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David K
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Posts: 65096
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
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Mood: Have Baja Fever
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Quote: Originally posted by rts551  | Without your hated funding, there would be no dams, and probably no SoCAl as you know and enjoy it.
| Quote: Originally posted by David K | | Quote: Originally posted by sancho | So called drought? You don't give up do you. Although according
to one here, the Ca. drought isn't bad in no. San Diego County,
must be the only place in Ca. is isn't. Quit embarrasing yourself,
do a little reading
[Edited on 4-24-2015 by sancho] |
The amount of rainfall is not that different and not the lowest from the recent past, but because water is released from reservoirs (built so people
could have water when it doesn't rain) to benefit some fish, at the expense of farmers needs to grow food, and the rest of us to live, makes it a
"so-called drought". The word 'embarrassing' has two s's fyi.
http://www.laalmanac.com/weather/we13.htm
115 years ago, we had less rainfall than in 2012, and the year before we had 5 inches over the average of the past 135 years. Remember all the bridges
south of Ensenada being washed out in 2010???
People have short memories, and then there are people who have a political agenda to bury the historic facts of rainfall in Southern California, in
order to get funding or power from the citizens. |
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Funding for HUMAN needs with human made money is logical. Here is a history page on the arid west and irrigation projects (dams): http://www.nps.gov/nr/travel/ReclamationDamsIrrigationProjec...
It isn't all an 'evil white-European' idea, either:
Lack of rainfall always has been a defining problem in the American West. Long before Europeans arrived, predecessors to the Hohokam
people migrated from central Mexico to southern Arizona, bringing domesticated crops and their knowledge of irrigation with them. The Hohokam created
an extensive canal system and irrigated thousands of acres along the Salt River. Their descendants, Akimel and Tohono O’od, constructed networks of
diversion dikes to capture runoff rainwater to cultivate their fields. When the Spanish arrived in the 17th and 18th centuries, mission priests
enhanced Native American efforts by expanding and building new rock dams and small, earthen reservoirs.
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mtgoat666
Select Nomad
Posts: 19303
Registered: 9-16-2006
Location: San Diego
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Mood: Hot n spicy
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not sure i understand your point. would funding of HUMAN needs with monkey made money be illogical?
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rts551
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6700
Registered: 9-5-2003
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| Quote: Originally posted by David K | | Quote: Originally posted by rts551 | Without your hated funding, there would be no dams, and probably no SoCAl as you know and enjoy it.
| Quote: Originally posted by David K | | Quote: Originally posted by sancho | So called drought? You don't give up do you. Although according
to one here, the Ca. drought isn't bad in no. San Diego County,
must be the only place in Ca. is isn't. Quit embarrasing yourself,
do a little reading
[Edited on 4-24-2015 by sancho] |
The amount of rainfall is not that different and not the lowest from the recent past, but because water is released from reservoirs (built so people
could have water when it doesn't rain) to benefit some fish, at the expense of farmers needs to grow food, and the rest of us to live, makes it a
"so-called drought". The word 'embarrassing' has two s's fyi.
http://www.laalmanac.com/weather/we13.htm
115 years ago, we had less rainfall than in 2012, and the year before we had 5 inches over the average of the past 135 years. Remember all the bridges
south of Ensenada being washed out in 2010???
People have short memories, and then there are people who have a political agenda to bury the historic facts of rainfall in Southern California, in
order to get funding or power from the citizens. |
|
Funding for HUMAN needs with human made money is logical. Here is a history page on the arid west and irrigation projects (dams): http://www.nps.gov/nr/travel/ReclamationDamsIrrigationProjec...
It isn't all an 'evil white-European' idea, either:
Lack of rainfall always has been a defining problem in the American West. Long before Europeans arrived, predecessors to the Hohokam
people migrated from central Mexico to southern Arizona, bringing domesticated crops and their knowledge of irrigation with them. The Hohokam created
an extensive canal system and irrigated thousands of acres along the Salt River. Their descendants, Akimel and Tohono O’od, constructed networks of
diversion dikes to capture runoff rainwater to cultivate their fields. When the Spanish arrived in the 17th and 18th centuries, mission priests
enhanced Native American efforts by expanding and building new rock dams and small, earthen reservoirs. |
You equate the use of canals by the Hohokam (and others) to our extensive use of dams and water usage? interesting.
here is a tidbit for you.
http://www.water.ca.gov/waterconditions/
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David K
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Posts: 65096
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
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Mood: Have Baja Fever
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Equate? No... stop guessing at what I do, it is in black and white, all other exaggerations are your creation.
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bajabuddha
Banned
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Location: Baja New Mexico
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Mood: Always cranky unless medicated
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| Quote: Originally posted by David K | | Equate? No... stop guessing at what I do, it is in black and white, all other exaggerations are your creation. |
Yup, just like that doppelganger that's marauding around Baja with your face and your voice and gift for gab that's creating such a bad name for you!
2 lbs in a one lb. bag. 
I don't have a BUCKET LIST, but I do have a F***- IT LIST a mile long!
