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Bajame
Nomad
Posts: 458
Registered: 6-12-2005
Member Is Offline
Mood: Baja Dreamin
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Hey David, Those shade trees you were talking about are so messy! Other campers and myself through our tents out because those trees driped a sticky
sap all over them that was impossible to clean off. They collect the dew and then it rains down on anything under them.
We all want a peaceful world, filled with love and laughter, but we fill ourselves with anger and hate trying to fiqure out how to achive it.
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Mexitron
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3397
Registered: 9-21-2003
Location: Fort Worth, Texas
Member Is Offline
Mood: Happy!
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DK--the Salt Cedar you are talking about I believe is Tamarisk aphylla which generally isn't as invasive as its cousin the smaller Tamarisk
ramoisissima (a noxious plant over-running ecosystems from Baja into Texas!). However both , as well as the rest of the 50 or so species, are native
to Eurasia. They were planted in Baja the same way figs and grapes were planted in the early missions down there--people brought them in.
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 64854
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline
Mood: Have Baja Fever
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Steve, how do they propagate... seeds to the wind or wildlife?
Bajame: Only in the hot/ humid months do the trees grab moisture out of the air and if windy or shaken, will sprinkel down on you... mixed with the
salt. That was the only time I got wet under them.
This is a wonderful, natural insecticide... You won't have a bug problem under the tamarisk trees!
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oladulce
Super Nomad
Posts: 1625
Registered: 5-30-2005
Location: bcs
Member Is Offline
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Nice red seafoam in Paula's video.
I don't read Nomad much anymore. At least the"Baja Home" section used to be sacred.
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ELINVESTIG8R
Select Nomad
Posts: 15882
Registered: 11-20-2007
Location: Southern California
Member Is Offline
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The tolerance of others in here is heartwarming, just plain heartwarming.
[Edited on 6-10-2008 by ELINVESTI8]
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Mexitron
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3397
Registered: 9-21-2003
Location: Fort Worth, Texas
Member Is Offline
Mood: Happy!
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David--on the reproduction of Tamarisk aphylla:
http://www.fs.fed.us/database/feis/plants/tree/tamaph/all.ht...
"Athel tamarisk flowers and produces many seeds, but most of the seeds
are sterile [9,34]. Its main method of propagation is vegetative. It
sprouts from the root crown or forms adventitous roots from submerged,
broken or buried stems [9,18]."
It would appear the early inhabitants of Baja perhaps brought cuttings with them.
On the ecology of the genera:
http://www.nps.gov/plants/ALIEN/fact/tama1.htm
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 64854
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline
Mood: Have Baja Fever
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Great links Steve...
Here is one line that the Baja Nomads should read regarding any harm caused by Luis planting the Nuevo Mazatlan forest in the late 60's-early 70's:
"Unlike the deciduous Tamarix spp., which have become serious weed
species in the Southwest, Athel tamrisk seldom escapes cultivation
and, therefore, rarely becomes a problem"
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rob
Senior Nomad
Posts: 509
Registered: 10-19-2004
Location: Pacific Coast, BCS
Member Is Offline
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PINE (?) IDENTIFICATION PLEASE
Rancho la Aguja is known for two huge "salt pines" (the locals call them "pino salado") - the discussion here has brought this issue to a head: what
exactly are they?
They are tall 60+ feet, have lots of tiny seeds at various times, but I have never seen a sapling. They appear to propagate by sending runners
underground, and if a main trunk falls, shoots immediately appear about of the trunk remnant and begin to form trees.
Here are two shots - one of the tree, one of the leaves clse up. Your comments appreciated.
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rob
Senior Nomad
Posts: 509
Registered: 10-19-2004
Location: Pacific Coast, BCS
Member Is Offline
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Leaves of "pine"
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shari
Select Nomad
Posts: 13048
Registered: 3-10-2006
Location: bahia asuncion, baja sur
Member Is Offline
Mood: there is no reality except the one contained within us "Herman Hesse"
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Ummm, I live in Asuncion and yes there are people available to water however we cannot afford to hire a gardener, maid or car washer for that
matter....so I am very interested in a drip system, particularly for the bushes around the beach house. I spend wayyyyyy tooooooo mannnnny hours
standing with a hose in my hand. But I think dogs will be a problem..our dogs dug up our water line and bit into it one day when they ran out of water
for a few hours. There are lots of thirsty dogs in Asuncion that would dig up hose so I can't think of an alternative...any suggestions? Maybe I could
try just a cheap system first...perhaps one where I could just replace the bitten bits..splice em together like...would soaker house work? Maybe the
dogs would just lick it.
