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DENNIS
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 29510
Registered: 9-2-2006
Location: Punta Banda
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by fishbuck
What, you never heard of a surf contest? |
Long time no see, Fish......How've you been?
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Dave
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6005
Registered: 11-5-2002
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by DENNIS
My point is that a grassroots, very vocal boycot of surfer tourism could, with proper press behind it and shareing logical reasoning with other
traveling demographics to recruit them to the cause, that of safe protected tourism, would be the best effort to date to change a situation that we
all know is wrong and dangerous and getting worse.
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Hate to break it to ya but:
Mexico doesn't give a flip about any tourist driving down Baja. To them, tourism means an organized destination venue like Cancun,
PV, Cabo and Ixtapa. Do something to disrupt tourism there and you'll get a response...Pronto!
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bajaandy
Senior Nomad
Posts: 769
Registered: 2-7-2004
Location: North County
Member Is Offline
Mood: Adventurous
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Sculpin has a valid point... getting surfers to agree about anything, let alone form a cohesive stand against an enemy that is at best an enigma, is
highly unlikely. The problem is exacerbated when other surfers see what they consider to be the up-side to the situation. Hence my ill-timed, yet
valid comment about there being more room in the lineup. (My apologies to the victims of these heinous crimes. I would never wish that experience
upon anyone.)
And yet there are those in our tribe who will take advantage of the hype and exploit the stories and tales only to keep others away from "their" Baja
surf break. And apparently this tactic is working (at least in my case) as I will never again surf/camp in any of the locations that these stories
are emanating from.
But I think I have to disagree with Sculpin about a group of surfers going on a man-hunt of revenge. Best leave that type of thing to the
professionals. (And I'm not talking about the Mexican police force or military. Certainly there must be some out-of-work former Blackwater employees
that will do the job.)
On edit: Looks like I spoke too soon... http://forums.bajanomad.com/viewthread.php?tid=28020
[Edited on 11-14-2007 by bajaandy]
subvert the dominant paradigm
"If you travel with a man, you must either fall out with him or make him your good friend."
JBL Noel
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DENNIS
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 29510
Registered: 9-2-2006
Location: Punta Banda
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Dave
Hate to break it to ya but:
Mexico doesn't give a flip about any tourist driving down Baja. ! |
Jeezo Dave.... You are such a nutless individual in regards to this issue. You won't discuss the facts. You wont ask questions. All you do is make
meaningless comments.
This issue is important to me. Not so much that people have been violated but, we as a people are being violated.
You know this, Dave. Comments to this are dismissed by you as naive, unknowing or stupid.
When anybody here has an idea to fix a problem related to the extortion issue, you shut them down with your time-tested knowledge. I've been here a
lot longer than you have and I see your responses as detrimental to the expats here who could truly benefit from your knowledge. The suggestions
here are just that. Why can't you work with that? It's OK with me if you're always right but, we have to agree on that.
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Al G
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 2647
Registered: 12-19-2004
Location: Todos Santos/Full time for now...
Member Is Offline
Mood: Wondering what is next???
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I am beginning to wonder what face Dave wears??? Do you own a mask? Is your brother in law a corrupt cop...maybe just a person with a dissatisfying
life. let us hear what's really up with you 
Albert G
Remember, if you haven\'t got a smile on your face and laughter in your heart, then you are just a sour old fart!....
The most precious thing we have is life, yet it has absolutely no trade-in value.
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Al G
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 2647
Registered: 12-19-2004
Location: Todos Santos/Full time for now...
Member Is Offline
Mood: Wondering what is next???
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Back to what is important
I have posted this on a couple sites...please make suggestions of others. I am really tired of being swepted to the side. I will joint the boards to
post, just let me know.
Albert G
Remember, if you haven\'t got a smile on your face and laughter in your heart, then you are just a sour old fart!....
The most precious thing we have is life, yet it has absolutely no trade-in value.
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DENNIS
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 29510
Registered: 9-2-2006
Location: Punta Banda
Member Is Offline
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OK Al.........Thanks for that.
