| Pages:
1
..
7
8
9
10
11
12 |
oldhippie
Banned
Posts: 742
Registered: 6-25-2006
Member Is Offline
Mood: muted
|
|
OK, back to amnesty.
Oldhippie's plan is taking shape:
1. We need to stop breaking up families. Deporting an illegal mother or father who have to leave the rest of the legal family behind because they have
no place for them in the other country, let alone themselves, is just plain ugly. It's happening, SHAME on America.
2. We need to stop giving automatic citizenship to childern born in this country to parents who are here illegally. Why do we do that? It doesn't make
any sense at all. The fact that we do that is why people come here illegally, have kids, and strain the welfare system.
3. We need to give amnesty to the entire family (parents and childern only) if one of them is here legally, either by birth or legal immigration, and
they can prove they are self sufficient and law abiding.
4. We should give amnesty to all elderly people who have no chance of adjusting to a new life if deported. Probably want to include the sick and
disabled in that category. I can't imagine deporting someone truly suffering from cancer or some such disease and telling them good luck.
5. Single, healthy people here illegally and young and healthy enough to work should be deported, if you can find them.
As soon as the US puts into place a program to deport people they will go into hiding in the dark. It will be a big cat and mouse game that I
personally believe will never work even after a tremendous amount of resources has been spent.
It's better to shine the light of legality and deal with the problem in a humane way.
Those of you who think we can round up 12 million people and deport them are out of your minds.
|
|
|
oldhippie
Banned
Posts: 742
Registered: 6-25-2006
Member Is Offline
Mood: muted
|
|
It's odd, I just reasoned from a humane point of view that we should deport people young and healthy enough to work. They're the ones we need to stay.
Hmmmmm
|
|
|
Mexitron
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3397
Registered: 9-21-2003
Location: Fort Worth, Texas
Member Is Offline
Mood: Happy!
|
|
Es el verdad Don Gorge.
Same for me with my landscaping business in California. There just wasn't anyone else to do the work. My guys all paid their taxes too...if any of
them were illegal they won't get their social security back--a net positive for US citizens. I say "if" they were illegal because the government
never said anything otherwise and gladly accepted their tax money.
|
|
|
DENNIS
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 29510
Registered: 9-2-2006
Location: Punta Banda
Member Is Offline
|
|
Seems nobody here wants to distinguish between illegal and legal workforce. The issue now is legality of entry, not anti-immigration. Of course we
need an immigrant work force. A legal immigrant work force.
Oldhippie ..... You didn't even mention the border problem. Don't you think the open border has anything to do with the problems we have today?
Or, should we just turn a blind eye to our border, as our government has done, and accomodate everyone who has the stamina to walk across?
If that's the case, I'll walk across too. It would be a lot easier than sitting in a line, choking on exaust fumes while waiting to be humiliated
at the gate.
Unfortunatly for me, a US citizen in good standing, if I were caught doing that, I would be in jail and my life would be ruined.
Amnesty is, or was the issue here. Legal immigrants don't need amnesty. Control the border and nobody will need amnesty.
|
|
|
Cypress
Elite Nomad
Posts: 7641
Registered: 3-12-2006
Location: on the bayou
Member Is Offline
Mood: undecided
|
|
 Yep DENNIS! Somehow the term "illegal" has gotten lost in the
shuffle.
|
|
|
oldhippie
Banned
Posts: 742
Registered: 6-25-2006
Member Is Offline
Mood: muted
|
|
Dennis,
I was addressing the problem of those already here. Preventing further illegal immigration is another can of worms.
As far as distinguishing between legal and illegal, as I pointed out in a previous post, from first hand experience, I know that getting into this
country to work legally is almost impossible for blue collar workers because of the complexity and cost. That alone is the biggest reason why there
are so many illegals.
The process itself is a wall to legal immigration. I don't think you would need to build to stop illegal immigration if you make an avenue for legal
immigration.
|
|
|
oldhippie
Banned
Posts: 742
Registered: 6-25-2006
Member Is Offline
Mood: muted
|
|
last sentence should read:
"I don't think you would need to build a wall to stop illegal immigration if you make an avenue for legal immigration."
|
|
|
Bajafun777
Super Nomad
Posts: 1103
Registered: 9-13-2006
Location: Rosarito & California
Member Is Offline
Mood: Enjoying Life with Wife In Mexico, Easy on The Easy
|
|
That' s the whole point behind these people thinking they focus on nonesense instead of the Real issue of "illegal immigration", nobody here has said
one word against "legal immigration" or disliking the Mexican people. Further, this is also towards all those entering illegally from a number of
other Countries. Yes, we have a mess and deals will be made without regard to any of our views on the issue, however "illegal immigration
enforcement" and border security will tighten up for everyones well being. Every day at our Calexico border area people are coming in illegally from
a number of other Countries besides just Mexico and are being caught. Duly noted before hand that the vast majority are from Mexico, go figure!!
