Skeet/Loreto
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4709
Registered: 9-2-2003
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Flying to Baja in Small Aircraft
To all Future Flyers to Baja Norte and Baja Sur!
Flying to Baja in a Small Aircraft is a truely new and different Experience.
Small Airstrips are now Limited, so caution is needed when planning a Flight.
Weather can play an important part for a successful flight there and back. Sometimes this can be a problem as there are not as many Weather Stations
and Navigation Aids in Baja.
Before you make a Flight with an unkonwn Pilot make sure that Pilot has the following:
Proper Certificate
At Least 200 Hours in Type of Aircraft
Previous Flights into Area of Destination
Membership in Baja Bush Pilots.
Check Log Book for at least 10 Flights in and out of Baja
Flying in and out of Baja from 1967 to 2000 in several types of Aircraft, being an Aviation Accident Investigator for several years, being a Glider
Pilot, and still concerened about Accidents , decided me to make this Post.
Be Safe, Be Knowledgeable, Get Experience and have a Great Time and "Watch Thy Airspeed,lest the Ground Rise up and Smite Thee""
Skeet
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MrBillM
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 21656
Registered: 8-20-2003
Location: Out and About
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Mood: It's a Zip-a-Dee-Doo-Dah Day
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Know Before You Go ?
Sounds Good, BUT most of the Lethal Lapses I've seen covered in recent years were people who had ALL of that great experience before joining those in
the Great-Beyond, including that last one from Gonzaga. I remember meeting a VERY experienced pilot down there years ago who exuded confidence in his
long and varied record. About a year later, he disappeared.
And then, there's Art Scholl and that Balloon Guy in Nevada. Steve Fossett.
I suppose, though, that it would be more comforting to spend your last few moments before impact feeling good that you'd taken such steps.
I hope never to put that one to the test.
[Edited on 4-4-2009 by MrBillM]
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Skeet/Loreto
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4709
Registered: 9-2-2003
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Mr. BillM
"Nothing Ventured, Nothing Gained"
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Udo
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6364
Registered: 4-26-2008
Location: Black Hills, SD/Ensenada/San Felipe
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Mood: TEQUILA!
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Hire Mike. He makes movies of his trips.
Udo
Youth is wasted on the young!
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Skeet/Loreto
Ultra Nomad
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Registered: 9-2-2003
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I think that a trip or two with Capt. Mike would do any new Pilot a lot of Good!
Skeet
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steekers
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Registered: 12-4-2007
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what makes a good pilot??
There are many subjective and objective factors that go into making a "good pilot" and flying into Mexico, with its usually good VFR conditions,
doesn't necessarily make a pilot better than one who does not fly into Mexico. Flying skills, attitude, sleep the previous day, knowledge of moving
weather systems, etc., are more important items that just being a member of BBP or your past experience as an "investigator".
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Bajafun777
Super Nomad
Posts: 1103
Registered: 9-13-2006
Location: Rosarito & California
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Mood: Enjoying Life with Wife In Mexico, Easy on The Easy
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Well, I do not like to fly but I have flown into Loreto with a very good pilot from El Centro that that is no longer with us due to old age his name
was Mr. Vedder. He had made numerous trips into Mexico flying people down to fish, hunt, and of course the "Play" that goes with single and those
that think they are still single. I strongly believe that the more flying time in the areas you are going the better. The "what ifs" are always out
there but give me an older experienced pilot over younger more daring ones that have to test the limits any day.
One of my worse flights was into Washington D.C. with no visiablity outside, hard rain, and lighting hitting the plane made me first pray to God for
his mercy on me being so stupid as to have taken that flight. Especially due to me knowing storms were active but relenting to my boss to go anyway.
I did call that #### and told him never, repeat never again would I fly when storms are known to be active. I also had a real bad experience coming
back from St. Martin, which had almost everyone screaming, some crying, the stewardess screaming, it was a joke. I again went to prayer with God for
his mercy in that I was back up in the dang air again. We went through rough conditions for about 45 minutes because the pilot could not find any
good airspace to get to. My wife talked me into the flight to St. Martin and during all of this mess she looked at me as she was screaming and I told
her to knock it of because she wanted to come so enjoy it. The guy next to me was in a big fit screaming and almost crying saying we were all going
to die, I put up with this for a bit and then told him to stop it or I was going to knock him out so he could get under control since he was scaring
others especially the kids. "Luck Be The Lady" that my wife must have had and God feeling sorry for me we landed safely. Yes, upon landing the
pilot came on the air saying he was sorry we had such bad weather. At that point I did not care, I just wanted off that plane immediately.
