BajaNomad
Not logged in [Login - Register]

Go To Bottom
Printable Version  
Author: Subject: EL CAMINO REAL in Baja (Part 9), Calamajue to Santa Maria
David K
Honored Nomad
*********


Avatar


Posts: 64845
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline

Mood: Have Baja Fever

[*] posted on 11-17-2003 at 01:18 AM
EL CAMINO REAL in Baja (Part 9), Calamajue to Santa Maria


Baja Almanac page 18:

From the terrace where the short lived mission at Calamajue stood, this final section of the Jesuit trail crossed the broad arroyo and climbed the steep north side, as does the auto road.

Crosby notes seeing signs of the trail just west of the road as they both head north to where passage over the ridge of SIERRA CALAMAJUE is possible.

Howard Gulick found the trail in 1952, also to the left (west) of the road and notes that the Camino Real passes the mouth of a canyon called El Culebrado (a snake like winding canyon) before crossing the road at LAS ARRASTRAS and comes to a water hole called San Francisquito, 0.6 mi. past Las Arrastras.

In 1769, Junipero Serra left Calamajue a little after noon and arrived at 'San Francisco' (San Francisquito) that day.

The name San Fancisquito had been applied to many sites in the region, including the larger part of what most call 'Gonzaga Bay': Ensenada de San Francisquito. The Mexican topos and Baja Almanac switched the names of the two halves of 'Gonzaga Bay', however.

From the water hole (and later an abandoned mining camp) of San Francisquito, the old trail follows the arroyo of San Francisquito, but called ARROYO LAS ARRASTRAS in the Almanac.
Crosby notes seeing excellent signs of the Jesuit road higher and on the west side of the arroyo from the auto road.

Both Gulick and Crosby say the Camino Real follows the arroyo to its junction with ARROYO SANTA MARIA, however recent muleback Camino Real traveler, Baja Bucko, says the trail short cuts to the mouth of the Santa Maria canyon and passes the palm oasis of Las Palmitas at 29?40.35'/ 114?28.29? Some excellent photos of this oasis are at http://www.timsbaja.com/jan03trip/jan03trip3.html

From Las Palmitas (also spelled: Las Palmytas or Las Palmas) the trail heads for the mouth of Santa Maria canyon...

Junipero Serra and likely the Jesuits before, went right up the canyon, called 'El Cajon' and climbed up the steep side to enter the valley containing the mission. This trail is now called the 'Indian Trail' as the El Camino Real was moved out of the canyon after Serra's trip to Alta California. The Indian trail is visible in this aerial photograph (bottom photo): http://davidksbaja.com/missionsm/page6.html

This 'El Cajon' canyon route was so dangerous that a new route was established which stayed out of the canyon, to the north. This was the route traveled on mule by Crosby, Baja Bucko, and Don Jorge.

Photos of the Camino Real where it leaves Arroyo Santa Maria at 29?41.733'/ 114?28.175' and heads northwest are at: http://davidksbaja.com/1102/page6.html

In November, 2003, I traveled further up the Camino Real from the previous year but did not have enough daylight to reach the mission (allow 6 hours). Photos and GPS at: http://davidksbaja.com/1103/page2.html

Soon after, in December, 2003, Don Jorge continued on to reach the mission and returned via the Indian Trail and canyon (Arroyo Santa Maria). Photos, GPS, and topo map at http://southcoastfarms.com/gonzaga_to_mision_santa_maria.htm

To Be Continued...


[Edited on 2-3-2004 by David K]




"So Much Baja, So Little Time..."

See the NEW www.VivaBaja.com for maps, travel articles, links, trip photos, and more!
Baja Missions and History On Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/groups/bajamissions/
Camping, off-roading, Viva Baja discussion: https://www.facebook.com/groups/vivabaja


View user's profile Visit user's homepage
Juan
Junior Nomad
*




Posts: 76
Registered: 8-31-2003
Location: Olympic Peninsula and Baja Sur
Member Is Offline

Mood: Life is good.