Every day illegal immigrants are bringing in numerous pounds of drugs also another illegal offense into our Country are caught. Every day illegal
immigrants are caught stealing vehicles and involved in other crimes are caught. Every day illegal immigrants are caught and found to be wanted by
the Mexican Authorities for commiting crimes of serious nature in Mexico and they are returned. We do not know anything about all the illegal
immigrants coming into this Country folks and they are not all your farm workers, landscrape workers, hotel workers, food workers, or construction
workers. That is why we have a process in place called "LEGAL IMMIGRATION" and if followed the system works for everyones well being. Nobody Legally
Immigrated can be under paid or mistreated in our United States, as they will be legally here and have all the rights of a U.S. citizen it's in our
Constitution. So, Legal Immigration is what makes everyone happy and keeps all of the horror stories you read about from happening. I still believe
Bush will get his "Workers Program," this will allow people from Mexico to cross and work without any problems. He has been gathering support for this
no matter what anyone thinks on this and no matter what politician are saying. So real easy here "Legal Immigration" good and "Illegal Immigration"
bad, wrong, violates the our LAW. Now, is a good time to say "No Fight, Be Happy." Too early to pop a cold one yet, right??
|
|
|
toneart
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4901
Registered: 7-23-2006
Member Is Offline
Mood: Skeptical
|
|
Some really good ideas expressed here! The politicians should read this and then turn it over to the Nomads. We'll draft a consensus bill. We'll get
er done!
Now....go pop a cold one. We can think and drink at the same time.
|
|
|
DENNIS
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 29510
Registered: 9-2-2006
Location: Punta Banda
Member Is Offline
|
|
POP...........................POP.......................... POP
Never too early.
|
|
|
Lee
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3508
Registered: 10-2-2006
Location: High in the Colorado Rockies
Member Is Offline
|
|
What guest workers?
| Quote: | Originally posted by Bajafun777
That' s the whole point behind these people thinking they focus on nonesense instead of the Real issue of "illegal immigration", nobody here has said
one word against "legal immigration" or disliking the Mexican people. |
From Grassfire:
"Aggressive deportation. Immediate investment in aggressive effort to deport the 12 million illegal immigrants currently within our borders – if
you’re caught, you are sent back.
No benefits. Erect a wall of separation between illegal aliens (and their children) and tax-dollar paid benefits reserved for U.S. citizens and
legal aliens. I support H.R. 418 that prohibits illegal aliens from being issued drivers licenses and prevents terrorists from abusing the asylum laws
of the United States."
Deport 12 million Mexicans? Right. Does anyone but this group think this is possible? This reads like fear and scarcity mentality. They're
storm the gates -- quick, get the guns. Rhetoric and nonsense. Not plausible or real. Grandstanding.
Put a wall between the illegals and their children? OK, now they're REALLY grandstanding, AND picking on kids. Maybe the kids should be thrown
in jail too?
Grassfire proposes a WALL OF SHAME. Israel and Germany had walls. Let's see what happens in reality, here.
http://www.grassfire.org/42/petition.asp?PID=13476250&NI...
Guest Workers? Read this:
http://realtime.com/realtime_news/14904312_recruiters_corrup...
People don't need to post here how much they like Mexicans -- but HATE the ''illegals," the "immigrants," the "aliens." Groups like Grassfire spread
fear, hatred and are racially motivated. This group hides behind the ''law,'' and the American flag claiming to protect the American way of life.
The BS just piles higher and higher.
Check out Grassfire News and their "Press Releases":
http://grassfire.org/NewsReleases/mainlink.asp
This stuff reads like a Rush Limbaugh show. Anti-liberal, anti-Democrat, and probably pro-right wing, white conservatives and extremists.
Wouldn't surprise me if the group pretends to be Christians.
That's my opinion and Grassfire supporters are welcome to their opinions. Just don't write how this group has REAL solutions to REAL problems and
really "like" documented Mexicans.
This bunch stands on the other side of the street at demonstrations involving immigration and Mexicans with signs and placards screaming: *******s go
home. You're not wanted here. Take your kids too.
Tell me they're addressing illegals only.
There is more than law issues here. And I KNOW there are class as well as racial issues playing out along with the issue of ''illegal immigration."
[Edited on 5-29-2007 by Lee]
|
|
|
DENNIS
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 29510
Registered: 9-2-2006
Location: Punta Banda
Member Is Offline
|
|
"Aggresive deportation"....... What a freakin joke. Put six ICE officers, making ninety thousand dollars each, on a mission to raid a tire shop
which employs four illegals and, what is the cost? What does it do to reduce the ranks of the illegals when , while they were rounding up four,
four hundred crossed the border?
