BajaNomad

Is travel in Baja and Mexico affected by mega migration?

verichip - 12-18-2022 at 02:51 PM

https://youtu.be/KyafGcZKi3g
How does this affect tourist's travel?
https://youtu.be/9dqeMUxyUY8
https://youtu.be/g-hy6uPHAtk

[Edited on 12-18-2022 by verichip]

RFClark - 12-18-2022 at 04:07 PM

The only “migration” we’ve seen driving north is a constant stream of cars, campers and towed rigs headed south from Canada and the US.

mtgoat666 - 12-18-2022 at 06:53 PM

Quote: Originally posted by verichip  
Is travel in Baja and Mexico affected by mega migration?


no. tourists wont see any impact.

verichip - 12-18-2022 at 07:05 PM

What if I was to travel to Oaxaca or Chiapas? Does an extra million gypsies affect the crime rate?

freediverbrian - 12-18-2022 at 08:38 PM

Gypsies?? Romanians are crossing the boarder? Maybe Hobos no Gypsies.

surabi - 12-19-2022 at 11:03 AM

Quote: Originally posted by surfhat  
Can we call them for what they are? Desperate refugees fleeing for their lives and their children's lives hoping for a future, any future where they won't be subject to gangs and corrupt officials.



Exactly. No one leaves their homeland, trudges hundreds or thousands of miles with their family, with only what they can carry on their backs, or gets in an overcrowded boat that is likely to capsize, just because they think the US is where they can make a lot of money. But those who rail against immigration portray immigrants as some kind of criminal element or looking for a free ride to distract from their xenophobia and lack of compassion. And referring to people as "illegals" is disgusting and demeaning- human beings are not "illegal", only actions are illegal.


[Edited on 12-19-2022 by surabi]

verichip - 12-23-2022 at 03:13 PM

"I don't see the connection"

The highest crime rates, the highest production of heroin, and the highest rate of outward migration are closely related.
This is a know known.

Don Pisto - 12-23-2022 at 06:41 PM

Quote: Originally posted by lencho  
Quote: Originally posted by verichip  
"I don't see the connection"

The highest crime rates, the highest production of heroin, and the highest rate of outward migration are closely related.
This is a know known.

I wasn't aware that Central America and Venezuela-- major sources of these migrants on the Mexican border-- are big heroin producers.

Are they? :wow:



I don't know but for a number of years AMLO has been flirting with the idea of not only allowing legal cultivation of opium poppy but also coca, the idea is to help farmers in southern mexico compete with Asia for synthetic opioids (fentanyl) its a crazy world out there

mtgoat666 - 12-23-2022 at 10:37 PM

Quote: Originally posted by verichip  
Is travel in Baja and Mexico affected by mega migration?


Fastest way across the border: get sentri. And don’t line up with the undocumented, they will slow down the line :light:

verichip - 12-24-2022 at 03:14 PM

Even Santa Claus got stopped at the border
https://youtu.be/5bf9lUdRWFA

surfhat - 12-25-2022 at 11:33 AM

Cliffy, you nailed that one.

Specifically, spend time, money, and effort in the country's of origin will help to keep the desperate refugees from becoming desperate refugees on the road and will solve so many other problems before they become many more problems.

Thanks Cliffy. If only others could show the same level of awareness and clarity you did this fine morning.

Peace, love and fish tacos to all here on Nomad.

verichip - 12-25-2022 at 03:33 PM

The opoid invasion is responsible for most of the crime. People are running from crime in their homeland. The heroin poppy is the root of the problem. Why are Mayan people Living in Ensenada instead of their home in Huehuetenago?

surabi - 12-25-2022 at 04:20 PM

Quote: Originally posted by verichip  
The heroin poppy is the root of the problem.


No it isn't. Heroin and other derivatives of the opium poppy have been around and used by some for hundreds of years. If they legalized heroin tomorrow, how many people do you think would say "Oh, goody. I've always wanted to be a heroin addict. Nodding out in a doorway in a filthy alley looks like such a cool lifestyle".

