BajaNomad - Telcel Limits cross border calls

Telcel Limits cross border calls

PaulW - 10-6-2022 at 07:36 AM

ALM said
There is also a limit on calls from MX to US/CA.https://www.telcel.com/mundo_telcel/quienes-somos/corporativ...
Policy for the Use of Services Without Borders

lencho posted comments and---Here is the full translation

To guarantee the reasonable use and avoid the permanent use of the Unlimited Voice, SMS and/or Data (No Limit) services outside the National Territory offered as "Without Border", users will be subject to the following policy:
Rent Plan Users (Postpaid)
• They must have an active Rate Plan (Postpaid) that includes the “Without Border” benefits or have contracted the additional “Without Border” product.
• Be up to date with payment.
• The line must have recorded traffic within the Telcel network (in Mexico) prior to using the services within the "Without Border" coverage (United States and/or Canada).
• Borderless Services ARE NOT FOR PERMANENT INTERNATIONAL USE . It will be considered that there is a Permanent International Use when any of the following assumptions occur:
(1) The user has made use of the "Sin Frontera" services for a period equal to or greater than 29 continuous days outside the National Territory; that is, without having registered national traffic within the Telcel network in the indicated period; either
(2) When during the current billing cycle the traffic of minutes, SMS and/or data is within the "Without Border" coverage (USA and/or Canada):
a) Is greater than the average number of minutes and/or SMS consumed by the user during the last 3 months within the National Territory, or
b) Is greater than 200 minutes and/or SMS; either
(3) When outgoing monthly International Long Distance (LDI) traffic while in Mexico to the US and/or Canada:
a) Is greater than the average number of minutes or SMS consumed by the user during the last 3 months within the National Territory, or
b) It is greater than 200 minutes and/or SMS.
The Permanent International Use will be considered as an unusual operation in terms of the Contract. In the event that the user incurs in any of the practices indicated in numerals (1) or (2) above, Telcel may temporarily suspend the use of services abroad for the countries included within the "Without Border" coverage. " (United States and Canada). In both cases, the use of the services while within Mexico will not be suspended, so the user may continue to use them upon re-entry into the country.
In the event that the user incurs in what is indicated in number (3) above, Telcel may temporarily suspend the use of outgoing ILD services destined for the US and/or Canada until the beginning of the next billing cycle. The foregoing does not imply blocking the line and you may continue to use the services within the National Territory.
In the case of numerals (2) and (3) above, the criteria that is most favorable to the user will be applied.
• In the case of Rate Plans with unlimited data use within the National Territory, your navigation while within the countries of the "Without Border" coverage will be adjusted to the Fair Use Policy while being within the National Territory applicable to the Rate Plan that the user have hired. See Fair Use Policy
• The consumption of Data for the use of social networks and instant messaging (Facebook®, Twitter® and WhatsApp®) will apply in accordance with the Terms and Conditions established in the Rate Plan and/or Package that the user has contracted.
• The browsing speed will depend on the available network capacity of the operator that provides the service while being within the countries that make up the "Without Border" coverage (Operator with which Telcel has an International Roaming agreement).
• "Without Border" services are not available for use within the Maritime or Air Coverage.
Make use of the "Without Border" services, being inside or outside the National Territory, in accordance with the Anti- Fraud Policy in the Use of Unlimited Services

