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Lengua
Nomad
Posts: 203
Registered: 9-13-2011
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leased land or Fidelcosimo
Nomads, , we would like to know if it is prudent to purchase a property on leased land or purchase property via a fidelcosimo.
The property is located in Loreto and is controlled by the ejido.
Our question , Is it better to obtain ownership in Mexico via fidelcosimo or is acquiring property improvements and the "rigt to use them" via leased
land a viable and sound option.
I know there are probably a lot of variables but at this point should we even consider acquiring the improvements (casita) on leased land.
All comments are welcome and we have read some of the posts in the RE section and Ramadun53s comments but are looking for other opinions .
Thank you
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DENNIS
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 29510
Registered: 9-2-2006
Location: Punta Banda
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If you can get an immediate, no wait til later, Fideicomiso from an Ejido, take it. Otherwise stay away from them. They lie, cheat and steal. Other
than that...they're nice folks.
Owning is, of course, better than leasing.
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bajaguy
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9247
Registered: 9-16-2003
Location: Carson City, NV/Ensenada - Baja Country Club
Member Is Offline
Mood: must be 5 O'clock somewhere in Baja
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Never
Never invest more than you can afford to walk away from.
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mcfez
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8678
Registered: 12-2-2009
Location: aka BN yankeeirishman
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| Quote: | Originally posted by DENNIS
If you can get an immediate, no wait til later, Fideicomiso from an Ejido, take it. Otherwise stay away from them. They lie, cheat and steal. Other
than that...they're nice folks.
Owning is, of course, better than leasing. |
I agree with DENNIS 100% with the "They lie, cheat and steal" remark.....but I'll add to that list.... many of the Realtors. Such dogs.
We have ejido investments in San Felipe for years...and have had no issues
. ..................................yet :-)
We also lease land .....and that has been a good experance...we did our homework. Buying / leasing in Mexico is NOT the same as doing business in the
USA!!!!!!
Word here from most BN's...dont invest what you cant afford to loose.
[Edited on 1-4-2012 by mcfez]
Old people are like the old cars, made of some tough stuff. May show a little rust, but good as gold on the inside.
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DENNIS
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 29510
Registered: 9-2-2006
Location: Punta Banda
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Drink mass quantities of Pacifico Beer.
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sourdough
Junior Nomad
Posts: 42
Registered: 11-14-2008
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Just signed our second ten-year lease with few Ejido problems over the past ten years. The lease has made our investment affordable for us.
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larryC
Super Nomad
Posts: 1499
Registered: 8-11-2008
Location: BoLA
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A fidiecomiso would be first choice. Leasing private land (leasing from the land owner) second choice and leasing from an Ejido last choice. Bottom
line, consult a local attourny familiar with the land in question and the situation with the Ejido. Good luck
Larry
edit for spelling, probably still got it wrong.
[Edited on 1-4-2012 by larryC]
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Pescador
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3587
Registered: 10-17-2002
Location: Baja California Sur
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You may not be able to get a Fideocomiso if the property is owned by the Ejido. The Ejido has to go through a privitization through the Agrarian
Court and have clear title to the land. This is a very long and involved process and I have had very close friends get really burnt in this process.
If it is in private titulo then you can go about getting a Fideocomiso.
A lease is alright if you only want 10 years of protection because the maximum, by law, term of a lease is 9 yrs, 11 months, and 29 days. The
other issue is that the ejido changes every three years by new election and you have no control over who gets elected in. The new officers may
decide, for example, that they really want your piece of land and you are pretty much out in the cold when that happens.
I know, everyone knows someone who had a good situation with a lease and it is a workable short term solution, but you have very little protection
if things ever go to court. You may improve your situation if the lease is registered with the Catastro and was filed by a Notario, but even that is
not absolute.
If you google Leasing Ejido land and Privatizing Ejido Land, you may get really educated about what goes on.
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Mengano
Banned
Posts: 1238
Registered: 9-26-2011
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Lengua
Nomads, , we would like to know if it is prudent to purchase a property on leased land or purchase property via a fidelcosimo.
The property is located in Loreto and is controlled by the ejido.
Our question , Is it better to obtain ownership in Mexico via fidelcosimo or is acquiring property improvements and the "rigt to use them" via leased
land a viable and sound option.
I know there are probably a lot of variables but at this point should we even consider acquiring the improvements (casita) on leased land.
All comments are welcome and we have read some of the posts in the RE section and Ramadun53s comments but are looking for other opinions .
Thank you |
A foreigner cannot buy land from the ejido and the ejido cannot legally sell land to a foreigner unless the land is first regularized by removing it
from the ejido. There is a long, drawn-out process to remove land from an ejido, which takes years and requires an approved surveyed map with meets
and bounds, approval by a vote of all the ejidatarios and then an approval by the Agrarian court.
In summary, it is NEVER prudent to buy ejido land because you can not legally own it.
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sourdough
Junior Nomad
Posts: 42
Registered: 11-14-2008
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Lengua,
Explore Colonio Zaragosa. Most of the gringos there lease from the local ejido. We choose to lease because we like the location and, for the most
part, our neighbors. Yes, there are risks, but the investment is much smaller than properties in Loreto Bay or the north side of town.
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Lengua
Nomad
Posts: 203
Registered: 9-13-2011
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Leased land or Fidelcosimo
Curious , Are you referring to Loreto Shores RV Park and Villas? I am not aware of Colonial Zargosa but will try to figure out where it is.
Thanks
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mulegejim
Nomad
Posts: 470
Registered: 9-4-2006
Location: San Clemente, CA/Mulege, BCS
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As a local in Mulege once told an American - "I can sell you this property you just can't own it".