The root of the problem is not the drugs. The root is to be found in why people become drug addicts in the first place. It isn't because drugs are available- if that were the case, everyone would be a drug addict. The question is why so many people are so unhappy, alienated, in emotional pain that makes them want to turn to drugs. Poverty, lack of education and lack of opportunity is what leads to crime and drug addiction, not the opium poppy. It's just a plant.

JZ - 12-25-2022 at 04:44 PM

Quote: Originally posted by surabi  
Quote: Originally posted by verichip  
The heroin poppy is the root of the problem.


No it isn't. Heroin and other derivatives of the opium poppy have been around and used by some for hundreds of years. If they legalized heroin tomorrow, how many people do you think would say "Oh, goody. I've always wanted to be a heroin addict. Nodding out in a doorway in a filthy alley looks like such a cool lifestyle".

The root of the problem is not the drugs. The root is to be found in why people become drug addicts in the first place. It isn't because drugs are available- if that were the case, everyone would be a drug addict. The question is why so many people are so unhappy, alienated, in emotional pain that makes them want to turn to drugs. Poverty, lack of education and lack of opportunity is what leads to crime and drug addiction, not the opium poppy. It's just a plant.


Lack of family structure and mental illness.

Barry A. - 12-25-2022 at 05:18 PM

Quote: Originally posted by JZ  
Quote: Originally posted by surabi  
Quote: Originally posted by verichip  
The heroin poppy is the root of the problem.


No it isn't. Heroin and other derivatives of the opium poppy have been around and used by some for hundreds of years. If they legalized heroin tomorrow, how many people do you think would say "Oh, goody. I've always wanted to be a heroin addict. Nodding out in a doorway in a filthy alley looks like such a cool lifestyle".

The root of the problem is not the drugs. The root is to be found in why people become drug addicts in the first place. It isn't because drugs are available- if that were the case, everyone would be a drug addict. The question is why so many people are so unhappy, alienated, in emotional pain that makes them want to turn to drugs. Poverty, lack of education and lack of opportunity is what leads to crime and drug addiction, not the opium poppy. It's just a plant.


Lack of family structure and mental illness.



-----Yes, agree with much of the statements above, but there is no "lack of opportunity". There are millions of "jobs" out there going unfilled. I and my friends and kids had about 20 different jobs in their teens and 20's before they actually found a career job that they loved and pursued to retirement. IMO taking drugs is a choice made by individuals who fail to take responsibility for themselves.

mtgoat666 - 12-25-2022 at 05:29 PM

Quote: Originally posted by Barry A.  
Quote: Originally posted by JZ  
Quote: Originally posted by surabi  
Quote: Originally posted by verichip  
The heroin poppy is the root of the problem.


No it isn't. Heroin and other derivatives of the opium poppy have been around and used by some for hundreds of years. If they legalized heroin tomorrow, how many people do you think would say "Oh, goody. I've always wanted to be a heroin addict. Nodding out in a doorway in a filthy alley looks like such a cool lifestyle".

The root of the problem is not the drugs. The root is to be found in why people become drug addicts in the first place. It isn't because drugs are available- if that were the case, everyone would be a drug addict. The question is why so many people are so unhappy, alienated, in emotional pain that makes them want to turn to drugs. Poverty, lack of education and lack of opportunity is what leads to crime and drug addiction, not the opium poppy. It's just a plant.


Lack of family structure and mental illness.



-----Yes, agree with much of the statements above, but there is no "lack of opportunity". There are millions of "jobs" out there going unfilled. I and my friends and kids had about 20 different jobs in their teens and 20's before they actually found a career job that they loved and pursued to retirement. IMO taking drugs is a choice made by individuals who fail to take responsibility for themselves.



hard for many to get ahead, when raised in poverty and ignorance, raised by the poor and ignorant.
Can you imagine how hard life is if you are an illegal who flees dire circumstances, arrives in usa with no money and no more than the clothes on your back, and You are accosted by ignorant Americans who hate you just because you are a refugee that needs a helping hand, and these hateful Americans ship you by bus to the snow country and shove you off the bus in a snowstorm on a deserted street at 200 AM?


