El Camote
Senior Nomad
Posts: 514
Registered: 9-7-2003
Location: Above the clouds
Member Is Offline
Mood: y Blues
|
|
Toyota 20R engine
Am considering buying an older camper for Baja built on a Toyota truck chassis with a 20R engine. Thought maybe some of you Toyota dogs would have
some valuable experience with this engine to pass on. Was wondering the following:
1. Ease of maintenance, specifically valve adjustments.
2. Availaility of parts
3. Is it an electronic ignition or does it use points? Is there an upgrade if it uses points?
4. Reliabilty of carburetor. Is the Weber a good upgrade?
5. What, if any, is the achilles heel of this engine? What goes wrong?
6. Timing belt or chain. When is the scheduled replacement?
7. Aftermarket parts that are worthwhile. Exhaust header, etc.
I like to have an intimate relationship with my engines and your experiences will help prepare me. 
|
|
|
bajaloco
Nomad
Posts: 159
Registered: 12-5-2002
Location: Huntington Beach, California
Member Is Offline
Mood: wishin I was fishin
|
|
If you have a problem with the engine, you can always swap it out for a later model. I did it on a 82 toyota. The big problem with those were the 5
speed tranys, went thru three tranys before I changed it to a later model 5 speed with larger input shaft bearings.
|
|
|
mrchuck
Junior Nomad
Posts: 82
Registered: 11-6-2002
Location: Gun Barrel City, TX
Member Is Offline
|
|
The 20R engine is very popular here and easy to get repaired, including head re-building, and total engine overhaul.
Plenty of parts, new and used. Plenty of seasoned mechanics that do excellent work.
Probably the aluminum head is the weak point, as many Mexicans do not use anti-freeze which stops the chemical reaction of water and aluminum. The
head corrodes, eats thru the head gasket, and you now have a big problem.
La Paz has several huge machine shops the weld and fixes them up good as new.
Can't go wrong with the old 20R Toyota motor in a 3rd World country,,,,Saludos,,,,mc
|
|
|
4baja
Super Nomad
Posts: 1339
Registered: 9-4-2003
Location: morro bay ca
Member Is Offline
|
|
petronics ignition replace, pull the head and check it and change coolent often, lots of parts availible, a very good moter. whats up mike?
|
|
|
jerry
Super Nomad
Posts: 1354
Registered: 10-10-2003
Location: loreto
Member Is Offline
|
|
20R
i had a 1977 toy 1 ton pickup with a 20R sold it in 1993 with 397000 miles on it it was a really bad engine i had to put a timing set in it and its
still being driven i see it offen just change the oil and runn it till the wheels fall off in 1993 i got a 1983 toy with a 22re fuel injected had to
put a timming set in it too just sold it with 356000 miles on it the guy headed for north carolina the next morning he called me when he got there
another really bad truck lol have a good one jerry
jerry and judi
|
|
|
Hook
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9010
Registered: 3-13-2004
Location: Sonora
Member Is Offline
Mood: Inquisitive
|
|
That's a good engine
but it was sorely underpowered in all the MH applications I saw it in. What is it, a Dolphin?
Do a compression check.
|
|
|
Me No
Banned
Posts: 444
Registered: 11-24-2003
Member Is Offline
|
|
Hook, muy correcto! Exactamente.
|
|
|
El Camote
Senior Nomad
Posts: 514
Registered: 9-7-2003
Location: Above the clouds
Member Is Offline
Mood: y Blues
|
|
New Toy.
Just as a follow up, I bought a '76 Toyota Chinook mini-motorhome off ebay (I must be out of my mind) and picked it up last weekend. Very original,
only 75K miles. Going to need a lot of elbow grease to get her up to snuff but, badly in need of a complete tune-up, the engine still starts right up
and purrs. Bought a $100 bag of tune-up parts this week and can't wait to dig in. Glad there's a Napa one block away!Thanks for all the input from
everybody, if definitely prompted my decision.
Steve, called Pertronix and they don't have a unit listed for this engine. Have you put one in a 20R before? Can't quite read the numbers on the
distributor so we couldn't cross check it that way.
Regarding the underpowered issue, the Chinook is very lightweight, made out of fiberglass with a pop-top. Sits only about 6.5' high with the top
down. My last Baja rig was a '71 VW bus so the Toyota seems like a Nascar in comparison!  
Hope to make it's maiden voyage to Baja this fall.
Anybody know anything about suspension lifts/upgrades for a Hi-Lux long bed? 
