Marie-Rose
Senior Nomad
Posts: 894
Registered: 10-2-2003
Location: Victoria, B.C. and Todos Santos
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Mood: Worried...
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Changing a Fideicomiso
Does any Nomad know the process of having a Fideicomiso changed? The property is in two names and one name needs to be removed and also the
beneficiary needs to be changed.
Remember, when in Mexico, yes may be no and no may be
maybe!
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bajajudy
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6886
Registered: 10-4-2004
Location: San Jose del Cabo,BCS
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It will cost you but you can get it done.
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Osprey
Ultra Nomad
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Registered: 5-23-2004
Location: Baja Ca. Sur
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Hi, All I have heard in the southland is that it is a very good opportunity for them to get in your pocket -- $400 or more is what I've heard for the
smallest of changes. That's just the bank and I don't think the notario is necessary -- just a change that involves the trust, not the deed. If you
have to change the deed, then probably you'll need to pay the notario too.
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Marie-Rose
Senior Nomad
Posts: 894
Registered: 10-2-2003
Location: Victoria, B.C. and Todos Santos
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Mood: Worried...
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So, if one needs to remove one of the names of the ownership... that would be changing the deed?
Remember, when in Mexico, yes may be no and no may be
maybe!
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longlegsinlapaz
Super Nomad
Posts: 1685
Registered: 11-18-2005
Location: La Paz
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Marie-Rose, any change to the fideicomiso requires the involvement of both the bank AND the notario, and they each have their individual fees. But
wait! It gets harder! Both parties named on the original document are REQUIRED to appear in person at the final signing at the notario. I can't
swear to this part, but I think it might be required for all the originally named owners on the fideicomiso to sign the request for change.
If the reason for the ownership change is due to death, you have to provide a certified death certificate in lieu of that person's warm body. Despite the fact that only some elements of the overall document change, the bank
& notario treat it as a new document in that they charge the same fees except for the 2% acquisition tax & the initial originating fideicomise
fee if it was new rather than the sale of property with an existing fideicomiso. So make all the changes you can think of at the same time....it's
the same cost to just change a beneficiary as to do a name & beneficiary change simultaneously. And it's NOT cheap!! Both bank & notario
quoted me $400-450 each to change my beneficiary several years ago.....I stayed alive long enough to sell the casa instead!
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DianaT
Select Nomad
Posts: 10020
Registered: 12-17-2004
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| Quote: | Originally posted by longlegsinlapaz
If the reason for the ownership change is due to death, you have to provide a certified death certificate in lieu of that person's warm body. |
Would a cold stiff body work???
Seriously, as far as appearing before the notario, we never appreared in person ---instead we signed a power of attorney for our agent. It is an
alternative.
We were in San Diego at the time and had to :
1. Have our signatures on the power of attorney notarized by a California notary.
2. Have the County of San Diego sign and verify that the Notary is a real California Notary---(forget the fee, but not a lot)
3. Then had to obtain an apostille from the local office of the Secretary of State of California ---office in San diego---another fee.
Good luck.
Diane
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Hook
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9010
Registered: 3-13-2004
Location: Sonora
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Mood: Inquisitive
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Shop around when it comes to notarios. We found their fees to vary wildly, depending on the action needed.
This was the case in Guaymas, anyways.............
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longlegsinlapaz
Super Nomad
Posts: 1685
Registered: 11-18-2005
Location: La Paz
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Diane, ya ever tried to get a cold stiff body to sign it's name?
I can see the benefits of giving someone power of attorney over your property, if you aren't here full-time....but ya gotta really know & trust
that person. Plus it adds to the overall costs of any transactions they're involved in. I'm always in a cost-avoidance mode; I do as much of this
kinda thing as I can myself!
Hook, you're right! Even in the same area, different notarios have different fee schedules.
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DianaT
Select Nomad
Posts: 10020
Registered: 12-17-2004
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| Quote: | Originally posted by longlegsinlapaz
Diane, ya ever tried to get a cold stiff body to sign it's name?
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Hey, many, many, many years ago, in another lifetime, I was an Escrow officer. Sometimes people died a day or two before a deal closed----amazing,
sometimes their hands still moved.
If we would have had the time to go to La Paz we would have prefered to be there, but could not do so at the time. As you say, ALWAYS better in
person if possible.
Diane
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tehag
Super Nomad
Posts: 1248
Registered: 1-8-2005
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Changeover
Bought a place with an existing a few years ago. Big surprise! They found some way to recalculate taxes from when there was a lot of peso flux going
on and nailed me pretty good. I used an attorney, everyone was here to sign, the valuation was very modest, there were no other problems. The fee was
$4,000US including the lawyer. The phantom tax was $10,000US. I balked, demanded a recount, stalled, finally paid. My Spanish is adequate to read the
law about the tax calculation, and it is no more or less vague than any other such government scam. I made sure the tax was paid directly to the gov,
but that was all I could do. If you are changing a Fidiecomiso that is older than the big three-zero peso adjustment, be prepared for a jolt.