[*] posted on 11-17-2003 at 09:04 AM


David, Your series on the lost missions is very interesting to me. I hope to use your information, and the information I glean from others, in my explorations next year. Thanks again, Juan
View user's profile
David K
Honored Nomad
*********


Avatar


Posts: 64845
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline

Mood: Have Baja Fever

[*] posted on 11-17-2003 at 09:22 PM


Juan, feel free to ask here or email any questions on Baja's missions (lost or not). If I don't know, I have a ton of references. When I finish the El Camino Real series, I will start with the mission articles... some that were posted on Amigos were saved by Baja Bernie... the ones that were lost when Amigos went off the air, I will rewrite.



"So Much Baja, So Little Time..."

See the NEW www.VivaBaja.com for maps, travel articles, links, trip photos, and more!
Baja Missions and History On Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/groups/bajamissions/
Camping, off-roading, Viva Baja discussion: https://www.facebook.com/groups/vivabaja


View user's profile Visit user's homepage
academicanarchist
Senior Nomad
***




Posts: 978
Registered: 9-7-2003
Member Is Offline


[*] posted on 11-18-2003 at 10:42 AM
Lost Missions


David. I think we need to discuss again on this forum the question of "lost" missions, that, as you know, I have good reason to believe never existed. There is nothing wrong with exploring for lost missions for the fun of it, but important sites have also been dispoiled by treasure hunters looking for the elusive and non-existent Jesuit treasure.
View user's profile
Tucker
Senior Nomad
***


Avatar


Posts: 664
Registered: 10-31-2002
Location: El Centenario, BCS
Member Is Offline


[*] posted on 11-18-2003 at 11:55 AM
In my opinion.....


whether legal or not, the publishing of GPS or other co-ordinates of these sites should be illegal. The argument that attracting people to these sites helps preserve them is a pretty leaky bucket. Has anyone checked the legality of this with the Mexican Authorities, and has any of the accumulated data been shared with Mexican government Archeaologists?



\"I think it would be a good idea.\"
-- Mahatma Gandhi, when asked what he thought of Western civilization
View user's profile
academicanarchist
Senior Nomad
***




Posts: 978
Registered: 9-7-2003
Member Is Offline


[*] posted on 11-18-2003 at 04:08 PM
Preserving Historic Sites


Tucker. I agree with you that unprotected sites should not be publicized by publishing GPS coordinates, although this is not illegal. My concern, and David and I have discussed this many times, is that people will go off and damage historic sites such as mission sites, believing that there are lost treasure of lost missions.
View user's profile
David K
Honored Nomad
*********


Avatar


Posts: 64845
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline

Mood: Have Baja Fever

[*] posted on 11-18-2003 at 09:15 PM


If you read my Baja missions web site introduction, you will realize that it began as a home for the wonderful photos taken by Jack Swords, a retired school teacher and part time resident of La Paz. Jack has official papers from INAH giving him permission to go through private property if needed and to take photos and GPS.

None of the mission sites are secret, either. The lack of appreciation or apathy of the sites has led some to their destruction. Making the sites known (and we aren't the only ones) can do no worse than doing nothing. I get plenty of emails and posts that people have taken a new interest in the history of Baja because of our efforts.

The government of Mexico has begun to invest in the reconstruction of some sites. With increased awareness of historical sites, only more preservation is possible.

Many sites were plowed over by farmers or road builders either out of ignorance or apathy. If all the people of Mexico realize that these ruins can be a financial boom, perhaps they will join those trying to preserve the sites.

There is even more details and GPS of the sites in Ed Vernon's wonderful book: Las Misiones Antiguas.

As for the lost mission stuff... Yes, there probably are no 'lost missions', just lost or forgotten mission era ruins. The treasure hunting era ended about 40 years ago, I think. Just finding an old site is treasure enough. The padres had no time for treasur hunting... they barely could feed themselves.

THERE ARE NO GOLD TREASURES IN BAJA MISSIONS.

Baja Missions: http://davidksbaja.com/bajamissions




"So Much Baja, So Little Time..."

