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Skipjack Joe
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Likely radiation related cancer to the cast and crew of the movie "The Conqueror" filmed near a nuclear test site in Utah -
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Conqueror_%28film%29
The exterior scenes were shot on location near St. George, Utah, 137 miles (220 km) downwind of the United States government's Nevada National
Security Site. In 1953, extensive above-ground nuclear weapons testing occurred at the test site as part of Operation Upshot-Knothole. The cast and
crew spent many difficult weeks on location, and in addition Hughes later shipped 60 tons of dirt back to Hollywood in order to match the Utah terrain
and lend verisimilitude to studio re-shoots.[5] The filmmakers knew about the nuclear tests[5] but the federal government reassured residents that the
tests caused no hazard to public health.[12]
Director Dick Powell died of cancer in January 1963, seven years after the film's release. Pedro Armendáriz was diagnosed with kidney cancer in 1960,
and committed suicide in 1963 after he learned his condition had become terminal. Hayward, Wayne, and Moorehead all died of cancer in the 1970s. Cast
member actor John Hoyt died of lung cancer in 1991. Skeptics point to other factors such as the wide use of tobacco — Wayne and Moorehead in
particular were heavy smokers. The cast and crew totaled 220 people. By 1981, 91 of them had developed some form of cancer and 46 had died of the
disease. Several of Wayne and Hayward's relatives also had cancer scares as well after visiting the set. Michael Wayne developed skin cancer, his
brother Patrick had a benign tumor removed from his breast and Hayward's son Tim Barker had a benign tumor removed from his mouth. [12][13]
Dr. Robert Pendleton, professor of biology at the University of Utah, stated, "With these numbers, this case could qualify as an epidemic. The
connection between fallout radiation and cancer in individual cases has been practically impossible to prove conclusively. But in a group this size
you'd expect only 30-some cancers to develop. With 91, I think the tie-in to their exposure on the set of The Conqueror would hold up in a court of
law." Indeed, several cast and crew members, as well as relatives of those who died, considered suing the government for negligence, claiming it knew
more about the hazards in the area than it let on.[12][14]
This is in regards to the suggestion of how well things went for Hiroshima and Nagasaki.
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tripledigitken
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4848
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So what's new with the kelp?
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Barry A.
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Location: Redding, Northern CA
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Mood: optimistic
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| Quote: | Originally posted by tripledigitken
So what's new with the kelp? |
 A good
point. Nothing, apparently, which is why this thread has taken another tact, but still related to the original topic, in my view.
Barry
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Sweetwater
Senior Nomad
Posts: 915
Registered: 11-26-2010
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Mood: chilly today hot tomale
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| Quote: | Originally posted by David K
Some years the glaciers shrink and some they get bigger... so what is new and different here? What happens in our tiny time on this planet is in no
way an accurate measure of what is 'normal', even if there is such a thing.
Some of us want to believe people are bad and foreign here, and some of us know that people are as natural a part of this planet as orcas and puffins.
Either way, the earth will continue to cool or warm, as it has for millions of years before man and will after man.
What is it that you want to argue about, and why?... To what end? Does it make us better friends or kinder Nomads? Is it not enough to just post news
and ponder the possibilities?
There are no absolutes in natural science. Science is the continuous gathering of data by observation. In my lifetime, I have observed sea levels at
many places over a period of 40-50 years. The levels are unchanged or so tiny as to not be noticeable when compared to the daily changes caused by
tidal action. There is no cause for panic.
We can adapt to the small changes in climate, or not... Just don't ask your neighbors to foot the bill if you agree with an ex-politician turned
environmentalist who still flies on private jets and has mansions with heating and air conditioning bills that would take a dozen or more typical
homes to equal. |
Hey DK..........the issue is pumping radiation into our biosphere, specifically the unnatural products of nuclear reactors which didn't exist on our
planet until we created them......and now they're running into our Pacific Ocean which has currents that bring them right to the front door of our
fisheries and cities. And you are shouting about what? Are you really stupid or just blind to facts? And all this so you can run your electric Toyota
to go live the high life.......
Everbody\'s preachin\' at me that we all wanna git to heaven, trouble is, nobody wants to die to git there.-BB King
Reality is what does not go away when you stop believing in it. -Philip K Dick
Nothing is worse than active ignorance. Johann Wolfgang von Goethe(1749-1832, German writer, artist and politician)
When choosing between two evils, I always like to try the one I\'ve never tried before. - Mae West
Experience is what keeps a man who makes the same mistake twice from admitting it the third time around.
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SFandH
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I use the Google news portal and have it customized to my interests. I set up a news alert for ***ushima when it happened. What that means is that
news articles about ***ushima take up a section of my news homepage, which I look at everyday.
