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Barry A.
Select Nomad
Posts: 10007
Registered: 11-30-2003
Location: Redding, Northern CA
Member Is Offline
Mood: optimistic
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| Quote: | Originally posted by fishabductor
how much your boat weigh barry? |
The Whaler is heavy-------it's a 1988 13' 4" Supersport GLS with a custom console. The base weight is 316 lbs, but with the custom console it probably
is double that, plus motor, etc.. Also custom gas tanks with 30 gal. capacity, so it is a "long cruizer". I normally only have 12 gallons aboard,
tho. I never use it in Baja as it is just too difficult to launch over the beach, I have to trailer it, and all of my Baja boating is with a tin
boat----much simpler..
It has no problem getting up on plane with two people in it, and it does it much faster with the Sting Ray hydrofoil, and hangs on plane at slower
speeds, for sure. But top speed and ideal RPM is really compromised with the Sting Ray, so I removed it.
By the way, I had been using the boat with the Sting Ray for some 13 years on fresh water lakes with it never hurting the cavitation plate on the
motor----I just removed the Sting Ray last year. It was an $11,500 boat when new in 1988-----I paid $4,500 for it in 1992 from a desparate guy who
needed the cash fast. IT IS A GREAT BOAT, but really heavy for so small a boat.
Barry
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Doug/Vamonos
Nomad
Posts: 417
Registered: 6-19-2006
Location: Bahia de los Angeles
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I have a 12' Gregor that I use to shuttle out to my boat and occasionally fish inshore with a nissan 9.8 or an evinrude 9.9. In my opinion this boat
is way too small and unstable to take offshore or away from camp if there is the possibility of wind or swell. It is a very small boat. I'd go 14 if
this was my primary fishing boat.
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Doug/Vamonos
Nomad
Posts: 417
Registered: 6-19-2006
Location: Bahia de los Angeles
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Hi. I want to put wheels on my 12'. I would only use it to beach during the day and overnight. No real distance so they don't need to be over-built.
Which wheels do you folks like. Inexpensive is good. Thanks.
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Skipjack Joe
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8084
Registered: 7-12-2004
Location: Bahia Asuncion
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I'm attaching a picture of my setup that my son took this summer. It uses the same launching wheels as Frank shows in his post on the first page. They
were purchased from Baja Enterprises. This is my 4th or 5th year launching with these wheels and we're pretty satisfied.
As you can see the face of this beach is fairly steep and pulling it up is much more difficult without the wheels. The wheels are very wide and don't
sink into the sand with our 13'8" boat. Previously I had transom wheels on it which were narrower and required more pushing power (due to wheels
sinking) and lifting power (these wheels pass through the center of gravity, allowing you to raise it with very little effort).
But the best thing about them is beaching the boat in the surf without getting any water into the boat. The boat is motored in, shut off, and rowed
with wheels on and the bow facing the incoming surf. The boat is rolled backwards through the 'washy' zone with the bow still facing the surf. When
the water is so low as to never reach the bottom of the boat it is reversed and rolled up the beach bow first to above the high tide mark.
As all have said a 12' boat is on the smallish side on the cortez and dangerous on the pacific. You would be restricted to fishing the shoreline close
to camp on the cortez or the pacific lagoons. I plan to upgrade to a 14'3" gregor this winter as this one is close to 20 years old now.
Our setup includes a trailer rather than carrying on top of the vehicle. But the trailer is constructed for a much larger, heavier boat. It has 12"
wheels. Trailers made for these small boats (8" wheels) are not suitable for the washboards and will break down (I learned that early on). The trailer
in the picture has been to baja now for 15 years without any failures (yes, the Gonzaga road many times).
A trailer is used instead of car-topping it because we carry things in the boat. The motor rides in the boat rather than on the transom. Empty fuel
tanks, rod cases, and boat wheels all ride in the boat, not the camper. Our camper is too small for all of these items.
It's a big subject and much can be said. I hope this helps some.
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Russ
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6742
Registered: 7-4-2004
Location: Punta Chivato
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I really like your wheel set up Skipjack Joe! But how do you push the wheels under water before you come in? Looks like those fatties wouldn't want to
go under. When you get your new boat could you show us how the wheel brackets are attached as you install them and how you how you put them on &
off while under way? Nice truck/camper setup too. I put bigger tires on my trailer too but they're too big for the original fenders and the tires are
under the boat a bit so no towing it until I figure how I'm gonna move the wheels out and make fenders.
Bahia Concepcion where life starts...given a chance!
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bajabass
Super Nomad
Posts: 2016
Registered: 10-4-2006
Location: La Paz,BCS
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Mood: Want to fish!!!
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Sounds like you will need to use a longer axle Russ. Generic replacement fenders can be made to work. I have a couple trailer shops in Orange, get an
axle length, and I'll check on it for you.
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baitcast
Super Nomad
Posts: 1785
Registered: 8-31-2003
Location: kingman AZ.