86 - 45*
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rts551
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6700
Registered: 9-5-2003
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| Quote: Originally posted by David K | | Equate? No... stop guessing at what I do, it is in black and white, all other exaggerations are your creation. |
lets see. you were talking about the so called drought. I was talking about dams...you brought up Hohokums, I thought it was an odd follow-up, you
? yup doppelganger all right.
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vgabndo
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Location: Mt. Shasta, CA
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Mood: Checking-off my bucket list.
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| Quote: Originally posted by David K | | Equate? No... stop guessing at what I do, it is in black and white, all other exaggerations are your creation. |
In my experience, an unacceptable proportion of your "facts" are your own creation. Which qualifies this particular offering as the source of my
"chuckle of the day". Thanks. I mean, this is an admission that you exaggerate...right? Which 'other' exaggerations have you put in black and
white?
Undoubtedly, there are people who cannot afford to give the anchor of sanity even the slightest tug. Sam Harris
"The situation is far too dire for pessimism."
Bill Kauth
Carl Sagan said, "We are a way for the cosmos to know itself."
PEACE, LOVE AND FISH TACOS
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bajabuddha
Banned
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Registered: 4-12-2013
Location: Baja New Mexico
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Mood: Always cranky unless medicated
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Seriously, ''black and white" in DK's world IS reality. There is no gray. There is no room for discussion. He's right, and all who agree are in
"The Dark Realm" of his dis-reality. there's no 'in-box', and if he says the sun rises in the west, IT IS SO. End of discussion.
It's what therapists call "Job Security".
BTW, the Hohokam, Hisatsinom (Ancestral Puebloans) and a host of other prehistoric races have contributed to their own demise/relocation; the
defecation of their own nests, i.e. over-burdening their micro-enviornments by over-populating, over-deforesting, and over-using their WATER first,
and everything else as well.
Scholars like DK wouldn't know dendrochronology from dentistry. I'm wiling to wager every single person responsible for putting the Hubble Space
Telescope into orbit, and repairing it, and studying it for the last 25 years would like 5 minutes alone with DK in a locked room; just to observe
(and of course)..... listen. Boy Howdy would they all be impressed.
I don't have a BUCKET LIST, but I do have a F***- IT LIST a mile long!
86 - 45*
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rts551
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6700
Registered: 9-5-2003
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You beat me to it. I was going to say, its about time for David to play the poor me coin. "I am only here to provide facts and help". Why is
everybody picking on me. Facts are provided all the time David doppelganger. You just turn around and call it leftist propaganda without even
looking at it. Far right radio means more to you.
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wessongroup
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 21152
Registered: 8-9-2009
Location: Mission Viejo
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Mood: Suicide Hot line ... please hold
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Oops ... thought I was in the "megadrought" thread ... 
[Edited on 4-25-2015 by wessongroup]
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bajadogs
Super Nomad
Posts: 1069
Registered: 8-28-2006
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"Funding for HUMAN needs with human made money is logical." - DavidK
um.. like healthcare?
You are quite the specimen DavidK.
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bajadogs
Super Nomad
Posts: 1069
Registered: 8-28-2006
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| Quote: Originally posted by David K | You know, I just asked where did the fertilizer come from that is being blamed for killing fish/mammals... there are no farms in Baja along the gulf
coast, and I don't think there are on Sonora's coast either (it is still a desert over there, yes?). So, that leaves the Colorado going through the
rich agricultural region that feeds so many people, thanks to dams and canals.
So many here kill fish for fun and food, but if they die from those things that feed millions, it is bad? Do we know for sure it is fertilizer that
causes death in the ocean?
I am just asking the questions and not dropping my thinking ability because some liberal media source says it's that way. Shame on those of you who
don't question the information (when it always blames capitalism, or the United States).
I would love to be corrected if I am factually in error. All I get back is rudeness and name calling when it doesn't follow leftist dogma. How about
black and white facts, not far off projections. I provided 135 years of rainfall data that proves we are in no greater a drought than other years.
Stop the drama, share the facts!  |
OMG, Where is this liberal media source you keep talking about? And why in the
F are you not OFF-TOPIC? Is that "rude" or "leftist dogma" or "Name calling"? Stop playing the victim DavidK. It IS embarrassing!
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bajadogs
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| Quote: Originally posted by David K | So many here kill fish for fun and food, but if they die from those things that feed millions, it is bad? Do we know for sure it is fertilizer that
causes death in the ocean?
I am just asking the questions and not dropping my thinking ability because some liberal media source says it's that way
Stop the drama, share the facts! |
Mr. K, YOU are the one who needs to stop the drama and realize the facts!
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 65096
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
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Mood: Have Baja Fever
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Maybe if you guys didn't keep tripping over yourselves to contend my asking a simple question... Still waiting for the answer, by-the-way!
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bajabuddha
Banned
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Location: Baja New Mexico
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Mood: Always cranky unless medicated
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| Quote: Originally posted by David K | | Maybe if you guys didn't keep tripping over yourselves to contend my asking a simple question... Still waiting for the answer, by-the-way!
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The only 'tripping' going on around here is from what you put in your morning Ovaltine.
