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JESSE
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3370
Registered: 11-5-2002
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Los Arcos will liquidate all employees and close for ever it was announced today, i hope the bastards that run that union can find a way to explain
their members, that they decided to go on strike right at the start of the worst reccession in our times. If i belonged to that union, i would be
furious with the leaders, because not only did i lose my job, but it would be almost imposible for them to find another during these tough times.
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BMG
Super Nomad
Posts: 1776
Registered: 6-10-2007
Location: La Paz / Bahia Asunci�n / Away from home
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| Quote: | Originally posted by vandenberg
Unions outlived their usefulness quite a while ago. |
Not according to Robert Reich.
I don't know the facts on the Los Arcos strike, but at this time it sure looks like the union leaders should be looking over their shoulders.
I think the world is run by C- students.
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Bajahowodd
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9274
Registered: 12-15-2008
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Robert Reich has it right. There was no better time in this country than at the height of the union movement. It was Reagan firing the traffic
controlers that signaled to big business that it was OK to bust the unions. Million of people grew up with excellent, affordable healthcare, were able
to send their kids to college, and had excellent defined benefit pensions. It has been all downhill from then.
For the life of me, I have never been able to understand how the (shrinking) middle class in this country could champion the ongoing destruction of
unions and be in lock step with the scions of industry whose only mission is to further depress the lifestyle of the middle class while ramping up
profits.
How can anyone, without a huge portfolio of stocks and bonds, or a huge safety net of savings, follow the ideas of rich people who are in the business
of screwing them.
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BMG
Super Nomad
Posts: 1776
Registered: 6-10-2007
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Turning into an off-topic thread now.
| Quote: | Originally posted by Bajahowodd
Robert Reich has it right. There was no better time in this country than at the height of the union movement. It was Reagan firing the traffic
controlers that signaled to big business that it was OK to bust the unions. Million of people grew up with excellent, affordable healthcare, were able
to send their kids to college, and had excellent defined benefit pensions. It has been all downhill from then.
For the life of me, I have never been able to understand how the (shrinking) middle class in this country could champion the ongoing destruction of
unions and be in lock step with the scions of industry whose only mission is to further depress the lifestyle of the middle class while ramping up
profits.
How can anyone, without a huge portfolio of stocks and bonds, or a huge safety net of savings, follow the ideas of rich people who are in the business
of screwing them. |
I think the world is run by C- students.
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Bajahowodd
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9274
Registered: 12-15-2008
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Sorry. But I kind of freaked when I saw the post from Vandeberg.
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vandenberg
Elite Nomad
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Mood: mellow
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Bajahowodd
Sorry. But I kind of freaked when I saw the post from Vandeberg. |
Used to be a union guy myself at one time and for years had a business that was a union shop.
Main problem, because a guy belongs to a union doesn't make him necessarily worth union wages. Most workers get carried on the backs of the guys that
know their business.
Believe me, I know what I'm talking about. Have seen a myriad of serious and costly abuses of the system by union members. How do you like $25,00 a/hr
electricians getting time carded in by their fellow workers for days at the time at big time &material jobs at steel miils and shipyards?? And
this is many years ago. I have a little larceny in my soul, but this is beyond a little misschief. This Los Arcos thing is also a small exemple of
what I'm talking about. There has to be another solution to just closing the place down. right? The union folks/leaders don't care, they still go to
their job tomorrow. I heard there's lots of room left around Hoffa?
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Bajahowodd
Elite Nomad
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No doubt that there were abuses attributed to unions. But history will inevitably show that there was a concerted conspiracy among the elite to
castrate the unions in the pursuit of higher profits for the elite. The healthiest solution is a level playing field. The Los Arcos employees are
probably incapable of controlling their "union". That's because as prior posts noted, the union leadership is most likely to be in cahoots with the
owners. Otherwise, why would any rational person attempt to strike during an economic calamity?
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LOSARIPES
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Registered: 8-14-2008
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This is another case of union stupidity carried out to its worst level. It is true that unions have been able to help working conditions, wages, etc.
but to push the boss to this limit where the business' best option is to close is flat out negligent and embarrassing leadership. What an incredible
failure. They f-ck up so badly they now have left 190+ employees w/o a job in possibly the worst time of the last 50 years...!
I hope others learn from this experience.
Aripes
God bless America
and Baja tambien
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TMW
Select Nomad
Posts: 10659
Registered: 9-1-2003
Location: Bakersfield, CA
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Bajahowodd
No doubt that there were abuses attributed to unions. But history will inevitably show that there was a concerted conspiracy among the elite to
castrate the unions in the pursuit of higher profits for the elite. The healthiest solution is a level playing field. The Los Arcos employees are
probably incapable of controlling their "union". That's because as prior posts noted, the union leadership is most likely to be in cahoots with the
owners. Otherwise, why would any rational person attempt to strike during an economic calamity? |
The members had to vote to strike by a majority. So whatever the union leaders told them they must have believed.
If I own a business it is my business to make whatever profit I want to make if I can make it, not the union and I don't care about a level playing
field. There is no law about a level playing field. Laws for workers are about minimum pay, not maximum. About overtime and breaks and lunch periods.
There are no laws or rights that says the union gets 50% of the profit. The union didn't start the business I did. They don't like it go some where
else to work. When was the last time a union gave investment capital to a company that needed it?
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Bajahowodd
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9274
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FYI- The Robert Reich op-ed piece in the LA Times resulted in a ton of letters stating that he was either plain crazy, or suggesting that this must
have been an article he wrote 30 years ago.
Time will tell. There's no winner or loser here. Just spirited debate.
As for Los Arcos, who knows if Coppola didn't engineer the whole thing because with such a drop in hotel occupancy, and the ongoing economic downturn,
it saves him money to board up the place until demand turns things around?
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bajajazz
Nomad
Posts: 386
Registered: 12-18-2006
Location: La Paz, BCS, Mexico
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UNION FUNDED CAPITAL INVESTMENT
| Quote: | Originally posted by TW
| Quote: | Originally posted by Bajahowodd
. When was the last time a union gave investment capital to a company that needed it? |
I don't know the last time a union loaned investment capital to a company that needed it, but I do recall that the financial success that is the whole
damn gambling industry in Las Vegas was initially funded by Teamster's pension money supplied by corrupt "unionists" to Mafia gangsters. Assuming
that money was repaid, I think that example should stand as a model for other industries needing capital investment to get off the ground, after first
weeding out any Mafia involvement in the transaction. Industries need capital, workers need jobs, what's wrong with marrying up the two in a
synergistic relationship? |
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805gregg
Super Nomad
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Back to the subject, I stayed 5 days in La Paz because we were based in Los Arcos Cabanas. I loved it there, it's a shame, the staff was great and
very helpful.
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Bajahowodd
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9274
Registered: 12-15-2008
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Need to make a correction here. Bajajazz' attribution to me was incorrect. The quote was from TW. That being said, I thoroughly agree with the point
jazz makes. That's what I was talking about in prior posts about a more level playing field. If there is no cooperation, things are not going to
improve. The more balance there is, the better it is for more people.
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