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Mood: good
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Like your whole setup Igor,love the camper,but in the old days a trailer meet a whole lot of misery,hot set up now.
Sounds like your on top of your game these days Igor.
Rob
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Barry A.
Select Nomad
Posts: 10007
Registered: 11-30-2003
Location: Redding, Northern CA
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Mood: optimistic
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Wow, Skipjack, I LIKE your setup!!! I am impressed that your trailer has stood up-------I continually crystalized leaf springs on mine, and finally
gave up on trailers. This was also a problem with ,my (an others) luggage/utility trailers----springs always crystalized, eventually, and we do not
go fast, ever. Very frustrating, and time concuming. I always thought that good shocks on the trailer would solve the problem, but never got around
to installing them. My son does have Bilstein shocks on his combi-utility/boat trailer, and has had no problems since.
I like your outrigger wheels on your boat better than mine----mine are duals,(4 tires-- 2 per axle) rigged on the transome (Eide wheels), and do work,
but yours look like a better setup. I did have to change out the factory alum. axles on my outrigger wheels, tho---changed them to stainless steel as
the alum. ones kept bending.
All in all I really like your setup. congrats.
Barry
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Skipjack Joe
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8084
Registered: 7-12-2004
Location: Bahia Asuncion
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I have to plead ignorance here, Barry. I don't know what 'crystalized leaf springs' means. Tried to google it up but got nothing. My guess is that the
metal is somehow weakening due to 'crystallization'? Maybe it's already happening of my trailer?
Anyway, one bad thing about trailers in my opinion is that they really slow you down on washboard. I see guys doing 30, 40, and more. They just leave
me in the dust. I average about 10 mph on most washboards. Any faster and I see that trailer bouncing violently in the rear view mirror. It could be
very frustrating for someone used to much faster driving.
If Frank or anyone doesn't post more pictures of those side launch wheels I will do so this evening after work.
The tin boat setup I'm using is mainly due to the fact that I believe that baja is rapidly shrinking now and it takes a setup like this to experience
what 15 years ago could have been done from paved roads (Los Muertos, Pt. Escondido, etc.).
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Timo1
Senior Nomad
Posts: 742
Registered: 11-2-2007
Location: Homeless
Member Is Offline
Mood: Lovin every minute of it
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SJ
How do you get those wheels on while underway
sold out and got out !!!
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Barry A.
Select Nomad
Posts: 10007
Registered: 11-30-2003
Location: Redding, Northern CA
Member Is Offline
Mood: optimistic
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Skipjack Joe
I have to plead ignorance here, Barry. I don't know what 'crystalized leaf springs' means. Tried to google it up but got nothing. My guess is that the
metal is somehow weakening due to 'crystallization'? Maybe it's already happening of my trailer?
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"Crystalizing" of the springs is what happens when the springs just break. It is a result of continous and violent flexing until the metal just
"breaks" and you can lose the entire axle (that happened to me) and totally destroy the trailer (that happened to me too). You can experience
"crystalization" by bending a wire over and over again until it just breaks.
Yes, going slowly is better than fast, but it still gets-to most trailers as they are simply not built for this type of punishment----pavement is
fine, washboard not so much.
As for deploying the transome wheels-------mine simply pivot from straight up in the air, to the down position, then locking into place with a
spring-loaded "dog"-------therefore you never have to remove the wheels, but they do sorta get in the way when up, so I normally don't even take them
with me to sea.
If the surfs up, (it is never THAT big in the SOC) and you have an on-shore wind, I just back into shore, throwing out the anchor when still in the
chop and maybe 200 + feet off shore, securing the boat off shore still in the chop (20 feet from shore, about??), and wade into shore. You can leave
your boat in this position for a long time as long as the anchor does not drag, and it rides out the waves just fine if you have a long enough line on
your anchor (I normally lay out about 100 feet of anchor line, at least--------more if the surf is REALLY up).
In an off-shore wind condition, shore waves are seldom a problem, and you just land bow first and secure with an anchor thrown up on shore.
I have developed a special anchoring system that allows me to pull my boat into shore (bow always pointing out to sea if on-shore wind), and then pull
it back out to sea 75 yards, or so, for the night, using the pulley on the anchor-rock, never taking the boat out of the water until it is time to go
home. It has worked for me, even during chabascos at night----never lost a boat yet, and I have done this dozens of times. (I use two points of
anchor to be sure) It takes a lot of 1/2 inch nylon rope (about 400 + feet) and a heavyduty galvanised pulley secured to an adaquate anchor (normally
a big rock) but it works slick, and you never have to swim out for your boat, nor hassle with pulling it up on the beach above the high tide mark. I
have a tny 'float' that marks the location of the anchor-rock, and that I leave the end of the night-time nylon rope attached to when away in the
boat.