From what I've read, the radiation threat that should be of the most concern to people on the U.S. west coast is the danger of eating contaminated
fish that have migrated here from the ***ushima region. They are finding fish on the west coast containing Cs-137. That's a common fission fragment
that is easy to detect by gamma spectrometers. The amounts of Cs-137 being detected are very small. The danger is directly proportional to the amount.
Marine biologists interested in migratory patterns are actually pretty excited about this because now when the find a fish with Cs-137, they know it
migrated here from the ***ushima region.
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BajaGringo
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| Quote: | Originally posted by SFandH
...Marine biologists interested in migratory patterns are actually pretty excited about this because now when the find a fish with Cs-137, they know
it migrated here from the ***ushima region. |
Radioactive tracers in our food supply...
Gee whiz, that would get me excited too!!!
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SFandH
Elite Nomad
Posts: 7084
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| Quote: | Originally posted by BajaGringo
| Quote: | Originally posted by SFandH
...Marine biologists interested in migratory patterns are actually pretty excited about this because now when the find a fish with Cs-137, they know
it migrated here from the ***ushima region. |
Radioactive tracers in our food supply...
Gee whiz, that would get me excited too!!! |
You got it!
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Skipjack Joe
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| Quote: | Originally posted by tripledigitken
So what's new with the kelp?
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Thanks for the kelp, Ken. We needed that. <groan>
Personally when people talk about economics and the related politics my eyes glaze over and I start yawning. Is there anything more boring? I find
that politics and their related view on economics are created very early in life, by parents and close friends and seldom change as a man grows up.
People just expound what they were raised to believe, over and over. It's really uninteresting. No matter what argument one side or the other
presents, nothing changes. It's just such a waste of time.
Science, on the other hand, is fascinating(I am in complete agreement on that with Ken Bondy). It's for this reason that suggesting that scientific
truth should somehow be driven by economics that I find particularly unpalatable. The idea that man made global warming should be accepted or denied
based upon it's cost really sits bad with me, Barry. It's just so ... dishonest.
[Edited on 6-6-2014 by Skipjack Joe]
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wessongroup
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Mood: Suicide Hot line ... please hold
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Strange what "Kelp" does to folks ...
Say, can ya smoke it .... just asking
Cuz, if just talking about the plant, results in this much mental activity ... WOW 
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Ateo
Elite Nomad
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We need magic mushrooms. That'll fix everything. 
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wessongroup
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This would appear to be visual evidence ... for some
Rising sea levels destroy World War II graves in Marshall Islands
Rising sea levels destroy World War II graves in Marshall Islands. For many people this scenario is very scary as environmentalists present ever
difficult picture of future.
http://nvonews.com/rising-sea-levels-destroy-world-war-ii-gr...
Some may wish to put things on the porch
this would be an example of human impact on the environment in a global manner negatively and is related to global warming ... human impact has many
forms ... radiation included .. along with many other chemical substances
[Edited on 6-8-2014 by wessongroup]
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Skipjack Joe
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Record of sea levels and project sea levels:
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Barry A.
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Location: Redding, Northern CA
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| Quote: | Originally posted by wessongroup
This would appear to be visual evidence ... for some
Rising sea levels destroy World War II graves in Marshall Islands
Rising sea levels destroy World War II graves in Marshall Islands. For many people this scenario is very scary as environmentalists present ever
difficult picture of future.
http://nvonews.com/rising-sea-levels-destroy-world-war-ii-gr...
Some may wish to put things on the porch
this would be an example of human impact on the environment in a global manner negatively and is related to global warming ... human impact has many
forms ... radiation included .. along with many other chemical substances
[Edited on 6-8-2014 by wessongroup] |
The "rest of the story"???
What this article fails to mention is that there is strong "scientific" evidence that the Marshall Islands, as well as many other coral/limestone
atolls, may be subject to subsidence. In an environment like the Marshalls where the highest point in the entire chain of islands is only 32 feet,
this is highly probable. Also, the coral reefs associated with the islands go down to depths where it is impossible for coral to grow, yet there they
are------a strong indicator of subsidence. (but also rising ocean levels). There are 5 other "indicators" that subsidence is happening in the
Marshall's.
(source: My head, plus Lobecks "Geomorphology")
Barry
[Edited on 6-8-2014 by Barry A.]
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rts551
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6699
Registered: 9-5-2003
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Barry A.
| Quote: | Originally posted by wessongroup
This would appear to be visual evidence ... for some
Rising sea levels destroy World War II graves in Marshall Islands
Rising sea levels destroy World War II graves in Marshall Islands. For many people this scenario is very scary as environmentalists present ever
difficult picture of future.
http://nvonews.com/rising-sea-levels-destroy-world-war-ii-gr...