It's like bailing the Titanic with a shot glass.
|
|
|
MrBillM
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 21656
Registered: 8-20-2003
Location: Out and About
Member Is Offline
Mood: It's a Zip-a-Dee-Doo-Dah Day
|
|
Grass on Fire ?
It's clear that the Lefty Looney Louts are trying to make Grassfire the De Facto Voice against ILLEGAL Immigration, but I doubt that
the Majority of those who oppose ILLEGAL Immigration for a variety of valid reasons have ever even heard of Grassfire. I hadn't
heard of them until the Ramos and Campean Tragedy occurred and I still have no idea (and don't care) what they are promoting.
All of this Rabid BS about about Racism is pretty much immaterial and won't have any affect on the Legislation under consideration. After feeling the
pulse at home, MOST of the Legislators (especially in the House) will vote one way or another depending on their Constituents feedback and that's how
the system should work. Thankfully, this bill is going to see a lot of Sunshine.
|
|
|
amir
Senior Nomad
Posts: 559
Registered: 5-4-2007
Location: Todos Santos, BCS
Member Is Offline
Mood: chiropractic
|
|
HISPANIC LEADERS SPEAK OUT!
"Go back to Boston! Go back to Plymouth Rock, Pilgrims! Get out! We are the future. You are old and tired. Go on. We have beaten you. Leave like
beaten rats. You old white people. It is your duty to die. Through love of having children, we are going to take over."
- Augustin Cebada, Brown Berets
"They're afraid we're going to take over the governmental institutions and other institutions. They're right. We will take them over... We are here
to stay."
- Richard Alatorre, Los Angeles City Council
"The American Southwest seems to be slowly returning to the jurisdiction of Mexico without firing a single shot."
- Excelsior, the national newspaper of Mexico
"We have an aging white America. They are not making babies. They are dying. The explosion is in our population... I love it. They are chitting in
their pants with fear. I love it."
- Professor Jose Angel Gutierrez, University of Texas
"Remember 187 -- proposition to deny taxpayer funds for services to non-citizens -- was the last gasp of white America in California."
- Art Torres, Chairman of the California Democratic Party
"We are politicizing every single one of these new citizens that are becoming citizens of this country... I gotta tell you that a lot of people are
saying, I'm going to go out there and vote because I want to pay them back."
- Gloria Molina, Los Angeles County Supervisor
"California is going to be a Hispanic state. Anyone who doesn't like it should leave."
- Mario Obledo, California Coalition of Hispanic Organizations and California State Secretary of Health, Education and Welfare under Governor Jerry
Brown, also awarded the Presidential Medal of Freedom by President Bill Clinton.
"We are practicing 'La Reconquista' in California."
- Jose Pescador Osuna, Mexican Consul General
"We need to avoid a white backlash by using codes understood by Latinos..."
- Professor Fernando Guerra, Loyola Marymount University
Are these just the words of a few extremists? Consider that we could fill up many pages with such quotes. Also, consider that these are mainstream
Mexican leaders.
|
|
|
DENNIS
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 29510
Registered: 9-2-2006
Location: Punta Banda
Member Is Offline
|
|
| Quote: | Originally posted by amir
Like birth, that can be painful, messy, uncomfortable, and sometimes bloody, human consciousness is going through the process of birth now, and these
issues that cause so much pain to many are part of the birthing process. I hope that when it's all said and done, that we'll be able to enjoy the
healthy baby of true universal brotherhood and forget the pains of the past.
--Amir |
Is this what all your above quotes are about?
|
|
|
amir
Senior Nomad
Posts: 559
Registered: 5-4-2007
Location: Todos Santos, BCS
Member Is Offline
Mood: chiropractic
|
|
| Quote: | Originally posted by DENNIS
| Quote: | Originally posted by amir
Like birth, that can be painful, messy, uncomfortable, and sometimes bloody, human consciousness is going through the process of birth now, and these
issues that cause so much pain to many are part of the birthing process. I hope that when it's all said and done, that we'll be able to enjoy the
healthy baby of true universal brotherhood and forget the pains of the past.
--Amir |
Is this what all your above quotes are about? |
No. My quote above was about hope. The quotes in my last post are about despair. I am just bringing up different sides of this debate. Remember that
in previous quotes I also used the words "implode" and "anarchy" and "revolution".
--Amir
|
|
|
DENNIS
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 29510
Registered: 9-2-2006
Location: Punta Banda
Member Is Offline
|
|
Well, despair is the ambiance of the issue, for both sides.
But, tell me.......... How does a foreign body within our society enact a revolution?
What is Anarchy by said group anything but violent riot?
