| Pages:
1
2
3 |
Anonymous
Unregistered
Posts: N/A
Registered: N/A
Member Is Offline
|
|
More tourists complain of abuse by officials
http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/mexico/20040101-9999_1m1t...
By Sandra Dibble
January 1, 2004
TIJUANA ? Amid a rising number of tourist complaints about police misconduct, an Arizona man has claimed he was stopped by police officers Friday near
the San Ysidro border crossing, placed in a police truck and forced at gunpoint to take money from an ATM.
Ron Terwilliger, 44, said he walked across the border to Tijuana the day after Christmas to buy jewelry on Avenida Revolucion. About 4 p.m., as he was
lining up to cross back to San Diego, he said, a man in a police uniform motioned him aside. Two other officers soon arrived.
"I feel lucky to be alive," Terwilliger said in a telephone interview from his home in Arizona.
He reported the incident to San Diego police as soon as he returned to the U.S. side.
At least a dozen allegations by U.S. tourists who say they have been extorted or assaulted by Tijuana police have come to light in recent months.
Over the summer, the U.S. Consulate in Tijuana sent the city's internal affairs office complaints filed by eight tourists who said police officers
forced them to hand over money, in one case $600.
In the past 15 months, three U.S. women have filed reports with California police agencies accusing Tijuana police officers of rape.
Tijuana law enforcement officials say they are trying to discipline corrupt officers. Gilberto Fimbres, Tijuana's assistant police chief, said nothing
will change unless victims report the crimes. "They should have the civic valor . . . or we will never end corruption."
In November, four municipal police officers were arrested after one of the alleged U.S. rape victims crossed the border and identified them as her
assailant. One officer was quickly charged with rape, two with extortion and abuse of authority, and the fourth with failing to report the crimes. Two
are in prison and two are out on bail until their trials.
Other U.S. victims have seen the wheels of justice turn far more slowly. When Tijuana's head of internal affairs reviewed the complaints from the
tourists who said they had been extorted, his office recommended that 16 police officers be dismissed. But David Solis, president of Tijuana's
Citizens Council for Public Safety and a member of the Commission of Honor and Justice, said the cases were too weak to warrant outright dismissal.
Instead, the commission ruled in November that only 12 of them should be punished ? with 30-day suspensions without pay.
As of this week, however, none of the officers has been notified of his suspension. Solis said he was told they were still on the job because the
department is short-staffed during the holiday season and is waiting until early next year to suspend them.
Terwilliger, a locksmith, said that when he was stopped he was carrying $200 worth of jewelry he had bought as gifts and $10 to pay for his parking
across the border.
After leading him for a half-block and handcuffing him, Terwilliger said, the first officer steered him around a corner to a covered white Chevy
pickup with a siren on top and marked with the word "Police."
"He told me, 'Get in,' and I said, 'What have I done?' " Terwilliger recalled. "He put his hand on his gun."
The officer wore a brown uniform, the color worn by Tijuana's commercial police, who are paid directly by banks and businesses to protect their
premises. They have no authority to patrol near the border.
A second officer arrived in a blue uniform, the color worn by Tijuana's regular patrol officers. Later, Terwilliger noticed a third officer watching
from a distance.
Terwilliger said he was told "the judge wants $400. He's very angry at you." He said the officers took his jewelry. They pulled off his shoes, emptied
his wallet and drove him to an ATM, forcing him to withdraw more than $200. At one point an officer c-cked his gun.
Terwilliger said he was released after he said he couldn't get any more money out of the machine. After crossing the border, he reported the incident
to San Diego police.
U.S. police can do little except tell victims to call the U.S. Consulate, said Sgt. Bob Lopez, head of the San Diego Police Department's Mexico
liaison team.
"People think that because we're so physically close it's one, but we're not just talking two different cities. We're talking two different
countries," Lopez said.
Liza Davis, a spokeswoman at the U.S. Consulate, said officials are aware of Terwilliger's case.