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fishbuck
Banned
Posts: 5318
Registered: 8-31-2006
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Dave
| Quote: | Originally posted by DENNIS
My point is that a grassroots, very vocal boycot of surfer tourism could, with proper press behind it and shareing logical reasoning with other
traveling demographics to recruit them to the cause, that of safe protected tourism, would be the best effort to date to change a situation that we
all know is wrong and dangerous and getting worse.
|
Hate to break it to ya but:
Mexico doesn't give a flip about any tourist driving down Baja. To them, tourism means an organized destination venue like Cancun,
PV, Cabo and Ixtapa. Do something to disrupt tourism there and you'll get a response...Pronto! |
I sure hate to agree with Dave because I don't want to get beat up(especailly by DENNIS).
But on my last trip I did get the impression that they feel there is an unlimited supply of tourists headed south. So if a few decide not to come no
problema. The hotel will still get filled up. Not everywhere but the more popular places for sure. That will only spread.
And they might be right too! I go down every couple of months when I can and I've been noticing accelerated change. At some point Baja will reach a
self sustaining mass and nothing will stop it. That may have already happened.
Maybe the crooks already know that too.
[Edited on 11-15-2007 by fishbuck]
"A ship in harbor is safe, but that is not what ships are built for." J. A. Shedd.
A clever person solves a problem. A wise person avoids it. – Albert Einstein
"Life's a Beach... and then you Fly!" Fishbuck
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Dave
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6005
Registered: 11-5-2002
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by DENNIS
You won't discuss the facts. You wont ask questions. All you do is make meaningless comments.
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I don't consider it a meaningless comment to point out that Mexico cares little about the type of tourist who frequents this board. Not only that but
it seems that tourists come regardless of the horror stories. I'm amazed. If I were a tourist, and after what happened last month at Puerto Nuevo, I
wouldn't stick one toe in Mexico. And I wouldn't care about boycotts or if they ever fixed the problem. There are other places I
could spend money. I'd be done.
If you want to have a discussion about ex-pats...that's different. I don't consider tourist and ex-pat problems to be related but we could discuss it.
...And please leave my nuts out of this. I'm very protective of them. 
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Diver
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4729
Registered: 11-15-2004
Member Is Offline
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Al,
Dave is not the same without a deli.
Have you ever been to a good Jewish deli ?
You don;t just go there for the food, the abuse is expected.
Dave needs an outlet !! 
You gonna order or just drool on my food ?
Nice tip, come back never !
2 whole chubs ? Hey Abe, another big spender !
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Al G
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 2647
Registered: 12-19-2004
Location: Todos Santos/Full time for now...
Member Is Offline
Mood: Wondering what is next???
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Diver
Al,
Dave is not the same without a deli.
Have you ever been to a good Jewish deli ?
You don;t just go there for the food, the abuse is expected.
Dave needs an outlet !!
You gonna order or just drool on my food ?
Nice tip, come back never !
2 whole chubs ? Hey Abe, another big spender !
. |
I get the picture.......
Albert G
Remember, if you haven\'t got a smile on your face and laughter in your heart, then you are just a sour old fart!....
The most precious thing we have is life, yet it has absolutely no trade-in value.
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Don Alley
Super Nomad
Posts: 1997
Registered: 12-4-2003
Location: Loreto
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Dave
Hate to break it to ya but:
Mexico doesn't give a flip about any tourist driving down Baja. To them, tourism means an organized destination venue like Cancun,
PV, Cabo and Ixtapa. Do something to disrupt tourism there and you'll get a response...Pronto! |
Perhaps Mexico believes one way to control predation of tourists by the criminal element is to encourage tourists to fly into specific resort areas,
like Cabo, Ixtapa, Cancun, etc, rather than attempt to police and control hundreds of miles of rural highways and remote beaches.
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bajabound2005
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 2760
Registered: 10-15-2005
Location: Punta Banda, BCN
Member Is Offline
Mood: words cannot describe...
