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mulege marv
Senior Nomad
Posts: 652
Registered: 10-8-2004
Location: san carlos / grass valley, calif.
Member Is Offline
Mood: relaxed
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sounds good mike
no problem, my new secret weapon is on its way !
Want what you have
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Pescador
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3587
Registered: 10-17-2002
Location: Baja California Sur
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Marv, I wasn't attempting to say that there was no skill involved in the tournament, that would be stupid, to say the least. But you and I have both
been out there fishing when some neophyte comes along with a salmon plug and 30 lb line on a mooching rod and manages to catch the big fish of the
day. I was just wishing, and putting in my two cents worth that in my humble opinion, the tournament would have been more realistic for fishing
abilities if they would have taken a five fish limit for two days and calculated the total weight.
I think I am pretty good when it comes to yellowtail but there is no way that I consider myself capable of competing with someone like San Marcos
Mike who fishes day in and day out under all kinds of conditions and manages to always catch more fish overall than anybody else out there. Sure
there are days when I catch a bigger fish or even a few days when I manage to catch more fish, but I am not stupid enough to want to compare my catch
for the season.
At least in the November tournament, it was big fish for two days running and Dave Hughes did a great job by catching a big fish two days in a row.
Ed Hogan managed the biggest fish on the first day and then did not manage to put one in the hold on the second day.
I am just saying that on the bass and walleye circuit, the results at the end of the year would be entirely different if the winner came from the
largest fish (only) of the tournament.
I also think that anybody that even placed in the tournament needed a lot of knowledge and skill to compete and that was certainly evident, I just
wish the tournament committee would have set it up more as a contest rather than one lucky fish.
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Skipjack Joe
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8084
Registered: 7-12-2004
Location: Bahia Asuncion
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tournaments and fishing conservation
I just had an interesting thought about tournaments.
Basically all these boats go out and catch yellowtail which they bring back to port for 2 days hoping to place 1st, 2nd, or 3rd. All the yellowtail
that don't place are killed needlessly as I see it. Wouldn't it be better if all of the boats had radio communication and kept track amongst one
another of what the 3 largest fish are at any time. Then, you could release the fish immediately if it measured less than the current top 3 fish. This
could save a lot of yellotail, IMHO. The sportsman gets his pleasure at less cost to the fish.
I know this suggestion is impractical. For one thing there is no radio strong enough to reach all participants.
Perhaps this sort of thing is already occuring to some degree. I don't know. Tournaments are not my cup of tea.
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capt. mike
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8085
Registered: 11-26-2002
Location: Bat Cave
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Mood: Sling time!
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this fish was cooked at the awards banquet as i unnerstang it, and any extra am sure went to freezers for later dining - who would waste some of the
best eating around?? as long as they don't bust the catch limits what's the problem with a tourney that does loads to promote the local economy?!
hope i get to participate next time. and better weather.
formerly Ordained in Rev. Ewing\'s Church by Mail - busted on tax fraud.......
Now joined L. Ron Hoover\'s church of Appliantology
\"Remember there is a big difference between kneeling down and bending over....\"
www.facebook.com/michael.l.goering |
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mulege marv
Senior Nomad
Posts: 652
Registered: 10-8-2004
Location: san carlos / grass valley, calif.
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Mood: relaxed
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tourney
mr. pescador, i had a long response to your explaination on your first post, but i think its gone far enough. have a nice day, and good luck fishing !
Want what you have
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Skipjack Joe
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8084
Registered: 7-12-2004
Location: Bahia Asuncion
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Catch and Release helps a fishery and the Cortez fish stocks are in a decline. In a decline, despite the Mexican fish limits. It's just a suggestion
to not take what you don't need.
All you have to do is compare the blue ribbon trout streams of Montana and Idaho in the 60's to what exists now. Up until catch and release and size
limits was introduced to rivers like the Henry's Fork and the Madison you were lucky to find a trout over 12 inches. Now you can expect to catch a 16
incher or larger every day on those rivers. And you will catch more such fish. Despite the fact that the fishing pressure has increased by several
factors. The local economy is also doing better now than in the past because people are attracted to a good fishery. People are consuming just as much
fish protein now as in the past. Sure, a wild trout would be preferable on the table than a hatchery trout from Safeway, but that's really the only
loss with the new system. I'm not very fond of Tilapia either.
I really believe that some form of catch and release will be the long range answer for the ocean sport fisheries near large population centers like
Southern California. It may also be what eventually turns things around in Baja. Something will have to happen as the peninsula continues to grow and
develop.
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Hook
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9009
Registered: 3-13-2004
Location: Sonora
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Mood: Inquisitive
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SJ Joe,
I have often thought about your suggestion about keeping the contestants informed about the size of the fish on the leader board, by radio. While it
wouldn't prevent me from keeping fish that are close to the leader (hey, hand scales in bouncing boats vary), it would prevent people from bringing
back fish that are 10 lbs off the lead.
The problem is that most of the tournaments in Baja have an awards banquet and the fish turned in become the banquet fare. The top three fish probably
aren't going to feed everyone.
In the Mulege Classic's defense, they are only allowing one entry per boat FOR THE ENTIRE TOURNAMENT, if I read the rules correctly. And so, after the
first day, you know what the leader's weight is and can decide to release all fish that are well under that weight. Even the first day, the boat only
returns with the largest fish among all the persons on the boat. Outside of a pure C & R, honor-system tournament, what could be more conservation
minded? You aren't going to be keeping YT alive in livewells for later release.
And who wants to eat carne asada at a fish tourney awards banquet? That's just not right........
