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motoged
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6481
Registered: 7-31-2006
Location: Kamloops, BC
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Mood: Gettin' Better
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Anybody run a Geiger counter over this thread?
Don't believe everything you think....
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Barry A.
Select Nomad
Posts: 10007
Registered: 11-30-2003
Location: Redding, Northern CA
Member Is Offline
Mood: optimistic
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| Quote: | Originally posted by motoged
Anybody run a Geiger counter over this thread? |
---------my lips are tingling a little, and my tongue is swelling up too?!?!?!?!?!?!
Barry
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 64854
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline
Mood: Have Baja Fever
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Sweetwater, lighten up. Nobody ever said blowing up a city was okay. One of your guys ordered it, it worked, the war ended and Japan became an
economic powerhouse since and builds great 4WD trucks!
If you can't handle good news about radiation or that sea levels are basically unchanged from when I was a kid in the 60's, then maybe it's time for a
Baja trip report?
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rts551
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6699
Registered: 9-5-2003
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| Quote: | Originally posted by David K
Sweetwater, lighten up. Nobody ever said blowing up a city was okay. One of your guys ordered it, it worked, the war ended and Japan became an
economic powerhouse since and builds great 4WD trucks!
If you can't handle good news about radiation or that sea levels are basically unchanged from when I was a kid in the 60's, then maybe it's time for a
Baja trip report?
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where did you get four data? Even the most ardent of conservatives now admit the sea levels are rising.
Current sea level rise is about 3 mm/year worldwide. According to the US National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA), "this is a
significantly larger rate than the sea-level rise averaged over the last several thousand years", and the rate may be increasing.[2] Sea level rises
can considerably influence human populations in coastal and island regions[3] and natural environments like marine ecosystems.[4]
According to NOAA
Between 1870 and 2004, global average sea levels rose a total of 195 mm (7.7 in), and 1.46 mm (0.057 in) per year.[5] From 1950 to 2009, measurements
show an average annual rise in sea level of 1.7 ± 0.3 mm per year, with satellite data showing a rise of 3.3 ± 0.4 mm per year from 1993 to 2009,[6] a
faster rate of increase than previously estimated.[7] It is unclear whether the increased rate reflects an increase in the underlying long-term
trend.[8]
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Kgryfon
Senior Nomad
Posts: 624
Registered: 1-27-2009
Location: East Bay, CA
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | 3) Why are you ignoring the ORIGINAL POST totally, which is what I responded to? Go to the top of this thread on page 1 and see the post was no
radiation in seaweed. By observation of the evidence, the radiation that was freaking some out vanished from the seaweed.
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OP here. I think they were not saying the the radiation in the Pacific kelp beds vanished, rather they were saying that it had dissipated in
the ocean waters before it got here; therefore there has been no significant increase in the amount of radiation on the Pacific coast despite the fact
that ocean currents bearing ***ushima-contaminated waters have arrived and been present for some time now.
Another article from Forbes on this topic, and an excerpt:
"Let me be really, really clear – there is no concern whatsoever that radioactivity from ***ushima could ever harm America."
http://www.forbes.com/sites/jamesconca/2014/03/16/radioactiv...
A bit different scenario from bombed cities in Japan because we know the radiation "made it there" in those instances. Whether or not the bombed
cities still contain high levels of radiation, and why or why not, I'll let you guys continue to debate 
[Edited on 5-30-2014 by Kgryfon]
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Skipjack Joe
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8084
Registered: 7-12-2004
Location: Bahia Asuncion
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I read recently an impact that the ***ushima earthquake had on the US that is not widely known. Invasive species.
It turns out that the tidal wave dumped a lot of flotsam(?) into the water that eventually floated to North America with species of marine
invertebrates that are local to the water of Japan. Large cargo containers and boats that never sank. The problem is that we are spending a great deal
of money to stop these new arrivals from being established and wiping out our local species.
Below is a floating dock that arrived from Japan. There are some cool looking barnacles.
[Edited on 6-6-2014 by BajaNomad]
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wessongroup
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 21152
Registered: 8-9-2009
Location: Mission Viejo
Member Is Offline
Mood: Suicide Hot line ... please hold
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Thanks ...good find
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monoloco
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6667
Registered: 7-13-2009
Location: Pescadero BCS
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| Quote: | Originally posted by danaeb
| Quote: | Originally posted by rts551
| Quote: | Originally posted by David K
If you can't handle good news about radiation or that sea levels are basically unchanged from when I was a kid in the 60's, then maybe it's time for a
Baja trip report?
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where did you get four data? Even the most ardent of conservatives now admit the sea levels are rising.
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I think David gets this data from his home experiment where he fills a glass with water and ice and waits to see if the level rises.
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I just spent a few days with the NOAA crew that maintains the equipment that monitors sea levels,
interestingly, the head scientist explained how it's impossible to determine sea level by using land as a reference because land is not static.
Baranof Island, where I'm currently staying, is rising about 12 mm a year due to melting glaciers applying less weight to the land, which to the
casual observer here, would give the illusion that sea levels are dropping. NOAA maintains a network of highly accurate pressure based sensors to
determine sea levels and provide tsunami data.
