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k-rico
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Location: Playas de Tijuana
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| Quote: | Originally posted by David K
If your brother is an American, they cannot deny him from returning to his own country... |
There's a problem with that logic. What happens if they don't believe he's a citizen and he has nothing to prove that he is? Can't illegals get
drivers licenses? I'm sure there are plenty of citizens who wouldn't dare leaving the country without their passports because they look foreign or
don't sound like native English speakers and know it would be a major hassle getting back in.
Curt said "He is super Mexican looking and a genuine badass."
[Edited on 9-17-2010 by k-rico]
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Woooosh
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| Quote: | Originally posted by k-rico
| Quote: | Originally posted by David K
If your brother is an American, they cannot deny him from returning to his own country... |
There's a problem with that logic. What happens if they don't believe he's a citizen and he has nothing to prove that he is? Can't illegals get
drivers licenses? I'm sure there are plenty of citizens who wouldn't dare leaving the country without their passports because they look foreign or
don't sound like native English speakers and know it would be a major hassle getting back in.
[Edited on 9-17-2010 by k-rico] |
I think that's why an earlier poster mentioned your color was important. No one is whiter than me and I crossed with just my CA drivers license.
When I got to the inspection booth I smiled, handed the DL to the inspector and told him I needed to go the the "penalty box" because I forgot my
passport. He asked if the passport had my named exactly the same as my DL, did a little typing and then waved me right through.
The real answer is as stated- an American cannot be denied entry into his country. You may go to secondary (the penalty box) , but you'll get in.
Next time just say you forgot it, show show your DL and see what happens (have your passport under your floor mat in case you chicken out).
\"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing\"
1961- JFK to Canadian parliament (Edmund Burke)
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k-rico
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True they can probably verify your citizenship, most probably if you have a passport and the systems are working. But if you don't
have a passport, not you have one and forgot it, the law is:
"Regardless of the destination in Mexico, however, all U.S. citizens age 16 or older must present a valid U.S. passport or passport card to re-enter
the U.S., even by land."
http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/cis/cis_970.html
So if you've never gotten a passport, and they are suspicious, they can enforce the law until you somehow convince them you are a citizen.
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mulegejim
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Woooosh
I forgot my passport just last week. All I had was a driver's license when I got to the booth. No problem. |
There is a big difference between not having your passport with you and not having a passport at all. Jim
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k-rico
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Bajahowodd
If we aren't going to enforce the law, then we really ought to change it back to where it was. |
I dunno. Perhaps allowing law enforcement officers to use discretion in enforcing some laws is a good thing. There have been a couple of times where
I've been stopped for speeding and let go with a warning. Good!!
The passport requirement is relatively new, that might have something to do with the situation.
And, not allowing discretion smells too much like the zero tolerance policies infecting society, and they really stink.
"There is no justice without judgement." - James T. Kirk, Captain, Starship Enterprise.
[Edited on 9-17-2010 by k-rico]
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Bajahowodd
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How about a show of hands. Who really thinks that a passport requirement to visit Mexico is a good idea?
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DENNIS
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Bajahowodd
How about a show of hands. Who really thinks that a passport requirement to visit Mexico is a good idea? |
It may have value as an idea for departing folks, but your question would be better posed from the Mexican side.
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Terry28
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Let's hear from someone who was denied entry...........
Mexico!! Where two can live as cheaply as one.....but it costs twice as much.....
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Curt63
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Thanks for your input.
We're going for it!
No worries
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JoeJustJoe
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Woooosh wrote: The real answer is as stated- an American cannot be denied entry into his country. You may go to secondary (the penalty box) , but
you'll get in. Next time just say you forgot it, show show your DL and see what happens (have your passport under your floor mat in case you chicken
out).
------------------------------
I believe Woooosh is right the bottom line is the border patrol can't deny US citizens entry to their own country, however you could be delayed by
going to secondary while they try to verify your identity by pulling up your drivers license information or some other methods.
On my forum where I spend most of my time we had a couple of guys either get mugged by "choke hold" or just lose their wallet and/or passport and
still get through the US border and back home.
Even the new passport laws you saw US citizens both gringos and Mexican-Americans still passing through the Border Patrol gates with nothing more than
their drivers license, and birth certificate.....sometimes with only a California drivers license.
Most of them weren't even sent to "secondary" but were sometimes told they need a passport/passcard next time.
This was going on for months, and I usually see it because I live in the states now, and frequently park and walk over over so I don't have to deal
with the long lines coming back, and many people were crossing with drivers license, with or without their "BC."
However, the last few months I see more and more people having the proper paperwork, but if I forgot my passport and wanted to go to Mexico. I
wouldn't let the fact I forgot my passport keep me from going, because I know I'll get back in the US.
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Bajahowodd
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Gotta go back to an earlier post. All this is fine and dandy for folks on short trips in the border zone, but beyond that, they need an FMM and need a
passport to obtain one. In reality, more times than not, people can get away without carrying the FMM. But, every once in awhile, there can be a bad
day.
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k-rico
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| Quote: | Originally posted by JoeJustJoe
I believe Woooosh is right the bottom line is the border patrol can't deny US citizens entry to their own country |
Well duh, of course that is right. I wish people would stop saying that.
That's not the issue. The issue is the problems caused by not being able to prove you are a citizen when they are suspicious of you for whatever
reason. They no longer take simple declarations like they used to.
White skin, blue eyes, native English speaker, you're in. Otheriwse, who knows.