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Lengua
Nomad
Posts: 203
Registered: 9-13-2011
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leased land / fidelcosimo
Nomads , thank you for the information and opinions .
One clairification . I am not trying to buy land from an ejido -but trying to figure out if a "lease" scenario is what we want versus ownership. All
of you have provided good information thus far .
It appears that the lease provides for a right to use the dirt and improvements upon it. You never own it. Seems like a waste of Capital , resources
and sounds riskier than a Fidelcosimo.For my money I beleive we are better off pursuing property that we can obtain title , especially if we get into
home improvements . As several Nomads stated , you need to get comfortable with what you can lose . I don't want to be held hostage by the Landlord
when its time to renew the lease. Seems like you would lose all your leverage . Although , it sounds like some Nomads are perfectly happy and pleased
with their leases and that arrangement.
Keep the comments and information coming.
Thank you
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larryC
Super Nomad
Posts: 1499
Registered: 8-11-2008
Location: BoLA
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Lengua
Nomads , thank you for the information and opinions .
One clairification . I am not trying to buy land from an ejido -but trying to figure out if a "lease" scenario is what we want versus ownership. All
of you have provided good information thus far .
It appears that the lease provides for a right to use the dirt and improvements upon it. You never own it. Seems like a waste of Capital , resources
and sounds riskier than a Fidelcosimo.For my money I beleive we are better off pursuing property that we can obtain title , especially if we get into
home improvements . As several Nomads stated , you need to get comfortable with what you can lose . I don't want to be held hostage by the Landlord
when its time to renew the lease. Seems like you would lose all your leverage . Although , it sounds like some Nomads are perfectly happy and pleased
with their leases and that arrangement.
Keep the comments and information coming.
Thank you |
Depends on the person or family that you lease from. If you don't maintain a freindly relationship then quite possibly you could have a problem when
the time comes to renew the lease. Pretty much a constant the world over, don't pee off your landlord. If the land where you want to be is available
then by far the best option is to get title to it, but most lease arrangements work just fine. You only hear about the ones where people are having
problems.
Good luck with yours.
Larry
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J.P.
Super Nomad
Posts: 1673
Registered: 7-8-2010
Location: Punta Banda
Member Is Offline
Mood: Easy Does It
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| Quote: | Originally posted by mcfez
| Quote: | Originally posted by DENNIS
If you can get an immediate, no wait til later, Fideicomiso from an Ejido, take it. Otherwise stay away from them. They lie, cheat and steal. Other
than that...they're nice folks.
Owning is, of course, better than leasing. |
I agree with DENNIS 100% with the "They lie, cheat and steal" remark.....but I'll add to that list.... many of the Realtors. Such dogs.
We have ejido investments in San Felipe for years...and have had no issues
. ..................................yet :-)
We also lease land .....and that has been a good experance...we did our homework. Buying / leasing in Mexico is NOT the same as doing business in the
USA!!!!!!
If they call thier selfs Realtors thats the first lie The term REALTOR is trademarked in the U.S. and as far as i know has no Mexican connection
Word here from most BN's...dont invest what you cant afford to loose.
[Edited on 1-4-2012 by mcfez] |
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viabaja
Nomad
Posts: 277
Registered: 10-6-2003
Location: Georgia
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I'll confirm Bajaguy "Never invest more than you can afford to walk away from". Do invest, pay, or put any monies into Mexico that will break you if
you loose it. Keep that always in mind.
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DENNIS
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 29510
Registered: 9-2-2006
Location: Punta Banda
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by larryC
Depends on the person or family that you lease from. |
Yep...what Larry says. I lease, and I got into my lease after weighing all known variables and after being down here long enough to have seen the
good and the bad of leases.
I made my decision to lease based on the financial condition of my landlord, who is richer than Gawd and won't be in need of additional funds from me.
I won't be used as a "cash cow" in other words.
Another reason to consider the lease as relatively safe is the economy. The days of hoards of Gringos storming the border to bid up the value and
price of everything in sight are all but over. Land developers no longer covet the waterfront packages as they did in the past, and that was a common
reason for a landlord to "change his mind" about the longevity of your investment.
My situation is mine alone. I'm 70 and have no heirs, nor do I have any delusions that I can take it with me. I invested my money and my efforts only
to satisfy the day, and I'm happy with that.
If my investment came to an end tomorrow, I couldn't care less and I'll carry on with what's left of my time.
The lease certainly isn't for everybody....neither is Baja so if you think one would cost you one minute of sleep, don't get involved with it.
One more thing to consider with a lease.....that wonderful little old landlord who offered you heaven on earth won't be living forever, so it's best
to consider who you will be dealing with in the future. He/she may not be so generous.
Oh yeah....jes one more thing.......the lease situation isn't only for Baja. Mobile Home Parks throughout the states are run on the same basis and
that says a lot about having wheels under your castle.
Not trying to sell you anything, but here's an idea of my investment:
http://micasaes.net/
.
[Edited on 1-5-2012 by DENNIS]
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Lengua
Nomad
Posts: 203
Registered: 9-13-2011
Member Is Offline
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Thanks Dennis , Nice place.
Mike
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DENNIS
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 29510
Registered: 9-2-2006
Location: Punta Banda
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Lengua
Thanks Dennis , Nice place.
Mike |
Thanks Mike. I'm still expanding....now there's another building where the mixer sits. Not much room left for projects, but I'll find something to
keep me busy. Maybe a carport if front of the garage.
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desertcpl
Super Nomad
Posts: 2406
Registered: 10-26-2008
Location: yuma,az
Member Is Offline
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Dennis
yes its a nice place
if its any of my business, you are wanting to trade it, where do you want to live if you do trade
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