| Pages:
1
2
3
4
5
6 |
Dave
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6005
Registered: 11-5-2002
Member Is Offline
|
|
Steering the debate
| Quote: | | Originally posted by Cardon ManFor many, the ATV is a means by which to experience the shoreline through swimming, snorkeling, and shore
fishing...Clearly, there is such a thing as irresponsible ATV riding. Perhaps if there was a well defined track way above the high tide line
|
Really makes no difference. The law is the law.
Believe it or not, there are people who base their decision to invest in beachfront homes on not seeing/hearing ATV's... not to save the
friggin turtles, or whatever. You may consider it elitist...I could really care. What I care about is enforcing the law and if it is
law then my rights trump yours...period...end of debate.
|
|
|
Capt. George
Super Nomad
Posts: 2129
Registered: 8-21-2003
Member Is Offline
|
|
cardon man
hit the nail on the head....
screw all the low lifes not able to afford beach front homes, as long as we have what we want (and can afford)..........we're doing it all the time to
the Mexicans in their own land. what a crock!
all these "elitists" will get bit in the ass, just a matter of time.
\"The penalty good men pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men\" Plato
|
|
|
Frank
Senior Nomad
Posts: 861
Registered: 6-5-2005
Location: San Diego
Member Is Offline
Mood: Is it time to leave yet?
|
|
Well, I guess I'll be hoofing it with my fly rod in hand chasing Rooster from shore. Please pour water on me if I pass out from the heat
|
|
|
Cardon Man
Super Nomad
Posts: 1319
Registered: 8-28-2003
Location: Thetis Bank
Member Is Offline
Mood: !Al Chingaso!
|
|
| Quote: | Originally posted by Capt. George
screw all the low lifes not able to afford beach front homes, as long as we have what we want (and can afford)..........we're doing it all the time to
the Mexicans in their own land. what a crock!
|
That's pretty much it amigo. Law or no law it's the beachfront gringo scene that complains the loudest and longest... Keep the riff-raff off "my
beach"! And it's got nothing to do with concern for fragile beachfront ecosystems. Tearing up the dunes for your beach front home is a-ok. But those
damn ATV's have gotta go! As do those pesky Mexicans having fun on the weekend.
|
|
|
Cypress
Elite Nomad
Posts: 7641
Registered: 3-12-2006
Location: on the bayou
Member Is Offline
Mood: undecided
|
|
Jeez, And I only thought it was about noise etc. and somebody ripping back and forth in my face on their loud wing-ding. Now it's a class thing, rich versus poor. As I understand it the "poor" should be allowed to rip back and forth on their $5 or $6 K rigs in my face and I'm
supposed to like it? Am I missing out on something here?
|
|
|
gnukid
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4411
Registered: 7-2-2006
Member Is Offline
|
|
What is the deal? you can drive all over mexico and right to the beach with all your poles and gear just not along the shoreline. Take it up a bit
where its flatter 20 meters from the tideline... how many people have I picked up with a broken collar bone because they had to ride the hip of the
sand til they wiped out on some quad causing thousands of dollars of damage to themselves and the bike. It's obvious, ride a little higher and don't
burnout your quad in the tideline. Is that such a big deal? high side it and arroyos are fine too. Can you break some bad habit to show a little
respect or is that sacrilege? "I always drive my quad at the waters edge." doh!@#$&!
Guess what, do it and you are out.
|
|
|
Capt. George
Super Nomad
Posts: 2129
Registered: 8-21-2003
Member Is Offline
|
|
the poor should be able to continue using "their" beaches as they have in the past. Gringos stealing beaches is a damn site worse then fishinermen
driving on them. Have you been to Bahia de "Muertos", now Suenos, lately?
Always a scam to get your own private beach, "well I lease the Federal Zone so it's ok for me to steal a townies beach".. If it isn't vehicles and
beach erosion, it's the "pity the poor piping plover" or other such bullchit. Chased from place to place in the states by this trumped up great
environmental concern crap, when all the time, it's simply about greed and me, me me.
Stay in the states if you want your own gated in, walled in, purified, homogonized, paturized community........Leave Baja alone.
Cape Cod back in the eighties, just an example of the bullchit excuses used to close areas. The Dept of the Interior (Goon Squad) took half tracks and
drove them up and down the beach where we used to go clamming. They used that as the study to prove how vehicles were the major cause of mortality to
that environment. The area had been driven on and clammed since the forties and the clamming was great right up to the half track experiment.
As far as vehicles damaging the beach...caca de baca. Regulated and driven above the tide line actually was proven (by Columbia University) in the mid
eighties, to actually prevent and slow down erosion. The beaches that no no vehicle access were eraoiding at a rate 40% greater?? The great
environmental scammers just never quit.
I will continue to drive on the beaches either until the day I die or they lock me away in nut house. adios, over and out, tu-da-lu, etc., etc I'm
going to go look for a beach to destroy....wadda bunch a crap!
