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C-Urchin
Nomad
Posts: 234
Registered: 12-17-2008
Location: La Paz
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Open pit gold mines
I am just getting acquainted with this issue.
http://mexidata.info/id2510.html
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wilderone
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3894
Registered: 2-9-2004
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And that's the tip of the iceburg. Canadian mining cos. all over the world will literally kill for their profits. There is absolutely nothing in
recent history which would infer they would do otherwise in Mexico.
Just getting acquainted with the issue? After more research, maybe join forces to stop them.
http://www.earthfirstjournal.org/article.php?id=294
http://www.pej.org/html/modules.php?op=modload&name=News...
http://www.thelunaticgazette.com/ev.php?URL_ID=121230&UR...
http://exopoliticsnews.wordpress.com/2009/12/26/canadas-digg...
http://www.wrm.org.uy/bulletin/71/Tanzania.html
http://upsidedownworld.org/main/index.php?option=com_content...
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baja Steve
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Posts: 472
Registered: 8-31-2003
Location: Bend, or
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Go to the property that they want to mine, then stand there and try to say that a BIG open pit mine would be good for the people or area. I have been
on these properties many times including last Friday.
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JESSE
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3370
Registered: 11-5-2002
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Nobody is going to issue permits during election years
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ELINVESTIG8R
Select Nomad
Posts: 15882
Registered: 11-20-2007
Location: Southern California
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wessongroup
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 21152
Registered: 8-9-2009
Location: Mission Viejo
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Mood: Suicide Hot line ... please hold
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Comparing Agriculture to mining is not a fair comparison... but, agree with your conclusion... folks will get pretty darn hungry without our
production of Food and Fiber here in the United States...
Hate to see the small guys continuing to go out... the family farm was the heart of our Country, we lose something when they go away and are replace
by Cargill and others..
Think we just can't imagine the "scale" of operations that are employed currently, compared to a number of years ago..
I think the scale of operations might be a fair comparison .... But the intent of their operations are quite different, one removes land and/or
minerals the other harvest a renewable product which is grown for that purpose...
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monoloco
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6667
Registered: 7-13-2009
Location: Pescadero BCS
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| Quote: | Originally posted by baja Steve
Go to the property that they want to mine, then stand there and try to say that a BIG open pit mine would be good for the people or area. I have been
on these properties many times including last Friday. |
I agree, I was up in that area last week too and it
is one of the most biologically diverse areas of BCS.
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 65410
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
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Mood: Have Baja Fever
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ANOTHER VIEW TO CONSIDER:
(personally, I would love no development at all in Baja... but it isn't my call)
Is is REALLY the people you are concerned about... the Mexican people? Maybe it is more about selfish desire to have a pretty place to hike through
when eco-tourists are on vacation?
Is doing nothing good for the people?
Perhaps, but it was the silver mines nearby that gave people a reason to go to that part of Baja in the first place, over 200 years ago (Real de Santa
Ana) and more recent at El Triunfo and San Antonio.
Who is the gold for in the end, dolphins? No, people use gold... jewelry, industry, etc. Is that good for the people?
The Canadian Gold Company isn't motivated to destroy a place... it is motivated by the need to produce gold for the world demand for the stuff.
Somebody is going to mine it, someday... Wouldn't a Canadian or American company be more interested in doing a clean job in a neighboring country than
say a Chinese or Russian company?
Think about it!
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k-rico
Super Nomad
Posts: 2079
Registered: 7-10-2008
Location: Playas de Tijuana
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Profit is the motive. Less environmental remediation, more profit.
Is this a new gold find or has it been known about and previously judged to be unprofitable because of low grade ore?
What happens if the current sky high gold prices come back down in the middle of operations and it costs more to mine an ounce than can be gotten for
it?
[Edited on 1-25-2010 by k-rico]
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monoloco
Elite Nomad
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Location: Pescadero BCS
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If the mine they were proposing wasn't of the open pit variety I would agree with you, but a huge open pit in that area will leave a giant scar that
will be visible for decades. That area is one of the prettiest forests in Baja with huge oaks, palo chinos, mautos and many other varieties of trees.
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rts551
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6700
Registered: 9-5-2003
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| Quote: | Originally posted by David K
ANOTHER VIEW TO CONSIDER:
The Canadian Gold Company isn't motivated to destroy a place... it is motivated by the need to produce gold for the world demand for the stuff.
Somebody is going to mine it, someday... Wouldn't a Canadian or American company be more interested in doing a clean job in a neighboring country than
say a Chinese or Russian company?
Think about it! |
Pure profit. And an American or Canadian company is not interested in a clean job in Mexico more or less than any one else.
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Don Alley
Super Nomad
Posts: 1997
Registered: 12-4-2003
Location: Loreto
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Based on the history of mining companies and their effect on the environment, trusting their lies about "state of the art methods" and "modern mining
technologies," is like asking a child molester to babysit your children.
I lived for decades in Montana, where such cyanide heap leaching mines are now illegal. I worked on mining issues for Trout Unlimited, a US/Canadian
coalition, and MEIC:
Cyanide Gold Mining
Yes, Mexico can do what they want. But they shouldn't pretend that they won't pay a heavy price, and continue paying that price for decades after the
jobs have left.