[Edited on 12-26-2022 by mtgoat666]

surabi - 12-25-2022 at 05:33 PM

"IMO taking drugs is a choice made by individuals who fail to take responsibility for themselves."

Your opinion is uninformed and ignorant. You obviously have little understanding of the issue. Most drug addicts endured sexual, physical, and emotional abuse from an early age. This was not a "choice" and these people are severly damaged by no fault of their own. Their parents and the system failed them and they do not have the tools or skills to be responsible for themselves or anything else.

[Edited on 12-26-2022 by surabi]

[Edited on 12-26-2022 by surabi]

verichip - 12-25-2022 at 07:53 PM

"Your opinions is uninformed and ignorant"

Pull your heaads out of the sand.

When a pregnant woman uses heroin her babies brain never develops properly.

surabi - 12-25-2022 at 09:54 PM

Quote: Originally posted by verichip  
"Your opinions is uninformed and ignorant"

Pull your heaads out of the sand.

When a pregnant woman uses heroin her babies brain never develops properly.


What is your point? Do you think you are telling us something we aren't aware of? Do you think a pregnant woman wants her baby to be born addicted? Why do you think she is using heroin? Simply because she's irresponsible?
What's your excuse for having a brain that doesn't function properly?

[Edited on 12-26-2022 by surabi]

BajaMama - 12-29-2022 at 03:38 PM

As we all know, opioids were widely prescribed for 15+ years in doses that caused millions to become addicted through no fault of their own. Look at all the homeless people around the country, especially in warmer climates. These unfortunates can't afford black market opioids so where do they turn? Meth and heroin. Is every homeless person a drug addict? Of course not, many work full time jobs, even two, and still can't afford rent.

Immigrants? Don't even get me started. Who do you think does all the work white privileged Americans refuse to do? Has anyone noticed the labor shortage? Immigrants aren't criminals, they are desperate human beings coming to America with hope in their hearts and the willingness to work hard.

surabi - 12-29-2022 at 06:46 PM

I spent several seasons picking fruit in the interior of British Columbia. I enjoyed it for the most part, but I can verify that it is hard work. Apples, and especially pears are really heavy and it's exhausting. You are up on a ladder picking into a large canvas bag that is strapped to you, when the bag is full, you have to climb down the ladder with the heavy bag, then empty it into a large wooden bin that sits in the middle of the row, gently so as not to bruise the fruit. You also have to be careful not to pick off the "spur" on the branch right next to the fruit stem, as next year's fruit grows from those spurs. Orchardists walk through and look for spurs on the ground under the trees and reprimand the pickers who were working those trees.

Whenever people b***h about "illegals taking all our jobs", I ask which job an illegal immigrant beat them out of- the one scrubbing out rich people's toilets, or the one crawling through a dusty tomato field all day in the blazing sun?

mtgoat666 - 12-29-2022 at 07:15 PM

Quote: Originally posted by BajaMama  
As we all know, opioids were widely prescribed for 15+ years in doses that caused millions to become addicted through no fault of their own.


Oh, those addicts are not faultless.

Marty Mateo - 12-29-2022 at 08:09 PM

Quote: Originally posted by mtgoat666  
Quote: Originally posted by BajaMama  
As we all know, opioids were widely prescribed for 15+ years in doses that caused millions to become addicted through no fault of their own.


Oh, those addicts are not faultless.



Read the book Empire of Pain and you should hopefully rethink that statement.
When are we as a society going stop wasting resources and get over our quasi religious judgemental stance against people who are struggling. Drugs are not a law enforcement issue, they are a public health issue . The “war on drugs “ was lost before it started, stop playing whack a mole and just making them more lucrative. It would be far cheaper and more humane to support people and not create the next generation. The U.S. almost no maternity leave for new parents and you wonder why you get the outcomes you get .