"We're really pleased that people come forward to us," she said, "and we do aggressively pursue the complaints with local authorities when we know
about them."
|
|
|
Ski Baja
Senior Nomad
Posts: 652
Registered: 8-19-2003
Location: Rosarito Beach
Member Is Offline
|
|
hahahahahaha
|
|
|
Phil S
Super Nomad
Posts: 1205
Registered: 10-28-2003
Member Is Offline
Mood: After 34 years. Still in love w/ my wife
|
|
corruption in TJ law enforcement
Ski. My first thought with your ha ha response was, "I hope that this should happen to Ski sometime". Then maybe he might not think it were so
funny. I can imagine the terror the gentleman must have felt during that experience. I'm sure your experience in crossing there Ski so many times,
has taught you not to "walk" downtown. But what about all those other Americans who are wanting to experience the "mexican" visit? Most likely,
enought exposure will force the gov't to do more than "slap hands" I would suppose that maybe all the border towns of any size have this problem.
Maybe it's not exposed as well as here.
|
|
|
Debra
Super Nomad
Posts: 2101
Registered: 10-31-2002
Location: Port Orchard Wa./Bahia de Los Angeles BC
Member Is Offline
|
|
You all make me so sad.......All ......
I'm kind of phyco right now.....so forgive me (if you please) I .......oh, good gosh, we all lost a good friend today........Can we all stop the
bickering for a moment?.....I'm sorry, I'm "on the wrong board"
|
|
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
Posts: N/A
Registered: N/A
Member Is Offline
|
|
The almighty dollar is the best tool to use to bring the Mexican Gov. pressure on corruption. Foriegners should stay away for a couple of months, this
might have a profound effect on additudes.
|
|
|
Stephanie Jackter
Senior Nomad
Posts: 566
Registered: 11-3-2002
Location: Arizona
Member Is Offline
|
|
After hearing about all this abuse
I wouldn't let myself be caught in Tijuana right now for all the trinkets in the world. The fact that few of the accused cops have been disciplined
in any way is definitely no laughing matter to all the unwitting potential victims still going there.
Unfortunately, just publiciizing this to the Southern California crowd won't do much good. It's still your average Joe that's coming in from out of
state who's getting attacked by these cops and they are also less likely to stick around and complain. I hope this makes it onto one of the news
shows like 60 minutes. It's the only way enough people will be warned about this nastiness to bring the economic house down on Tijuana until the mess
is cleaned up. - Stephanie
When the goin' gets tough, the wierd turn pro
|
|
|
Ski Baja
Senior Nomad
Posts: 652
Registered: 8-19-2003
Location: Rosarito Beach
Member Is Offline
|
|
Grains of salt
is what I take anything I read on these boards with.
Having spent a lot of time in TJ, NOT going to bars or being an idiot, I find it hard to believe that Sr. Terwilliger was just pulled out of the
innocent line and charged all that money. Especially if there was more than one officer involved.
Something smells a little fishy with this one. Again.
If something like this happens to any of you guys, demand to be taken to the police station. And, if they don't let you, go there immediately after
the fact.
Unless of course you don't speak any Spanish which means you really have no business being here anyway.
The Mexican people have a lot more morals than most people north of the border. I am sure there are still some corrupt cops but as far as them
acting like terrorists which is what Terwilly is describing, I doubt it.
As far as apologizing to this board so you join my group Skeet, you are the one missing out, not me. I put that Group together for everyones
enjoyment and I hope they enjoy what's on there.
Maybe I'll do a "staying safe in dangerous places" section. Let's see, should I start it with Tijuana, San Diego or Los Angeles ?
It's time for a return to Addams Family values!
|
|
|
Stephanie Jackter
Senior Nomad
Posts: 566
Registered: 11-3-2002
Location: Arizona
Member Is Offline
|
|
How about the woman who was raped AT THE POLICE STATION, J.R.? Duhhh.
