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bajaguy
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9247
Registered: 9-16-2003
Location: Carson City, NV/Ensenada - Baja Country Club
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Mood: must be 5 O'clock somewhere in Baja
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| Quote: | Originally posted by tjBill
Entered Mexico at Otay this evening, 6:30 pm. Big backup both entering and leaving Mexico. Guess people were trying to avoid San Ysidro.
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Yup, being around flying lead is never good for your health
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arrowhead
Banned
Posts: 912
Registered: 5-5-2009
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| Quote: | Originally posted by gnukid
The consistency of your behavior and action certainly belies your role and intent.
Case closed. |
I'm reopening the case. Here is an eyewitness report from AFN from a man whose fiancee was in line two cars back when the incident occured. I know you
read Spanish, so there is no need to translate it. Just compare it to your conjured up rendition of what occured.
"informante anónimo
Septiembre 22nd, 2009
Esta es la version que mi novia me comento, que estaba a 2 carros de cruzar la linea: todo fue por una panel que quiso cruzar a la brava por la
sentri. Como la panel no se detuvo a la revision, se activo una alarma. Inmediatamente todos los oficiales cerraron sus garitas y corrieron hacia la
panel. Le gritaron y todo a la panel para que se
detuviera pero esta no se detuvo, seguia rumbo a SD para darse a la fuga, fue entonces que le comenzaron a disparar. Aparentemente la panel respondio
los balazos. En menos de 10 minutos ya estaban los de CSI acordonando la zona, despues llegaron los policias mexicanos a sacar a todos los carros en
reversa de regreso a mexico. Segun mi novia hubo muchos heridos."
http://afntijuana.info/blog/?p=18200#more-18200
No soy por ni contra apatía.
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DavidT
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Posts: 494
Registered: 4-9-2005
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| Quote: | Originally posted by gnukid
As has been shown, this pattern is the textbook approach of Mass Communications Specialists who are hope to sway politics.
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What's your favorite mind-protection material? I like this one.
http://www.reynoldspkg.com/reynoldskitchens/en/product.asp?c...
David
Not one shred of evidence supports the notion that life is serious.
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redhilltown
Super Nomad
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Registered: 1-24-2009
Location: Long Beach, CA
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Forgive me for getting in the way of the "conversation", but 70 PEOPLE IN THREE VEHICLES???!!!!!
Wha da f*#@???? I was pulled into secondary coming north last week in Tecate. One single old fart who had been fishing for three days in a Toyota
truck that obviously had NO one under the bedliner. All my answers matched their wonderful computer. Yet, pulled into secondary, 15 minutes sitting
there while they SHOWED me who was boss...finally one guy comes over asks some stupid questions before another guy comes over and asks me stupid
questions (these stupid questions on top of the stupid questions of the initial rookie agent at the gate) before they FINALLY bring out someone who
seems to be in charge who asks me intelligent questions and has a human face and you can see he knows I am ok and wonders what the HELL where the
others thinking. The only other car in secondary was ANOTHER old fart like myself and we just looked at each other and shrugged.
If the coyotes had 70 people in three vehicles they must think they had a chance. Considering me and the other guy who got pulled over, maybe they do.
And I can just hear the responses coming in "oh, you just THINK they were stupid questions! you have NO IDEA what they know and HOW they know it".
We have all passed this border hundreds of times. We all know it's a joke. I realize it must be done...I realize most of the guys are doing their
best. There just has to be a better way. And by not offering that better way, i am as guilty as any.
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k-rico
Super Nomad
Posts: 2079
Registered: 7-10-2008
Location: Playas de Tijuana
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The news is saying the cops opened fire, shooting 3 unarmed people in an area jammed with innocent people, because the smugglers were using their
vans as weapons.
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 64857
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
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Mood: Have Baja Fever
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If they were using vans as weapons, then they weren't 'unarmed'.
If an officer tells you to get out, and you try to run him over.... expect to get shot.
"Shot while being stupid" should be the first thing understood here...
Yes, the new, stronger border fence IS working... The coyotes obviously thought they could rush the border in their 3 vans with 70 people as an EASIER
way to sneak in!