\"The penalty good men pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men\" Plato
|
|
|
Cypress
Elite Nomad
Posts: 7641
Registered: 3-12-2006
Location: on the bayou
Member Is Offline
Mood: undecided
|
|
And there used to be "free range", no stock laws, no hunting seasons or limits, no limits on fish. Wonder why "free range" no longer exists. Why the
hunting seasons and limits? Why the fish limits? 
|
|
|
Al G
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 2647
Registered: 12-19-2004
Location: Todos Santos/Full time for now...
Member Is Offline
Mood: Wondering what is next???
|
|
Before I weigh in here, I need some info on this law.
Is it a Mexican law set by their culture or is it a law (compromise law) for the whiners of Marin county and the city SF, CA. There is not a single
day passes they don't come up with a new limit law to take a little more of your freedom.
So if someone can point me to the history of the law it could help me with the respect I will show.
My feeling:
1) I agree and support the Turtle "season" protection.(With a prescribed Date)
2) Any fool who puts anyone in danger with their vehicle needs to be dealt with, with the lost of vehicle and more. (a good gang bang?)
3) I would help to form a organization to limit and reverse these whiner's California laws.
4) Protecting the little bugs, is true California numb skull thinking.
Albert G
Remember, if you haven\'t got a smile on your face and laughter in your heart, then you are just a sour old fart!....
The most precious thing we have is life, yet it has absolutely no trade-in value.
|
|
|
Capt. George
Super Nomad
Posts: 2129
Registered: 8-21-2003
Member Is Offline
|
|
Cypress tooooo many people in USA, tooo many whiners, tooo many gated community types.
if you like that crap, stay in the states. leave Baja and it's people alone. it will turn into the states soon enough.........
first house built in Baja...architects? engineers? permits? My answer from the town government, Vikingo, necesito a hammer!!!
now here come the do-gooders...."oh my God, I must have an architect, I want it to be just like in the states!!" It's so beautiful here but we really
need to make some changes.........SICKOS!!!!
\"The penalty good men pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men\" Plato
|
|
|
Dave
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6005
Registered: 11-5-2002
Member Is Offline
|
|
Stealing?
| Quote: | Originally posted by Capt. George
the poor should be able to continue using "their" beaches as they have in the past. Gringos stealing beaches is a damn site worse then fishinermen
driving on them. |
Please tell me how you steal a beach. Much cheaper than paying for it. 
And where do the poor get off thinking it's "their" beach. The beaches belong to the government. They can sell them to anyone they want.
Mexico...where the rich make the rules and rules are just suggestions.
Especially the law about driving on the beach,..... right Captain? 
|
|
|
Cypress
Elite Nomad
Posts: 7641
Registered: 3-12-2006
Location: on the bayou
Member Is Offline
Mood: undecided
|
|
If they were really poor they would be walking instead of ripping back and forth on a high-dollar quad.
|
|
|
viabaja
Nomad
Posts: 277
Registered: 10-6-2003
Location: Georgia
Member Is Offline
|
|
Hear Hear for Capt. George!! All you tree (cardon cactus) hugging gated community green dudes stay in the states and leave Baja. I will continue to
ride the beaches in my jeep and quads with a cerveza in my left hand!! I suspect I'll be able to do this for many years to come!
|
|
|
Dave
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6005
Registered: 11-5-2002
Member Is Offline
|
|
We could fix that
| Quote: | Originally posted by Cypress
If they were really poor they would be walking instead of ripping back and forth on a high-dollar quad. |
Enforce the law
Confiscate the quads
Back to walking.
Poof...Instant poor.
SAY NO TO ATV'S!
Beaches were made for long walks, Brie and Chardonnay.
|
|
|
Al G
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 2647
Registered: 12-19-2004
Location: Todos Santos/Full time for now...
Member Is Offline
Mood: Wondering what is next???
|
|
| Quote: | Originally posted by Cypress
If they were really poor they would be walking instead of ripping back and forth on a high-dollar quad. |
You are attempting to sling crap without thought or consideration. Very few of the Mexican poor have a Quad and even fewer, like almost none have high
dollar quads (mostly Chinese junk)
I spent 4 months on the beach this year and only saw a few Mexican and all were fishermen making a living despite willy nilly gringo made, and gringo
enforced laws.
Not saying I am involve here....Be careful turning in quad riders that are not doing anything stupid, most are part of groups that track down
squealers in small pueblos. Not hard to do for people who have lived there 10-20 years...only Reporting the news
Albert G
Remember, if you haven\'t got a smile on your face and laughter in your heart, then you are just a sour old fart!....
