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DENNIS
Platinum Nomad
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Location: Punta Banda
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| Quote: | Originally posted by sancho
I remember a phrase in Mex, back in the day, something
with a #, like 40, which referred to 40 Mex Families which
held approx 85% of the Country of Mex's wealth. I'm sure the US
has # similiar, maybe not the same imbalance |
It used to be called Grupo Monterrey....now Grupo Alfa:
"The Monterrey Group empire derived from the founding in Monterrey of Cerveceria Cuauhtemoc, a brewery, in 1890 by Isaac Garza Garza, his
brother-in-law, Francisco Sada Muguerza, and two others. In 1936 the family holdings, already vast, were divided into two separate industrial groups.
One of these, Valores Industriales S.A. (Visa), established Hojalata y Laminas S.A. (Hylsa) to make steel sheet for the bottle caps of its beverages
during World War II, when the United States cut steel supplies to Mexico to meet its own needs. Hylsa became the largest privately run steel mill in
Mexico, a fully integrated complex with activities ranging from mining and processing iron ore to finished products. In 1957 it patented HyL, a system
of direct reduction known as fire sponging.[2]
One of the two heads Eugenio Garza Sada,of the Monterrey Group, was murdered in 1973 in what was described as an abortive kidnapping by left-wing
terrorists, but before this happened, he and his brother Roberto Garza Sada divided the company into two parts. Bernardo Garza Sada, Roberto's son,
became chairman of Grupo Industrial Alfa, S.A., which inherited Hylsa and many other industrial enterprises, including Empaques de Carton Titan, a
packaging company founded in 1926; Nylon de Mexico (synthetic fibers), founded in 1952; and Polioles (chemicals), founded in 1962. "There is no
falling out", one source explained to the New York Times. "But there was a real problem as to who would be next 'supreme,' so they juggled the shares
within the family and divided the group."[2]
Under Bernardo Garza Sada's leadership Alfa diversified from its base into petrochemicals, synthetic fibers, capital machinery, farm equipment,
television sets, and tourism. It also took a quarter share in Grupo Televisa, which virtually monopolized Mexican television broadcasting. Its assets
grew from $315 million to $1.5 billion between 1974 and 1978, its sales from $194 million to $836 million, and its income from $21 million to $83
million. In 1978 Alfa was the only Mexican company in the Fortune 500 list of the biggest companies outside the United States, except for state-owned
Petroleos de Mexico (Pemex). Himself a graduate of the Massachusetts Institute of Technology, Garza Sada staffed top management with graduates of MIT,
Harvard, and the University of Pennsylvania's Wharton School of Business. One observer said they "always picked the kid with the Harvard MBA over the
guy who really knew the business. The Alfa man had to look good on paper."[2]
Although Alfa formed joint ventures with Hercules and American Petrofina to produce polyester, Du Pont to produce other synthetic fibers, Ford to turn
out aluminum cylinder heads, and Hitachi to make electric motors, it insisted on control. "We manage these ventures, always", Garza Sada told Forbes
in 1979. "We demand that!" Alfa received $2.4 billion in loans from more than 130 foreign creditors and was planning to invest $3.5 billion by the end
of 1984, almost three-fifths of it in money to be borrowed, mostly from sources outside Mexico. It was not only the leading private firm in Mexico but
in all of Latin America. By 1980 it had 157 subsidiaries in 39 branches of the economy.
In retrospect, following Alfa's near-bankruptcy in 1982, Alfa's success bred arrogance. Many of the lower-management people had no practical
experience, while the experienced upper management took charge of firms about which they knew very little. The company unwisely abandoned its prudent
traditional policy of only integrating firms that had similar or complementary products. One observer said that Alfa "bought businesses like someone
would buy candies for their children." A foreign bank representative recalled, "They were on the same kind of roll that the Mexican government was on
then. Oil prices would know no limit. Grupo Alfa profits would know no limit."
More here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ALFA_(Mexico)
"YOU CAN'T LITTER ALUMINUM"
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msteve1014
Senior Nomad
Posts: 947
Registered: 12-2-2006
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| Quote: | Originally posted by DavidE
| Quote: | Originally posted by BajaBlanca
So much money. Does Slim do anything for Mexico that anyone knows of? Schools? Hospitals? |
He is purchasing USA pay as you go cell phone companies, then changing the original cell plans so a person is FORCED to purchase the most expensive
recharge cards in order to receive a couple of months service time.