You can choose to believe whatever fairytales you care to, but the facts are that there's some serious doo doo going down in Tijuana and the big
problem is that going to the police station won't help a bit because THEY'RE THE CRIMINALS! And the fact that the majority are not being punished at
all shows that this goes way higher than a few street cops. Get Real. - Stephanie
When the goin' gets tough, the wierd turn pro
|
|
|
Ski Baja
Senior Nomad
Posts: 652
Registered: 8-19-2003
Location: Rosarito Beach
Member Is Offline
|
|
You're absolutely right
If I were you, I wouldn't dare take the chance of coming to this dangerous country at all if I were you guys. You never know what might happen,
that's for sure. So, why do you ? And shouldn't you stop coming for your own safety?
I have a feeling that these types of incidents are going to happen more frequently and in many more areas including the american enclaves like BDLA
for instance.
I recommend the safety of your own neighborhoods in your own country to insure security, good health and a happy future. Feliz A?o Nuevo
It's time for a return to Addams Family values!
|
|
|
Stephanie Jackter
Senior Nomad
Posts: 566
Registered: 11-3-2002
Location: Arizona
Member Is Offline
|
|
First, JR, I think you know we're discussing a city, not a country.
Go throw back a couple more beers and laugh all you want. If you think that's a constructive way to solve a very concrete and verifiable problem,
you're deluded. If you think it's laughable because the problem is so big that it will never be solved or that the victims deserve what they get
(which is an obvious tone of your posts), then it's disheartening to know there's somebody out there who might be an even sicker puppy than those
doing the crimes. - Stephanie
When the goin' gets tough, the wierd turn pro
|
|
|
Ski Baja
Senior Nomad
Posts: 652
Registered: 8-19-2003
Location: Rosarito Beach
Member Is Offline
|
|
Here we go
I don't "throw back" many beers. I am laughing because I don't believe half the doo that comes out of peoples mouths, especially when they are talking
about a country other than their own.
In many of your minds I am a very sick puppy I am sure. hahahaha And I will never agree with many american ideas which makes me even sicker in
some shallow minds but as far as safety in Mexico goes, stay home.
Many people feel much safer here and with very good reason. In the mean time, enjoy your own areas that are free of rape, thievery and crime. We
wish we were you.
It's time for a return to Addams Family values!
|
|
|
Baja Red
Junior Nomad
Posts: 80
Registered: 9-2-2003
Member Is Offline
|
|
.
[Edited on 1-5-2004 by Baja Red]
|
|
|
Baja Red
Junior Nomad
Posts: 80
Registered: 9-2-2003
Member Is Offline
|
|
Ski
Ski, I am with you ...partially...You can't believe everything you hear or read. However I did not agree with your:"unless of course you don't speak
Spanish which means you really have no business being here anyway"....comment. I live in Long Beach, Ca and I deal with the public daily. Should we
send ALL of the people who cannot speak "English" back to where they came from or tell them "you have no business being here if you cannot speak
English? I speak a little Spanish and I love going to Baja. I know enough to get by but I am not a pro. I would "like" to learn more Spanish (and
I will) but I don't think that just because I don't speak it fluently that I should stay home. Baja Red
|
|
|
Ski Baja
Senior Nomad
Posts: 652
Registered: 8-19-2003
Location: Rosarito Beach
Member Is Offline
|
|
Clarification
I said "if you don't speak (any) Spanish". Meaning some will work. Again, it is all about attitudes from what I have seen. I am sure there are
exceptions but everytime I have seen a problem occur anywhere down here, it's because of a certain "attitude" that many norte americanos carry around
with them. And it's quite common whether some of you want to believe that or not.
Humans are already aware of what I am saying. These are the people that don't go to the american/canadian enclaves for safety in numbers and they
are not afraid of seeing the real people and country of Baja and Mexico and learning from them. Rather than teaching them american nonsense.
And yes, I do believe that you should speak the language at least a little bit before moving to a foreign country. Especially if you plan on working
at the DMV.
