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djh
Senior Nomad
Posts: 936
Registered: 1-2-2005
Location: Earth mostly. Loreto, N. ID, Big Island
Member Is Offline
Mood: Mellow fellow, plays a yellow cello...
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Skeet/Loreto
DjH; Diversity makes us Stronger????
Why??
How?
Diversity- The state or Form of being diverse. unlikeness, difference: Varitey, multiformity.
I am concerned that if every aspect of our life is made Diverse that there will no longer be an Individuality of the past Mores that have made this
nation Great, those things, such as Honesty, Respect,Morals, Kindness etc.
Labels are meant for identifing a particuliar group, not always as an insult such as:
*I agree with you... not always...!
Extreme Left Mostly aganist Communist/Socialist Types
Liberals
Moderates
conservative
Right Wing--Mostly aganist Religions Groups
Do you think that we as Children should give up our Moral Character just to make someone different "Feel Good"?
All of the above is ask in a Serious manner.
Skeet/Loreto |
Hi Skeet,
Thanks for your sincere questions. I'll try to express my thoughts as sincerely. You're my senior, so I respectfully hope this doesn't sound like a
lecture... just my view, ok?
Firstly, I always appreciate your experiences, perspectives, and opinions here... I've watched for quite a while before ever signing on too. You have
experiences (and thus perspectives) that I don't, and I try to 1. find value for myself in those experiences and perspectives (especially related to
Loreto), and 2. think about your views, and try to understand them, even when they're different from mine..... so thanks . .
Next, because of your experiences and your views (and willingness to share them here with us), you are the individual that you describe:
"Individual[ity] of the past Mores that have made this nation Great, those things, such as Honesty, Respect, Morals, Kindness etc.". You and I (and
many others here) share those important priorities, regardless of our opinions on different topics.
Right.... Labels don't have to, but can, and have historically often been used to, marginalize individuals and groups. In my own experiences and
international travels, I (for myself) have tried to understand WHY someone I meet and get to know believes what they believe.... For me, there is a
difference between respectful discussion and simply trying to argue a point with the intent of proving the other wrong or "deciding" who is right.
(The word decide has its origins in.... basically... killing off (cide - as in insecticide, biocide, etc... alternatives to arrive at one.)
Both discussion and decision (conclusion oriented debate) have their place and value, for sure. I try not to spend too much time in discussion with
someone who only transmits (and has a broken receiver), or someone who disrespects me because of my individual (and sometimes evolvig) perspective or
view.
Diversity. Biological diversity sustains us and many other creatures on our planet. Cultural diversity is one of the reasons many of us are
attracted to Baja, Mexico, and travel in general. Intellectual diversity leads to new and creative solutions in many human areas. And honestly....
I'd get tired of the same old same old flavor of ice cream if there were only one - or only one type of music (I love a variety of musical styles...
diversity).
I was born on one side of the planet, my wife, girlfriend, travel buddy, and best friend (all one in the same  ) was born on the other side. I am, perpetually, plesantly surprised by our different experiences, and my own
experiences when I let go of my "comfortable familiar" and adventure in her home, culture, family, traditions, etc.
BTW, since you asked.... I'm not real caught up in "making someone different feel good", but I do try to spend more of my personal / choice time
around people who are positive and genuinely happy... And I don't think I really "give up [any] moral character" by considering or tolerating other
views or enjoying another place, culture, experience, etc. That's just me...
Sheesh... I wrote a book. (and I feel a bit exposed ) Sorry.... Ok Nomads.... Edit that down to a sentance or two for me 
Thanks, Skeet.
djh
Its all just stuff and some numbers.
A day spent sailing isn\'t deducted from one\'s life.
Peace, Love, and Music
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ursidae69
Nomad
Posts: 275
Registered: 2-22-2004
Location: Youngsville, NM
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: |
Sheesh... I wrote a book. (and I feel a bit exposed ) Sorry.... Ok Nomads.... Edit that down to a sentance or two for me
djh |
Thanks for your posting, you put a smile on my face and literally made my whole weekend. 
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Skeet/Loreto
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4709
Registered: 9-2-2003
Member Is Offline
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djh:
Thanks for your Answer.
