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CaboRon
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Very Interesting 
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toneart
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| Quote: | Originally posted by grover
Sounds like a good opportunity to show a little reserve and humility in not speculating/advocating.
We weren't there, lots of flat-out garbage journalism around...
Perhaps we'll be surprised by further developments. |
Good advice, Grover!
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CaboRon
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| Quote: | Originally posted by soulpatch
Man, that's a fast turn around on a toxicology report......who knew they were so efficient?
| Quote: | Originally posted by fulano
http://www.ensenada.net/noticias/?id=12640
It goes on to further say that toxology tests show the perp was driving under the influences of marijuana, methamphetamine and amphetamine. He
entered a tourist camp and was endangering the tourists. |
[Edited on 7-11-2008 by soulpatch] |
it does take longer, the report is BS
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aha baja
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Mood: wherever you go, there you are...
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Karma... Got to Bahia a few hours after the incedent.I have it from a Very reliable source(30 year ex pats living in Bahia) that Cortez was involved
in a vehicular manslaughter in ensenada a few years ago. Got off scott free(somehow) The la familia Cortez is known locally for "Dealing" in Bahia.
Frontier justice-karma. Just hope there are no reprisals. Federales were called in to investigate. Just a young punk kid caught up in Crystal and paid
the ultimate price
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aha baja
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P.S. Saw the funeral prep on tues for a wed 6pm burial. His plot is 50' back of the front mosoleum to the right.All i can hopeis that this was just
an anomoly and that is over and done with.
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aha baja
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PS Fulano The cop is in hospital and is in critical condition. So what ever illinformed cynical opinion you have about this case it is backed with
hard evidence. anything else is pure conjecture
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Barry A.
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| Quote: | Originally posted by jdtrotter
If he ran over the police officer, IMHO, the police did what they needed to do --- isn't it their job to protect others from being hurt? He could
have easily run over someone else.
Having lost a brother many years ago to the world of heroin and eventual suicide after many years of being in and out of prison for property crimes
committed to support his habit. I know this may sound cold, but while I mourned his death, there was also a relief involved. No longer in the small
town did I have to face his victims, including myself and other family members. His only violent crimes were against family.
Tough love works sometimes, but as stated before, it only works when the addicted person is ready and makes a choice to accept help. Prison? Drugs
are a major problem in prisons as is violence. Facing a long prison sentence is what put my brother over the edge to take his own life.
Yes, I always feel for the family who loses anyone, but I feel more for the victims. It is easy to get hooked on drugs which do take over one's
being, but getting help is a choice.
Sad for his family, yes, but the blame belongs with the young man, IMHO.
Diane |
Diane------
In my opinion you are "right on" in your points----all of them here.
Lets wait until all the facts are known before forming opinions, as others have said.
As a retired LE officer, 3 or 4 hits out of 6 or 8 shots is fantastic!!! This shooting sounds like a totally legit one to me, so far. (Cops are
TRAINED [it is pounded into their heads] to shoot to kill in circumstances like this-----as described)
Barry
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fulano
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| Quote: | Originally posted by aha baja
PS Fulano The cop is in hospital and is in critical condition. So what ever illinformed cynical opinion you have about this case it is backed with
hard evidence. anything else is pure conjecture |
p.s. Aha baja, the only opinion I rendered on this thread was that I though it stinks that they charged the chief of police with murder for shooting
the kid after he ran over his fellow officer, and that I thought the kid probably had a family with 'connections'. And if you would read the newpaper
article I linked in my post, you would learn that the cop is OK and was released from the hospital after 24-hours of observation.
That is what you get for getting your facts from the nearest latrine while taking a dump [e.g. some "30-year expat"] instead of reading the news.
Do you have some kind of a problem with that? Or do you need a short course in reading comprehension?
[Edited on 7-13-2008 by fulano]
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aha baja
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I hadn't read the news article as I just got in from bahia last night. I misspoke and misinterpereted your post. my bad on that
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BajaBruno
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I had my wife translate the articles for me. What I heard was that the officer was in stable condition with head trauma and unspecified spinal
injuries, and in 48 hours he may be released, or may not. That time has passed and I don't know what happened.
There are easily imaginable situations where an officer could be charged with murder, even when the Reader’s Digest version of events seems to
justify deadly force. I won’t speculate what happened here, but I was in BOLA when this happened and I probably heard the gunshots, though at the
time I dismissed them as cherry bombs. I don’t recall hearing any sirens or seeing flashing lights, but I was reading and didn’t walk over to
investigate. The next day we saw a couple of very professional looking cops outfitted in jumpsuits and driving an unmarked Expedition making
inquiries about town. We saw the short funeral procession a couple of days ago as we were leaving BOLA.
In US law, homicide and murder are very different terms, but it may be important to remind readers that Mexico works by Napoleonic law and judicial
criminal investigations of disputed or uncertain facts are very common. This may simply be a case where the shooting officer is brought before the
magistrate so that a proper judicial investigation can be conducted—the judge will then decide if the officer is prosecuted. The newspaper report
says that the state attorney general (that’s the best translation of the title that I can muster) is making a fuss that the deceased was not armed
with a gun (I guess s/he doesn't consider a vehicle a weapon), but that may be just newspaper hyperbole, or based on a statement of facts that we are
not aware of. I suspect that as this story plays out and the facts become more clear, we will see that early conclusions were silly and unfounded.
BTW, toxicology tests for drugs can be done in an hour or so. That it takes so long for reports to be produced in the US is not a function of the
actual processing time, but simply the bureaucratic maze such forensic requests need to travel in our system.
