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longlegsinlapaz
Super Nomad
Posts: 1685
Registered: 11-18-2005
Location: La Paz
Member Is Offline
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Food For Thought
MY thoughts on BajaNomad site?........
It is a phenomenal site with an amazing wealth of information. I think that Doug did; and continues to do; a HUGE service to anyone interested in the
Baja by creating & maintaining the site. I don?t think that some members realize or appreciate the amount of blood, sweat & tears that Doug
puts into it. In MY opinion, the occasional thanks he gets is vastly diminished by a few people who are rude, abusive & disrespectful to people
who post, and by extension, are rude & disrespectful to other members, as well as Doug. Does anyone honestly believe that Doug created the site
as a forum for a few to be rude, offensive & abusive to many? Think of what the phrases ?Tarred with the same brush? & ?One bad apple spoils
the whole barrel? mean.
When I first discovered the site, I lurked?.I started with viewing topics I was interested in & worked my way through years of information; some I
found to be credible & of value to me personally, some held less value for me. The thing that stood out to me; beyond the wealth of information
contained herein; was what I?ll call a distinct ?Post-At-Your-Own-Risk? factor. When I finally got up the nerve to make my first
post, I took flack, I defended myself, but soon realized that my defense was simply adding fuel to the fire. I rapidly learned which members to
avoid, if a bully had added a sarcastic or rude comment to a post, I stopped coming to the defense of the original poster, which goes against my
grain. I?m the kind of person who does go to the defense of people, even at personal physical risk.
This week, I?ve been furious over two posts on this site; the beheadings in Rosarita & Pilar?s. I posted on the Rosarito thread, only to be
told?.basically?.to lighten up on Bruce & understand this is life here & Bruce needs to keep up his humor in order to not succumb to the bad
things that happen here! That was my last post. Then along came what I view as Pilar?s innocent post & the rabid attack on her. It infuriates
me that so many members attacked her, the manner in which they attacked her, and then when she stood her ground, she was attacked for standing her
ground! On top of that, she gets crucified for responding in kind!!! I fully understand why Pilar2006 came out swinging; she was attacked with the
first response to her post, and as with school yard bullies, others immediately banded together & jumped on the ?Let?s attack Pilar wagon?!!
There are other ?Real Estate Available? ads on this site that never received one comment! If you truly have a problem with any post on here, why is
it that a small number of people kick into attack mode? It's not cute & it's not funny! There are as many polite, respectful ways to ask a
question or state your opinion, as there are rude & offensive!! An even more important question is WHY DO OTHER MEMBERS TOLERATE
IT? There appear to be a few members who DO take the time & effort to speak up, however, IMHO, the
abuse they too take makes them think twice about ever speaking up again. It?s really sad what the majority allow the minority to do in
THEIR name. Each and every member is a BajaNomad!!! Most convey personal pride in being associated with the site & seem to
enjoy BajaNomad status....in whatever uniquely individual way they view it. What you need to keep in mind is that each & every rude/crude/lewd
offensive attack is a personal reflection on every single member.
I?m angry with myself for not coming to Pilar?s defense, but I?m furious at the few members on here for whom I have absolutely NO respect who put me
in the position of deciding against posting. I knew if I did post that it would just add fuel to the fire & it would become exactly what it did
become?.a peeing match!! Are you mudslingers proud of how you treat a first-time poster? Or do you have so little respect for others that you just
flat don't give a damn?
Initially, I was inclined to stay away from the site for a while, to just slink quietly off into the night....but I doubt that would make the bullies
magically disappear, any more than it might make more people speak up & shout the bullies down with LOUD & CLEAR objections
to abusive posts. IMHO, we should all be ashamed of allowing things to get to a point where Doug is forced to become a ?Hall
Monitor?. Doug has a helluva lot of time & effort invested in this site & it?s too bad that a few people apparently forget that & devalue
his efforts! IMHO, this is the reason that other sites have failed & faded?.do you want BajaNomad to go the way of other sites? Is that all the
respect that you have for Doug? For other BajaNomad members? For future potential members?
It?s really a shame that I?ve allowed a few people to make me ashamed of being a member!!! I usually scoff at the people who say ?You?re known by the
company you keep?. It disgusts me that I?ve allowed a few abusive bullies to make me stand back & watch without coming to the defense, but a few
quiet little voices in the wilderness don?t appear to carry too much weight; sadly, it appears to have the adverse effect of adding fuel to the fire.