Friend of Telcel Users (Prepaid)
• They must have a Collection Scheme (Prepaid) and/or an active additional Package that includes the “Without Border” benefits.
• The line must be in the Active Phase of the Friendly System Life Cycle .
• The line must have recorded traffic within the Telcel network (in Mexico) prior to using the services within the "Without Border" coverage (United States and/or Canada).
• Borderless Services ARE NOT FOR PERMANENT INTERNATIONAL USE . It will be considered that there is a Permanent International Use when any of the following assumptions occur:
(1) The user has made use of the "Sin Frontera" services for a period equal to or greater than 29 continuous days outside the National Territory; that is, without having registered national traffic within the Telcel network in the indicated period; either
(2)When the monthly voice, SMS and/or data traffic is within the "Without Border" coverage (USA and/or Canada):
a) Is greater than the average number of minutes and/or SMS consumed by the user during the last 3 months within the National Territory, or
b) Is greater than 100 minutes and/or SMS; either
(3) When outgoing monthly International Long Distance (LDI) traffic while in Mexico to the US and/or Canada:
a) Is greater than the average number of minutes or SMS consumed by the user during the last 3 months within the National Territory, or
b) Is greater than 100 minutes and/or SMS.
In the event that the user incurs in any of the practices indicated in numerals (1) and (2) above, Telcel may temporarily suspend: a) the use of services abroad for the countries included within the coverage “Without Border” (United States and Canada), and/or b) contracting packages that include “Without Border” benefits. In both cases, the use of the services and the contracting of packages while in Mexico will not be suspended, so the user may continue to use them upon re-entry into the country.
In the event that the user incurs in what is stated in number (3) above, Telcel may temporarily suspend the use of outgoing ILD services to the US and/or Canada for up to 30 calendar days. The foregoing does not imply blocking the line and you may continue to use the services within the National Territory.
In the case of numerals (2) and (3) above, the criteria that is most favorable to the user will be applied.
• The consumption of Data for the use of social networks and instant messaging (Facebook®, Twitter® and WhatsApp®) will apply in accordance with the Terms and Conditions established in the Collection Scheme and/or Promotion of recharges and/or Package that the user have hired.
• The browsing speed will depend on the available network capacity of the operator that provides the service while being within the countries that make up the "Without Border" coverage (Operator with which Telcel has an International Roaming agreement).
• "Without Border" services are not available for use within the Maritime or Air Coverage.
• The minutes, SMS or data granted by promotion for use within the National Territory, may not be used while within the countries that make up the "Without Border" Coverage.
• Make use of the "Without Border" services, whether inside or outside the National Territory, in accordance with the Anti- Fraud Policy in the Use of Unlimited Services.
To reactivate the use of the services abroad (within the "Without Border" coverage) and/or ILD while in Mexico, the user must go to a Customer Service Center in Mexico or contact the Customer Service number Telephone *500 from your Telcel to request their reactivation.

AKgringo - 10-6-2022 at 07:58 AM

I don't think that will affect my ATT pre-paid phone, but that sure is a lot of words for a "gotcha" to hide in. It looks like Tecel has been studying ATT's business model!

When ATT talked me into changing plans a few months ago, I lost coverage in Mexico. I had to change the plan again before this trip to add coverage back to the plan ($35/month more) and change back when I head back north.

I don't use my phone very much, but the bulk of my minutes are to numbers north of the border!

[Edited on 10-6-2022 by AKgringo]

surabi - 10-6-2022 at 08:05 AM

For using the Sin Limites plan from Mexico, I don't see much in the way of limits. Just the limit of 100 minutes. But one can always use Whatsapp to call or text from Mexico to US or Canada as much as you like, as long as you are hooked up to internet, not using Telcel phone data.

Most if this is about just staying in the US or Canada and thinking you can continue to use Telcel because it's cheap. I don't see any big changes.

surabi - 10-6-2022 at 08:44 AM

Quote: Originally posted by lencho

Can you use it to call land lines or folks that don't have the app installed? I've never investigated that...

The person you call or message on Whatsapp has to also have a Whatsapp acct. When you want to add someone as a Whatsapp contact, they get sent an invite to set up an account. Because it's a phone app, I don't see how it could work with landlines, but don't know for sure.

RFClark - 10-6-2022 at 09:03 AM

We make all the from home calls on Starlink wifi. T Mobil claims that you can only use their service in Mexico for a limited period, but so far no problems. We also have a VPN setup at work which makes it look like the call is from Los Angeles.

JDCanuck - 10-6-2022 at 09:06 AM

This may explain why my Telcel phone was so often down while in residence in Mexico, despite never using it for US or Canada calls from there. We use text or Whatsapp for that.
Locals had no problems using our antenna and transmitters, even from across the road, only our Telcel phones were blocked. Prepaid and should have been registered, but were not receiving incoming calls or texts.
Keeps stating"not registered"at our home, but works fine in La Paz. Perhaps the cell tower we are accessing from our antenna is the "marine" one?

[Edited on 10-6-2022 by JDCanuck]

surabi - 10-6-2022 at 09:23 AM

Quote: Originally posted by JDCanuck

This may explain why my Telcel phone was so often down while in residence in Mexico, despite never using it for US or Canada calls from there. We use text or Whatsapp for that.
Locals had no problems using our antenna and transmitters, even from across the road, only our Telcel phones were blocked. Prepaid and should have been registered, but were not receiving incoming calls or texts.
Keeps stating"not registered"at our home, but works fine in La Paz.