I thought of putting out an offer to someone who might like to come down here for a few days for the royal treatment in exchange for setting up a
little watering system for us...we could try it and see how it worked...any takers????
Oh yeah, by the way Dianne, I see that Los Pinos in Vizcaino has planted salt pines all around their greenhouses...
I love our salt pines in San Roque as they are the only trees there that survive without water and provides the only shade. But everyone knows not to
park their car under them or pitch a tent because they do rain nasty pitchy icky stuff down on whatever is under them...
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 64854
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline
Mood: Have Baja Fever
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Shari, I am happy to help any way that I can.
A drip system is very simple and inexpensive.
With the correct parts and equipment available, it will not clog and give you years of low water use, inexpensive service. What's even more important,
plants grow better when watered with drip as their roots, not the leaves get all the water... and it comes at regular intervals, not sporadically from
hand watering.
Perhaps a new thread on automatic drip watering for the Baja garden is called for?
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shari
Select Nomad
Posts: 13048
Registered: 3-10-2006
Location: bahia asuncion, baja sur
Member Is Offline
Mood: there is no reality except the one contained within us "Herman Hesse"
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What I need is not advice...we need some live body...preferably a tecate drinker (but will tolerate Corona fans) to bring the stuff down and help us
set it up...work together so we do it and have fun doing it...otherwise it just gets put on our very long "TO DO" list. There must be some nomad who
in interested in a little project in exchange for accomodations, fishing,whatever.
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 64854
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline
Mood: Have Baja Fever
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Well, the parts are the most important... quality, professional grade parts. Then installed correctly, of course.
This is real easy Shari and fun... like Tinker Toys!
Here is the info needed to put together a parts list:
Water source: hose bib, PVC pipe (size), or ? from a city water system or a pila... How much pressure (PSI)?... If a pila, the elevation difference
(feet)from the bottom of the tank to the garden.
Operation: 110v available (inside or outside)? Otherwise, battery powered controller and valve(s).
Plantings: Shrubs, trees, ground cover, planter, garden? How far from the valve location. How many... or if a planter, ground cover or vegetable
garden, how long and wide is the planting area?
That's the basics... next is the type of system to use.
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 64854
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline
Mood: Have Baja Fever
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Shari (or others), shall I continue or do you really don't have any interest in how to set one up... You know I would help do this if you weren't 500
miles away! Maybe Bajaboy can bring it down to you... I can meet him at the irrigation store up here in San Diego County?
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Taco de Baja
Super Nomad
Posts: 1913
Registered: 4-14-2004
Location: Behind the Orange Curtain, CA
Member Is Offline
Mood: Dreamin' of Baja
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| Quote: | Originally posted by rob
Rancho la Aguja is known for two huge "salt pines" (the locals call them "pino salado") - the discussion here has brought this issue to a head: what
exactly are they?
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Looks like one of the Tamarisk sp. to me.
Depite being called "salt pine" or salt cedar, they are neither pines nor cedars.
Truth generally lies in the coordination of antagonistic opinions
-Herbert Spencer
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shari
Select Nomad
Posts: 13048
Registered: 3-10-2006
Location: bahia asuncion, baja sur
Member Is Offline
Mood: there is no reality except the one contained within us "Herman Hesse"
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David, remember the bushes surrounding the beach house? This could use an irrigation system, the hose outlet is in the back corner and there is 110
power...pressure depends, usually good when the water is on but it varies. I don't know if pvc or hose works better. We probably need around 75'. I
know you would come down if you could...the idea about trading is one that appeals to us for various reasons...finances is one, help setting up is
another, and fun doing it with others is another. We want to try it and if it works out we can turn our mexican waterers onto it so they don't have to
stand there with a hose all day, they have better things to do too.