SHAME ON ME FOR KNUCKLING UNDER TO THE BULLIES!
I know I?m not alone in my feelings, and hopefully the time & energy I put into writing this will prompt some creative thinking on the part of
everyone. If my views would force one thoughtless immature bully into seeing themselves through the eyes of others & changing their approach,
it?d be a beginning; if it will cause more people to speak up when they?re offended, maybe it could snowball! I personally have enough ?Pollyanna?
left in me to believe that there are more people in the world who would come to the aid of someone being physically attacked, why should it be any
different when someone is being verbally attacked? What ever happened to ?Do unto others?..??? Common human decency & courtesy for other?? "If
you can't say anything nice, don't say anything at all"?? While I do believe that we all have a right to voice our opinions, I also believe that
there are socially acceptable parameters to do so in!
Come on people, take a stand, speak up! Don't let the minority taint the majority! I can?t be the only one who feels this way, nor the only one who
just decided to dust off her big brass balls!
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Bruce R Leech
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6796
Registered: 9-20-2004
Location: Ensenada formerly Mulege
Member Is Offline
Mood: A lot cooler than Mulege
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Boy I was hoping that every one was going to drop this thing. I think you have been a good person and have posted some good things here. but sense you
are dragging it out in to the open again and seem to be determined to start sling mud again here we go. I seem to be the only one that you named so
you force me to defined myself. If you would have read the thread carefully you would have seen that I attacked here only after she attacked me and I
only attacked her personally for her actions and behavior. I never attacked here project , business or her right to post on the Baja Nomad Forum. I
don't see what I have done to you to make you want to pick a fight with me. your post seems a little hypocritical to me. most of the people here can
take care of them selves and don't really need someone baby sitting them. but if that is your thing go right ahead but I'm not going to give you the
satisfaction of fighting with you 
I think the main reason some people jumped on pilers case is that they relay don't like to see someones first post on the forum to be some
advertisement for anything as a good thing . this usually is a strong indicator that it is spam and that they will never post anything interesting for
all the Baja readers here. and this seem to be the case with her. it is the only contribution she made here is to promote a project that may very
well be good. but in my opinion it takes more than that to be a good nomad. you received a good welcome here after making some exultant and
informative posts.
read the thread again and tell me what you think. I know it is difficult because of all of the editing and deleting that took place by here heavy
report button finger.
[Edited on 6-29-2006 by Bruce R Leech]
Bruce R Leech
Ensenada
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Bob and Susan
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8813
Registered: 8-20-2003
Location: Mulege BCS on the BAY
Member Is Offline
Mood: Full Time Residents
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The post by pilar2006 was NOT an offer to sell property in baja....
I'm glad you didn't stick of for someone you don't even know..
Remember this is the internet and pilar2006 MAY NOT even be a woman!!!
It wouldn't suprise me in the least.
Just because its on the internet it MAY not be true.
It was a post to solicit money for a partnership.
That partnership DOES NOT own the property in question.
I think Nomads deserve to be warned of any questionable profit making schemes...period.
If these people really have good intentions...I wish them the best of luck but....
They cannot show a track record of investment profit or sucess in realestate transactions in Mexico.
Talk is cheap...the loss of money invested is horrible...just beware.
And unless you know some personally, on the internet you should beware.
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Baja Bernie
`Normal` Nomad Correspondent
Posts: 2962
Registered: 8-31-2003
Location: Sunset Beach
Member Is Offline
Mood: Just dancing through life
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longlegsinlapaz
Lady, I assume you are a lady because I would have great difficulty in believing any real Baja Guy would use your handle.
I share with you your comments on a seeming lack of civility that arises, in what seem to be cycles on this board. I see absolutely no need for
crudeness or attacks until someone attacks. Right out of the barn this woman attacked everyone in sight. Even if she were legal I would never buy
anything from her.
This is the only board I post on and I have been doing that for more than 6 months and I have been kicking around Baja for almost 50 years and some
of the people you are painting black have been around more than long enough to realize that one of the most dangerous things you can do is fall for
the siren songs of flyby night ?real estate? people in Baja. Stop and evaluate the motives of many of the posters and you will find that they raise
up when something like this comes along because they do not wish other Nomads or lurkers to get drawn into this kind of deal. These people just
offend their sense of decency.