JDCanuck - 12-30-2022 at 06:42 AM

Quote: Originally posted by lencho  
Quote: Originally posted by BajaMama  

Immigrants? Don't even get me started. Who do you think does all the work white privileged Americans refuse to do?

At the moment I'm in the agricultural belt of Washington (think "apples" and "wine"), and there's not a white face to be seen out in the orchards and vineyards. Well, maybe the foreman, but you can be sure she's bilingual.

I've considered picking apples for a season to get a handle on that vocabulary set and hang out with the paisas, but at my age it'd probably cripple me: those folks bust their butts and as you say, it's the white privileged Americans reaping the benefits.

I never ask what someone's immigration status is-- none of my business-- but for what it's worth, credible figures I've seen state that some 50% of agricultural workers in the country are currently undocumented.

There's no question that overall, the U.S. benefits from this influx of fresh eager energy; the question is how to manage it in a humanitarian manner without negatively impacting those of us who got here first (i.e. us privileged white "natives" [as if we were here first]).

[Edited on 12-30-2022 by lencho]


Somehow we always seem to assume illegal immigration and legal immigrants that are offered a solid future for themselves and their families are the same thing. Our countries rose to the high standard of living we presently enjoy through massive legal immigration of people who appreciated the advantages of moving here. They tend to work harder, live more frugally and contribute far more to society than the average entitled citizen. No one i know is opposed to that. But why would we discourage legal immigration and at the same time encourage illegal immigration is beyond me. Who benefits except the employers who can pay them far less than the legal required standards through the fear of deportation and those that get paid to smuggle them in?

JZ - 12-30-2022 at 06:54 AM

Quote: Originally posted by BajaMama  


Immigrants? Don't even get me started. Who do you think does all the work white privileged Americans refuse to do? Has anyone noticed the labor shortage?


Maybe if we didn't give Gen Z an "extra" $10K in stimulus checks to stay home after Covid was over.

This brilliant choice caused worker shortages and helped fuel inflation.

So, the next brilliant idea to solve that one is to let 15 million people waltz across the Southern border over 4 years?


mtgoat666 - 12-30-2022 at 08:01 AM

Quote: Originally posted by JZ  
Quote: Originally posted by BajaMama  


Immigrants? Don't even get me started. Who do you think does all the work white privileged Americans refuse to do? Has anyone noticed the labor shortage?


Maybe if we didn't give Gen Z an "extra" $10K in stimulus checks to stay home after Covid was over.

This brilliant choice caused worker shortages and helped fuel inflation.

So, the next brilliant idea to solve that one is to let 15 million people waltz across the Southern border over 4 years?




Shorty mcjizm:
You sure do complain a lot!
Why did you cash your covid stimulus checks? You feel so strongly about this I assume you refused all the money, right?
Or are you a hypocrite? Hate stimulus, but gleefully collecting stimulus, eh?

JZ - 12-30-2022 at 08:57 AM

Quote: Originally posted by mtgoat666  

Shorty mcjizm:
You sure do complain a lot!
Why did you cash your covid stimulus checks? You feel so strongly about this I assume you refused all the money, right?
Or are you a hypocrite? Hate stimulus, but gleefully collecting stimulus, eh?


Those checks, which went to employees, were to "keep them working."

Not sit at home doing nothing. A whole generation of youth have been taught to be lazy and expect handouts from the government.


[Edited on 12-30-2022 by JZ]

Ateo - 12-30-2022 at 09:09 AM

There were some very thoughtful and elegant posts in this thread yesterday morning. Posts that appeared well reasoned and judged by history and love would make a Nomad proud!

Your fears are a map to your freedom!

Have a good day!

surabi - 12-30-2022 at 11:52 AM

Quote: Originally posted by JZ  


Those checks, which went to employees, were to "keep them working."

Not sit at home doing nothing. A whole generation of youth have been taught to be lazy and expect handouts from the government.


[Edited on 12-30-2022 by JZ]


Which youth are sitting at home doing nothing? Name one, since you seem to have personal knowledge of this.