The most precious thing we have is life, yet it has absolutely no trade-in value.
|
|
|
gnukid
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4411
Registered: 7-2-2006
Member Is Offline
|
|
What makes you think gringo whiners have set in motion action to protect beaches. Why would you assume anything except that Mexico is protecting
itself, no but mexicans can make laws, run for office or vote.? That is so ethno centric to think that Marin gringo mentality had anything to with
Mexico's laws about protecting the last 20-30 meters of beach front tideline?
Why can't you respect their wishes? Why would you arrogantly break the law? In the name of what? You seem to have trouble with the concept of
respecting the law of the state and the community? Is that the source of your obstinance, rebel attitude? Cool.
|
|
|
Capt. George
Super Nomad
Posts: 2129
Registered: 8-21-2003
Member Is Offline
|
|
bullchit
| Quote: | Originally posted by Dave
| Quote: | Originally posted by Capt. George
the poor should be able to continue using "their" beaches as they have in the past. Gringos stealing beaches is a damn site worse then fishinermen
driving on them. |
Please tell me how you steal a beach. Much cheaper than paying for it.
you know as well as I. lease the federal zone, all it takes is money....something the local Baja people are lacking. people leasing the zone are just
thieves helping thieves getting their own whining way.
And where do the poor get off thinking it's "their" beach. The beaches belong to the government. They can sell them to anyone they want.
really? you think the Mexican Gov't gave two chits about Baja before the arrival of the sniveling gringos? the beach belonged to the Mexican people
that settled this desert and it still should!.
Mexico...where the rich make the rules and rules are just suggestions.
What a shock, it's different in the states? enlighten me. If it isn't the wealthy few flocking things up, then it's the enviro-freaks that have
(unfortuneately) weaseled their way into Baja
Especially the law about driving on the beach,..... right Captain?
|
has been unenforced for years, till the whiners from the states arrived.
stay in the states...go bird watching and screw your own people instead of native Baja people. 
\"The penalty good men pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men\" Plato
|
|
|
Cypress
Elite Nomad
Posts: 7641
Registered: 3-12-2006
Location: on the bayou
Member Is Offline
Mood: undecided
|
|
Let's see now?  I don't like loud, obnoxious machines. This makes me a whiner? Guilty! And I'd rather watch birds than quads any day of the week.
|
|
|
Cardon Man
Super Nomad
Posts: 1319
Registered: 8-28-2003
Location: Thetis Bank
Member Is Offline
Mood: !Al Chingaso!
|
|
| Quote: | Originally posted by Dave
Enforce the law
Confiscate the quads
Back to walking.
Poof...Instant poor.
SAY NO TO ATV'S!
Beaches were made for long walks, Brie and Chardonnay. |
Apparently, the Mexican community for the most part does not care to enforce the law. I spent the day fishing along the coast here at East Cape by
boat. I saw many ATV's and lots of trucks, jeeps etc. on the beach. Almost all of them Mexican owned. This is their country. And they work damn hard
to have those ATV's and trucks so that they can have fun with their families on the weekend and holidays. Do they deserve to have their vehicles
confiscated? I think not. The local police feel the same way. As did PROFEPA until the beach front gringos started raising a stink about the issue.
Before anyone starts throwing stones at me...Let it be known I walk the beach and I'm giving thought to buying an ATV to facilitate my beach
fun be it snorkeling or fishing. Beaches are indeed for long walks etc...but they are also for ATV rides and good times.
And what about the local Mexican fishermen who launch their boats with trucks on the beach? They are breaking the law too. Do they deserve to have
their vehicles conficated because a gringo doesn't want to see them on the beach?
Frankly, the beach front homes of the "bourgeoisie" are far more of a disturbance to my Baja experience than any ATV or truck. We should confiscate
them and once and for all leave one stretch of beach empty for every human to enjoy, Mexican and gringo alike. On foot or by vehicle.
|
|
|
amir
Senior Nomad
Posts: 559
Registered: 5-4-2007
Location: Todos Santos, BCS
Member Is Offline
Mood: chiropractic
|
|
SOME RULES JUST HAVE TO BE RESPECTED
| Quote: | Originally posted by Cardon Man
And what about the local Mexican fishermen who launch their boats with trucks on the beach? They are breaking the law too. Do they deserve to have
their vehicles conficated because a gringo doesn't want to see them on the beach? |
The local Mexican fishermen of the old-fishing-pueblo of Todos Santos belong to one of two co-ops that have permits to operate their trucks on the
beach to launch and beach their boats. Nobody else is allowed to launch their boat from that beach. The general public drives out to Punto Lobos when
the panga fleets return to buy fresh catch right off the boats. The Punto Lobos beach is also a popular swimming and picnicking spot for locals and
foreigners alike.
Besides the towing trucks that work the pangas and the trucks that ferry fishermen and supplies, everybody else parks on the lot before the dune.
Everybody waks over the dune to the surf line. -- Amir
|
|
|
| Pages:
1
2
3
4
5
6 |
![[*]](images/xmbforum/default_icon.gif){kind=icon}