[Edited on 4-23-2008 by tehag]
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bajaguy
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9247
Registered: 9-16-2003
Location: Carson City, NV/Ensenada - Baja Country Club
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Mood: must be 5 O'clock somewhere in Baja
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If you need a "Death Certificate" let me know............
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Marie-Rose
Senior Nomad
Posts: 894
Registered: 10-2-2003
Location: Victoria, B.C. and Todos Santos
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Mood: Worried...
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Thanks for the info everyone... any other experiences in La Paz area greatly appreciated. I think one of the best pieces of advice at this point is
selling the property with the existing Fideicomiso!! (anybody interested in prime property in Todos Santos with guest casita!!!!)
(thanks Betty for u2u)
Remember, when in Mexico, yes may be no and no may be
maybe!
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longlegsinlapaz
Super Nomad
Posts: 1685
Registered: 11-18-2005
Location: La Paz
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Yeah, but you STILL need all the people named on the fideicomiso to be present at the final signing. Worked for me because I'm the only name on the
document. Unless you take Diane & John's route. Maybe it IS a better way to go.....no dead bodies at the signing!
| Quote: | I think one of the best pieces of advice at this point is selling the property with the existing Fideicomiso!! (anybody interested in prime property
in Todos Santos with guest casita!!!!)
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Lauriboats
Senior Nomad
Posts: 563
Registered: 9-6-2006
Location: Mulege/Bahia Asuncion
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We are currently in the process of taking our ex-partners name off of our fideicomiso. The notario that we are using in La Paz is requiring a new
appraisal of our property. This is based on the low value that was placed on the property from the prior owners who didn't want to pay the taxes. Our
paperwork should be done in the next week or so. I will let you know what the fees are as soon as I find out.
What we see depends mainly on what we look for.
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Marie-Rose
Senior Nomad
Posts: 894
Registered: 10-2-2003
Location: Victoria, B.C. and Todos Santos
Member Is Offline
Mood: Worried...
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Lauriboats
That would be fabulous to get that info... and the name of the notario you are using!
Remember, when in Mexico, yes may be no and no may be
maybe!
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rhintransit
Super Nomad
Posts: 1588
Registered: 9-4-2006
Location: Loreto
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okay, a friend did it in La Paz this fall. her partner died. this is what she just wrote me about the process:
"Hi Roberta: Let me think how it all went. It would depend on the reason for the change. In the case of R..... dying I had to get a death
certificate, certified by the county clerk in the county he died, and then have it apostillated which is an ok by the state's Secretary of State
office, I think. Then, in Mexico, I had to have it all translated by a perico, an official translater. I had to go to the bank that holds the
fideicomiso and fill out a form regarding the changes I wanted. I had to do a letter asking for the changes. The bank prepared that for me. I
probably needed an electric bill, of course. I needed certificates from the Municipal tax people that the taxes were up to date and I needed
certificates saying there were no liens on the property (from the Municipal Assessor's office, or whatever it is called that has the deeds of all the
houses in the city). I think then it went to the Notary that had done the original Fideicomiso and they did all the rest. There was a big fee to the
bank and the notary. I would have to look that up. Fees for the certificates from the city. I think a registration fee for the big record keeping
place in Mexico City. The whole thing probably cost at least $1000 and maybe more, and took many months. You can hire people to do the whole thing,
though. I did mine myself but I knew enough Spanish to sort of talk to the fideicomiso person at the bank, who speaks no English, the offices at the
city hall and the notary. Some of it was double for me since I own two lots. A person with no Spanish should really get help."
reality\'s never been of much use out here...
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Lauriboats
Senior Nomad
Posts: 563
Registered: 9-6-2006
Location: Mulege/Bahia Asuncion
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Mood: Loving life in Baja
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Marie-Rose
Lauriboats
That would be fabulous to get that info... and the name of the notario you are using! |
Marie-Rose,
We received the price to remove our ex-partner's name from our fideicomiso today. We are also changing the beneficiarios, the cost to the notario
will be $19,800 pesos. Our bank is Scotia and we haven't found out their fees yet. We have a good friend here in Mulege who is helping us with the
paperwork, so I haven't talked to the notario directly. The notario we are using is Lic. Alejandro Mendoza Cevallos Notario #8. Good Luck, Lauri
What we see depends mainly on what we look for.
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