"The future ain't what it used to be"
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Barry A.
Select Nomad
Posts: 10007
Registered: 11-30-2003
Location: Redding, Northern CA
Member Is Offline
Mood: optimistic
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That is great info, Mono, because we tend to forget the tectonics. This is especially true on our Pacific Rim as we are so tectonically active. Lets
hope that our coasts heave up instead of just slipping sideways all the time, to keep up with these projected on-going sea-level rises. Might
happen!!!
On the other hand, the Sea of Cortez base is probably falling since it appears to occupy a Graben-like structure and subsiding as the peninsula slides
NNW and up and away from the Continent. Shell Island needs to catch more sand to keep up and build up, I guess. With the Colorado River being long
cut off, and thereby it's load of sand and mud not replenishing the Gulf, that's not likely.
We are rocking and rolling, that is for sure. The Coasts have always made me a teensy nervous to live on, mostly because the ocean and the land
beneath it is so unstable, in all respects.
These are the worries of a Geographer---------
Barry
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Skipjack Joe
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8084
Registered: 7-12-2004
Location: Bahia Asuncion
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Glacial isostatic adjustment is a slow process. The mantle isn't that fluid. Baranoff isn't rising from the current deglaciation but from the
deglaciation that started after the last ice age, 20,000 years ago.
At that time you could walk from Siberia to North America. If the land adjustments would had been short term then the continents should have sunk from
the additional weight and the water level maintained. But this did not happen. As the ice thickened the sea levels dropped. The aborigines in
australia were populated by descendents from africa when land masses were almost connected. Our Central Valley was underwater. Why didn't the
continents bob up?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post-glacial_rebound
Man made global warming is not an issue in geological time. It's an issue in human historic time. The living system has evolved to adjust to slow
changes on this planet. Fast changes lead to species eradication.
All the people on this board that continue to defend global warming play this game - providing long term changes as evidence that what we are now
experiencing is normal. I hope that intelligent nomads can see through this for what it is - smoke.
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 64854
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline
Mood: Have Baja Fever
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I spent the first 7 years of my life in Del Mar, CA (1957-1964). Our home was on the beach... the most northern home in Del Mar, in fact. I think our
home address was 3010 Sandy Lane. After we moved away, the old beach house was replaced by a giant stucco thing (I think my mom called it). Lot's of
fun memories living on the beach...
Lucille Ball and Desi Arnaz spent their summers in our home (we moved out for 3 months each summer to rent it to them). It was a deal that the
previous owners had made with them and my parents continued it until 'Lucy' and 'Ricky' divorced... and then rented to Desi one more summer after.
Here is the point of this history... Sandy Lane was only a few feet higher than high tide when I lived there and over 50 years later, it STILL is a
few feet higher. The San Dieguito River meets the sea just north of our old house spot. The horses from the Del Mar race track (just on the other side
of 101 and the train tracks, used to be walked in the sea water there.
I mention a San Diego point of reference, which is a paved street and not getting higher like how sand bars moves.
Some of you like to discard my Baja observations of salt flats that get flooded by high lunar tides... 40 years ago.. and still do... IF the seal
levels were a threat... wouldn't they be flooded by all high tides, or underwater all the time, instead of just the lunar highs?
Have a nice day... the sky is not falling (yet)... and higher taxes do not change climate!
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Kgryfon
Senior Nomad
Posts: 624
Registered: 1-27-2009
Location: East Bay, CA
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Skipjack Joe
I read recently an impact that the ***ushima earthquake had on the US that is not widely known. Invasive species.
It turns out that the tidal wave dumped a lot of flotsam(?) into the water that eventually floated to North America with species of marine
invertebrates that are local to the water of Japan. Large cargo containers and boats that never sank. The problem is that we are spending a great deal
of money to stop these new arrivals from being established and wiping out our local species.
Below is a floating dock that arrived from Japan. There are some cool looking barnacles. |
Interesting, Skipjack. This could be a real problem, very quickly.
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Barry A.
Select Nomad
Posts: 10007
Registered: 11-30-2003
Location: Redding, Northern CA
Member Is Offline
Mood: optimistic
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Skipjack Joe
Glacial isostatic adjustment is a slow process. The mantle isn't that fluid. Baranoff isn't rising from the current deglaciation but from the
deglaciation that started after the last ice age, 20,000 years ago.
At that time you could walk from Siberia to North America. If the land adjustments would had been short term then the continents should have sunk from
the additional weight and the water level maintained. But this did not happen. As the ice thickened the sea levels dropped. The aborigines in
australia were populated by descendents from africa when land masses were almost connected. Our Central Valley was underwater. Why didn't the
continents bob up?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post-glacial_rebound
Man made global warming is not an issue in geological time. It's an issue in human historic time. The living system has evolved to adjust to slow
changes on this planet. Fast changes lead to species eradication.
All the people on this board that continue to defend global warming play this game - providing long term changes as evidence that what we are now
experiencing is normal. I hope that intelligent nomads can see through this for what it is - smoke. |
Righttttttt----------and you use insults to convince us all-------yeah, that will work. What folly!!!