Obviously, you should plan on staying in the same camp for several nights to make this system practical. (we usually stay at least a week)
Barry
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Skipjack Joe
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8084
Registered: 7-12-2004
Location: Bahia Asuncion
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Russ
I really like your wheel set up Skipjack Joe! But how do you push the wheels under water before you come in? Looks like those fatties wouldn't want to
go under.
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The wheel's 'axle' is solid aluminum with the last 5 inches cut into a perfect circle. When attaching these wheels in water you guide the axle into
the hole all the way to the square part and let it float in the water. Then you push the wheel under water until that arm is vertical. As the wheel is
pushed down there is natural force back upwards that helps the axle want to enter the hole ( As Woody Allen would say: "Do we always have to talk
about sex?"). Once partially in you rock the tire up and down driving the axle further in. Taking them out is the same process except you push
slightly away from the boat and each push drives it further out.
There is nothing that actually binds the wheel to the boat. The buoyancy of the tires provides all the force you need to keep the axle from coming
out. Last winter I left the boat below the high tide line and the following morning found the boat floating with both wheels firmly in place. The
waves all night weren't able to dislodge the wheels.
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Skipjack Joe
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8084
Registered: 7-12-2004
Location: Bahia Asuncion
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Timo1
SJ
How do you get those wheels on while underway
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Tim,
Unlike the transom wheels these are removed after launching. I keep one on the stern opposite the gas tank and the other way up front at the bow.
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Skipjack Joe
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8084
Registered: 7-12-2004
Location: Bahia Asuncion
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Here's a picture of the boat all packed and under way. The wheels sit in milk crates at the very back with the motor inside on a palette between the
seats. Near Abreojos.
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Skipjack Joe
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8084
Registered: 7-12-2004
Location: Bahia Asuncion
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One of the best things about these small boats is that they make it easy for you to camp at some of the most beautiful spots you can imagine.
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Russ
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6742
Registered: 7-4-2004
Location: Punta Chivato
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| Quote: | Originally posted by bajabass
Sounds like you will need to use a longer axle Russ. Generic replacement fenders can be made to work. I have a couple trailer shops in Orange, get an
axle length, and I'll check on it for you. |
Measured 40' inside hub to inside hub. I would need 2" more on each end to clear the boat. What are your (or any ones) feelings about the torsion type
axles? Think they'd hold up over dirt roads? My factory springs are as wimpy as the 1 1/2" axle so by the time I change every thing out i may be
better to buy another trailer that's built stronger to start with. If I do trailer this boat it would only be from here to Campo Rene or La Bocana so
not too much driving the bad roads. Thanks for your help.
Bahia Concepcion where life starts...given a chance!
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Bob and Susan
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8813
Registered: 8-20-2003
Location: Mulege BCS on the BAY
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Mood: Full Time Residents
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remember the bearings and tires are your weakest links
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Barry A.
Select Nomad
Posts: 10007
Registered: 11-30-2003
Location: Redding, Northern CA
Member Is Offline
Mood: optimistic
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Skipjack---------
Is that a PACIFIC galvanised trailer you have there?
If so, that is the exact same trailer I had that disintegrated on me about 3 miles north of Punta Bufeo on the San Felipe to Gonzaga road. Keep a
sharp eye on those springs, tho when they break they give no warning that is visible, as far as I could tell. Also, to avoid having the axle twist
off and fly out into the desert (like mine did), I suggest that you put some sort of safety chain around the axle near each spring to keep that from
happening. Then if one spring breaks, at least your axle remains with you, and you can at least jury rig it and limp home, probably.
Here's hoping that you NEVER have to face the dilemma that I was in with both springs broken and no hope of ever reattaching the axle in the boonies
(that we could figure out). I had to just abandon the trailer, putting my boat on top a utility trailer that I had to run to El Centro, Ca to get.
It was NOT A GOOD DAY!!! (but a typical 'baja' day)
Barry
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Doug/Vamonos
Nomad
Posts: 417
Registered: 6-19-2006
Location: Bahia de los Angeles
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SJ:
I like your setup but it is more than I need. More money and more effort. My little boat rides 200' on a trailer to launch and retrieve from my campo
to the ramp and only needs to be pulled to the high tide line on a firm beach while on the wheels. I prefer a simple setup like the Eide and I realize
it is a whole different class than what you have. If my boat were bigger and I didn't want to use a trailer I would go for your solution. Thanks for
the input.
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Skipjack Joe
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8084
Registered: 7-12-2004
Location: Bahia Asuncion
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Barry A.
Skipjack---------
Is that a PACIFIC galvanised trailer you have there?
Barry |
Barry,
You'll be happy to hear that not only has the trailer lasted 15 years but I'm still on the original bearings.
I hope you still respect me (assuming you ever did). I know you can't stop laughing. My mechanic just shakes his head when I tell him. But wait til
you see the pictures of the yellowtail.
I used to change the bearings on the old trailer every year.
I attribute my good fortune to:
a. lubing the wheels after every trailer launch.
b. having a lube system where excess grease overflows into the axle. Thus I never break the seals no matter how often I grease it.
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