And by the way, I don't wish anything bad upon anyone. Ever. I may not be sympathetic in many instances but as far as people getting hurt or robbed,
I take it highly offensively to be accused of wishing it upon them.
You can take my posts and ------------but as far as you interpreting my meanings , WRONG again Steph.
My brother lives in Long Beach and so do some other Nomads.
It's time for a return to Addams Family values!
|
|
|
BajaNomad
Super Administrator
Posts: 4999
Registered: 8-1-2002
Location: San Diego, CA
Member Is Offline
Mood: INTP-A
|
|
Something I wrote seven and a half years ago:
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=51r60c%24ccg%40newsbf02...
Subject: Baja/Mexico Paranoia (Was:Robbed by cops in Baja)
Newsgroups: rec.travel.latin-america
Date: 1996/09/19
In article <51iuqr$rpk@mark.ucdavis.edu>, ez018859@dale.ucdavis.edu (Marc
Crepeau) writes:
>allegations about raping and knee-cap shooting police in
>Baja... ... this is
>just a lot of paranoid hogwash.
I think I'll raise a Pacifico to all of the paranoia that surrounds North
Americans on travel to Mexico, and *especially* Baja. For if it wasn't
for this, the place would be DELUGED with tourists!!!!!
Here's the address/phone for the Baja California Secretary of Tourism (if
you need it):
P.O. Box 2448
Chula Vista, CA 91912
Phone#: 01152.668.19492
Fax#: 19579
Yeah, I've been hassled for $$$ at times, but that's about the extent of
it. And I CERTAINLY haven't had ANY problems when I'm away from the
cities in a rural locale. People are at their most basic element in these
locations, and they live life "close to the bone." People like this have
little knowledge of politics, living-class, etc. They know what it takes
to survive and enjoy every precious minute of life that's been given to
them. If you were out there in your $20,000 automobile/truck in the
backcountry, and went hiking in your $100 Nikes, with your $500 Nikon
around your shoulder, and hurt yourself..... these people (with few
possessions), would take the last shirt off their back if they needed to
to stop you from bleeding.... and not expect anything in return (except
maybe a little mutual respect). Their reality is that everyone helps
everyone else out.
GOD, what has happened to us in the big cities of North America?????
We're afraid to walk out the door, in fear someone may shoot us down today
(I live in L.A. area, okay!). We're all defensive.... and it all boils
down to the rotten apples making it miserable for the rest of us in the
bunch. We end up not being able to trust anyone, unless you already know
them somehow. Life in largely populated areas becomes more impersonal
than it does in sparsely populated areas.
South Ensenada, I trust ANYONE if I'm in a bind.... and with just reason.
Those who've been there, know it. Those who haven't, don't worry about
it. Stay where you're at. You're right, Mexico is dangerous. And where
you're at, I will presume, is not.... allrighty?
This basic theme has been seen before on the r.t.l-a board. Yes, crime
happens in Mexico (yes, there are rotten apples there too!!). But it also
happens in the U.S. Just look at your newspaper. I see a lot more
shootings/major crimes in Southern California than in Baja on a daily
basis. For me, case closed.
Yes, I have to be smart when in Mexico to avoid being taken advantage of,
but I need to do that in the U.S. too. Some of us just happen to be in
the wrong place at the wrong time, wherever we are, and whatever country
we're in. The luckiest among us, make our own luck by just plain being
aware of our surroundings, and being the smartest travelers we know how to
be.
--
Doug
When I was young, I admired clever people. Now that I am old, I admire kind people.
– Rabbi Abraham Joshua Heschel
We know we must go back if we live, and we don`t know why.
– John Steinbeck, Log from the Sea of Cortez
https://www.regionalinternet.com
Affordable Domain Name Registration/Management & cPanel Web Hosting - since 1999 |
|
|
bajalera
Super Nomad
Posts: 1875
Registered: 10-15-2003
Location: Santa Maria CA
Member Is Offline
|
|
JR, that hahahaha wasn't worthy of you. YOU might have enough Mexi-smarts not to be scared shotless in the situation described, but this poor guy
obviously didn't have. But I don't think he deserved a snide guffaw--particularly from a guy who devotes considerable time to doing good stuff.