BajaMama - 12-30-2022 at 01:46 PM

We didn't get one stimulus check, but we did get the CA $400 gas rebate a couple months back. That one surprised me. My kids got the stimulus checks. One really needed them, the other two donated the $$ to charity since they were still employed during that time.

I know, white people problems....

JZ - 12-30-2022 at 02:22 PM

Quote: Originally posted by surabi  
Quote: Originally posted by JZ  


Those checks, which went to employees, were to "keep them working."

Not sit at home doing nothing. A whole generation of youth have been taught to be lazy and expect handouts from the government.


[Edited on 12-30-2022 by JZ]


Which youth are sitting at home doing nothing? Name one, since you seem to have personal knowledge of this.


Try talking to ppl running small businesses some time..

JZ - 12-30-2022 at 02:37 PM

Quote: Originally posted by BajaMama  


I know, white people problems....


All of these ethnicities have higher household incomes than white ppl.

Indian
Bangladeshi
Cambodian
Chinese
Taiwanese
Filipino
Hmong
Indonesian
Japanese
Korean
Laotian
Pakistani
Iranian
Thai
Vietnamese
Nigerian
Samoan

surabi - 12-30-2022 at 02:38 PM

Quote: Originally posted by JZ  
Quote: Originally posted by surabi  
Quote: Originally posted by JZ  


Those checks, which went to employees, were to "keep them working."

Not sit at home doing nothing. A whole generation of youth have been taught to be lazy and expect handouts from the government.


[Edited on 12-30-2022 by JZ]


Which youth are sitting at home doing nothing? Name one, since you seem to have personal knowledge of this.


Try talking to ppl running small businesses some time..


In other words, you don't actually know any young people who are sitting at home doing nothing while collecting stimulus checks. But think its fine to claim they are. Just like the other claims you present as fact with zero actual proof.

JZ - 12-30-2022 at 02:48 PM

Quote: Originally posted by surabi  

In other words, you don't actually know any young people who are sitting at home doing nothing while collecting stimulus checks. But think its fine to claim they are. Just like the other claims you present as fact with zero actual proof.


I know plenty of them. My kids are their age. All our friends have kids in their early 20's. I've been around dozens of Gen Z the last couple years. And have sat with many business owners and discussed their businesses with them. My wife does a lot of hiring for her business.

Article this week.

Home Depot co-founder says ‘socialism’ killed motivation to work: ‘Nobody gives a damn’
https://nypost.com/2022/12/29/home-depot-co-founder-says-soc...

So, we open the US border to find ppl to work after we paid ppl to not work? Makes perfect sense.


[Edited on 12-30-2022 by JZ]

mtgoat666 - 12-30-2022 at 04:04 PM

Quote: Originally posted by JZ  
Quote: Originally posted by surabi  

In other words, you don't actually know any young people who are sitting at home doing nothing while collecting stimulus checks. But think its fine to claim they are. Just like the other claims you present as fact with zero actual proof.


I know plenty of them. My kids are their age. All our friends have kids in their early 20's. I've been around dozens of Gen Z the last couple years. And have sat with many business owners and discussed their businesses with them. My wife does a lot of hiring for her business.

Article this week.

Home Depot co-founder says ‘socialism’ killed motivation to work: ‘Nobody gives a damn’
https://nypost.com/2022/12/29/home-depot-co-founder-says-soc...

So, we open the US border to find ppl to work after we paid ppl to not work? Makes perfect sense.


[Edited on 12-30-2022 by JZ]


Shorty,
Lots of kids out there busting their balls in the work place. Sorry to hear your kids turned out to be stimulus-sucking couch potatoes.

The home depot dude is a senile right wing nut. I see that HD disavowed any association with his silly utterances.

[Edited on 12-30-2022 by mtgoat666]

surabi - 12-30-2022 at 04:08 PM

And I also know plenty of Gen Zers. They are all working or going to school. Kids not having the motivation to work has zero to do with socialism (another right wing bogeyman buzzword that most of you have no idea the meaning of)- they were never taught to be responsible, and had no expectations of pulling their weight. Blame their parents, not politics or stimulus checks.