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k-rico
Super Nomad
Posts: 2079
Registered: 7-10-2008
Location: Playas de Tijuana
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They haven't said that the people who were shot were the smugglers. At least I didn't hear that.
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BajaGringo
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There is a lot of talk on the street down here that the "expected" border agent was not at the gate and the drivers just decided to "go for it" when
they weren't waved through. I have a hard time swallowing that their original plan was based on running the suicidal gauntlet they had to know they
would face.
When an unfamiliar face appeared at the gate, panic took over. That makes a lot more sense to me...
But what do I know?
[Edited on 9-23-2009 by BajaGringo]
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wessongroup
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Registered: 8-9-2009
Location: Mission Viejo
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Mood: Suicide Hot line ... please hold
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Mexico and Mexican's
| Quote: | Originally posted by gnukid
Something sorta odd here, first off it's not a shootout as apparently only the border police shot at those running the gate without serious injury. A
shootout is an exchange of fire which did not occur as far as is being reported.
Second, what coyote would ever run the border through the main gate when they know full well this is impossible and idiotic, there are endless
barricades, police, BP and others to protect this one spot, while on the other hand many other sections of the border are apparently open to coyotes
as well as tunnels and endless options.
Sorry for perking my spidey sense, but this seems completely orchestrated for drama like so many stories about border violence, staged for effect,
notice no one was hurt seriously while a vehicle charged the border-not likely. Since no coyote would do this, who would? Who had the motive, the
means and who benefits?
Was border sr.communications officer Arrowhead on base during this operation? Cambio. |
Don't know about all the above, but believe your overall thrust is on point.
First learned about this site from an individual who was posting on another board "City Data".
He was from Mexico, Mexico City and was attempting to defend his Country's.
His point was, Mexico is not as bad and/or bad off as it is always protraid by the American press.
I would have to agree, overall most folks here in the "States" think that when you drive across the border you will within minutes: start breaking out
in purple spots (an unknown diease which has just evolved from the filth that only exisits in Mexico), you will then be robbed by a band of "Drug
Cartel" enforcement types, and lastly your women folk will be raped in the Police Station, and you will be shot in the head along side the road (in
down town TJ).
Well that view has not changed since I stated going down with my Dad in 1952.
My mother would never cross the border and go to Mexico, said it was: dirty, dangerous, their food was not inspected, their water, you can not drink..
you know the story.
My brother and I played in the streets on Ensenada in 1952 while my Dad was out fishing on a rough day.. we played with the police... shooting off
fire works in the dirt streets. We started going on down to San Quintin we called the place Johnson's Ranch. Saw it in one of Dennis's map's.. we used
to camp on the beach with an old canvas tent, coleman stove, water and a shovel. We just surf fished, dug clams, and explored. It was quite a trip in
those days, had to take a second part for just about everything. My Dad hade been through the depression and did quite well under those circumstances.
I still can't believe that we were driving down in a 1939 Plymouth with a roof rack and 5 kids.
Once we did upgrad to a structure which a Mexican family let us use... we called it the pink hacienda... it was where there pigs lived... it was fun,
we were kids and the family had kids so we just had fun, fun fun.. and the pigs were fun too.
Mexico has always been good to me, my wife Mexican's been married 43 years and her family excepted me after a while, her grandmother did not speak to
me for 10 years because we did not get married in the "CHURCH".... After all I was a "gringo" and they were at the time "La Raza" big time. I once
asked what is it you want... "We want it back".
Well, enough rambling on the subject... but, I do think there is an "orchestrated media message" constanting being put out.... don't go to Mexico!!.
Which in my case is just fine... yeah, I would like to see fewer people down there however, I truly do not wish the negative economic results for the
"PEOPLE" that live in Mexico.. they have it hard enough with out that happening too... and it's their Country anyway.
The under lying reason is what I'm think about... WHY
Might be that upto 85% tax level on retiree's income going above $44,000
Saw the report on rent change already, 250-350/month now up to 650-800 for the locals... that is a hard one, as we all know from first hand
experience.