While an aggregate total of fish weight IS probably a better indication of fishing skills, it would certainly lead to more fish being killed.
The current set-up tends to level the playing field which should encourage even greater participation, possibly even by non-locals. I cant match Kid
Jurel or John Dinning or Alan Lewis or Rick Barber in multiple fish measures, but I might have a chance catching that ONE fish that beats them.
In the end, isn't it really about putting some money back into the community, rather than necessarily proving who the best fishermen are?
It's pretty apparent who the best fishermen are down there, anyway; tournament or no tournament.
I commend the Mulege Classics Tournament for running a very conservation minded tournament.
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mulege marv
Senior Nomad
Posts: 652
Registered: 10-8-2004
Location: san carlos / grass valley, calif.
Member Is Offline
Mood: relaxed
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well put
thank you !
Want what you have
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Bruce R Leech
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6796
Registered: 9-20-2004
Location: Ensenada formerly Mulege
Member Is Offline
Mood: A lot cooler than Mulege
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Hook
I have often thought about your suggestion about keeping the contestants informed about the size of the fish on the leader board, by radio. While it
wouldn't prevent me from keeping fish that are close to the leader (hey, hand scales in bouncing boats vary), it would prevent people from bringing
back fish that are 10 lbs off the lead.
The problem is that most of the tournaments in Baja have an awards banquet and the fish turned in become the banquet fare. The top three fish probably
aren't going to feed everyone.
In the Mulege Classic's defense, they are only allowing one entry per boat FOR THE ENTIRE TOURNAMENT, if I read the rules correctly. And so, after the
first day, you know what the leader's weight is and can decide to release all fish that are well under that weight. Even the first day, the boat only
returns with the largest fish among all the persons on the boat. Outside of a pure C & R, honor-system tournament, what could be more conservation
minded? You aren't going to be keeping YT alive in livewells for later release.
And who wants to eat carne asada at a fish tourney awards banquet? That's just not right........
While an aggregate total of fish weight IS probably a better indication of fishing skills, it would certainly lead to more fish being killed.
The current set-up tends to level the playing field which should encourage even greater participation, possibly even by non-locals. I cant match Kid
Jurel or John Dinning or Alan Lewis or Rick Barber in multiple fish measures, but I might have a chance catching that ONE fish that beats them.
In the end, isn't it really about putting some money back into the community, rather than necessarily proving who the best fishermen are?
It's pretty apparent who the best fishermen are down there, anyway; tournament or no tournament.
I commend the Mulege Classics Tournament for running a very conservation minded tournament. |
this is good Hook
Bruce R Leech
Ensenada
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Skipjack Joe
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8084
Registered: 7-12-2004
Location: Bahia Asuncion
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Hook
I cant match ....... Alan Lewis .....in multiple fish measures, but I might have a chance catching that ONE fish that beats them.
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Are you sure about that Hook? I don't think you give yourself enough credit. 
It's really about the value of a fishery. I watch these billfish tournaments on ESPN Outdoors and they all seem to know who the winner is without a
single fish being boated. It would be madness to kill all those marlin because you would be shooting yourself in the foot.
The largemouth bass tournaments now all keep their fish in livewells for weigh in. Imagine what these pros would do to those Alabama lakes if they
were allowed to keep all of the fish for a barbeque for the audience.
The people of Christmas Island make all of their tourist dollars from visiting bonefishermen. Imagine them promoting a tournament for the biggest
bonefish on the island. Even they understand the impact of such a thing. The islanders, a people who live from the sea, no longer harvest their own
bonefish, which they consider to be very good eating.
Traditions die hard. Mexico has always been backward in managing it's own resources. It's manana until your back is to the wall.
But to put things in perspective. Comparatively speaking, these tournaments do little damage to the Cortez fisheries.
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Hook
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9009
Registered: 3-13-2004
Location: Sonora
Member Is Offline
Mood: Inquisitive
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Skipjack Joe
| Quote: | Originally posted by Hook
I cant match ....... Alan Lewis .....in multiple fish measures, but I might have a chance catching that ONE fish that beats them.
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Are you sure about that Hook? I don't think you give yourself enough credit.
It's really about the value of a fishery. I watch these billfish tournaments on ESPN Outdoors and they all seem to know who the winner is without a
single fish being boated. It would be madness to kill all those marlin because you would be shooting yourself in the foot.
The largemouth bass tournaments now all keep their fish in livewells for weigh in. Imagine what these pros would do to those Alabama lakes if they
were allowed to keep all of the fish for a barbeque for the audience.
The people of Christmas Island make all of their tourist dollars from visiting bonefishermen. Imagine them promoting a tournament for the biggest
bonefish on the island. Even they understand the impact of such a thing. The islanders, a people who live from the sea, no longer harvest their own
bonefish, which they consider to be very good eating.
Traditions die hard. Mexico has always been backward in managing it's own resources. It's manana until your back is to the wall.
But to put things in perspective. Comparatively speaking, these tournaments do little damage to the Cortez fisheries. |
I think your last statement is the key. The effects of a conservation minded tournament are miniscule compared to the effects of the commercial
fishing fleet and it's blatant violations of even the generous rules in place for them.
Should we, as fisherman, simply become C & R fishermen because of the havoc they have wrought? I think the compromise that many of us have made is
to reduce our take to levels well under the legal limits.
And, no, I don't completely dismiss the possibility that I could outfish the people I mentioned. I have always felt that a large part of successful
fishing involves a healthy amount of luck. But it is not likely that I can remain lucky enough over the course of an aggregate fish count.
But lucky enough to catch that ONE big fish?.............that's possible.
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