if you were out of the country for 8 years and then tried to reenter on your PM, but that's hypothetical.


I think the term permanent means you INTEND to stay in Mexico permanently. I don't think it was intended to mean the document was PERMANENTLY valid.

BTW, the question about a 10 year expiration was not gringo chatter. It was from an INM agent at the Guaymas office in Sonora. She claimed that you would be forced to get a new one because they want an updated photo every ten years.

:?:


What one INM agent in Guaymas claimed can hardly be taken as some sort of fact. And there is no expiry date on the PR card. So if a new one was needed every 10 years, wouldn't it stand to reason that there would be an expiry date, like there is on a driver's license, a passport or a temporary residency permit?

[Edited on 1-31-2021 by surabi]

[Edited on 1-31-2021 by surabi]


I've lived in Mexico long enough to know that there is very little that can be called "some sort of fact".

But I can tell you this. It wasn't gringo chatter/gossip/chisme. THAT'S a fact. :smug:

Visa related, but slightly OT

s/v Ola Chica - 2-1-2021 at 01:54 PM

I moved my sailboat from San Diego to Ensenada @ the Hotel Coral Marina back in November 2019 and it was documented with the necessary Mexican Temporary Import Permit (TIP) that is valid for 10 years. Is this sufficient grounds to acquire a residency visa? I realize asking here is a shot in the dark, but I thought I'd give it a try. Any input welcome.

defrag4 - 2-2-2021 at 02:32 AM

Quote: Originally posted by ch47pilot  
I do not believe that you can get a Residente Permanente without having a Residente Temporal for two years. I have had my RP for several years and my wife just got her Residente Temporal based on being permanent residents and my having the RP.

you can skip straight to the permanente if you meet the financial requirements

surabi - 2-2-2021 at 09:44 PM

Quote: Originally posted by ch47pilot  
Now I am confused, I also did not have a Temporal card I went from FM3 to PR. We have no income problems but Paperworks did our processing for my wife and last week she got a very nice Residente Temporal card and Immigration said she would get her Permenante in two years. This is in Cabo.


What exactly are you confused about? You, like I, never had a temporal card because those didn't exist back then- what is now called a temporal used to be called an FM3. They are essentially the same thing. So we just segued to permanente when our FM3s ran out, or in my case, I had a couple 5 year renewals of the FM3 before they changed the immigration policies to say if you wanted to renew the temporary status, you had to do it from outside the country, which didn't used to be the case.

Yes, your wife will be eligible for her permanente in 2 years. Don't let all these other folks confuse you.

[Edited on 2-3-2021 by surabi]

pacificobob - 2-3-2021 at 12:53 PM

is anyone here available for medical consultation? i require multiple opinions.