See the NEW www.VivaBaja.com for maps, travel articles, links, trip photos, and more!
Baja Missions and History On Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/groups/bajamissions/
Camping, off-roading, Viva Baja discussion: https://www.facebook.com/groups/vivabaja


View user's profile Visit user's homepage
Ski Baja
Senior Nomad
***


Avatar


Posts: 652
Registered: 8-19-2003
Location: Rosarito Beach
Member Is Offline


[*] posted on 11-18-2003 at 10:57 PM
Publicity


You guys are pretty funny if you think that this publicity that you David are publishing, (GPS coordinates), and exact directions is helping to preserve these sites when they are using 4WD and whatever it takes to get to them without having to get off their fat fannies.
Something tells me that preservation isn't first and foremost on your minds. Good thing you only know a few places in Baja Norte or I'd never find any real Baja people.
View user's profile Visit user's homepage This user has MSN Messenger
Ski Baja
Senior Nomad
***


Avatar


Posts: 652
Registered: 8-19-2003
Location: Rosarito Beach
Member Is Offline


[*] posted on 11-18-2003 at 11:21 PM
True feelings


This has nothing to do with the Hatfield /McCoy stuff that I see is still going on on this board. I do not believe in what you and Minnow are doing. Take it outside and get it done with. Neanderthal works!
These are my real feelings when it comes to destroying Baja. Which is what's happening.

Let's see, I live in California and I have a new Hummer, hmm, Death Valley, naw, too many regulations, Anza Borrego, samesame, McKinney/Rubicon, nah, too far and too cold. I know, let's check out David K's GPS points in "The Baja". I hear there's gold buried by the blah blah blah.
Cmon you guys, it's starting to look like you have some hidden interests here besides preserving Baja.
Why not GPS points in your own beloved country ? Where nobody cares.:lol:
View user's profile Visit user's homepage This user has MSN Messenger
academicanarchist
Senior Nomad
***




Posts: 978
Registered: 9-7-2003
Member Is Offline


[*] posted on 11-19-2003 at 06:23 AM
Things


Ski. Keep in mind that there have been numerous Baja travel guides that have identified the different mission sites. I am personally ambivalent about what you talk about in your post, which is perhaps why I keep hammering away at the theme of lost missions and no mission treasure. I also agree with your assessment about people going to tear up Baja, when it can be done here in the U.S.. West Texas has a lot of dry open spaces. I am particularly concerned about the desecration of native burial sites, and on a number of occasions have suggested that perhaps the same should be done for predominately white burial space.
View user's profile
academicanarchist
Senior Nomad
***




Posts: 978
Registered: 9-7-2003
Member Is Offline


[*] posted on 11-19-2003 at 06:26 AM
One Last Thought


Groups such as the California Landmarks Club initiated restoration projects at San Antonio mission in California and promoted preservation of the mission sites, because people visited the mission sites. I agree with you that too many Norte Americanos go to Baja with a pee poor attitude, and don't respect the fact that it is a different country. However, at the same time INAH has taken steps to protect the mission sites, and this probably would not have happened without tourism. I only wish the Mexican government would do more to deal with the jerks who go to Baja, but then smiley in the White House would throw a hissy fit.
View user's profile
Stephanie Jackter
Senior Nomad
***




Posts: 566
Registered: 11-3-2002
Location: Arizona
Member Is Offline


[*] posted on 11-19-2003 at 06:40 AM
Speaking of desecration...


It seems to be our favorite pastime in the United States. I studied anthropology in college and then came to the rude awakening that the only decent paying job I could get if I pursued the field was as a "Cultural Resource Manager". Fancy words for someone who goes in and digs up a site real quick for whatever information can be gathered on a shoe string before the bulldozers come in a wreck the whole thing to put up another set of those condos J.R. talks about. I've been to a couple of these sites in Tucson, where Hohokam people, who we still know relatively little about, lived near the banks of the now dry Santa Cruz and Rillito Rivers. Watching as the archeologists scurried around to measure the ball courts and dwellings and grave sites that would never again be seen was enough to make my stomach churn. Development and desecration, no matter what kind of a spin they put on it, go hand in hand. The same will happen in Baja. - Stephanie



When the goin' gets tough, the wierd turn pro
View user's profile
academicanarchist
Senior Nomad
***