Some ask questions wanting pertinent answers and are willing for exchanges of ideas and learning; others ask questions merely to set up their already
prepared answers to propagate their own agendas and further their own unchangeable beliefs. The answer is already moot point even before it's given.
99% of your questions are merely rhetorical to begin with, so you can answer them yourself with a means to step up on your box, and hear yourself
orate. You damned sure don't hear anyone else.
However; I believe your question is: "So many here kill fish for fun and food, but if they die from those things that feed millions, it is bad? Do we
know for sure it is fertilizer that causes death in the ocean? "
Or was it the one about "Why's everybody always pickin' on me??" ...... believing it was the former, here goes:
And you go on to state about 'no farming in Sonora, etc., but look first to the grand amount in just the Mexicali / Yuma greater basin area. Over one
million people live there, as well as huge industrial farming, and that water run-off doesn't go to Des Moines.
Start with "The New River".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_River_(Mexico%E2%80%93United_States)
Granted, it doesn't flow into the SOC (directly). It was created by the screw-up of the Alamo Canal in 1904 that created the present Salton Sea, and
since that time has become one of the most polluted rivers in the world. It's small, but its' bite is huge. Border patrol are ordered to stay out
of the water at all costs, regardless of necessity. Point is, that's just a small area of a very large farming conglomerate, and most groundwater and
surface runoff goes south. If, as stated before that caused your usual rant, there's a big rain or Governmental 'flush' all the effluence is washed
into the SOC.
You'd asked bout Sonora; I took a 10 minute Google Earth flight over the northern/eastern seaboard of the SOC, and saw several agricultural areas,
especially around and west of Hermosillo down to Los Mochis. So yes, there are farming endeavors. The products and amounts are not as governed as in
the U.S. (maybe for the good) but the chemicals are still there.
One must also consider the amount of commercial fishing factories and cooperativos, plants, and aquatic farming along the northeast shores as well;
there are a bunch. Where does their effluent go? Not just fish guts, but processing byproducts and chemicals too?
Dams vs. pre-dams. Used-to-was, a big river flush (flood) brought all the nutrient-rich gold to the upper SOC and renewed its' life and luster. Now
whatever flushes in is quite the opposite; heavy salt and chemical laden poisons and gunk and funk of upstream human habitation.
Also, airborne pollutants are ever present. Every time I drive by Mexicali on my way down Baja I see a disgusting soup of what can only be described
as a 'Zombie Parfait' and it has to go somewhere, too.... doesn't just dissipate into thin air; it's particaulate matter that will fall to earth
somewhere. Then think of the western Baja agricultural areas, and the strong prevailing west winds that carry laden dust .... where? EAST.
So there you have it. I hope you don't trip over your upper lip long enough to read it all... but i'm certain t'was a waste of my time. These are
only postulates... "what-ifs"... that may have bearing on the topic at hand, and your such important 'simple question' that you already know the
answers to, already formulating your big comeback. To some, growing older is to find out what we really don't know; we knew it all when young.
Black and white was such a looooong time ago.
I don't have a BUCKET LIST, but I do have a F***- IT LIST a mile long!
86 - 45*
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bajaric
Senior Nomad
Posts: 644
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Aw, come on folks, isn't this discussion getting a little heated?
heated, ha ha, get it?
I have no issue with people expressing their opinions, and I for one appreciate all views. So, it was reported that there was a mass die off, it is
natural to wonder if some cause can be identified. I simply put forth the possible explanation of ag runoff causing a plankton bloom, although on
further review that seems unlikely. Ditto with Slim's gold mine. That leaves natural causes, or perhaps maybe the temperature of the sea is
increasing a tiny little bit? I am as skeptical about man made global warming as anyone; the last major climate episode on the planet was an ice age
when half of north America was covered under glaciers and it has been warming up pretty steady since then without any help from humans. Still, it
does seem like the ocean temps have been warmer than usual in recent years.
On a more general note, I am all for prosperity and running water. I grew up in Fresno, for crying out loud, the poster child for water reclamation,
and now I live in San Diego, a nice place to live. It would not be possible to live here without dams. With that said, I have to question the wisdom
of capturing the every last drop of water from rivers that drain a quarter of a continent, and leaving the wetlands to wither and die so we can all
take long showers and flush toilets and dump the wasted water in the ocean via deep water sewage outfalls. Anyone bother to go fishing in the
Southern California bight anymore? I sure don't. I go fishing in Mexico where the water is clean. And if someone dares to suggest that we cut back
on our extravagant water use a little so some little fish can be saved from extinction they are branded whackos by the right wing.
In regards to the drought, rainfall totals in Los Angeles have little bearing on the situation, look at the snow pack in Wyoming or Northern
California.
How many more posts before I am not a newbie any more. its so degrading.
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Ateo
Elite Nomad
Posts: 5912
Registered: 7-18-2011
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5 more posts I think.
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rts551
Elite Nomad
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The guy that sits in a bar in Baja Sur and says he owns this forum (or so its been posted before) averages 9.48 posts per day. take a few lessons
from him and you will exit the newbie status in no time. Now degrading...thats a different story.
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