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Riom
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Posts: 492
Registered: 12-17-2004
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It's not just on touristy stuff - applies also (or perhaps especially) to real estate.
Years ago I was looking at buying property in France. Went into a real estate office, asked in French for a listing of certain types of properties,
found one that looked interesting (on the French listing) and got a more detailed information sheet.
That sheet had been drawn up for English buyers (local buyers don't expect it) and included a price that was close to double the price on the French
summary listing. When I queried this, I was told "that's the "prix anglais"" - the price listed for those who don't speak French!
In this case, making a minimal attempt to be a "local" saved me a lot. (not that I speak much French - just real estate, travel and food vocabulary
really - but it was enough).
Getting back to charging tourists more than locals, it does seem to be common in areas that treat tourists as walking ATMs and don't care what
impression they give or if the tourist comes back. And then they wonder why tourism to their area is declining.
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sylens
Senior Nomad
Posts: 584
Registered: 4-6-2005
Location: Ensenada
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Mood: ando bajando
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in ensenada
particularly during winter holiday season when tourism tends to be down a bit, lots of local radio commercials advertise 10 or 15% discounts for local
residents. ad said, "just bring in your 'comprobante de domicilio'" (water or light bill, e.g.).
we kept planning to do it, but never got around tuit
lili
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sd
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Riom -
"And they wonder why tourism to their area is declining"
Very well said!
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sd
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Sylens -
I for one do not have any problem with that. Having locals fill up the place during slow times is OK business with me.
I have a HUGE problem when one group of people is charged a price different than others. As discussed here, many times it is in writing (different
menu prices)!
Some say they just "charge what they can"
My experience is limited to Baja, but I feel cheated when I am charged a great deal more only because I am a tourist.
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DianaT
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sd
Yes, recently someone did state that they thought it was OK to charge gingos more and even encouraged them to do so. We guess that some people think
that just because someone has a little more money, they "deserve" to pay more.
We agree with others that it is NOT ok, yet we are realists and know that it happens. We have walked into stores and when the price quoted to us is
really high, we turn around, leave and shop elsewhere. Yes, we barter, but when the starting price is obviously a major GRINGO price, we are gone.
On the other hand, there are times we pay the gringo price when we still think it is a fair deal for us, and what we think is a fair deal for the
seller, but we often tell the seller that we know we are paying the gringo price, and they just smile.
Two menus in restaurants, no, we are gone---won't play that game.
Just our opinion----like we said in another post about a different topic, it is situational----guess just like most things in Baja
John and Diane
[Edited on 4-24-2008 by jdtrotter]
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Bob and Susan
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Location: Mulege BCS on the BAY
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"Two menus in restaurants"
YES one is in ENGLISH and the other in SPANISH!!!
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DianaT
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Bob and Susan
"Two menus in restaurants"
YES one is in ENGLISH and the other in SPANISH!!! |
Opps, we were referring to the two menus someone else talked about----two sets of prices. 
John and Diane
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Iflyfish
Ultra Nomad
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Registered: 10-17-2006
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I always use the Mexican Menu. I know I must be aware that I look like a walking bank.
I really don't like the mordida of it, and consider it as such, really a form of institutionalized graft. Money is money and I really don't like mine
taken in this way. It is this sort of practice that gives Mexico a bad name. It is also very bad business practice.
I consider the practice to be immoral and will not frequent a place that does that to me. I understand how it works, I am not stupid, I also know that
tourism brings with it increased prices for locals, that too is a reality. None the less I would not do that to someone else. I feel like I am being
used to subsidise others when this happens to me. I would hope that a business has enough control over it's product to be able to assess and charge
what they really need to be successful with ONE menu. Charging the white, foreign, or tourist guy more is not a way to bring them back. When they find
out they have been robbed, they will not be back. Look at what has happened to Baja tourism. This issue is only an example of why tourists are not
coming to Baja. Why go someplace where you are seen as a sheep to be fleesed? It is this attitude that most rankles tourists, a society that supports
this way of doing business exists along a continuum that has this form of petty extortion on one end and kidnapping on the other.