I quit becoming interested in voicing my opinion on this stuff a long time ago when some newby?s wanted to argue with experienced ?old-timers? and
assumed that they could ask questions and then argue with the answers if they were not what they wanted to hear. If someone asks me I am happy to
share my limited knowledge as I have invested in both Californias and my wife was a broker in San Diego for a few years
I have encouraged lurkers to come out of the shadows (especially women because I think the board needs more of their viewpoints) and join the
discussion---however, as with anyone new to any organization or group of people it always pays to get to know the personality?s of the ?senior? guys
and gals so that the new kids on the block do not ruffle to many feathers without meaning to.
You will note that the only real interest I showed in this thread was asking the lady if she knew Bill and Bertha Steele?she didn?t bother to respond
and from that I got the information that I needed because they are well known investors and developers in that area and have been for about 15 years
(they have been in Baja Norte for close to 40 years)?I have found that they know almost everyone in that area and most people know them?Bill is the
Gringo and Bertha is his wonderful Mexican wife and help mate.
On the Rosarito thing I agree that a few peoples ?humor? was way out of line and I believe they know it. Cops use this kind of humor (I retired as
one) among themselves and ER nurses as a means of surviving while dealing with terrible events. They seldom if ever shared this black humor with
civilians because it is so easy to be misunderstood.
I think we all forget that there are always people out at the fringes evaluating both individuals and the board by what we post.
If you will stop and think the only reason most folks join the Nomads is because we have a wealth of information and experience that is available to
anyone who asks?but we do get a little put out when newby?s with brass balls get a bit too carried away with their constructive (yes! I mean that)
criticisms. Bear with us and you will find that we may fight a little with each other but by and large we do care about each other and other Baja
people.
Hope this makes a little sense! And welcome
My smidgen of a claim to fame is that I have had so many really good friends. By Bernie Swaim December 2007
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bajabound2005
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 2760
Registered: 10-15-2005
Location: Punta Banda, BCN
Member Is Offline
Mood: words cannot describe...
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I agree with Longlegs
Longlegs, I completely agree with you. Have felt the same way many times. Some good people have left this board due to the attacks other choose to
make. You will note, Longlegs, that the same ones attacking you on this very post are the same ones attacking Pilar. They are a small but very vocal
minority on the board, something I'm only beginning to understand.
Bruce, it may have been a Freudian slip but I think you meant you were forced to DEFEND yourself; but perhaps if you defined yourself as well that
would be helpful.
| Quote: | Originally posted by Bruce R Leech
I seem to be the only one that you named so you force me to defined myself. |
Anyway, this board has a lot to offer so you just have to skim over the bad and absorb the good!
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Bruce R Leech
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6796
Registered: 9-20-2004
Location: Ensenada formerly Mulege
Member Is Offline
Mood: A lot cooler than Mulege
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| Quote: | Originally posted by bajabound2005
Longlegs, I completely agree with you. Have felt the same way many times. Some good people have left this board due to the attacks other choose to
make. You will note, Longlegs, that the same ones attacking you on this very post are the same ones attacking Pilar. They are a small but very vocal
minority on the board, something I'm only beginning to understand.
Bruce, it may have been a Freudian slip but I think you meant you were forced to DEFEND yourself; but perhaps if you defined yourself as well that
would be helpful.
| Quote: | Originally posted by Bruce R Leech
I seem to be the only one that you named so you force me to defined myself. |
Anyway, this board has a lot to offer so you just have to skim over the bad and absorb the good! |
is it fun to be a hypocrite bajabound2005. you are one of two people that have attacked some one by name on this thread. what is with you people
everyone wants to fight. I'm sorry I don't spell that good but at least it gives you reason to feel good about your self when you can find fault with
others.
[Edited on 6-29-2006 by Bruce R Leech]
Bruce R Leech
Ensenada
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Baja Bernie
`Normal` Nomad Correspondent
Posts: 2962
Registered: 8-31-2003
Location: Sunset Beach
Member Is Offline
Mood: Just dancing through life
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bajabound
I didn't attack anyone and I responded to the lady in a very reasonable manner.
