BajaBruno
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Which fish finder for BCS?
I'm setting up a 20' Bayrunner for a month or two in La Paz (or areas around there as the conditions dictate) and I'm looking for suggestions from the
fishing guys and gals as to which fish finder/depth screen to buy.
How much is enough, or perhaps more germane to my wallet, more than enough? Do the bait schools show up well on your fish finder? None of the
Mexican pangas I have ever fished on had a fish finder, but I'm a little more technology driven and I like that added information.
Pompano? Skeet? FlyfishingPam? Help me out, troops.
Christopher Bruno, Elk Grove, CA.
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Alan
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I run a Furuno 600L and couldn't be happier
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Don Alley
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I have an Eagle Cuda 240 combo Finder/GPS on my kayak. I don't think they make that model anymore.
I only have used it to water up to about 125 feet deep. It does what I want-it shows the bottom, shows individual fish, schools of fish, bait, and if
I look at the extreme right edge it will show a 3 ounce megabait jig dropping straight down. The transducer is inside and shoots through the hull.
Price was low; I believe you can get an equivalent fish finder from Cabela's for just under $100.
I have a more slightly expensive Humminbird finder that I will install on my boat when I get it, hopefully soon. For the boat I'll want a look at
deeper water from time to time so I have gone for a little more power and better screen resolution.
I hear that the Furano 600L is a great finder, but I've seen prices in the $800 range and think I'll pass for now.
For GPS, for now I have my little Garmin handheld. GPS may be as important as a fishfinder. I have been out when low clouds covered the mountain peaks
and we were unable to triangulate and find the reef. GPS will get you to the spots, if you can get the data in it. If you are looking for bait, rod
and reel willtell you if the bait is there and only takes a couple of minutes more than the fishfinder.
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BajaBruno
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Thanks to both of you. The Furuno is pricey, but I have heard good things about it.
You are correct, Don, a GPS is valuable for a lot of reasons--not the least because it can get back to that same rock where you caught the last fish:
like you, I have a handheld that has treated me pretty well so far.
Anyone else like to weigh in?
Christopher Bruno, Elk Grove, CA.
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Pompano
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A few suggestions for you.
First some humor:
Do you remember when you could get a reliable fish finder and gps plotter in one. It was called... Grandpa.
Now down to your request:
Your choice of electronics depends on your budget and what you need to accomplish. You said SOC fishing and the need to spot
baitfish...you're in luck, because that's something we all do almost every time out.
First: I would suggest that since this might be your first purchase that you keep your expenses low. So..say we have a budget of $400-$500? You can
get a very usable unit/units for your 20' Bayrunner at that price.
Second: I also suggest that unless you are dead set on having a 'living-color' unit, forget it and get good old B&W. You will save major bucks.
Color is cool but afer the initial wow, it just comes down to functional...
Third: Look only at units that have at least a 5" screen..and preferably larger. Also make sure that you can see that screen clearly in direct
sunlight with your polarized sunglasses on...(not needed in Seattle!..but very important in Baja!)
Fourth: I would not get a combo sonar/gps unit just yet. Get a separate gps.. Garmin are generally thought to be
tops in gps units. You can get a handheld Garmin 12 gps and a mounting bracket for your console for less than $160. Also, you can double your gps
use by taking it in the car, on hikes, camping, etc. (see photo)
Fifth: Furuno is known to be the standard for FF's. They are a mite spendy, but you can find good deals on Ebay. Lowrance
(Eagle), Raymarine, Sitex, etc all make great units, too. I have used Lowrance units since the first 'little green box' came out in the early 60's.
On my last boat I used a LCX-113CHD with a 10" screen..color, gps, back-scratcher, all-in-one, yadda-yadda unit. (see photo) It was much more than I
needed, plus mucho bucks...but I like to play with the dang things when the fish are not biting...and it even plays tunes! But..they are not as
user-friendly as others. Eagle, a division of Lowrance, is by far the best value between the two.