I did provide pro bono services in my practice, but that was not based upon the sort of clothing worn, or the type of car they drove, but upon
circumstances that changed in the person's life while I was working with them. I have always been clear about my prices and up front about them. When
I was not, when I worked in an agency with a sliding fee scale, they had trouble keeping their doors open while clients milked the system. Lack of
clarity sets up games and games end with bad feelings.
I have so much to spend, a budget, and if Pedro steals it from me then Delores won't get it where she works cause I won't have it to spend there.
This becomes even more of an issue when one gets on a fixed income and inflation raises prices for all. I am very worried about how much we will be
able to travel in the future given the raising price of fuel. To be hit by that and then by inflated prices because I am a tourist really rankles me.
I know that Mexico has a history of graft, corruption, nepotism and chronicaly low pay. I am not naive about how all this works. I just think that it
is very poor business planning. Very short sighted.
I went to a restaurant in Mexcio in a town that I love, was way over charged and will NEVER go back. They could have made hundreds of dollars off me,
in the long run, but now their theft leaves them with the receipt from one dinner. It so upset me that I cannot even recall what I ate there. Only
once is all it takes sometimes. It is a very short sighted business plan to have a dual pricing system. Short term it pays off, but long term, it
generates bad feelings and the victim of the graft resents it.
It is interesting to find myself in Bill's boat, I just won't go back. Life is too short and there are honest business people everywhere. I don't
want bad feelings. I don't want to play games. Life is too short and there are lots of businesses that do not engage in this practice. I cannot
imagine why a business owner would want to place themselves in the position of deciding what their client can pay and then charging accordingly. It
seems to me to be burdensome to the business person and a real set up to lose the business of the person paying more...killing the golden goose. Bad
business practice in my view. Short sighted business practice in my view. Generates "them and us" thinking in my view. Reinforces a pernicious
contempt of the client which can and does generalize. This practice creates a mileau of bad feelings, one that I don't like to be in.
Iflyfish
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sd
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jdtrotter -
It happens, but when it does it bothers me. When it is encouraged it amazes me.
Capt. George -
It happened to me at another restaurant near there. They gave me the spanish menu, and I had seen the price. They took it away and gave me the english
menu, with a higher price for the exact item. We worked on their "exchange rate" at time of payment.
Bob and Susan,
I followed your building progress and that was very kind of you to share. It made me happier I am just a tourist, do to all the work and expense you
went to. Hope it is working well for you. Someday, I am coming for a visit.
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Iflyfish
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3747
Registered: 10-17-2006
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A local practice of providing a coupon or local incentive related to the time of year is different than intentionally bilking someone BECAUSE they are
a tourist, woman, black, hispanic, tall, short, blind, you get the picture. They can offer the same discount by saying something like "tell 'em KBAT
radio sent you in. Or mention the name of the newspaper, radio station etc. with out discriminating due to membership in a perceived class. Because I
am white, a tourist, dressed like a foreigner, etc. should not be the basis of a discount.
Let do it to Mexicans here in the US. Lets charge Mexicans more for their food. Then come up with a rationale why we should do that. Get Rush Limbaugh
on it, or Bill O'Reilly and then you will really hear why this is patriotic and good for us. I can hear it now "they make more money here than they do
at home", "they are paid more here than at home", "they are rich in their own country", "look at that fancy car, they can afford to pay more", "they
won't be back around here and may never know". Makes me want to go and extort a Mexican tourist and then justify it to myself.
Man, I am hotter on this than I thought. It really does generate bad feelings.
Iflyfish
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Iflyfish
Ultra Nomad
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Now, sd, what would you tell your friends about eating at that restaurant?
Iflyfish
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Iflyfish
Ultra Nomad
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JD,
Would you tell your friends to avoid that restaurant? Would you recommend it to a friend?
Iflyfish
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sd
Nomad
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Iflyfish -
I will NEVER be back to any place with this business practice.
I have made enough trips to know how much each tourist dollar means to the economy and business owner. I normally meet outstanding people that take
great care of me. Many great people!
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Skipjack Joe
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8084
Registered: 7-12-2004
Location: Bahia Asuncion
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Earlier today I stumbled upon Pam's website in which she writes about the fact that the conservation laws in Loreto are being ignored by some
fishermen. Apparently the yellowtail are protected during their spawning time but someone reported 3 tons netted right in the middle of this period.