The story of my Life. I am always interested in one"s background in an effort to find out"Where they are coming from"' i.e. their experiences
sometimes give me a clue to their position.
I have been trained to ask Questions.
Most of my concerns are for the Children of Today and their Teachings:
On one hand you have those Religious Groups in our culture teaching all the Mores and ways of their community.
On the other side you have the Teachings of change, diversity, no restraint etc.
I do not think at this time nor in the near future that Diversity in the USA will be obtained. Groups of like kind can get more of the Goodies in Life
than those who seek Divirsity.
Thanks for the Post, I am going to copy this one for my Paper file.
Skeet/Loreto
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Cardon Man
Super Nomad
Posts: 1319
Registered: 8-28-2003
Location: Thetis Bank
Member Is Offline
Mood: !Al Chingaso!
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I digress, but...
| Quote: | Originally posted by Skeet/Loreto
Such as the Dam to the West of Pt. angeles Wash. the enviors want to Blazt so the fish will swim bacvk up the river.. O.K but the envior group should
Foot the bill.
Skeet/Loreto |
It's alot more than Enviros that want the dams off the Elwha Skeet. I don't know any Olympic peninsula fishermen who want them in. Those two dams
provide nothing in the way power and they have done a great job of screwing up one of the best salmon rivers in North America! Did you know that there
were once 100lb plus kings in that river? The enviros don't need to foot the bill...anyone who loves catching salmon should. I believe you fall into
that group no?
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djh
Senior Nomad
Posts: 936
Registered: 1-2-2005
Location: Earth mostly. Loreto, N. ID, Big Island
Member Is Offline
Mood: Mellow fellow, plays a yellow cello...
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We likely have more in common than first thought on our side-discussion, Skeet.
As an elementary school counselor, I spend an incredible amount of time teaching and reinforcing boundaries and trying to help build respect,
personal accountability, and self-discipline.
In my small town, in my one school of about 450 K-5 kids.... about 10 years ago, I started saying "looking down this one hallway, I believe I can see
the fabric of our society starting to unravel."
That was 10 years ago. Today, it is much more so. Rampant POVERTY, transience (40% turnover most years) homeless kids, homeless families,
incarcerated parents, parents AND kids on diversion or probation, parents addicted to drugs and alcohol... (the meth problem here is out of control),
kids in and out of foster homes or being raised by grandparents, domestic violence, abuse, abandonment, neglect, explosive children, and more and more
mentally ill parents AND CHILDREN, every year.
Some days, I have to NOT look at the "Big Picture".... it is like a current too strong to swim in.... I have to get out in the eddyline.... and just
think about the next little kid I'm seeing who is "wounded", and I have a bandage to help. If I spend too much time thinking of the big picture, I
burn out and become overwhelmed.... And yaknow.. the present administration doesn't recognize or assess those things we do in our "failing schools"
nowadays... Here where I work, our schools are NOT failing, our society is, and parenting is... But we show up everyday and do way more than just
teach.
I keep reminding myself... I am fortunate to have a job where I help kids (and families) try to "get a grip on their baggage". (and that I'm retiring
to Loreto one day very soon!)
Thanks Skeet, and ursidae69,
Cardon Man, I think Skeet and I were the ones digressing - not you... sorry. Back to global warming, right ! ? !
djh
Its all just stuff and some numbers.
A day spent sailing isn\'t deducted from one\'s life.
Peace, Love, and Music
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Skeet/Loreto
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4709
Registered: 9-2-2003
Member Is Offline
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Thanks Again ; We could have a very good conversation about Loreto after you have been there for about a Year. I was a little involved in the School
ZKids there , atone time.
Take Care!
on Man: OH the Elwha!-- A private Dam built with Private funds--People who bought and built on Private Land-Perhaps their Dream of Life for themand
their childen and GrandChildren!!
Along comes some people who wants to tell them how to live , How their Grandchildren are to Live. Says " You can not longer have your dream-The dream
of the Salmon Fish and our read on what should be done is paramount to any of your Rights or desries!!
Therefore we will blaxt the Dam with the Taxpayers Money!!