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Mulegena
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Some thirty years ago on a walk-in thru Mexicali into Calexico I got in easily with my drivers license i.d. My companion was a first generation
Chicano, pure Mexican-American from the get-go, with no identification whatsoever. They stopped him at the turnstile-- I in the US, he in Mexico. Boy,
that 10 feet sure looked looonng! "No i.d.?," said the B.P. guard, "Then answer this question, 'What was the civil war about?" Without hesitation he
answered the question correctly. "Ok, you're IN, no problems." That, ladies and gentlemen, was 30 years ago.
These years I routinely cross in with a British citizen who lives in Baja, passports and visas in hand. We routinely get thrown into Secondary so they
can hassle him about something or other. They make us both get out of the car, "Stand away from the car; No, you can't go to the restroom, Open the
hood of the car, and so it goes for a half-hour or more". Other times they whisk us right through. Can't figure it out.
A few months ago I crossed in with a woman, US citizen with only California Drivers' License for i.d. No problem whatsoever.
Another time I crossed in with a woman who'd just had dental surgery. The border guard insisted she speak to him.
So yes, I'd say if you're a US citizen crossing in by land be sure to have a US picture i.d. You'll more than likely be ok, but you may get hassled.
Its really up to the the Border Patrol Agent and your luck of the day.
"Raise your words, not your voice. It's rain that grows flowers, not thunder." ~Rumi
"It's the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." ~ Aristotle
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sanquintinsince73
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Like I posted earlier in the thread, it depends on your skin color and the CBP officer. I've forgotten my American passport and first of all you get
treated like crap by the CBP. I've shown my Marine Corps tattoos and recited the National Anthem. Still, secondary inspection and on one occasion
fingerprinted. My CDL was not enough for these guys. The worst guys are the Filipino officers. The nicest and most understanding are the white and
Afro-American officers. I will say that as a veteran and an American of Mexican ancestry, it feels like crap to be treated like an illegal.
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DENNIS
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It's an area where nothing can be expected to be nice, proper or legal. It's their world and there's only one way to avoid it if it's too bothersome.
Don't go there or, develop some of that Oriental Patience that the Mexicans use when power is having it's way with them. They've been dealing with
power abuse since the beginning of time.
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Ken Cooke
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| Quote: | Originally posted by sanquintinsince73
Depends on the color of your skin. Really, no BS. |
Agreed. My wife and I were put through the 3rd degree. The border guard rolled his eyes at me several times like I have no business traveling
Central & South America?
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sanquintinsince73
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Ken Cooke
| Quote: | Originally posted by sanquintinsince73
Depends on the color of your skin. Really, no BS. |
Agreed. My wife and I were put through the 3rd degree. The border guard rolled his eyes at me several times like I have no business traveling
Central & South America? |
Right on!! Finally someone who's experienced it. I've served my country, I speak better English than I do Spanish, and I don't look illegal, but thats
not good enough. I had a pacific islander officer ask me how I became an American citizen, I replied " I was born in Los Angeles". His reply was "I am
not going to ask you again, how did you become an American citizen?". I was peeed!! I told him " I was born in East Los Angeles!! I didn't come over
on a boat like you did, A**H***!!".
He was so peeed he just waved me thru.
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mtgoat666
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Location: San Diego
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| Quote: | Originally posted by sanquintinsince73
Like I posted earlier in the thread, it depends on your skin color and the CBP officer.
I will say that as a veteran and an American of Mexican ancestry, it feels like crap to be treated like an illegal. |
now you know why so many think arizona is so wrong.
of course, what do you expect border patrol to do?
perhaps y'all should suck it up, and carry your passports like the law requires?
boycott arizona!
carry your passport when crossing border!
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Ken Cooke
Elite Nomad
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| Quote: | Originally posted by sanquintinsince73
| Quote: | Originally posted by Ken Cooke
| Quote: | Originally posted by sanquintinsince73
Depends on the color of your skin. Really, no BS. |
Agreed. My wife and I were put through the 3rd degree. The border guard rolled his eyes at me several times like I have no business traveling
Central & South America? |
Right on!! Finally someone who's experienced it. I've served my country, I speak better English than I do Spanish, and I don't look illegal, but thats
not good enough. I had a pacific islander officer ask me how I became an American citizen, I replied " I was born in Los Angeles". His reply was "I am
not going to ask you again, how did you become an American citizen?". I was peeed!! I told him " I was born in East Los Angeles!! I didn't come over
on a boat like you did, A**H***!!".
He was so peeed he just waved me thru. |
I'm sorry you deal with this after fighting for this country. In my case, I always carry my Passport in my front pocket, so the 'swipe' function
doesn't work, and the numbers have to be manually keyed in. Not my fault, since I literally carry my passport EVERYWHERE I go.
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Mulegena
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| Quote: | Originally posted by DENNIS
It's an area where nothing can be expected to be nice, proper or legal. It's their world and there's only one way to avoid it if it's too
bothersome... |
From experience I have to agree with Dennis on this, so I'll elaborate a bit further.
It doesn't seem to make much rhyme nor reason what happens when you cross La Frontera by land because you're in their hands, the US Border Patrol;
they got ya' and can do pretty much what they want. Essentially, whenever you cross the border, you're under arrest for that duration, whether they're
nice and polite and professional and wave you on through, whether they throw you in secondary, take you into their offices; whatever they decide to
do, during that time they have your i.d., passport, they have ya' body & soul-- you're their's for the duration, you're essentially under arrest.
I've crossed over many, many times and have come to recognize the individual Agents on duty; some are always nice, polite and professional. Other
ain't. Period. End of Story.
It doesn't really seem to correlate with your skin, eye or hair color; it does appear to correlate with who the attending Agent is and their
personality and take on life.
"Raise your words, not your voice. It's rain that grows flowers, not thunder." ~Rumi
"It's the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." ~ Aristotle
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