Just my 2 cents on the subject
 
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Taco de Baja
Super Nomad
Posts: 1913
Registered: 4-14-2004
Location: Behind the Orange Curtain, CA
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Mood: Dreamin' of Baja
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| Quote: | Originally posted by BajaGringo
There is a lot of talk on the street down here that the "expected" border agent was not at the gate and the drivers just decided to "go for it" when
they weren't waved through. I have a hard time swallowing that their original plan was based on running the suicidal gauntlet they had to know they
would face.
When an unfamiliar face appeared at the gate, panic took over. That makes a lot more sense to me...
But what do I know?
[Edited on 9-23-2009 by BajaGringo] |
I agree with your theory. 70 people in 3 vans is a lot of smuggling money, even a small cut of that is a sizable bribe. There is no way 3 vans would
be in the same lane and somehow expect to get the 23 people in each van through undetected without help….
”Wadda got in the back?”
“A pile of blankets for the poor in San Diego?”
“Thanks, and have a nice day.”
“What? The guys behind you are blanket donators too?”
“God bless you, I’ll just wave them through.” 
CBT needs to determine what agent was supposed to be in that lane. Or if the Coyotes messed up, what lane they were supposed to be in, and then nail
that inspector with a life sentence.
Truth generally lies in the coordination of antagonistic opinions
-Herbert Spencer
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DENNIS
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 29510
Registered: 9-2-2006
Location: Punta Banda
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| Quote: | Originally posted by redhilltown
I am ok and wonders what the HELL where the others thinking.
And I can just hear the responses coming in "oh, you just THINK they were stupid questions! you have NO IDEA what they know and HOW they know it".
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That "good cop -- bad cop" routine at the border is older than Skeet. It's just part of their nonsense. They must think it's effective 'cause they
still do it.
Their questions are pointless as well and they arn't asked to get a specific answer. They are more concerned with your frame of mind under
questioning. If you stutter or seem slow and confused, they will think your mind is preoccupied and you may warrent a closer look.
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k-rico
Super Nomad
Posts: 2079
Registered: 7-10-2008
Location: Playas de Tijuana
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Wessongroup said:
"Well, enough rambling on the subject... but, I do think there is an "orchestrated media message" constanting being put out.... don't go to Mexico!!."
I don't know if the message is orchestrated. I tend to think that many Americans actually take delight in the troubles of Mexico and therefore eagerly
buy newspapers and watch news shows headlining the problems. It lessens the quiet desperation of their daily existence to know that others have more
significant problems.
Shadenfreude is the word. It's a concept that I've just recently become aware of although it is an idea first warned of in the Old Testament.
[Edited on 9-23-2009 by k-rico]
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arrowhead
Banned
Posts: 912
Registered: 5-5-2009
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Taco de Baja
| Quote: | Originally posted by BajaGringo
There is a lot of talk on the street down here that the "expected" border agent was not at the gate and the drivers just decided to "go for it" when
they weren't waved through. I have a hard time swallowing that their original plan was based on running the suicidal gauntlet they had to know they
would face.
When an unfamiliar face appeared at the gate, panic took over. That makes a lot more sense to me...
But what do I know?
[Edited on 9-23-2009 by BajaGringo] |
I agree with your theory. 70 people in 3 vans is a lot of smuggling money, even a small cut of that is a sizable bribe. There is no way 3 vans would
be in the same lane and. |
I have to disagree with you and bajagabacho. One of the vans in line was reported stolen in San Diego last month. The automatic license plate readers
would have flagged it as stolen in the computer, no matter who was at the booth. How would a "bribed" CBP officer explain away passing a stolen
vehicle? It would have been an automatic bust for him or her.
No, you can bury that theory along with gnukid's fantasies.
No soy por ni contra apatía.
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k-rico
Super Nomad
Posts: 2079
Registered: 7-10-2008
Location: Playas de Tijuana
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"How would a "bribed" CBP officer explain away passing a stolen vehicle? It would have been an automatic bust for him or her."
Maybe the stolen vehicle aspect is what caused the bribed officer to reneg on the deal. He knew he couldn't get away with it.
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wessongroup
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 21152
Registered: 8-9-2009
Location: Mission Viejo
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Mood: Suicide Hot line ... please hold
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Hope, fear and greed
| Quote: | Originally posted by k-rico
Wessongroup said:
"Well, enough rambling on the subject... but, I do think there is an "orchestrated media message" constanting being put out.... don't go to Mexico!!."