Sixth: You will use these features the most...TIME, GPS POSITION, SPEED, WATER TEMP, and DEPTH. Thats really all I need to know. Seeing the fish
icons on the screen is just a plus, and almost all units will show them anyway, so don't worry about seeing the baitfish clouds below you.
Some other good ones in that budget range:
West marine still has a few of the classic Garmin Bluewater 240 Pros around. I would consider this superior to a lowrance/eagle
product. Should cost you are $150 with the 500 watt transducer. Couple this with the Garmin handheld gps w/bracket and you are good to go.
Search Ebay for a good deal on Furuno FCV620..as they run over that budget when new.
Furuno LS4100
Raymarine DS 500
Raymarine E-series is the nicest and the most user freindly that I've seen.
Lowrance-Eagle SeaFinder 480DF or Eagle 225
..and about a million others...but if you narrow your search to Furuno-Lowrance-Raymarine for 'fishfinders'...and Garmin for gps...it
gets a lot easier.
See what a can of worms you opened up? Have fun shopping!
[Edited on 4-17-2007 by Pompano]
I do what the voices in my tackle box tell me.
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BajaBruno
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As usual, Pomp, you have been very helpful. I'd love to stop by and chat on my way south in July. Thanks!
Christopher Bruno, Elk Grove, CA.
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cbuzzetti
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I have bought Humminbird products for my last 3 boats. All of them were GPS/FF/Chartplotter all in one units. I have been very happy with them as a
whole. I have used Furunos also and they are top notch.
The last unit I bought was for a 15' Gregor Baja. It is the Humminbird 161 GPS/FF/Chartplotter that I found on Ebay for $229+ shipping.
This had built in charts that included some roads for all of the US, Canada and Mex. It does not have detailed info like you get with a chart card.
Most of which is useless in Mex anyway.
This is a B+W unit comes with transducer, water temp and built in GPS ant. I believe it is only a 3.5" screen, but then I have a small boat. No
problems reading in sunlight. One main issue I have with this unit is that the transducer does not have a kick up bracket.
Aluminum boats require that the transducer be mounted externally. Most alu boats ride high in the water so transducer must be mounted lower in water
to read at speed. This can put them in harms way when boat is beached for loading and unloading. Personal experience here.
Most manufactures make quality units. I just happen to like the menus on the Humminbird and since I keep buying them I do not have to learn new menus.
As usual this is just my opinion.
Now go get one and start fishing ;-)
BajaBuzz
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Pompano
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an old, old photo for some 'sonar nostalgia'..
Great thread, BajaBruno...Nothing like talking fishing and fishing gear...fun stuff.
I bought my first 'fishfinder' in 1964. The classic 'little green box' by Lowrance. It was a dial-flasher unit using a 2-9 volt batteries and a
suction-cup transducer on the stern. When I saw it in a sporting goods store before leaving on a trip, I had to have it! My fishing partner was not
impressed and suggested I spent too much money on a 'fancy anchor.' It is on the side console in my trusty old Lund shown in this photo.
We are boat-camping at Hunter's Bay, Lac La Ronge, northern Saskatchewan in 1964. We did use it successfully to hit some rocks while watching that
dial...scouting around for these lake trout.
I do what the voices in my tackle box tell me.
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4baja
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i bought a humminbird 787c2 and have been very happy with it. it was simular to my last unit so was very easy to learn. it allso takes the nav cards
wich i bought for ca. and baja. good luck.
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Alan
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I believe that like most things in life you get what you pay for. Furuno is the standard for commercial operations and Garmin seems to be the
standard for Nav.
Having now used color scopes I would never consider going back to B/W for my FF or chartplotter. The information provided and ease of reading what is
ACTUALLY under your boat is infinitely better. It does however require that you learn how to use them. If you merely plan to set it to auto and drop
your bait on fish symbols save your money and get a Hummingbird or a low-end Lowrance. Though primarily made for skinny water it will show bottom
structure.