Now, I hopefully only have one more air flight over to Europe since I promised my wife long ago upon retirement we would go. Thus, from where I am
at in El Centro it will take me about 17 hours of flight time over and then same thing coming back, I am taking my bible with me on that one and then
never again. I will hope that "Luck Be The Lady" and God has mercy on me one more time in the air. This is why I like Baja and even Mainland area
of Mexico because I can drive to them all. So, " NO Hurry No Worry Just Fun" happens as when I am driving I am in control of what is going to happen
unless God decides otherwise. Later, bajafun777
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Skeet/Loreto
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4709
Registered: 9-2-2003
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steekers:
What makes a Good Pilot---Good Judgement in all things including the Ability to Fly and Airplane.
A good amount of my 6,000 Hours flying time was spent in the investigation of Aircraft Accidents. as you are probably aware 98% of Accidents are
"Pilot Error'
During those years as an investigator the "Human Factor" and Pilots Background and Actions prior to the Accident was one of my Major Duties.
With the Authority I would make the following Mandtory:
In Addition to the Basic Certificate:
10 Hours Glider Time and Certificate
At least 20 take offs and Landings at Airport above 5,000 Ft. and Temp above 100 Degrees.
Several Take offs and Landings at Monanche Meadows in the Hi Sierras
Complete a Class and make a Written report on "Exploring the Monster"".
The Baja Bush pilots Membership might help a new pilot if he became involved and discussed the Flying of an Aircraft in Baja with experienced Pilots.
Judgement
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capt. mike
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8085
Registered: 11-26-2002
Location: Bat Cave
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Mood: Sling time!
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there are no experts - only varying degrees of applying good judgment after having gained experience. It's as much fun doing now what i began in 1978,
and in Mexico 1980 - only far less scary! (well.....for me anyway!)
if yur going to fly Baja or Mexico a membership in the BBP is a huge asset.
since the gov't changed the exit & entry procedures that are in beta practice form now since Nov 2008 but go official on May 18th - if you do not
know about these procedures or how to access them and use them (DHS and CBP) then yur in for a big surprise and shock after May 18th.
The BBP has been helping pilots on this and other issues since our stupid guvment decided to "lessen" the nuclear threat from us GA guys flying bombs
and al queda stooges into towns and buildings.....
even with these new guvment restrictions and controls.....which DON'T apply to cars....or pedestrians for that matter....i cannot wait for my next
adventure south in my personal time machine.
formerly Ordained in Rev. Ewing\'s Church by Mail - busted on tax fraud.......
Now joined L. Ron Hoover\'s church of Appliantology
\"Remember there is a big difference between kneeling down and bending over....\"
www.facebook.com/michael.l.goering |
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Ken Bondy
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3326
Registered: 12-13-2002
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Mood: Mellow
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| Quote: | Originally posted by capt. mike
there are no experts - only varying degrees of applying good judgment after having gained experience. It's as much fun doing now what i began in 1978,
and in Mexico 1980 - only far less scary! (well.....for me anyway!)
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Couldn't agree more mike! Just when you think you are an "expert" something bites you in the ass. I think flying in Baja generally made me a better
pilot, but in subtle ways. Much of the stuff that was essential for flying in the USA was irrelevant in Baja, communications, airspace requirements,
TCAs, heavy traffic, etc. But I learned some valuable stuff in Baja. In the US somebody tells you the wind speed and direction with great precision.
In Baja you figured it out yourself, windsocks (if any), dust, trees, white water on the wind waves, and if you don't have any of those clues, just
groundspeed on short final. I also learned a lot about weather from flying in Baja and that was invaluable. Baja flying taught me that all
generalities in flying are false ("always land uphill at Rancho Buena Vista"). Mainly Baja flying made me a more self-sufficient and "aware" pilot.
But I must say that what I learned in the US also helped in many circumstances below the border. Primarily that would be instrument training;
precision flying helps in any circumstance, even VFR, and it sure helped me in staying in the right place when going into some tricky strips like
Meling. Good discussion, thanks for starting this Skeet.
[Edited on 4-5-2009 by Ken Bondy]
carpe diem!
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jodiego
Nomad
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Registered: 2-16-2007
Location: San Diego
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Mood: ever hopeful
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Skeet/Loreto
To all Future Flyers to Baja Norte and Baja Sur!
Flying to Baja in a Small Aircraft is a truely new and different Experience.
Small Airstrips are now Limited, so caution is needed when planning a Flight.
Weather can play an important part for a successful flight there and back. Sometimes this can be a problem as there are not as many Weather Stations
and Navigation Aids in Baja.
Before you make a Flight with an unkonwn Pilot make sure that Pilot has the following:
Proper Certificate
At Least 200 Hours in Type of Aircraft
Previous Flights into Area of Destination
Membership in Baja Bush Pilots.
Check Log Book for at least 10 Flights in and out of Baja
Flying in and out of Baja from 1967 to 2000 in several types of Aircraft, being an Aviation Accident Investigator for several years, being a Glider
Pilot, and still concerened about Accidents , decided me to make this Post.