What implosion? Law enforcement?
|
|
|
amir
Senior Nomad
Posts: 559
Registered: 5-4-2007
Location: Todos Santos, BCS
Member Is Offline
Mood: chiropractic
|
|
Dennis, I'll be brief here because I have to go to a meeting; I'll elaborate later.
I'm not an expert on revolution, but what these Mexican leaders were screaming here was bloody revolution.
Anarchy is violent. All those paramilitary white supremacist groups are armed to the teeth. There are all kind of hate groups that will look for any
excuse to carry out their aggressions. They are just going to start shooting at each other, and then it all snowballs into a huge conflagration. That
is why it would be a good idea to find peaceful solutions. However, peace is not profitable... I've elaborated on that earlier in this thread and I
was thoroughly chewed out by Skeet and others...
What I mean by implosion is that the fighting will come from within and collapse will be towards the center. Law enforcement would collapse, too -
there are a lot of Hispanics in law enforcement, what side would they take? It would all be VERY messy and bloody, that is why I was hoping for a
universal brotherhood where fighting and destruction can be avoided...
I wish I had an answer to this profound problem. I'm not a pessimist or a fatalist, but we've got to find peaceful solutions or there's gonna be some
kind of revolution...
--Amir
|
|
|
DENNIS
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 29510
Registered: 9-2-2006
Location: Punta Banda
Member Is Offline
|
|
OK Amir ......... Hope it's not a La Raza meeting.
Look forward to further discussions. I appreciate your stance[s] on this issue.
|
|
|
Lee
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3508
Registered: 10-2-2006
Location: High in the Colorado Rockies
Member Is Offline
|
|
The Left and the Right will meet on their long walk back to the Middle
| Quote: | Originally posted by MrBillM
It's clear that the Lefty Looney Louts are trying to make Grassfire the De Facto Voice against ILLEGAL Immigration, but I doubt that
the Majority of those who oppose ILLEGAL Immigration for a variety of valid reasons have ever even heard of Grassfire. I hadn't
heard of them until the Ramos and Campean Tragedy occurred and I still have no idea (and don't care) what they are promoting.
All of this Rabid BS about about Racism is pretty much immaterial and won't have any affect on the Legislation under consideration. After feeling the
pulse at home, MOST of the Legislators (especially in the House) will vote one way or another depending on their Constituents feedback and that's how
the system should work. Thankfully, this bill is going to see a lot of Sunshine. |
Grassfire is just one of a hundred sites set up to ''protect'' Americans from Mexicans.
Take your pick: http://www.immigrationwatchdog.com/?page_id=1998
Do a Google on Ramos and Campean and see how many racist (hateful, right wing) sites come up.
Ramos and Campean? ''Two Border Patrol agents were convicted of a variety of crimes after they shot at a suspect who fled from a traffic stop. Agent
Jose Alonso Compean fired several shots at the suspect but Agent Ignacio Ramos had better aim. His single shot struck the suspect in the buttocks.
Campean picked up his spent shells and neither agent reported the incident.''
If you read enough about what happened here, you see the answer EASILY between the lines -- and the facts, presented by the Department of Justice.
These two agents happen to be Hispanic. So what? Don't know what their problem was: bored, under paid, whatever. They were dirty cops, and
dishonest, and after the suspect ran, they shot him, purposely tried to cover it up, WENT BACK TO THE SHOOTING SCENE AND PICKED UP SPENT AMMUNICATION
SHELLS to hide the evidence, yada yada yada.
Both these thugs had to take polygraph exams -- and guess what? They failed. They lied to the DOJ! That's enough, by itself, to get into prison.
They got 11 years. If they had been white, I'm guessing the outcome might have been different.
For the sake of balance, the below is the conservative side.
http://www.theconservativevoice.com/forum/read.html?id=5186
Get ready. Minutemen in Chicago -- on the job and protecting our borders? From Canadians? Nope. This is scary.
http://minutemenmidwest.com/Search.asp?entryType=Events
Bill writes: "MOST of the Legislators (especially in the House) will vote one way or another depending on their Constituents feedback and that's how
the system should work."
These guys vote with whoever is putting money in their campaign bucket. Right wing, left wing, it's all the same.
Lefty louts and right wing hypocrits passing themselves off as Christians. Take your pick. Both Parties are responsible for 12 million Mexicans
crossing our borders.
Bill writes: ''All of this Rabid BS about about Racism is pretty much immaterial and won't have any affect on the Legislation under consideration. ''
Guess you're out of touch Bill. You couldn't be more wrong. Actually, if you're writing about Middle America, you might be right. Don't think
you're talking about California though. Whites are in a minority in California already. You don't think racism is an issue?
Let the bigger party step forward and take responsibility. The silence is deafening.
|
|
|
| Pages:
1
..
7
8
9
10
11
12 |
![[*]](images/xmbforum/default_icon.gif){kind=icon}