I don't know if the message is orchestrated. I tend to think that many Americans actually take delight in the troubles of Mexico. It lessens the quiet
desperation of their daily existence to know that others have more significant problems.
Shadenfreude is the word. It's a concept that I've just recently become aware of although it is an idea first warned of in the Old Testament.
[Edited on 9-23-2009 by k-rico] |
No disaggrement on the poor state of the human condition and it's thinking... and it will not be getting better anytime soon..
Just woundering where all the money to pay for the 8 light years of debit that has just been rung up is going to come from... we are losing the middle
class to retirement...and they are the ones that will have money.
Not sure where the replacement jobs for the 6 million that lost them is coming from.
Where could one move to and live really pretty good on $35,000 per year? On the same land mass and close to the United States at the same time?
When I see Shari's old man out there getting a line wet, catching dinner.... man oh man, where else...
Seems like Mexico maybe a focus of many, many Amerian's in the near future
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arrowhead
Banned
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| Quote: | Originally posted by wessongroup
Where could one move to and live really pretty good on $35,000 per year? On the same land mass and close to the United States at the same time?
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Phoenix. Seems that is where all the Canadians retire to and they are poorer than Americans.
No soy por ni contra apatía.
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k-rico
Super Nomad
Posts: 2079
Registered: 7-10-2008
Location: Playas de Tijuana
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| Quote: | Originally posted by wessongroup
| Quote: | Originally posted by k-rico
Wessongroup said:
"Well, enough rambling on the subject... but, I do think there is an "orchestrated media message" constanting being put out.... don't go to Mexico!!."
I don't know if the message is orchestrated. I tend to think that many Americans actually take delight in the troubles of Mexico. It lessens the quiet
desperation of their daily existence to know that others have more significant problems.
Shadenfreude is the word. It's a concept that I've just recently become aware of although it is an idea first warned of in the Old Testament.
[Edited on 9-23-2009 by k-rico] |
No disaggrement on the poor state of the human condition and it's thinking... and it will not be getting better anytime soon..
Just woundering where all the money to pay for the 8 light years of debit that has just been rung up is going to come from... we are losing the middle
class to retirement...and they are the ones that will have money.
Not sure where the replacement jobs for the 6 million that lost them is coming from.
Where could one move to and live really pretty good on $35,000 per year? On the same land mass and close to the United States at the same time?
When I see Shari's old man out there getting a line wet, catching dinner.... man oh man, where else...
Seems like Mexico maybe a focus of many, many Amerian's in the near future |
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BajaGringo
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3922
Registered: 8-24-2006
Location: La Chorera
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Mood: Let's have a BBQ!
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| Quote: | Originally posted by arrowhead
One of the vans in line was reported stolen in San Diego last month. The automatic license plate readers would have flagged it as stolen in the
computer, no matter who was at the booth. How would a "bribed" CBP officer explain away passing a stolen vehicle? It would have been an automatic bust
for him or her.
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That would only be true if the coyote wasn't smart enough to have changed the license plate to one that would not have flagged. Discovering that the
vehicle was stolen could have happened after the fact when they looked at the VIN.
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BajaGringo
Ultra Nomad
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Mood: Let's have a BBQ!
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| Quote: | Originally posted by arrowhead
| Quote: | Originally posted by wessongroup
Where could one move to and live really pretty good on $35,000 per year? On the same land mass and close to the United States at the same time?
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Phoenix. Seems that is where all the Canadians retire to and they are poorer than Americans. |
You are so right. And I hear the surfing, diving and tuna fishing is awesome in Arizona!
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capt. mike
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"Phoenix. Seems that is where all the Canadians retire to and they are poorer than Americans. "
not the ones I know. Muy Rico. They are buying everything up.
formerly Ordained in Rev. Ewing\'s Church by Mail - busted on tax fraud.......
Now joined L. Ron Hoover\'s church of Appliantology
\"Remember there is a big difference between kneeling down and bending over....\"
www.facebook.com/michael.l.goering |
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