Be Safe, Be Knowledgeable, Get Experience and have a Great Time and "Watch Thy Airspeed,lest the Ground Rise up and Smite Thee""
Skeet |
Hey Fishbuck. do you have all those qualifications? Just asking in case you ask us to join you on a trip again.
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Skeet/Loreto
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4709
Registered: 9-2-2003
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Very well said Ken:
Flying in Baja is different! I still remember my first landing Uphill at Rancho Bueno Vista-1967- Lots of Sand- Takeoff downhill toward the water.
Dead Reckoniong Flying is Fun and necessary in Baja.
The Ability to know the actions of Winds coming across Mountains is necessary.
How to make a Dead Stick Landing on the Beach.
Most of this can be learned while flying in Baja, not attending a Class, or a Lecture.
Flying in the States you would probably not think about a pass over the Strip looking for Donkeys- You had better Check each time in Baja.
In short, every trip you take to Baja can be a learning experience. Go and enjoy and come back Safe.
P.S. Before landing at the Hotel Mulege Strip you had better know how to do a Short Field Landing and Take off!!
And make darn sure if you are at Max Load. taking off from Sant Inez in a Cessna 172 to stay over the Arroyo going West.
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capt. mike
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8085
Registered: 11-26-2002
Location: Bat Cave
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Mood: Sling time!
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yes!! baja flying makes you think. Forces you to be way more conservative in your actions and personal minimums.
weight and balance, dirt, sand or paved. density altitude, WEATHER!! And....where is the NEXT gas stop??!! (one that you know actually has gas...)
length of runway. etc - the list is longer.
all are factors - every flight - if you don't consider each one before take off and landing - - big "gotcha's" might be lurking! 
formerly Ordained in Rev. Ewing\'s Church by Mail - busted on tax fraud.......
Now joined L. Ron Hoover\'s church of Appliantology
\"Remember there is a big difference between kneeling down and bending over....\"
www.facebook.com/michael.l.goering |
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Ken Bondy
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3326
Registered: 12-13-2002
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Mood: Mellow
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Thanks Skeet and mike! Skeeter I got a kick out of your comment about the Hotel Mulege strip. It was my very first Baja dirt strip landing in 1974
(I had cleared in Mexicali). I was in a Cardinal 177RG and every round muscle in my body was so tight they all had cramps for days  .
carpe diem!
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Skeet/Loreto
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4709
Registered: 9-2-2003
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Hey Ken: Did you by chance know about the guy in the Bonanza that burned in coming into Bay of Los Angeles in about 74 I think?
It was a guy named Powers out of the Nutree at Vacaville. He tore off both Wings on descent to the Bay. Figured he was at 10,000 Ft. and got caught in
a Shear.
That is just One good reason to learn about Winds and Speed in Baja.
When I was going into the Hotel Mulege Saul was running it, before he got the Store.'They sure had some good Carnitas stirred up in that big black
Pot.
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Ken Bondy
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3326
Registered: 12-13-2002
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Mood: Mellow
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Skeet I remember an accident that happened in Bahia at about that time that injured a young child who was walking on the runway. That's when the
runway was right in the middle of town, of course. Not familiar with the one you are talking about. That one sounds horrible, ruins your whole day
when both wings come off at 10,000 ft. Other than that first landing, I didn't spend much time up at Hotel Mulege. Mostly I hung out at Serenidad
or Las Terrazas in town.
carpe diem!
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Skeet/Loreto
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4709
Registered: 9-2-2003
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Ken: I remember about the Little Gitl. I would land and Fuel at Pappa Diaz Place.
Can never forget the first time I landed there and observed the "Los Angeles Theme Place" which had just been finished.
Ken : Did you ever go dancing in Mulege at the building where they had Guards with AK 47's to guard the Doors.?? I went up several times and went
Dancing- Never had any trouble.
Oh! so many stories. to the pacifico where you could land at a little strip and the People would bring you all the Lobster and Shrimp you could eat
for a Buck!!
Some of those strips had not seen Americanos in Airplanes since the Days of the Shark Livers.
Bahia Ascinscion{SP} still had women and Children making Shell buttons for the Japanese Market.
Well it has been a great week end for memories. Thanks All.
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capt. mike
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8085
Registered: 11-26-2002
Location: Bat Cave
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Mood: Sling time!
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bonanza....?? V tail?
forked tailed doctor killer.
quick to spin and then can get away from you even quicker.
so i hear..but the owners love em!
formerly Ordained in Rev. Ewing\'s Church by Mail - busted on tax fraud.......
Now joined L. Ron Hoover\'s church of Appliantology
\"Remember there is a big difference between kneeling down and bending over....\"
www.facebook.com/michael.l.goering |
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