If you truly want to become better and are will to learn to properly adjust your scope to get the maximum information available go with the 600L as a
minimum and learn to use it. The question is "What are you willing to invest in not only your money but also your time to improve your fishing"? For
me the couple of hundred more dollars for the Furuno amortized over the life of the boat and living with the quality of the purchase over the life of
the boat made the extra cost more than acceptable.
For those of you that still live in SoCal, Mark Wisch provides an excellent class on adjusting and reading your FF at his store Pacific Edge Tackle in
Huntington Beach.
I used to agree with those that said their GPS put them on more fish than their FF but since taking Mark's class those figures are rapidly changing.
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BajaBruno
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Thanks to all of you.
Alan, do you feel as though your Furuno shows you fish that you couldn't see before, or allows you to distinguish species better? Is there a
difference in discerning bottom structure?
Cbuzzetti mentions transducers and that is a good question: are the 3-in-one transducers (depth, speed, temp) as good at imaging the water as a
separate sonar transducer? The big boys say no, but I might not be as discriminating as them! What’s the real world Baja experience? I’ve had both,
but never done a head-to-head comparison, or used them on the same water.
Cbuzzetti also brings up an unrelated but important issue with the Baja charts in chartplotters. Are there chartplotters that will “learn” the bottom
you run over, actually updating their software to reflect actual conditions?
4Baja might want to comment on the usefulness of his chartplotter cards….
Pompano, I also used one of those flasher finders many years ago, but I never could get the hang of it—it was wasted with my eyes, although I knew
guys who got a lot of info off of them. Nice char in that photo.
Christopher Bruno, Elk Grove, CA.
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Pompano
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Well, BajaBruno..you have a lot of info to digest...and a lot of great electronics to pick from. You will have no problem getting one that suits your
needs the best. 'Brokenlegdave' has some of the best electronic deals on the Internet..check it out.
Dual transducers are a good bet. 50-200hz. The flasher sonars are still great for high-speed depthsounding...as in going downriver at speed or
finding those shoals. Lots of fishermen use 2 or 3 separate units.
You can see, BajaBruno...there are many opinions and choices to be comtemplated before choosing your electronics. Personally I have used Lowrance and
Furunos in oceans, lakes, and rivers for quite a few years now...in depths of 1500ft to shallows of 4 feet....and they did the job better than all
others I have tried. Again, I think Garmin is tops for gps, but the sonar ..read fishfinder....field is dominated by Furuno, Lowrance, and Raymarine.
Check out hulltruth.com for some more opinions. Search.. best fishfinders, gps, sonar, etc.
Have fun shopping and Good fishing.
p.s. check out the Lowrance paper graph/flasher on this 1978 side-console. I used that unit from Bristol Bay to Conception Bay...for halibut &
salmon up north to yellowtail and grouper down south. Some fun times reading the paper records over c-cktails later that night!
[Edited on 4-19-2007 by Pompano]
I do what the voices in my tackle box tell me.
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Alan
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| Quote: | Originally posted by BajaBruno
Alan, do you feel as though your Furuno shows you fish that you couldn't see before, or allows you to distinguish species better? Is there a
difference in discerning bottom structure?
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Yes to all of the above. Still yes to distinguishing species but it is a learning curve.
I agree with Pomp on the dual frequency transducer but I have no experience to tell if there is a difference with the combo units - mine is with speed
and temp. For whatever unit you buy remember that the transducer is just as important as the scope.
You can find some good info here http://www.thehulltruth.com/forums/forum-view.asp?fid=8 and also here http://www.lowrance.com/Support/Tips_Tutorials/tutorials.asp
[Edited on 4-19-2007 by Alan]
[Edited on 4-19-2007 by Alan]
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Pescador
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Alan has the right aproach to solving your issue. What do you want the instrument to do. I would not even consider anything less than a color
Garmin. Leave the Lowrance, Humminbird, and those types for freshwater. I use my finder to do the most important job in the morning and that is to
find bait. Without the ability to turn up the gain to really see what is going on underneath me, I find it hard to find the bait. I watch a lot of
people who bought depthfinders but they are still using the little fish projections and really don't have an idea as to what is happening underneath
them. Then when I am fishing I need to know about thermoclines, feeding activity, approximate size of fish on the reef, etc. so that I can make some
type of a decision as to what is happening down there. So not only do I have a unit on the boat, I carry a spare unit in case something happens to
the primary unit and I can simply switch units and have the repairs done when I return to the US. I could probably catch fish off of an innertube, as
long as I had my depthfinder and GPS units mounted.