Christopher Bruno, Elk Grove, CA.
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fulano
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| Quote: | Originally posted by BajaBruno
I had my wife translate the articles for me. What I heard was that the officer was in stable condition with head trauma and unspecified spinal
injuries, and in 48 hours he may be released, or may not. That time has passed and I don't know what happened. |
From the article which I linked:
"Tenía lesiones en el costado derecho de su cuerpo y permaneció casi un día en observación, pero al confirmar que su estado de salud era estable,
abandonó el hospital.
Aclaró que el paciente no está completamente sano, pero ya está fuera de peligro, por lo que ahora deberá seguir un tratamiento y guardar reposo en su
hogar. "
[Translation]
He had lesions on the right side of his body and remained almost one day under observation, but upon confirmation that his health was stable, he left
the hospital.
He clarified that the patient is not completely healthy, but is now out of danger, and should now follow a treatment plan and home rest.
...and the other article actually says that the police chief was not just brought before a magistrate, it says he was incarcerated, and made no
mention of any bail.
[Edited on 7-13-2008 by fulano]
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Cypress
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Running over a cop ain't a smart move. Especially if his partner happens to be
nearby, he might pop a cap or two at you just for the hell of it. You could get
shot doing stuff like that.
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BajaBruno
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Sorry, Fulano, but I do not see the text that you quote in the original article that you linked. I do see:
"Datos de la PGJE señalan que al llegar presentaba traumatismo craneoencefálico y lesiones en la columna. En 48 horas se determinará su permanencia en
el hospital o si se le da de alta."
Which I translate to mean that information from the justice department is that the officer arrived at the hospital with head trauma and spinal
injuries and that in 48 hours it would be determined if he could be released.
Oh, I see where you got this. There is a later article that you are quoting:
http://www.elvigia.net/noticias/?seccion=generales&id=44...
and yes, that article does say that the injured officer was released.
As for the shooting officer (the police chief), my knowledge of Napoleonic Law as it is applied in Mexico is far from complete, but in other
Napoleonic Law countries it is common to take persons into “custody” (which sometimes means house arrest) for a magistrate to conduct a judicial
inquiry of the events. How it is applied in this case, I do not know—I just think we should be mindful that the Mexican legal system, even when it is
functioning exactly as designed, is much different in character than the US system.
Christopher Bruno, Elk Grove, CA.
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toneart
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| Quote: | Originally posted by BajaBruno
eleased.
As for the shooting officer (the police chief), my knowledge of Napoleonic Law as it is applied in Mexico is far from complete, but in other
Napoleonic Law countries it is common to take persons into “custody” (which sometimes means house arrest) for a magistrate to conduct a judicial
inquiry of the events. How it is applied in this case, I do not know—I just think we should be mindful that the Mexican legal system, even when it is
functioning exactly as designed, is much different in character than the US system. |
In The United States, police officers who are involved in a shooting that resulted in death are immediately placed on furlough, pending investigation.
Maybe the Napoleonic application of the law works the same way.(?)
Incarceration would certainly be an effective way to keep him clear of the investigation, and even the area. Maybe this is not a violation of the
officer's civil rights, in Mexico. Pretty good insurance for all, including the officer.
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pascuale
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| Quote: | Originally posted by shari
hardly tragic unless it's your son/brother/neighbour....tweakers are human too...I do not condone this act but I do feel for his family. In these
small villages we all know and love and are related to someone who does meth and I for one would rather wish for their recovery instead of their
death. Many of us have done rash things under the influence or perhaps in a fit of anger or despair...most live through them...some don't. My heart
goes out to the family of this man and to the police officers as well. |
I agree, better in rehab than dead but looks like it was necessary. Sad to hear in such a beautiful place.
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Udo
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I am beginning to think that it is best to just post the spanish links regarding writings in newpapers or other sources, and let the BN
members that read Spanish interpret the writings and conjectures on their own. It doesn't pay for Fulano, myself, or other members to interpret the
writing. As we all know, iterpretations are subjet to interpretation of the interpreting interpritor.
Try to say [b[THAT in Spanish.
phew!
Udo
Youth is wasted on the young!
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CaboRon
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| Quote: | Originally posted by udowinkler
I am beginning to think that it is best to just post the spanish links regarding writings in newpapers or other sources, and let the BN members that
read Spanish interpret the writings and conjectures on their own. It doesn't pay for Fulano, myself, or other members to interpret the writing. As we
all know, iterpretations are subjet to interpretation of the interpreting interpritor.
Try to say [b[THAT in Spanish.
phew! |
You Are Wrong .... We Appreciate the Translations ,
CaboRon
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Bajajack
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We may never know
what it's all about but for sure
someone with a lotta juice is after this guy.
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fulano
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You know if you read between the lines in this article and the other news items about the incident, based upon all the security they have thrown up
around this accused police chief, I think they are trying to protect him from some kind of a revenge attack.
He's just one straight-up guy and not really a flight risk, yet they have a whole wall of people guarding him.
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Bajajack
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There's that one little problem
| Quote: | Originally posted by fulano
You know if you read between the lines in this article and the other news items about the incident, based upon all the security they have thrown up
around this accused police chief, I think they are trying to protect him from some kind of a revenge attack.
He's just one straight-up guy and not really a flight risk, yet they have a whole wall of people guarding him. |
he was charged as I read it with murder and by mexican standards very quickly, really too quickly as opposed to the norm.
It's gonna take a while to sort this one out, if ever.
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