[Edited on 10-6-2022 by JDCanuck]

If it worked fine in La Paz, but not at your house, that doesn't sound like anything to do with the Telcel limits, but some glitch with your phone location. And the limiits have nothing to do with receiving calls and texts, but initiating them.
I have an old dumb phone that is registered with Telcel that I have not put any $ on for 3 years but I still receive calls and texts on it.

JDCanuck - 10-6-2022 at 09:31 AM

Lencho. As we were in a fringe area we had an antenna receiver and transmitters installed. I could never understand why the local construction workers across the street could use it fine, but we kept getting the "not registered " message on both our prepaid phones sitting right next to the transmitter.
Then as soon as we drive out and get near a La Paz tower we get a burst of messages. and the phone registers again.

Hughesnet Wifi works fine and we may have to use a VOIP service when we are aat home down there, the disadvantage being our financial institutions have our Telcel number on file, and if i remember correctly, VOIP assigns you a new number?

[Edited on 10-6-2022 by JDCanuck]

SFandH - 10-6-2022 at 09:43 AM

Have you tried using your phone's WiFi connection?

JDCanuck - 10-6-2022 at 09:47 AM

SFandH: Yes, for emails, Whatsapp and data that works fine. It's actual calls to those businesses that don't have Whatsapp in Mexico that we have issues with. If we do actually get through on the phone (this does work occasionally) we immediately ask them to switch to Whatsapp if they have it and then use texting to communicate.

[Edited on 10-6-2022 by JDCanuck]

JDCanuck - 10-6-2022 at 09:53 AM

Quote: Originally posted by lencho

Quote: Originally posted by JDCanuck

I could never understand why the local construction workers across the street could use it fine, but we kept getting the "not registered " message on both our prepaid phones sitting right next to the transmitter.

Interesting; I wonder if Telcel can tell you're connecting via a repeater (amplifier?).

When you drive out and suddenly get connectivity, is that with the tower to which your repeater is connecting?

Have you tested from across the street where those workers have connectivity? Any chance they're actually talking to the Telcel tower rather than your repeater?

No, it's actually a tower at the highway 36km away, and the workers were really pleased we installed this repeater as they now are able to use it when they had no access before we put it in.

surabi - 10-6-2022 at 09:55 AM

Quote: Originally posted by JDCanuck

SFandH: Yes, for emails, Whatsapp and data that works fine. It's actual calls to those businesses that don't have Whatsapp in Mexico that we have issues with. If we do actually get through on the phone (this does work occasionally) we immediately ask them to switch to Whatsapp if they have it and then use texting to communicate.

[Edited on 10-6-2022 by JDCanuck]

Yes, businesses do not often have Whatsapp numbers. That is true even in Mexico. I order fabric from a distributor in Guadalajara, and that requires a normal phone call.

And it's true that many people in the US and Canada do not use Whatsapp because they don't have any need to make international calls, nor do they travel internationally. I had to get some of my Canadian friends to install the app so I could whatsapp them and many really had no idea what it was.

JDCanuck - 10-6-2022 at 10:12 AM

Lencho: I kept thinking it was something on our dual sim phones that was set wrong and was hoping to talk to someone at a Telcel Kiosk to help us get it working properly. But based on what you posted, I think it is related to the tower that our home based antenna happens to be receiving from in combination with the Amigo Sin Limites package. I have no other explanation of why it kicks us off but keeps local workers connected.
Another issue to work through our next visit down along with finally getting an appointment for the tax number and getting that out of the way.

SFandH - 10-6-2022 at 10:19 AM

Quote: Originally posted by surabi

Quote: Originally posted by JDCanuck

As far as I know, no special apps (whatsapp, skype, or?) are needed for wifi calling. It's a phone setting that you enable.

"WiFi calling is built into the phone natively. It uses the phone’s native dialer and contact list. There’s no need to install any additional app, and only the person who wants to make a phone call over WiFi must activate the feature — the other party can be connected to a cellular network."

https://www.netspotapp.com/blog/all-about-wifi/wifi-calling....