The man is a walking talking MACHO ripoff artist.
He has been quoted many times VERBATIM
"I want to become the richest person in the world and I know how to do it"
He has the very best system of PRI government supporters in Mexico City, that money can BUY
Carlos SlimE |
I can also remember him as being quoted for saying " the difference between me and Bill Gates is that I do not give away money after making it".
Nice. My hero.
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MrBillM
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 21656
Registered: 8-20-2003
Location: Out and About
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Mood: It's a Zip-a-Dee-Doo-Dah Day
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NOBODY
Is Forced to buy Cell Phone services from Slim.
And, a Cell Phone is NOT a Life Essential.
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willardguy
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6451
Registered: 9-19-2009
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who
said they did?
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 65087
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
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Mood: Have Baja Fever
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Rich people also don't just sit on their money, and count it like Donald Duck's uncle. They buy things, create jobs, grow the economy. I wish there
were more rich people.
The economy is not static... there is no 'pie', with limited slices to take from. When someone gets rich, it does not take away from those who are not
rich or prevent anyone else from success or wealth.
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elgatoloco
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4341
Registered: 11-19-2002
Location: Yes
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Viva trickle down!
MAGA
Making Attorneys Get Attorneys
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grizzlyfsh95
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Posts: 226
Registered: 1-8-2010
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| Quote: | Originally posted by David K
Rich people also don't just sit on their money, and count it like Donald Duck's uncle. They buy things, create jobs, grow the economy. I wish there
were more rich people.
The economy is not static... there is no 'pie', with limited slices to take from. When someone gets rich, it does not take away from those who are not
rich or prevent anyone else from success or wealth. |
yea...what he said
The harder I work, the luckier I get
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DENNIS
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 29510
Registered: 9-2-2006
Location: Punta Banda
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| Quote: | Originally posted by lencho
I suspect had Telmex continued as before Slim, we'd not have *nearly* as good communications in Mexico. He's gotten rich in part because he turned an
ailing government monopoly, into a very effective private monopoly (People don't flock to buy products that don't work.) |
Not to mention being there when Salinas privatized the industry, for which I imagine he's still indebted to Carlos.
"YOU CAN'T LITTER ALUMINUM"
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EnsenadaDr
Banned
Posts: 5027
Registered: 9-12-2011
Location: Baja California
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Mood: Move on. It is just a chapter in the past, but don't close the book- just turn the page
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I'm more interested in the 10 richest men in Punta Banda myself!!
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monoloco
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6667
Registered: 7-13-2009
Location: Pescadero BCS
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Pompano
Just saying...what does Carlos Slim pay in taxes?
On being super rich, in the USA, the top 10 percent of taxpayers paid over 70% of the total amount collected in federal income taxes in 2010.
I wonder if the same holds for Mexico? |
That same 10% controls 90% of the wealth so paying 70% of the taxes
isn't such a bad deal for them.
"The future ain't what it used to be"
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willardguy
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6451
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what did he do to the tortilla?
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DavidE
Ultra Nomad
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Registered: 12-1-2003
Location: Baja California México
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Mood: 'At home we demand facts and get them. In Mexico one subsists on rumor and never demands anything.' Charles Flandrau,
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On being super rich, in the USA, the top 10 percent of taxpayers paid over 70% of the total amount collected in federal income taxes in 2010.
Oh I would looooooove to see where that stat comes from...
A Lot To See And A Lot To Do
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willardguy
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6451
Registered: 9-19-2009
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same site that tells you to cough during a heart attack?
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 65087
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
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Mood: Have Baja Fever
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| Quote: | Originally posted by DavidE
On being super rich, in the USA, the top 10 percent of taxpayers paid over 70% of the total amount collected in federal income taxes in 2010.
Oh I would looooooove to see where that stat comes from... |
HALF the people pay 0 income tax because they make below the min. and yet get all the services of being an American citizen. So, their share must be
paid by those who make more the min. in our crazy tax system.
Of course, the really crazy answer is "tax corporations and big business more!"
Like business doesn't pass along tax increases to their customers (the rest of us) in the form of higher prices!
When you tax something you make it harder to buy or more expensive... What did this government recently do? They taxed our HEALTH CARE!