Some may wish to put things on the porch
this would be an example of human impact on the environment in a global manner negatively and is related to global warming ... human impact has many
forms ... radiation included .. along with many other chemical substances
[Edited on 6-8-2014 by wessongroup] |
The "rest of the story"???
What this article fails to mention is that there is strong "scientific" evidence that the Marshall Islands, as well as many other coral/limestone
atolls, may be subject to subsidence. In an environment like the Marshalls where the highest point in the entire chain of islands is only 32 feet,
this is highly probable. Also, the coral reefs associated with the islands go down to depths where it is impossible for coral to grow, yet there they
are------a strong indicator of subsidence. (but also rising ocean levels). There are 5 other "indicators" that subsidence is happening in the
Marshall's.
(source: My head, plus Lobecks "Geomorphology")
Barry
[Edited on 6-8-2014 by Barry A.] |
Scientific?? Are you sure your head qualifies? how long did iit take to find a book on landscapes written in 1939 to support your conclusions?
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Barry A.
Select Nomad
Posts: 10007
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Location: Redding, Northern CA
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Mood: optimistic
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| Quote: | Originally posted by rts551
| Quote: | Originally posted by Barry A.
| Quote: | Originally posted by wessongroup
This would appear to be visual evidence ... for some
Rising sea levels destroy World War II graves in Marshall Islands
Rising sea levels destroy World War II graves in Marshall Islands. For many people this scenario is very scary as environmentalists present ever
difficult picture of future.
http://nvonews.com/rising-sea-levels-destroy-world-war-ii-gr...
Some may wish to put things on the porch
this would be an example of human impact on the environment in a global manner negatively and is related to global warming ... human impact has many
forms ... radiation included .. along with many other chemical substances
[Edited on 6-8-2014 by wessongroup] |
The "rest of the story"???
What this article fails to mention is that there is strong "scientific" evidence that the Marshall Islands, as well as many other coral/limestone
atolls, may be subject to subsidence. In an environment like the Marshalls where the highest point in the entire chain of islands is only 32 feet,
this is highly probable. Also, the coral reefs associated with the islands go down to depths where it is impossible for coral to grow, yet there they
are------a strong indicator of subsidence. (but also rising ocean levels). There are 5 other "indicators" that subsidence is happening in the
Marshall's.
(source: My head, plus Lobecks "Geomorphology")
Barry
[Edited on 6-8-2014 by Barry A.] |
Scientific?? Are you sure your head qualifies? how long did iit take to find a book on landscapes written in 1939 to support your conclusions?
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-----about 5 seconds to pull the book off my shelf after finding NOTHING about it on the net.
Lobecks "Geomorphology" is STILL THE EXCEPTED by many best textbook written on the subject. As I have said, it is mostly all theory, which makes me
still skeptical as to what is the truth about man-caused "Global Warming" and it's projected (by some) outcome? I have no doubt about "Climate
change" however------it's happening, and probably always will. Live with it.
My "head" comment was made in jest---------if we can't laugh about stuff, then we are all lost and just crazy, IMO.
If you and others are willing/anxious to start spending other peoples money (trillions) on attempting off-setting Global Warming by maybe 3% max.,
then why not trillions spent on anti-meteorite technology, or more disease prevention/curing, or moving people away from the Oceans, or away from
volcanoes and faults, or safer highways/vehicles, etc. etc. etc.-------all are real and known problems?
If you feel THAT strongly about it--------YOU can take the initiative and MOVE yourself to where you think you might be safer, but don't ask me to pay
for it until you can convince me it is the right thing to do.
Barry
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rts551
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6699
Registered: 9-5-2003
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Barry A.
| Quote: | Originally posted by rts551
| Quote: | Originally posted by Barry A.
| Quote: | Originally posted by wessongroup
This would appear to be visual evidence ... for some
Rising sea levels destroy World War II graves in Marshall Islands
Rising sea levels destroy World War II graves in Marshall Islands. For many people this scenario is very scary as environmentalists present ever
difficult picture of future.
http://nvonews.com/rising-sea-levels-destroy-world-war-ii-gr...
Some may wish to put things on the porch
this would be an example of human impact on the environment in a global manner negatively and is related to global warming ... human impact has many
forms ... radiation included .. along with many other chemical substances
[Edited on 6-8-2014 by wessongroup] |
The "rest of the story"???