Did you bother to read my post in your haste to condemn others?
You paint with a very wide brush.
The edit was to correct a run on word. Didn't wish you to have another excuse to find fault.
[Edited on 6-29-2006 by Baja Bernie]
My smidgen of a claim to fame is that I have had so many really good friends. By Bernie Swaim December 2007
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bajabound2005
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 2760
Registered: 10-15-2005
Location: Punta Banda, BCN
Member Is Offline
Mood: words cannot describe...
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Bernie, I carefully read your post and took no issue with you. You did not attack in that post. It was quite thoughtful, in fact. Neither did you
attack in Pilar's post (and your point about her lack of response is well taken)! Others have been out of line and from your post you obviously agree
with that much! Peace!
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longlegsinlapaz
Super Nomad
Posts: 1685
Registered: 11-18-2005
Location: La Paz
Member Is Offline
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Baja Bernie, thank you for your well thought out response! While you haven't changed my thoughts or feelings about what I feel to be abusive or
offensive posts, I do sincerely appreciate & respect the straightforward & respectful manner you presented your response. You GOT the fact
that what I meant to convey truly was constructive criticism; some thoughts to hopefully get others thinking about keeping this a well-respected site
where newbies don't need to worry about making a post then ducking as fast as they can! 
Bajabound2005, Thank you also for your well thought out response, and I'm pretty sure you left out the word "some" in your comment about who posted
what where....because when I read it I didn't feel you were knocking Baja Bernie. As I stated above, I respect his thoughts & feel he expressed
himself in a respectful manner. Nothing in his response offended me or gave me cause to pause! I totally agree that this board has a lot to offer
& will do my best to steer clear of the rabblerousers.
Bruce, I apologize for your's being the only name I used in the post, I should have taken the time & gone back & named each & every one
whose posts I felt were out of line...or NONE at all! It was not intentional, it's something I overlooked in the heat of the moment getting my
thoughts out! Again, I apolgize for having given the appearance of singling you alone out!
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Anonymous
Unregistered
Posts: N/A
Registered: N/A
Member Is Offline
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After many years in Baja and mostly in Baja Sur and taking a recent trip from Tecate to La Paz I decided that I did not have the time to to waste on
this Board.
I started out on the old Amigos board then switched to Dougs board.
The insults, especially if you are a Christian, The Porn, the bragging about excessive Drinking and smoking DOPE finally tuned me off.
I have asked several times to have all of my Posts deleted from this Forum, I no longer want to have my name associated with several of the "Child
Like Bashers" that seems to occur on nearly all Posts.
Let the first timers go to Baja and find out from the Good People of Baja through experience not "Monday Morning Quarterbacks"!
There are and still are some fine people on this board-Now they are outnumbered by the"Children with ego Problems".
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Anonymous
Unregistered
Posts: N/A
Registered: N/A
Member Is Offline
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Skeet if you do not have time for this board why do you keep coming back and whining and sniveling?
bajabound your first couple of post here were loaded with sarcasm and drew enough heat that you deleted them...Talk about hypocrites.
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bancoduo
Banned
Posts: 1003
Registered: 10-3-2005
Location: el carcel publico mazatlan sin.
Member Is Offline
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Soon PILAR2006$ will jump into this and it will start all over again On second
thought 
[Edited on 6-30-2006 by bancoduo]
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The Sculpin
Nomad
Posts: 401
Registered: 9-3-2002
Location: Back in the Saddle
Member Is Offline
Mood: Riding into the Sunset, looking for a sunrise.
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HOOOOOOOO Boy!
Here we go again!
This reminds me of the 'ole Amigo days when the new crew got all upset over posts on where to find the best cat houses, and which dirt road was the
most trecherous.
There's no doubt Pilar was itchin for a fight, and that's why there were so many hits - it was damn entertaining...and if it wasn't, don't click in!
Why she felt she had to defend or explain herself to a bunch of losers like us was way beyond me. Either he/she/it (say that one fast 3 times) knew
people on this board and tried to goad them, or he/she/it is a monumental idiot for letting personal feelings get in the way of a classified ad. Just
post an email addy and get on with it!