Posts: 978
Registered: 9-7-2003
Member Is Offline


[*] posted on 11-19-2003 at 06:52 AM
Desecration


Steph. I agree with you 110%. Some 25 years ago developers building condos near the site of Santa Cruz mission in California uncovered the remains of a previously unknown mission structure. Instead of waiting a few days, they took advantage of a long holiday weekend and bulldozed to bed rock. The civic fathers, who were in the developer's pockets, did nothing.
View user's profile
Ski Baja
Senior Nomad
***


Avatar


Posts: 652
Registered: 8-19-2003
Location: Rosarito Beach
Member Is Offline


[*] posted on 11-19-2003 at 10:56 AM
desecration


Before I start getting called anti american again, the Mexican Tourists, which there are many of, are just as guilty of trashing these places as the american and canadian ones are.
Which is why the people I know down there are now very strict when it comes to trash, graffiti, theft of artifacts, and just being idiots in general.
I was actually trying to persuade them to make more mummies to put in some of the caves. So what if their last names happen to be Smith or Douglas rather than an Indigenous name. They would still be mummies!
Possession of psycotropic substances and littering, punishable by death. Kinda has a ring to it.:lol:
View user's profile Visit user's homepage This user has MSN Messenger
Jack Swords
Super Nomad
****




Posts: 1095
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: Nipomo, CA/La Paz, BCS
Member Is Offline


[*] posted on 11-21-2003 at 08:58 AM
Mexican Antiquities


Gad, I hate to jump into this, trying to avoid the "Hatfield/McCoy" thing, but you all raise good points. Tucker, you deserve a response: In traveling the back country in Baja for 20 years the loss of historical structures and artifacts was too apparent. I contacted INAH in Mexico City and proposed locating sites exactly (GPS) and photographing them as they stood at a certain period of time. I was given written authorization under my terms which was that the material was the exclusive property of Mexico and INAH. I was given permission to use the material gained as long as "credit to INAH was given." I want/need nothing from this. I strongly feel that these are Mexican resources, to be preserved, exploited, or otherwise used according to Mexican wishes. In just the last couple of years several mission structures have melted and washed away. I suspect that Marty might have taken the front wall of Mission Santa Maria (in spite of trying to get INAH to stop the undercutting). The point? There is now some photographic evidence of these sites that would not exist in a few years due to a variety of causes. A side benefit has been that INAH (particularly N Baja) has protected adobe ruins with covers, cement slurry, and enhanced Mexican participation in research and saving material for future museums. The increased awareness has caused this (and possibly some negative effects too). But, now INAH is looking at Baja historical sites as important resources instead of just the Mayan and Aztec sites. As an aside, I know David K does NOT publicize GPS locations of sensitive locations. In discussions with him he (and all of us) run into special places that are protected by isolation. These places have more time. Mission locations are well known and need to be protected. Now, the mining towns, artifacts, and history are going the same way...my current hope is to get these down for future historians. Regrettably, Baja is changing fast with development. Hopefully we can stay ahead of it. I hope this didn't offend anybody, this topic, like many others, deserves much more discussion...preferably over a Pacifico.
View user's profile

  Go To Top

 






All Content Copyright 1997- Q87 International; All Rights Reserved.
Powered by XMB; XMB Forum Software © 2001-2014 The XMB Group






"If it were lush and rich, one could understand the pull, but it is fierce and hostile and sullen. The stone mountains pile up to the sky and there is little fresh water. But we know we must go back if we live, and we don't know why." - Steinbeck, Log from the Sea of Cortez

 

"People don't care how much you know, until they know how much you care." - Theodore Roosevelt

 

"You can easily judge the character of others by how they treat those who they think can do nothing for them or to them." - Malcolm Forbes

 

"Let others lead small lives, but not you. Let others argue over small things, but not you. Let others cry over small hurts, but not you. Let others leave their future in someone else's hands, but not you." - Jim Rohn

 

"The best way to get the right answer on the internet is not to ask a question; it's to post the wrong answer." - Cunningham's Law







Thank you to Baja Bound Mexico Insurance Services for your long-term support of the BajaNomad.com Forums site.







Emergency Baja Contacts Include:

Desert Hawks; El Rosario-based ambulance transport; Emergency #: (616) 103-0262