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Cypress
Elite Nomad
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Location: on the bayou
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Thanks for the info!
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wornout
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Loreto Area
Baja Expeditioner
[Edited on 4-4-2006 by wornout]
Followed by Navigator
Followed by City Select North America V7
[Edited on 4-4-2006 by wornout]
This Space Available, E-Mail Me If Interested.
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wornout
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| Quote: | Originally posted by wornout
Baja Expeditioner
Followed by Navigator |
This Space Available, E-Mail Me If Interested.
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wornout
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| Quote: | Originally posted by wornout
| Quote: | Originally posted by wornout
Baja Expeditioner
Followed by Navigator |
Followed by City Select North America V7 |
This Space Available, E-Mail Me If Interested.
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wornout
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So, now you see why we say spend the extra $30 and get the Expeditioner.
This Space Available, E-Mail Me If Interested.
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jack
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| Quote: | Originally posted by wornout
So, now you see why we say spend the extra $30 and get the Expeditioner. |
Your right. That is exactly the kind of comparison I wanted to see. For what I want the Expeditioner is the one to get. Thanks for going to the
trouble of posting those images.
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Pescador
Ultra Nomad
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Location: Baja California Sur
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This discussion really led to some valuable information and I have spent the last couple of days with the cartography guys at Garmin, Lowrance, and
Furuno. Now they all advertise that they have the best thing going with their units, etc. but the stark reality is that as far as blue charts are
concerned, they all copy their maps off of the US21008 charts which are horribly inaccurate. Furono used to allow you to recenter your chartplotter
for local adjustment, but I can not get anyone to verify that they will allow you to do that any longer, and Lowrance and Garmin both admit that there
is no adjustment built in to their charts. The topo maps all show coastline but have no information as to very far offshore, so they are pretty much
worthless for chart navigation as well. In the US where the charts are really accurate, it is almost possible to slide in to your dock and decide on
the basis of your chart whether or not you want to park in your slip right or left sided. But in Northern Baja, the whole navigation thing is pretty
much worthless.
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Cypress
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Charts!!?? Just looking for a good depth, wreck, snag, hang, etc. chart. Don't need a guide for backing in to the dock!
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Cypress
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Guess my frustration is showing! Sorry.
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Pescador
Ultra Nomad
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 I agree, I don't want to even find the dock, I just want to be able to find the
entrance to San Lucas Cove in the dark and be able to get up to Santa Rosalia for bait in the dark and figured that $100 or so would be money well
spent. Then the first day I plugged the Blue Chart in to my chartplotter and found that I was a mile north and about 2 miles inland, I was pretty
frustrated. 
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Roberto
Banned
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Registered: 9-5-2003
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Pescador
This discussion really led to some valuable information and I have spent the last couple of days with the cartography guys at Garmin, Lowrance, and
Furuno. Now they all advertise that they have the best thing going with their units, etc. but the stark reality is that as far as blue charts are
concerned, they all copy their maps off of the US21008 charts which are horribly inaccurate. Furono used to allow you to recenter your chartplotter
for local adjustment, but I can not get anyone to verify that they will allow you to do that any longer, and Lowrance and Garmin both admit that there
is no adjustment built in to their charts. The topo maps all show coastline but have no information as to very far offshore, so they are pretty much
worthless for chart navigation as well. In the US where the charts are really accurate, it is almost possible to slide in to your dock and decide on
the basis of your chart whether or not you want to park in your slip right or left sided. But in Northern Baja, the whole navigation thing is pretty
much worthless. |
I understand your frustration. Now that you are armed with the facts, you can decide how to solve the problem. There are a few possibilities. The
simplest is to set your own waypoints, that you know are accurate. Remember that GPS (at least civilian GPS) is not intended to be accurate enough to
do what you describe safely. At night, I rely on my own waypoints, my vision, my ears, the GPS and radar. You have not
really enjoyed life until you have come into a busy port, at night, in the fog, without radar. 
Even with radar, it's pretty interesting and stressing to say the least - those 500+ foot boats don't exactly stop on a dime (IF they can even see
you).