What this article fails to mention is that there is strong "scientific" evidence that the Marshall Islands, as well as many other coral/limestone
atolls, may be subject to subsidence. In an environment like the Marshalls where the highest point in the entire chain of islands is only 32 feet,
this is highly probable. Also, the coral reefs associated with the islands go down to depths where it is impossible for coral to grow, yet there they
are------a strong indicator of subsidence. (but also rising ocean levels). There are 5 other "indicators" that subsidence is happening in the
Marshall's.
(source: My head, plus Lobecks "Geomorphology")
Barry
[Edited on 6-8-2014 by Barry A.] |
Scientific?? Are you sure your head qualifies? how long did iit take to find a book on landscapes written in 1939 to support your conclusions?
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-----about 5 seconds to pull the book off my shelf after finding NOTHING about it on the net.
Lobecks "Geomorphology" is STILL THE EXCEPTED by many best textbook written on the subject. As I have said, it is mostly all theory, which makes me
still skeptical as to what is the truth about man-caused "Global Warming" and it's projected (by some) outcome? I have no doubt about "Climate
change" however------it's happening, and probably always will. Live with it.
My "head" comment was made in jest---------if we can't laugh about stuff, then we are all lost and just crazy, IMO.
If you and others are willing/anxious to start spending other peoples money (trillions) on attempting off-setting Global Warming by maybe 3% max.,
then why not trillions spent on anti-meteorite technology, or more disease prevention/curing, or moving people away from the Oceans, or away from
volcanoes and faults, or safer highways/vehicles, etc. etc. etc.-------all are real and known problems?
If you feel THAT strongly about it--------YOU can take the initiative and MOVE yourself to where you think you might be safer, but don't ask me to pay
for it until you can convince me it is the right thing to do.
Barry |
I would have EXCEPTED it as well. more disease prevention/safer highways and vehicles. Yes. glad you are coming along Barry.. Finally...... oh,
only if its not your dollar. Bet you just hated that there was a cure for polio, or that a man was sent to the moon, huh?
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Skipjack Joe
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Posts: 8084
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You need to be careful with pulling old textbooks off the shelf like that. Things change too fast. I do the same, with books written in the late 60's
- early 70's. One of the greater pleasures of having a child in school is that you need to reread all that information again. It's amazing how much
more they're taught. Oh yes, and it's more fun the 2nd time around (for the parent).
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 64854
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
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Mood: Have Baja Fever
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| Quote: | Originally posted by wessongroup
This would appear to be visual evidence ... for some
Rising sea levels destroy World War II graves in Marshall Islands
Rising sea levels destroy World War II graves in Marshall Islands. For many people this scenario is very scary as environmentalists present ever
difficult picture of future.
http://nvonews.com/rising-sea-levels-destroy-world-war-ii-gr...
Some may wish to put things on the porch
this would be an example of human impact on the environment in a global manner negatively and is related to global warming ... human impact has many
forms ... radiation included .. along with many other chemical substances
[Edited on 6-8-2014 by wessongroup] |
Sea level is a base point because it is fairly consistent within the range of normal tidal change. So the sea level in Del Mar, California and the sea
level in the Marshall Islands is the same level.
How is it graves are going underwater in these islands but city streets in Del Mar are still the same height above sea level after the same time
period? If the sea level has not raised several feet, then the OBVIOUS conclusion to a scientific mind is the island has dropped in elevation. In fact
many Pacific islands are dropping as coral degrades and volcanic soil erodes.
Please think about these things folks before you blindly accept the media's 'science' as being fact. 
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wessongroup
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 21152
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Yep, that subsidence is what it is ... happening in AK too along with the Solomon Island's down in the South Pacific ... there are numerous examples
which are NOT related to subsidence ...
Climate-Induced
Displacement of Alaska
Native Communities
http://www.brookings.edu/~/media/research/files/papers/2013/...
Displacement of the people of the Solomon Islands
http://www1.american.edu/ted/ice/solomon-sealevel.htm
Additionally the "root" cause is NOT subsidence ... rather increase levels of ocean waters due to "ice melting" ... which is documented and supported
by "current" science
thus far, there are three examples of raising sea levels ... in some cases enough to where the population has to be "moved"
All three examples are not related to subsidence, rather Global Warming
Sorry I don't buy the PC term which has developed a political following ... for obvious reasons
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rts551
Elite Nomad
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http://www.sdfoundation.org/TSDFProjects/BlaskerRoseMiahforEnvironment/PublishedBlaskerResearch/SeaLevelRiseMaps.aspx
Just why is it that I put more credence in a Scripps Institution of Oceanograph Study and conclusion, than an unemployed drip installer's
conclusion. Maybe if you published your study David?
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