[Edited on 5-28-2005 by El Camote]
|
|
|
jerry
Super Nomad
Posts: 1354
Registered: 10-10-2003
Location: loreto
Member Is Offline
|
|
lift
if i recall right mine had a torsion bar suspention in the front its easy to raise and lower it as you want just add shackels in the rear once you
get it where you want get the front end alined
check to hear any timing chain noise it has a hydralick tensioner that works off the oil pressure but with only 75k miles on it its just broken in
if by any chance you need to have the head done its very critacal not to shave it down too mutch it will change the distance between shafts for the
timming chain causing it to be loose or at the end of ajustment not a good thing. have a good one
jerry and judi
|
|
|
Me No
Banned
Posts: 444
Registered: 11-24-2003
Member Is Offline
|
|
Mike, get yourself a Downey caalogue. They have all the parts for toyotas you will ever need. Call them up. at 562-949-9494 They will send you one
right out for free.
|
|
|
Packoderm
Super Nomad
Posts: 2116
Registered: 11-7-2002
Member Is Offline
|
|
El Camote, keep us updated on how your Chinook turns out. If you live in the States, do you need to smog your rig? A neighbor of mine recently bought
one for $400.00 It needs a bunch of work; and honestly, I don't think it is ever going to happen. I would like to hear your opinions about Chinook vs.
VW bus.
|
|
|
El Camote
Senior Nomad
Posts: 514
Registered: 9-7-2003
Location: Above the clouds
Member Is Offline
Mood: y Blues
|
|
The Project...
Jerry, the front suspension is coil spring. Guess I'd have to put longer coils and shocks on to raise it? Could I raise the leaf spring rear an inch
or two just by putting longer shackles on? Would this affect all the other angles like the drive shaft?
Tom, I knew there was a business that specialized in Toyota parts but couldn't remember their name. I'm going to send for their catalog, thanks for
the reference.
I started digging into the engine this weekend. Pulled the valve cover and was horrified to see thick oil sludge piled up to the height of the valve
springs on the exhaust side. On a whim, I took out all the head bolts thinking I could lift out the whole rocker assembly to clean it up. Big
mistake! Broke the seal of the head to the block, yada yada. Seems this engine has suffered from serious neglect. All the hoses and wires are
brittle. The spark plug wires are actually stiff. Solid chunks came out of the radiator. It's a real testament to Toyota engines that this thing
still ran in this state of neglect! 
Found what seems to be a good Toyota mechanic within walking distance. I just strolled up while walking the dog and the owner must have spent half an
hour with me yakking about 20R engines and Baja. He goes several times a year on long m.c. rides staying at Mike's Sky Ranch and Alfonsinas. He
told me a lot including the sludge is from long durations between oil changes and using Pennzoil motor oil which is apparently caca. Glad I've never
used it! Anyway, some things should be left to the experts and I'm taking it
in later this week for him to pull the head, clean up the sludge, do an inspection and replace the head gasket. Hopefully, with 75K miles it won't
need any machining. I expected at least one big ticket job to be done on it and looks like this is it and hopefully the only one.
Packy, yes, I do have to pass smog. The previous owner passed it last December but let the reg. lapse so it has to be done again. Hopefully, in 2006
when it's 30 yrs. old it won't have to be smogged again. My VW wasn't a camper but had a 6 ft. bed platform in the back. That thing would go
anywhere: Plenty of ground clearance and it's giblets tucked up nice and tight. Never had a problem on the Gonzaga road and used to do it quickly.
Worst damage I ever had from many miles of Baja back roads was rock dents in the steering gear cover and a bent front license plate from diving into
arroyos! As good as it was down in Baja, it was too underpowered for the freeway drive down and I used to push it too hard.
I'm looking forward to the little extra oomph (and reliability) of the Toyota engine and the amenities of the camper. Cranked up the 3-way fridge
yesterday and it froze water in 4 hrs. The 2-burner stove works, as does the pump sink and the batterycharger/converter. I bought one of those
Costco 400W inverters for $25 just to have. I've gotta do something about that 70's era beat-up paneling on the walls and maroon shag carpeting
though.
If it's of interest to anyone else, I'll post updates on the project as I go. Could help someone else who may be considering the same thing and
everyones comments sure help me!
All in all, I want to do this for under $4K. so it will be the Baja economy rig. Packy, tell your neighbor to get going on his. One sold on ebay for
$4600. recently just because it only had 27K miles and was original. Think I'd rather have one with recent engine work than original low miles.