The marine park is virtually right in town so it couldn't have been very difficult not to notice.
Now maybe that seems to be unrelated to this thread but I see a commonality here.
The cultural mentality of bending the rules here and there to make a profit applies to so many things. It's pervasive. In this case the Mexicans
aren't taking advantage of the gringos, they're taking advantage of themselves.
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shari
Select Nomad
Posts: 13048
Registered: 3-10-2006
Location: bahia asuncion, baja sur
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Mood: there is no reality except the one contained within us "Herman Hesse"
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ummm...hate to go against the grain...BUT...I'm all for sliding scale. I really dont have a problem if a local restaurant takes a few pesos off for
the construction workers that come there to eat...who makes $10 a day. There is no way they could charge a "decent" price for the food these workers
consume...they go there every day to eat...are good steady customers whereas a tourist may eat there once or twice and I'm sure can afford and don't
mind paying $6 for a heaping plate of yummy food for dinner. Circumstance is everything as Ms.Trotter mentioned. I hate to think of prices being
inflated here because of an influx of tourism...therefore I believe it is fine to continue charging the locals...who are the main consumers...the
"normal" price...call it a discount if you wish. I think the restaurant people should charge a "fair" price for a nice dinner...it's WORTH it...but
also think it's important not to raise prices so the locals cant' eat there anymore. Where real estate is concerned....hey, it's anyones call...some
people think $15,000 is too much for a 2.5 acre ocean front lot....whereas others are like....where do I sign!!!! Someone once asked me about an ocean
front lot and I said...Oh it's WAAAAYYYYYY too much money...which it was for us or anyone in our village...it was kind of a joke...Who would EVER pay
THAT much????? Well, someone came and couldn't believe it was soooooo cheap...so you see...if someone thinks that for example $15,000 is a gringo
price...well..darn...the lot is worth 10 times that anyway you look at it.
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bajajudy
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Posts: 6886
Registered: 10-4-2004
Location: San Jose del Cabo,BCS
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Every resort I have ever lived in has had prices for "locals" It is an appreciation for your business which is year round....it also gets the
"locals" to patronize your business year round which can make or break you.
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stanburn
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Registered: 10-4-2007
Location: Santiago, Colima, MX
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Shari,
Right On! I also don't have a problem with a sliding scale, especially if you can't function in the language of the land!
Flame away, I just watched my 2nd division soccer team lose, so I can take it!
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David K
Honored Nomad
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Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
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Mood: Have Baja Fever
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Hmmm... well, I am not surprised if we gringos get quoted a higher price... as we don't use the services in Mexico on a frequent basis.
For example, I get lower materials price than do 'home owners' as I am in the installation business. It is competition and the free market that
various distributors offer deals for my repeat business.
When I needed to get a flat tire repaired at Bahia de los Angeles (across from the Xitlali market) I was quoted a price higher than a Mexican had paid
before (I understood the language exchange)... so be it. I am a tourist on vacation, and can afford it.
The bunch of you who think this is unjust and isn't fair (like in the US of A) need to stop whining and don't think of trying to change their way!
That would be as bad as the way we pander to all the Spanish speakers up here! Let Mexico stay Mexico! I pay in dollars (always accepted) just so I
give an extra 10% or so when I buy products or sevices... on purpose.
Another note, I live in a 'tourist region' (San Diego County) and I have NEVER seen special prices for locals at restaurants, etc. The only place
locals get a break is at Disneyland, I have seen.
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Osprey
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Location: Baja Ca. Sur
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Shari, there are a dozen or more little hidey hole restaurants around this little village who have some tables and chairs out front, a couple in the
back. In the back, day laborers get hot, tasty meals for a buck or two while the wandering gringo visitors on ocassion pay $3 for the same fare.
Without the ocassional gringo walkin the restauranteur couldn't afford to feed the ditch digger an affordable meal. Here it all works out, nobody is
offended. My Mexican neighbors are smart enough to have only one menu -- no use offending anyone. If you come here, see the people and the prices,
learn our little secret, become offended by it, hope you get the hell out and don't come back.
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DENNIS
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I didn't think this thread was about one group or another getting a lower price. If there is a stated price, the problem is being charged a price
higher than that. If there is no stated price, you're on your own.
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