Anyway, what makes this board so great is the interaction between the posters. Yes, it's a club, and yes anyone can join, and yes sometimes there are
little get togethers, and yes it might appear cliquish at times, but overall it's pretty damn inclusive and a pretty good refelection of the people
who love baja. Basically, alot of us are a little rough around the edges, and have never been hesitant about walking up to a campfire and peeing in
it! That's the baja spirit. Another way to put it is, yeah sure, if we see you stuck in the middle of nowhere we'll stop and do whatever it takes to
get you unstuck, but that doesn't mean we can't have a little fun at your expense while doing it!
This board is also highly addictive. Just look at the plight of the poor poster above. The guy posts to say he no longer posts and had all his posts
deleted! What's going on there? The shame is that everybody loves the guy and wishes him the best!
Oh well, like I have said before, it sure is fun being on this board, but I hope I never see you guys crossing the sand dunes into my campsite - I'll
just leave!
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Bruce R Leech
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6796
Registered: 9-20-2004
Location: Ensenada formerly Mulege
Member Is Offline
Mood: A lot cooler than Mulege
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If I could writ gud Id say whet The Sculpin sad
The Sculpin thank you
Bruce
Bruce R Leech
Ensenada
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Bedman
Senior Nomad
Posts: 523
Registered: 9-4-2002
Location: Orange County, CA.
Member Is Offline
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Sculpin,
I love this line!!
"Basically, alot of us are a little rough around the edges, and have never been hesitant about walking up to a campfire and peeing in it!"
Says quite a lot in a few words.
Bedman
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jimgrms
Senior Nomad
Posts: 664
Registered: 9-30-2005
Location: oceanside ca
Member Is Offline
Mood: its always good
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O K Sculpin where is the best cat house in baja
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DanO
Super Nomad
Posts: 1923
Registered: 8-26-2003
Location: Not far from the Pacific
Member Is Offline
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Don't be silly, there are no cats in Baja. The coyotes keep eating them.
\"Without deviation from the norm, progress is not possible.\" -- Frank Zappa
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thebajarunner
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3718
Registered: 9-8-2003
Location: Arizona....."Free at last from crumbling Cali
Member Is Offline
Mood: muy amable
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| Quote: | Originally posted by jimgrms
O K Sculpin where is the best cat house in baja |
Doug, can we do a topic on "Great Cat Houses of Baja"???
Just wondering...
I have no first hand info, of course, just lots of great stories we have all heard about.
(that's my story, I'm stickin' with it)
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Sharksbaja
Elite Nomad
Posts: 5814
Registered: 9-7-2004
Location: Newport, Mulege B.C.S.
Member Is Offline
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Bernie...are u sure?
"Bear with us and you will find that we may fight a little with each other but by and large we do care about each other and other Baja people."
I guess I haven't garnered a private response for my efforts of peace with you. Such is life....
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Sculpin.... if I know it's you....yer welcome into my camp anytime. Good post! You nailed it!
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Legs. I'm still digesting what you said....
[Edited on 7-25-2006 by Sharksbaja]
DON\'T SQUINT! Give yer eyes a break!
Try holding down [control] key and toggle the [+ and -] keys
Viva Mulege!
Nomads\' Sunsets
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longlegsinlapaz
Super Nomad
Posts: 1685
Registered: 11-18-2005
Location: La Paz
Member Is Offline
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Sharksbaja, the Reader's Digest Condensed Version would be.....Any & all who post here have a right to do so without being subjected to personal
attack. I was in no way, shape or form, supporting the substance of Pilar's post; merely her right to post...without being subjected to attack. It's
very telling to me that the majority of people who commented overlooked what to me is obvious, Pilar didn't START the venom, she merely responsed in
like! But were the rude, abusive agitators taken to task? Nope, for the most part only the victim was. Like breeds like; you attack someone &
they're most likely going to respond in kind.
We all have our own unique experiences, thoughts & feelings!! I believe that there are just as many respectful ways to disagree with someone as
there are rude, offensive & abusive ways! I was simply asking people to think about "doing unto others......." I made the mistake of only using
those two thread examples, when in reality, I was speaking towards ALL threads & ALL posts.
Alright already you cat house guys!! I can see my next "contribution" is gonna be
entitled "Proper Etiquette on Thread Hijacking!!!!! (((Whoa!! She DOES have a sense of humor!!)))
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