Here's a little inspirational webpage for the Chinook. Wouldn't this make an awesome Baja rig?
http://www.toyotamotorhomes.com/nolan's_76_chinook.htm
[Edited on 6-1-2005 by El Camote]
|
|
|
jerry
Super Nomad
Posts: 1354
Registered: 10-10-2003
Location: loreto
Member Is Offline
|
|
sounds like your getting into it if it was me id change the timing set while i had it down if the oil wasnt changed as offten as needed this is a weak
point the week point yes it has coil springs but also torsion bars that are ajustable an inch or 2 wont bother anything else except posibley the front
end aline habe a good one
jerry and judi
|
|
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
Posts: N/A
Registered: N/A
Member Is Offline
|
|
I have a 1980 Toyota Pick-Up I bought last year for $1800.00.
Its a 4x4, I bought an engine re-ring kit for it this last winter.
I had a bad head gasket that went out last fall, I just recently
changed the gasket, I did the timing wrong, and will have to
pay a mechanic to re-due the timing. Last week I bought another
toyota p/u w/ a running engine that I will swap this summer.
This next winter I will rebuild that other engine. 20R engines
are very beautiful, I get about 23.5 miles to the gallon.
My wifes Grandfather owns a 1979 Toyota p/u & rebuilt
the engine two years ago. When you replace the head gasket
or rebuild the engine you need to put some high temp gasket
sealant in front of the timing chain.
|
|
|
Me No
Banned
Posts: 444
Registered: 11-24-2003
Member Is Offline
|
|
| Quote: | Originally posted by Anonymous
When you replace the head gasket
or rebuild the engine you need to put some high temp gasket
sealant in front of the timing chain. |
Do use the black RTV, but, It don't matter, chances are it will leak anyway. Viva paper towels work best. Roll it up and shove it into the crack
where the head and the timing chain cover meet, it will prevent the oil from getting all over your belts and hoses. A toyota tampon if you will. A
design flaw to be sure, but one of the few. The other obvious one is the plastic timing chain guides. Still cheap and easy to fix, and parts and
people who know how to work on them are readily available in baja.
|
|
|
PJC
Super Nomad
Posts: 1670
Registered: 3-28-2003
Location: EVERYWHERE
Member Is Offline
Mood: Right
|
|
| Quote: | Originally posted by El Camote
Just as a follow up, I bought a '76 Toyota Chinook mini-motorhome off ebay (I must be out of my mind) and picked it up last weekend. Very original,
only 75K miles. Going to need a lot of elbow grease to get her up to snuff but, badly in need of a complete tune-up, the engine still starts right up
and purrs. Bought a $100 bag of tune-up parts this week and can't wait to dig in. Glad there's a Napa one block away!Thanks for all the input from
everybody, if definitely prompted my decision.
|
Replace the timing chain soon. That was always a weak point in these motors.
I swear by True-Flow foam air filters as do many Baja Race teams. http://www.trueflow.com Avoid K&N, they do not filter all dirt.
Throw some Bilsteins under that rig as well.
Open up the exhaust a bit, larger pipe all the way and a very free flowing muffler. Headers are not needed.
Keep a box of spares (all very cheap) and you are good to go.
Oh yeah, get some of those super bright, HID lights. At least 6 of them on a roof mount for nightime highway driving.
[Edited on 6-28-2005 by Baja Blackie]
|
|
|
Me No
Banned
Posts: 444
Registered: 11-24-2003
Member Is Offline
|
|
Blackie is right about the timing chain. Get someone who knows what they are doing and pray it doesn't leak. It probably will anyways. You have the
advantage that your rig will probably be used for mostly long hauls. Mine never leaks when the head gasket has time to really heat up and form a good
seal. The short trips however are a different story. The Vivas help keep leakage onto the belts and hoses to a minimum. I know I've had mine done 4
times.
I like my K@N, but I don't drive in dusty conditions all the time like off-roaders do, but if you spray too much oil on the filter it screws up the
gasket that makes a seal. This can be a problem.
Downey says a larger diameter pipe is not needed, but do put on a flowmaster exhaust and an aluminized pipe. A header will get you some increase in
horsepower, but, and it is a big but, it will warp crack and cause you countless headaches trying to get the thing just right. Just do the hi flow cat
and the flowmaster.
Yes on the bilstiens. You can get a set for 240 right now on e-bay including shipping. That price beats downey by 50 bucks.
|
|
|
PacO
Nomad
Posts: 173
Registered: 1-19-2005
Location: waiting for the sun
Member Is Offline
|
|
http://www.trueflow.com
I called these folks because it sounds like they have a great product. Unfortunately they don't sell anything for a pickup w/a 22R or my Isuzu Rodeo.
Damn.
|
|
|
![[*]](images/xmbforum/default_icon.gif){kind=icon}