[Edited on 10-6-2022 by SFandH]

Don Pisto - 10-6-2022 at 10:27 AM

with wifi spreading far and near won't wifi calling render cellular obsolete?

surabi - 10-6-2022 at 10:33 AM

Quote: Originally posted by Don Pisto

with wifi spreading far and near won't wifi calling render cellular obsolete?

Wifi is not available everywhere. When I was in Canada staying at my daughter's place, they get their Wifi through a cellular hot spot from their phones. They tried a wifi router at their home, but the reception is terrible in their area. So when they weren't home, they of course had their phones with them and I had no Wifi to connect to.

JDCanuck - 10-6-2022 at 10:52 AM

The governments and financial institutions increasingly require smart cellphones to travel, look up any government health records, bank account balances, tax accounts, pay bills or access any increasingly protected personal info. I think it looks like computers will soon become obsolete and smart phones will be required for almost everything we do.

Surprisingly, in order to obtain your most recent tax filings including any government changes after you filed, you must wait for them to snail mail out your access code (10 days delay) before you are allowed to access them through a complicated multi stage access procedure.

[Edited on 10-6-2022 by JDCanuck]

AKgringo - 10-6-2022 at 11:11 AM

I recently had an appointment with the Franchise Tax Board in Sacramento. It was my second visit, so I knew where to go, and as I am at the window to check in, I get a text telling me that it is time for my appointment.

I was directed to take a seat in a fairly small waiting area that was just about deserted. I am close enough to the clerk to make eye contact, but he sent me a text telling me it was my turn! This is progress? :?:

JDCanuck - 10-6-2022 at 11:17 AM

Same for pre booked appointments to get blood tests here AKGringo. Go to door and sign in, fill out an admission form, go back to car and wait for a text telling you you can now come in for your appointment.
If you are 10 min early for the appointment, wait til exactly your appointment time and come back to do the sign in.

JDCanuck - 10-6-2022 at 11:29 AM

Lencho...I think the biggest issue we run into is we have a 6 digit alphanumeric postal code and refuse to accommodate all those 5 digit numerical code fields to pay bills.
Followed closely by the fact we have an off grid rural address when we wanted satellite internet(why would an urban address want it?) and a bank account rather than a local urban address we could take a picture of with of course a CFE bill to prove that's where we don't live, (but someone we know does).

[Edited on 10-6-2022 by JDCanuck]

surabi - 10-6-2022 at 11:31 AM

Quote: Originally posted by AKgringo

I am close enough to the clerk to make eye contact, but he sent me a text telling me it was my turn! This is progress? :?:

While recently visiting my daughter in Canada, she sometimes texts from downstairs my teenage granddaughter who is up in her room.

Seems truly bizarre to me.

JDCanuck - 10-6-2022 at 12:28 PM

Maybe when Elon gets his AI robot working with conversational voice recognition and the ability to fill in our forms we can get them trained to do all this legwork for us and just show up like we used to when all the preliminaries are dealt with? Life is soooo much easier in the digital age.
One could only hope.
Wait! Are we training the robots, or are the robots training us?

[Edited on 10-6-2022 by JDCanuck]

JDCanuck - 10-6-2022 at 01:00 PM

It's the setup for automatic payments of bills, Lencho. For some unknown reason, now these automatic payments or municipal tax payments get refused when you register a credit card with either a Canadian 5 digit code or the local residence 5 digit postal code. On immediate payments at both Telcel and Hughesnet, it accepts the same card with the 6 digit local residence postal code. For the municipal taxes we can now do the SPEI transfer as we now have a Mexican bank account.
It's a programming thing that used to exist as well when we paid for items on a lot of US sites, but they had a workaround by entering zeroes in place of the letters and adding another zero. Most US payment sites now accept the Canadian 5 digit alphanumerical, but not these Mexican sites...yet.

[Edited on 10-6-2022 by JDCanuck]

JDCanuck - 10-6-2022 at 01:26 PM

Quote: Originally posted by lencho

Quote: Originally posted by JDCanuck

when you register a credit card with either a Canadian 5 digit code or the local residence 6 digit postal code.

Six-digit postal codes in Mexico? :?:

That's a new one for me... care to provide some examples?

Sorry Lencho...5 digit Mexican codes, 6 digit alphanumeric Canadian