Barry
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Skipjack Joe
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8084
Registered: 7-12-2004
Location: Bahia Asuncion
Member Is Offline
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Barry,
Please respond to content and not to civility or lack of it. It really is very secondary. If you disagree with information please state where it is
wrong.
Virtually every disagreement you've had on this thread has to do with delivery, how you feel things should be said.
And yes, I do believe that most of the misinformative reasoning that is supposed to influence the reader is the inappropriate comparison of events
occurring on a geologic time scale to the recent events (since the industrial age). And yes, I hope nomads can and do recognize this when they see it.
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Barry A.
Select Nomad
Posts: 10007
Registered: 11-30-2003
Location: Redding, Northern CA
Member Is Offline
Mood: optimistic
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Skipjack Joe
Barry,
Please respond to content and not to civility or lack of it. It really is very secondary. If you disagree with information please state where it is
wrong.
Virtually every disagreement you've had on this thread has to do with delivery, how you feel things should be said.
And yes, I do believe that most of the misinformative reasoning that is supposed to influence the reader is the inappropriate comparison of events
occurring on a geologic time scale to the recent events (since the industrial age). And yes, I hope nomads can and do recognize this when they see it.
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You know, Skipjack, I often agree with you and the facts you present, but I associate insults and personal attacks as a form of bullying, and that
almost never produces anything other than resentment and anger and a feeling of humiliation in others. Consequently, there goes any type of rational
thinking and influencing of others. We have only raw emotion. Just my (and others) theory, of course.
I am not trying to convince you of anything tangible. I am simply saying that I am not convinced, based on what I have heard and read, of what you
are convinced of. I want it clear that much of the scientific studies are at least partially flawed, not necessarily caste-in-stone, otherwise the
research would just stop-----problem solved-------we now know the truth. There is a lot of science out there that comes to different
conclusions----------we (they) are still studying the situation. And in addition, fighting Global Warming or Climate Change may be just a hopeless
and destructive endeavor taking reality into consideration.
I have always thought that lay-opinions are interesting at the least, and worth considering-------even maybe leading to something that makes sense on
some basic level. I certainly don't think that lay-opinion should be shouted down------that guarantees that your message will not get thru--------I
speak from experience.
After spending 13 years in the CA desert trying to convince 10's of thousands of Off-Roaders that what the BLM was trying to do was wise and good for
the desert, I learned that looking down on them and insulting them was NOT THE ANSWER, and in fact they had some very valid ideas and thoughts that we
(BLM) had not considered, and that we incorporated into our final plans..
This general vicious head-butting & arrogance on both sides has GOT to stop!!! or at least be managed by all of us as individuals lest we
accomplish nothing, or worse cause a mini-revolution.
Barry
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SFandH
Elite Nomad
Posts: 7084
Registered: 8-5-2011
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Barry A.
There is a lot of science out there that comes to different conclusions |
Conclusions about what? Enlighten me, please provide links after you specify what you're talking about..
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Barry A.
Select Nomad
Posts: 10007
Registered: 11-30-2003
Location: Redding, Northern CA
Member Is Offline
Mood: optimistic
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| Quote: | Originally posted by SFandH
| Quote: | Originally posted by Barry A.
There is a lot of science out there that comes to different conclusions |
Conclusions about what? Enlighten me, please provide links after you specify what you're talking about.. |
The "conclusion" that Man is causing Climate Change. Many Climatologists and Meteorologists simply are not buying that, and think the studies are
flawed, incomplete, and miss-stated, have an agenda, but I admit the majority do buy into Man-caused Climate Change..
If you would like to research that, then have at it. I already have to my satisfaction, but do not have the "links" at my fingertips. I constantly
hear learned folks interviewed by the Media refuting the generally excepted "Man-caused Climate Change" theory, which causes me to be skeptical.
My constant (often repeated on NOMADS by me) over-riding issue is that it is not worth disrupting and partially destroying the World economy by
passing draconian laws in the USA which have the possibility of changing the projected possible outcome by only 1 to 3% at best even if the entire
human population cooperated, which they won't.
Barry
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Mexitron
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3397
Registered: 9-21-2003
Location: Fort Worth, Texas
Member Is Offline
Mood: Happy!
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Well I do see that the American Association of Petroleum Geologists has changed their 2007 opinion that man is not altering the climate to the
statement that they now have no opinion on the matter since they are not climate scientists
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Skipjack Joe
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8084
Registered: 7-12-2004
Location: Bahia Asuncion
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1-3%?
Perhaps by land mass. But most of the population centers are on the coast: Seattle, Boston, NYC. Our Central Valley would once again become an inland
sea.
Here is an interactive map to examine the changes on all the continents if all the ice melted (216' rise in sea level).
http://ngm.nationalgeographic.com/2013/09/rising-seas/if-ice...
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rts551
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6699
Registered: 9-5-2003
Member Is Offline
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Barry...the people that quote rising ocean waters, changing climate, and man altering pollution are quoting studies...Please do the same and quit
telling people to find there own citations. I would like to see reputable and factual studies that say this is not happening.
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