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Pescador
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3587
Registered: 10-17-2002
Location: Baja California Sur
Member Is Offline
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Shari, if you don't get anybody sooner than Sept. please let me know and I would be happy to set it up for you. With David's knowledge, and my
supervisor ability, and someone else on the shovel, we could whip that baby out in no time.
If the dogs are a serious problem then you may want to go buried PVC and then buried and protected heads to the plant area. If I had it to do over
again, I would put PVC on the main lines and then take off from there with pulpos or octopus. It is really easy to replace 1/4 inch feeder tubes if
they get chewed up. I don't think the dogs in my area chewed it for water but the taste of the plastic. When I changed tubing, part of the problem
disappeared.
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 64854
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline
Mood: Have Baja Fever
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Okay Shari, sure... and once you get the basic system layed out... it is real easy to add more emitters on new plantings. From the back corner of the
beach house (near the washing machine, right?)... a 1/2" poly hose (black in color) can run around the lot, with a side line from a tee in the hose
going to plants next to the house.
Each plant would get 1-3 emitters (depending on the size of the plant). A tree would get 3-6 or more emitters... evenly spaced around the tree, near
it's drip line (below the edge of the leaf canopy, on the ground).
The emitters should be turbulent flow and pressure compensating... like the Agrifim PC+ or Netafim WPC or equivalent. Use 2 GPH for most
applications... 1 GPH on the smallest shrubs... 1/2 GPH only on pots.
For planter beds, vegetable gardens, ground cover, and even around trees use emitterline (dripperline)... a 1/2" hose (brown in color) with a 1/2 GPH
emitter inside the hose, every 12 inches... It works like a soaker line, but provides even water flow throughout the recommended maximum run (about
300 feet)... Typical soaker hoses flow less water the further awy you get from the source, so plants don't grow evenly. Netafim Techline CV is what I
use, but other companies, like Agrifim and Toro Ag and Rain Bird also have Pressure Compensating emitterline.
Be aware that the emitterline hose size and the plain poly hose size may not be the same and have their own fittings available. You may need to make
an adapter up to go from the black poly hose to the brown emitterline.
There also is a 1/4" brown emitterline (1/2 GPH) emitter pre-installed in the tube, every 12"... this is fine for shorter runs (up to 30 feet) and can
be attached to the 1/2" black poly with a 1/4" barb connector (coupling) inserted into a hole you punch into the poly hose. The end of the 1/4" soaker
tube is closed off with a 1/4" tube plug, also called a 'goof plug'.
Avoid micro sprays, foggers, and running 1/4" tube to remote drip emitters to have the least amount of problems later.
Micro sprays clog and break easily, foggers are nice for misting hanging plants, but will clog as they require a tiny hole to make the fine mist. 1/4"
tubes can get raked up by gardeners then cut... 1/2" hose with the emitters directly attched (or emitterline) is heavier and are less likely to wander
away from what they are supposed to irrigate. Staking down the hose will insure it stays put, as well.
Now, any questions?... Just ask!
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 64854
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline
Mood: Have Baja Fever
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That's great Pescador... I see we posted about the same time!
Okay... yes PVC (sch. 40) can be used to go from the valve to where the plantings begin... then convert to poly or emitterline. However, the distances
at the beach house are not so great... So, to protect from dogs or coyotes, BURY the lines and stake them down ever 5-10'.
The good emitters and emitterline (Techline CV) has check valves built in so dirty water will not siphon back into the lines after the system is
turned off. Use an anti-siphon control valve at the start and be sure it is 1 ft. above ground level... have Juan make a box to put over the valve to
keep the sun and dogs off of it.
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shari
Select Nomad
Posts: 13048
Registered: 3-10-2006
Location: bahia asuncion, baja sur
Member Is Offline
Mood: there is no reality except the one contained within us "Herman Hesse"
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Questions? It's all Greek to me David...sounds pretty complicated for my simple little brain. Thanks Pescador...nothin moves too fast in these
parts....we'll see what happens.
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