The only fair way to pay for needed government is one rate flat tax that everyone can afford and nobody will need to hide from paying.
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rts551
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6700
Registered: 9-5-2003
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| Quote: | Originally posted by David K
Rich people also don't just sit on their money, and count it like Donald Duck's uncle. They buy things, create jobs, grow the economy. I wish there
were more rich people.
The economy is not static... there is no 'pie', with limited slices to take from. When someone gets rich, it does not take away from those who are not
rich or prevent anyone else from success or wealth. |
come on you are a supply and demand guy....there is only so much demand....you should have learned that when you studied (oops) competition. As for
paying 0 income tax but using benefits, Its been so long since I haven't paid I wouldn't know how it feels...maybe you can enlighten us.
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DavidE
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3814
Registered: 12-1-2003
Location: Baja California México
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Mood: 'At home we demand facts and get them. In Mexico one subsists on rumor and never demands anything.' Charles Flandrau,
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Oh, I want TOP YIELD from my commodities investment!
OK, everyone else agrees to raise prices of this basic necessary for life commodity, so let's do it! 300% increase!
What if there's a backlash?
A what? You must be joking!
DEMAND AND SUPPLY. We demand THIS price or no SUPPLY
I'm only a stupid MBA. What do you take me for?
A Lot To See And A Lot To Do
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MitchMan
Super Nomad
Posts: 1856
Registered: 3-9-2009
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| Quote: | Originally posted by DavidE
On being super rich, in the USA, the top 10 percent of taxpayers paid over 70% of the total amount collected in federal income taxes in 2010.
Oh I would looooooove to see where that stat comes from... |
For those of you who believe in trickle down economics and supply side economics that do not know the above as fact, if that statement above can be
substantiated, would you then incorporate that as fact and adjust your "macroeconomic" judgment accordingly? Or, would you persist in your original
point of view in spite of the facts?
[Edited on 5-3-2014 by MitchMan]
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durrelllrobert
Elite Nomad
Posts: 7393
Registered: 11-22-2007
Location: Punta Banda BC
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Mood: thriving in Baja
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Top 10 Percent of Earners Paid 71 Percent of Federal Income Taxes
Top earners are the main target of tax increases, but the federal income tax system is already highly progressive. The top 10 percent of income
earners paid 71 percent of all federal income taxes in 2010, though they earned only 45 percent of all income. The bottom 50 percent paid 2 percent of
income taxes, but earned 12 percent of income.
http://www.heritage.org/federalbudget/top10-percent-income-earners
[Edited on 5-3-2014 by durrelllrobert]
Bob Durrell
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DENNIS
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 29510
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Location: Punta Banda
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| Quote: |
would you persist in your original point of view in spite of the facts?
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Ahhh...who would do such a thing on this board?
"YOU CAN'T LITTER ALUMINUM"
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rts551
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6700
Registered: 9-5-2003
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| Quote: | Originally posted by durrelllrobert
Top 10 Percent of Earners Paid 71 Percent of Federal Income Taxes
Top earners are the main target of tax increases, but the federal income tax system is already highly progressive. The top 10 percent of income
earners paid 71 percent of all federal income taxes in 2010, though they earned only 45 percent of all income. The bottom 50 percent paid 2 percent of
income taxes, but earned 12 percent of income.
http://www.heritage.org/federalbudget/top10-percent-income-earners
SO?
"While the tax burden on this country's largest wage-earners has continued to grow since the Bush tax cuts were passed, the impact has been
substantially muted.
The income gains made by the wealthiest Americans far outpaced that for the remaining workers, according to an analysis conducted for the
Washington-based Center on Budget and Policy Priorities
In fact, two-thirds of the nation's total income gains from 2002 to 2007 flowed to the top 1 percent of households, the 2009 analysis of IRS data by
economists Thomas Piketty and Emmanuel Saez showed."
and
"In the U.S., the share of total gross income (excluding capital gains) going to the top 1 percent of earners has more than doubled since 1981,
standing at nearly 20 percent in 2012. Other countries have seen similar rises, but none as dramatic as the one in the U.S. And the super-rich - the
top 0.1 percent - have quadrupled their share of the pie, from 2 percent in 1980 to more than 8 percent in 2010."
I wouldn't mind being a 1 percenter and paying taxes!
[Edited on 5-3-2014 by durrelllrobert] |
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