Man; No!! as a fisherman I will be content to fish Below the Dam and let the "Right' of the people living on the Lake to be respected--Like sometimes
the 'common Good" does not Trumph the Individual. especially if the "Common Good is that of a Weak-minded Liberal..
Skeet/Loreto
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Skeet/Loreto
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4709
Registered: 9-2-2003
Member Is Offline
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Wildone:
forgot to answer your question of the Light bulbs. I have at least 20- The Barn I just finished has all of those Squrirlly litle smal Bulbs that last
for 8,000 Hours. I have been trying even at my age to do such small things as recycle; wife and I are on the Recycle pick up at Timbercreek.
I have not yet been convinced that this Global Warming Theory is Valid.-In one instant the whole thing can be changed by a Tusami-Earthquake- Volcano
etc.
In other words How do you stop the Heat from the Deserts along with particles of Sand being Blaxted into the Atmosphere? that is something we have no
control over what so ever!!
there are no SUV'S or very few on the Sahara.
I will await more reliable information before acceptance.
Skeet/Loreto
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Cardon Man
Super Nomad
Posts: 1319
Registered: 8-28-2003
Location: Thetis Bank
Member Is Offline
Mood: !Al Chingaso!
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I digress yet again...
on Man: OH the Elwha!-- A private Dam built with Private funds--People who bought and built on Private Land-Perhaps their Dream of Life for themand
their childen and GrandChildren!!
The dams were built to supply power to the mills in Port Angeles. They only provide 40% of the power to the mills and there are other sources.
Over 70 miles of river are blocked off to spawning fish. The damns were built with no fish passage of anykind and the result has been devastating to
the Elwha's fish. Regarding the "dream" of the builders...screw them. Individuals don't get to destroy our Northwest heritage at their whims. Those
fish are for your grandchildren too Skeet. Was it not a true "sin" to let the worlds biggest salmon rot and die at the foot of the damn without
spawning?
Along comes some people who wants to tell them how to live , How their Grandchildren are to Live. Says " You can not longer have your dream-The dream
of the Salmon Fish and our read on what should be done is paramount to any of your Rights or desries!!
Yes, as already stated salmon are paramount to the land holdings of a very few individuals. That's our resource Skeet...mine and
yours.
Therefore we will blaxt the Dam with the Taxpayers Money!!
Yes
Man; No!! as a fisherman I will be content to fish Below the Dam...
I've been doing just that since I was a kid. It can be fun but it's not what it should be. Don't you ever want to see a 100lb king salmon? Or
silvers so thick they choke the river? Do you realize that if it wasn't for the hatchery there would be jack squat in that river?
and let the "Right' of the people living on the Lake to be respected--Like sometimes the 'common Good" does not Trumph the Individual. especially if
the "Common Good is that of a Weak-minded Liberal..
Weak minded liberal my a*s. I'm talking about the right of every American to experience great fishing on a wild river. Yes, in this case the
individual is far less important than the common good.
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Skeet/Loreto
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4709
Registered: 9-2-2003
Member Is Offline
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Man:
When the Dam was built there was no one thinking ahead about Salmon!!
Now it was built by private funds, it should be then destrpyed by Private funds.
It should not be controlled by a bunch of Liberals from Seattle.
It is not right to punish peope for those things done so long ago by their ancestors.
It is the same as making me responsible for the acts of Salvery!!
The pesent is where the changes have to be made, that is the one thing the Liberal cannot seem to understand! that is that you do not Cry and Whine
about who did it 100 years ago so you have to Pay, instead of O. K. it is done and past, lets try to improve from here on.!!!
No! Man. I don't have to think about trying to catch a 100 LB. Salmon. It is interesting to watch the Indian Fisherman loading his 50% in the back of
his Pick up , in the Hot Sun and driving to the market.
Your way of thinking is just like "Enimant Domain"!
Built at their Whims???? Those people built their Homes many years before a bunch of Liberal Minded People decided to Protect the Salmon.
You think that Your right to catch a Fish where you want to catch a fish is paramount to a person who bought a Piece of Private Property, built a Home
rasied his Children to have someone come along a Trunp His
s Rights????
zYes if you PAY
No! if the Govt. has to Pay
Skeet
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Cardon Man
Super Nomad
Posts: 1319
Registered: 8-28-2003
Location: Thetis Bank
Member Is Offline
Mood: !Al Chingaso!