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Hook
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Agree with Jorge on the top brands.
I favor Furuno because failure of their units is just so darn rare and they do discriminate well. Their tech support is also excellent. I've never had
to call them with a tech question except to upgrade to a newer software version. But I know people who have called them with questions on networking
systems and they are very prompt. They also have a nice web tech support system that follows up with your web inquiries to make sure your question was
satisfactorily answered.
The 600L was a great choice but it has been replaced by the 620. All digital signal processing now. The more powerful big brother is the 585.
Personally, I think the 620 is fine unless you are huge into rockfishing real deep. The 620 will discriminate fish just fine from the bottom at depths
approaching 500 feet.
Heck yeah, the bait schools show up well on a good fishfinder!
I have never heard anyone say that including speed and temp are a detriment to the 'ducer. I do run them separate on my current boat but have run
combos on other boats with fine results. I generally use the GPS for speed, though.
With the Bayrunner, you will be pretty much forced to use a transom mount ducer. That's fine but the placement will be critical to avoid lots of
aeration. They generally do not read as well at high speeds, either. Get temp included, at least.
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Pompano
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transom mount for aluminum boats
BajaBruno..just in case you are not familiar with this feature of sonars. This is how I have mounted transducers on my aluminum hulls in the past.
How it helps.
The transducer should be mounted on your aluminum transom just below the water line and at a minute upward angle towards the bow. A well designed and
installed mount will work at high speed.. I get 32+mph out of my Lowrance model and read the bottom muy bueno. A must for fishing in reef country!
The obvious problem to overcome is cavitation at high speeds. The flow of water around the transducer has to be smooth...if the water flow is broken
by a rough surface and becomes turbulent you will have air bubbles. The bubbles are the problem..they will screw up your sonar screen as
‘noise’..making your bottom, structure, and fish signals difficult or impossible to see.
So..mount it so the water can flow past it without turbulence. Make a minimum of holes and mount it so it can “kick-up” without damage if struck by
something. Also, the problem is not limited to the shape of the transducer housing, because the boat hull itself can be a major problem with air and
turbulence over the sensor. A riveted boat is real problems, but your boat is welded, right? Each rivet streams bubbles behind it..and each weld
does the same. This means that you have to mount the transducer bracket as far down as possible on the transom.
Good luck and be sure to let us know how everything worked out...and how the fishing was!
[Edited on 4-19-2007 by Pompano]
I do what the voices in my tackle box tell me.
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cbuzzetti
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Another point to consider in transducer mounting is if the boat is going to sit in saltwater for extended lenghts of time. Meaning a week or more.
Electrolysis is something that must be considered. I had the SS mounting screws start to eat away my hull on a previous Alu boat. This boat did not
stay in salt water for extended periods. It was usually kept on the trailer.
On my current boat I mounted a piece of teak on the transom, 1/2" thick by 8" long by 3" tall to allow me to move transducer to optimal spot and to
hopefully eliminate electrolysis. The board is mounted using 2 SS bolts that have plastic washers on the inside of hull. The board has 3M 4200 sealer
between hull and wood. Transducer is mounted straight to wood.
Starboard is probably the better product to use for this application, I just did not have any when the install occoured.
Just something to consider.
BajaBuzz
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BajaBruno
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Good advice from all of you. Thanks so much. I'll get back to you in a couple of months and let you know if there are fish at the end of the line!
Christopher Bruno, Elk Grove, CA.
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