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So Dave - what's your story? You apparently LIVE on this (Mexican) side of the border...and we never had the privilege of dining at your deli before
it closed (sign is still up - we did try)! Totally understand that "Mexico" doesn't care about the tourists on this board -- but really?? "Mexico"
may not care but Baja does! Isn't it time someONE took a stand and did SOMEthing? What happens here is insane, crazy, stupid, bad....I'm sure the
rest of the Nomads have better words to describe it.
Friends don't let friends drink white zinfandel.
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DENNIS
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 29510
Registered: 9-2-2006
Location: Punta Banda
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by fishbuck
I sure hate to agree with Dave because I don't want to get beat up(especailly by DENNIS).
But on my last trip I did get the impression that they feel there is an unlimited supply of tourists headed south. So if a few decide not to come no
problema. |
That's the point, Fish. Limited supply. How do you think they would act if they thought they were looking at their last tourist?
That's ridiculous, I know but, an abbreviated scenario such as this is possible.
We're loseing sight of the objective here. It isn't how reactive we can be merely for the sake of strength....it's how we can react to abuse. A pain
reflex. We're also talking about how we react to the pain of our brothers at the hands of our host. Could we all band together and say, "That's
enough. We won't tolerate any more of that crap. We may not have rights but, we do have pride."
Or, do we?
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DENNIS
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 29510
Registered: 9-2-2006
Location: Punta Banda
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Dave
I'm amazed. . |
That's one of your problems Dave. You stand there, "AMAZED."
What you should be is indignant. Loud and vocal telling the world how **** it is that the government of the country you have chosen to live in has
given tacit approval to their agencys to terrorize and rob and abuse their guests.
Amazing, isn't it.
[Edited on 11-15-2007 by Hose A]
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Diver
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4729
Registered: 11-15-2004
Member Is Offline
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Kinda like knowing a friend who says they were beaten by their spouse and then dating the supposed beater for lack of a better date ?
If I don't believe the beaten spouse's story, I am proceeding in good faith.
If I do believe the story, I am ..... hoping it won't happen to me.
Until it does happen to me.
Then what ?
I'll let you know.
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DENNIS
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 29510
Registered: 9-2-2006
Location: Punta Banda
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Don Alley
Perhaps Mexico believes one way to control predation of tourists by the criminal element is to encourage tourists to fly into specific resort areas,
like Cabo, Ixtapa, Cancun, etc, rather than attempt to police and control hundreds of miles of rural highways and remote beaches.
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I think that's a good idea. Mexico should fly all of their illegals into Washington DC. Then....well, who knows.
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Diver
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4729
Registered: 11-15-2004
Member Is Offline
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Shy of our government jumping in or the Mexican government making a huge change, either some effort towards solidarity or some type of boycott would
seem to be likely solutions.
Since I don't see either governement doing anything without a large volume of complaints, solidarity could be to dutifully report the incidents to all
that will listen.
I have been trying to think of some way that we could easily show solidarity and improve the situation.
Caravaning is one option assuming the caravan is not made of sheep.
Perhaps a windshield sticker warning of some sort ?
Perhaps a map of TJ police stations.
Perhaps a card with US and Mexico phone numbers and names of someone who might scare the cops.
Perhaps we need to invent a good way to smuggle our guns south ?
Black-ops of our own sounds good to me - ambush anyone ?
????????????
Anyone ???
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DENNIS
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 29510
Registered: 9-2-2006
Location: Punta Banda
Member Is Offline
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Diver....
I just want to give you a great big kiss for saying all that stuff. I was feeling so alone in my thoughts.
Lets not talk too loud about the gun stuff. Maybe just suggest a lethal caliber.
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Diver
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4729
Registered: 11-15-2004
Member Is Offline
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It is odd.
A few years back, we were at El Requeson when my wife woke me and said someone was outside our camper. Then she said "I think that guy took our gas
can".
I got up and ran after the 3 guys in the truck and almost caught them.
They got my gas can and a busted windshield for their trouble.
My camp shovel was barely scratched.
When I got back to camp, no-one seemed to care.
The overall response was "You're in Baja, sh-t happens."
Lots of sheep in Baja.......part of the problem.
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