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Skeet/Loreto
Man:
When the Dam was built there was no one thinking ahead about Salmon!!
Now it was built by private funds, it should be then destrpyed by Private funds.
It should not be controlled by a bunch of Liberals from Seattle.
It is not right to punish peope for those things done so long ago by their ancestors.
It is the same as making me responsible for the acts of Salvery!!
The pesent is where the changes have to be made, that is the one thing the Liberal cannot seem to understand! that is that you do not Cry and Whine
about who did it 100 years ago so you have to Pay, instead of O. K. it is done and past, lets try to improve from here on.!!!
No! Man. I don't have to think about trying to catch a 100 LB. Salmon. It is interesting to watch the Indian Fisherman loading his 50% in the back of
his Pick up , in the Hot Sun and driving to the market.
Your way of thinking is just like "Enimant Domain"!
Built at their Whims???? Those people built their Homes many years before a bunch of Liberal Minded People decided to Protect the Salmon.
You think that Your right to catch a Fish where you want to catch a fish is paramount to a person who bought a Piece of Private Property, built a Home
rasied his Children to have someone come along a Trunp His
s Rights????
zYes if you PAY
No! if the Govt. has to Pay
Skeet |
It's too bad ( and very typical ) that you're insisting on looking at this as a liberal/conservative issue. Somehow in your mind it's "Liberal" (
which means "stupid"correct? ) to give priority to priceless, renewable resources that need to be looked after. That's so short sighted it should be
criminal. I'll never understand that.
Not one home will be compromised by removing the damns.
PS...Don't be thinking for a second I'm some Seattle Liberal. I'm deepest darkest Olympic Peninsula thru and thru. Huntin, fishin, shootin guns,
drivin jacked up trucks... the whole bit.
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bajajudy
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6886
Registered: 10-4-2004
Location: San Jose del Cabo,BCS
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Skeet/Loreto
You think that Your right to catch a Fish where you want to catch a fish is paramount to a person who bought a Piece of Private Property, built a Home
rasied his Children to have someone come along a Trunp His
s Rights????
y
Skeet |
What if those very same children have nothing to eat because no one thought far enough ahead to make sure that those natural resources would be
available when they and/or their grandchildren grew up? Some one has to think about the future of this world and, making sure there are salmon to
eat, is only a very small part of what should be a master plan to insure that we leave something worth having to our kids.
You can put any title you would like on me, but the short-sightedness of some sectors of the population defies common sense.
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Skeet/Loreto
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4709
Registered: 9-2-2003
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Man; True or Dalse???
Did are did not the Elwha Dam problem start with the Sierra club Sponsered "Save the Salmon Group of Liberal Save the Whales including that Liberal
Actor from cheers who tried to help promote an Area where no one would be able to catch a Salmon any where near the entrance to the Elwha??????
If my memory is not to dim the effort was made by and promoted by a Demorcat who beat Slade Groton{SP}. If fact it was he who proposed that the Groups
wanting to destroy the Elwha Damn should pay for the Removal.
Liberaql or Not Judy I am not putting a label on you, just puting the labels on groups of people who "Shout to High Heaven about Rights"' then think,
nothing of taking some ones Property or livehood for the sake of a Fish.
Just as they did and then Failed at Kalmath Falls Oregon,.
I agree with you 100% that we should do as we can to save some of this Planet for our children.
I do not think that it can be done entirely at my Expense!!
Liberals and Conservatives have to realize that the Present P{opulation has to take the necessary action for the future.
Look at what happened to me;-75 years old, worked my butt off for the future and look at it!!
Do you think that my Generation ever thought what the 60's have wrought on this Great Country?????
I would include in that "Master Plan'" some very Tough Penalties for destroying our Streams.
We do not "Take Private Property, destroy private Property for something that happened many years ago when there were Plenty of Salmon.
Skeet/Loreto
A good start on your Master Plan would go to the Owners of the Loreto Bay Villages and suggest to them that they should look to the future and not
Polute the Bay of Loreto.
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