Anyway, here's the bottom line from my standpoint. Navigation in the dark, fog, bad sea conditions, etc., is much too dangerous and delicate to trust
solely to instruments. You need a variety of them, and lookouts, experience and great care. If you don't have them, can't afford them, whatever, stay
out of the water until you don't need them. Think of it as IFR for boats.
Good Luck, fisherperson.
[Edited on 4-7-2006 by Roberto]
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Oso
Ultra Nomad
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Location: on da border
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You just can't rely on anything anymore. The labels on bottles of Buzzard's Bay Brewing products have an interesting chart, but then the back labels
state "Chart on front not meant for navigational purposes". And I was figuring that after a doce, that would be the best guide back to port.
All my childhood I wanted to be older. Now I\'m older and this chitn sucks.
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Bruce R Leech
Elite Nomad
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Location: Ensenada formerly Mulege
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Wow Roberto you really have your stuff together. I couldn't agree more with all you have written here.
Bruce R Leech
Ensenada
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Roberto
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Bruce R Leech
Wow Roberto you really have your stuff together. I couldn't agree more with all you have written here. |
Why thank you, Bruce. But you gotta be careful, me being a powerboater and all, and not a slowboater (er, I meant sailboater)
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beercan
Senior Nomad
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Location: North of da Bear
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Roberto , you mean well, but you're not completely correct !!
Capt mike and I fly on just instruments regularly. You just can't turn or stop our airplanes on a dime either. He and I trust our instruments ---GPS
I have flown to the tip (Sur) many times and use just a standard Lowrance Airmap 300 GPS (about 8 years old), and it is accurate to less than 300 ft.
and that is without WAAS.
It is right on at Loreto, Lapaz, San Jose, and any other spots in Baja!!!!!!!!!!
It only has a 3 inch screen , but shows all the coast lines , major roads and even islands !!!
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Even with radar, it's pretty interesting and stressing to say the least - those 500+ foot boats don't exactly stop on a dime (IF they can even see
you).
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* libs, all about choice until you choose different
* B. Hussein Obama - an Empty Suit for Empty Minds.
* Annoy a liberal - Work hard and be happy!
* Arguing facts & truth to libs is like bringing a warm smile to a gun fight.
* Lets win the War on Terror
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Roberto
Banned
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So let me get this straight beercan. Would you land your airplane with the aid of nothing but your "better than 300 foor accuracy" GPS/chartplotter,
that has a chart loaded that MIGHT be as much as 1-2 miles off in places?
Because THAT was my point.
[Edited on 4-7-2006 by Roberto]
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Cypress
Elite Nomad
Posts: 7641
Registered: 3-12-2006
Location: on the bayou
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Charts
Thanks Nomads, Will get the best paper chart available and make corrections as needed. Have not used GPS very much. Used LORAN C years back. Know that
GPS is better. Plan to get back into bottom fishing etc. Don't expect to be doing much on the water in adverse conditions, but you never know.
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Pescador
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3587
Registered: 10-17-2002
Location: Baja California Sur
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As a follow up, I talked with Furono and Lowrance. Guess what, they all use the US21008 charts, so no help with different companies. Following is
the e-mail I got this morning from Garmin Cartography department.
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Pescador
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3587
Registered: 10-17-2002
Location: Baja California Sur
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oops, maybe this is better.
I took a look at the coverage for that area and it looks as if it is a chart issue. What you have in that area is a small scale and very old chart.
We usually try to use local charts whenever possible but we have been unable to come to a licensing agreement with Mexico?s hydrographic office.
Therefore, the maps that we have available to us in Mexico are limited. Hopefully in the near future we will work out a deal and our detailed
coverage for Mexico will be better. Sorry for any problems this may cause. Garmin and our data vendors do everything possible to provide the most up
to data and accurate maps possible.
Please let me know if you have any other questions and thank you for your interest in Garmin.
Regards,
Nathan
________________________________________
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beercan
Senior Nomad
Posts: 670
Registered: 4-3-2005
Location: North of da Bear
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Roberto --YES !!
Reread my post ! It is right on !!From Florida to Canada to the tip . It is as I stated !
* libs, all about choice until you choose different
* B. Hussein Obama - an Empty Suit for Empty Minds.
* Annoy a liberal - Work hard and be happy!
* Arguing facts & truth to libs is like bringing a warm smile to a gun fight.
* Lets win the War on Terror
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