I can't imagine what will happen when a hurricane, or weather like that currently in northern Baja, fills the pits with rain, washes out the settling
ponds and washes away the massive tailings piles.
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wilderone
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3894
Registered: 2-9-2004
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"The Canadian Gold Company isn't motivated to destroy a place... it is motivated by the need to produce gold for [THEIR OWN PROFIT]."
Period. At any price - even killing people to remove them from a site or driving them from their homes.
Now really, David, can you speak for canadian gold mining companies in that vein after reading the links?
And I didn't even include canadian oil sands projects which was a feature in Forbes (I think) magazine, reporting on the destruction of such a large
area - that project is beyond ugly and the earth will never recover from it. There must be a balance of enterprise and allowing open space for
people's well being. Each is important - one not less than the other. Industry can get along without gold.
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wessongroup
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 21152
Registered: 8-9-2009
Location: Mission Viejo
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Mood: Suicide Hot line ... please hold
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Don, pretty sure you can imagine what will happen....
But, then they, the Mexican people could sell tickets to view it from an elevated platform..
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berkeley_Pit
And thanks for posting on the subject, it all helps to understand what may and/or can happen if all factors are not fully evaluated..
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wilderone
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3894
Registered: 2-9-2004
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audiobaja - why don't you speak to the people in Guatamala who lost their homes and those in Africa who were tortured. Your uncle is probably the
recipient of graft, and tell that engineer to get a job with gold mining companies so he can show them how it's done without contamination - BECAUSE
APPARENTLY THEY DON'T KNOW SQUAT ABOUT IT SINCE THEY'RE POLLUTING THE EARTH WITH EACH OF THEIR PROJECTS.
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mtgoat666
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 20355
Registered: 9-16-2006
Location: San Diego
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Mood: Hot n spicy
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| Quote: | Originally posted by David K
ANOTHER VIEW TO CONSIDER:
(personally, I would love no development at all in Baja... but it isn't my call)
Is is REALLY the people you are concerned about... the Mexican people? Maybe it is more about selfish desire to have a pretty place to hike through
when eco-tourists are on vacation?
Is doing nothing good for the people?
Perhaps, but it was the silver mines nearby that gave people a reason to go to that part of Baja in the first place, over 200 years ago (Real de Santa
Ana)
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DK: Perhaps Spanish appetite for gold and silver is not the best justification you can put forth for promoting gold plans of foreigners. How did
that work out for the Aztecs?
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monoloco
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6667
Registered: 7-13-2009
Location: Pescadero BCS
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Don Alley
Based on the history of mining companies and their effect on the environment, trusting their lies about "state of the art methods" and "modern mining
technologies," is like asking a child molester to babysit your children.
I lived for decades in Montana, where such cyanide heap leaching mines are now illegal. I worked on mining issues for Trout Unlimited, a US/Canadian
coalition, and MEIC:
Cyanide Gold Mining
Yes, Mexico can do what they want. But they shouldn't pretend that they won't pay a heavy price, and continue paying that price for decades after the
jobs have left.
I can't imagine what will happen when a hurricane, or weather like that currently in northern Baja, fills the pits with rain, washes out the settling
ponds and washes away the massive tailings piles. |
I'd like to also point out that there is a lot of surface
water in this area that provides water for the numerous ranchos and is the watershed for Lapaz and Todos Santos. This area is in the Biosphere Reserve
not the Mining Reserve.
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wilderone
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3894
Registered: 2-9-2004
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this is only one site. you can see for yourself re Athabasca tar sands, Alberta oil sands, et al., Google searches.
http://www.dominionpaper.ca/weblogs/macdonald/1251
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rts551
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6700
Registered: 9-5-2003
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If you really went into the Sierras, you would have seen the very deep scarring from the Placer mining that happened over 100 years ago.
| Quote: | Originally posted by audiobaja
| Quote: | Originally posted by lencho
| Quote: | Originally posted by audiobaja
...simply a matter of minimizing it and then let nature reclaim the land when finished. |
No kidding. This fellow have actual experience with strip mining in arid environments?
--Larry |
Don't know. But he seemed rather convincing and my 'eco-hippy' uncle dismissed the criticism as uninformed. After all, he said, mining has been one
of the prime drivers in Baja for hundreds of years and they didn't even *bother* with being eco friendly in the slightest as little as, what, 50 years
ago? I've been near a lot of mines here that are in the middle of very pretty areas and the areas don't seem to be any worse for it.
Just went deep into the Sierras yesterday with him (and he plans on retiring there). There are hundreds of places where you could tuck a mine and
never even find it unless you had a map, GPS and maybe a helicopter. It kinda reminds me of the whole ANWR thing in the US. People get bent out
of shape about *possible* damage to a place so large they can't even conceive of it, by a pinprick so relatively small that it would be hard to find
or notice. Generally much ado about nothing. |
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 65410
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline
Mood: Have Baja Fever
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| Quote: | Originally posted by audiobaja
Mebbe. But the Grand Canyon is just the world's largest strip mine. If man had done it, we'd all be horrified at the destruction. Just
sayin....... |
Yep, pretty clever analogy! 
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