- bajalera
|
|
|
Ski Baja
Senior Nomad
Posts: 652
Registered: 8-19-2003
Location: Rosarito Beach
Member Is Offline
|
|
CLARIFICATION II
See my replies to Stephanie J. and Baja Red.
A. Ha HA HA = I don't believe half the dung I read here or elsewhere.
B. READ what I am saying rather than trying to interpret hidden meanings like the Steph.
C. These things happen everywhere.
D. I am not sympathetic to many things that could have been avoided with just a little knowledge or better attitude.
And thank you for your compliment. The feeling is mutual.
It's time for a return to Addams Family values!
|
|
|
JESSE
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3370
Registered: 11-5-2002
Member Is Offline
|
|
This is nothing new, been goin on for ever, but i am sure glad its getting the attention it deserves.
|
|
|
bajalera
Super Nomad
Posts: 1875
Registered: 10-15-2003
Location: Santa Maria CA
Member Is Offline
|
|
Ski
A. Not believing about half of what you read, here or elsewhere, sounds about right to me.
B. I did read your stuff, and seeking secret meanings has never seemed worth the effort.
C. Agreed. Stuff happens everywhere, and what doesn't hit the fan flows downhill.
D. I'm more tolerant of human frailties than you are, but don't think that this earns me any halos.
You're a bit weird, but you already know that.
- bajalera
|
|
|
Stephanie Jackter
Senior Nomad
Posts: 566
Registered: 11-3-2002
Location: Arizona
Member Is Offline
|
|
Touche, Balalera
And to Doug, You, like JR, missed the point completely. I've written the same tomes as you about how people who don't know Mexico judge it very
harshly and how glad I am that there's less invasion of the places I love to be in Baja because of it, but frankly, in this case, I consider it a
hackneyed and shallow argument. Is this something to be taken lightly simply because it's not likely to happen in La Paz, BCS? - or Boise Idaho, for
that matter?
I was very specifically speaking of a specific set of situations having to do SPECIFICALLY with POLICE BRUTALITY in TIJUANA. You name me one city in
the US or Mexico where tourists are being taken out of the shopping district and being robbed and raped by the very police that are assigned to
protect them. This is insanity and you and JR are treating the issue as if it's a little roadside bribe that one has to pay to get on with a
vacation.
No. This is something we should all be up in arms about and let the powers that be in Tijuana know that their City, which bases much of its economy
on day tourists, is off our invite list until things change. Not acknowledging the gravity of these crimes or the travesty that the aggressors who
have positons of power directly over the tourists who shop there have not been punished, seems to me callous at best and at worst, invites even more
terrible behavior by those very criminals.
And as far as Americans being jerks, JR, and therefor deserving what they get, I don't buy into that game of blaming the victim. You think there's
more to the story of the woman that got taken by cops away from her husband and child and raped at the police station????
Only what you make up in your own mind so that you can feel superior and invincible. The bottom line is that if you can convince yourselves that
whoever got victimized brought on his or her own victimization, then you can walk through the world feeling like nothing like that will happen to you.
Well, maybe that will work for you. Maybe it won't.
The only thing I would agree with you on is that those who don't speak spanish are the most likely to be victimized in Tijuana. But, last I saw, that
was no crime and those are the very people Tijuana needs to sell all those trinkets to. Most of us who speak spanish haven't bought trinkets in 20
years, have we?
But anybody with half a heart would stand in support of these victims instead of laughing at reports of what happened to them and making them seem
responsible for the audacity of taking a day trip to Mexico without speaking the language. What baloney! That attitude is just wrong and you know
it. Do you laugh when you hear gang bangers killed an innocent by-stander in Los Angeles? I bet not. Then why laugh or try to make excuses or
diminish the importance of the event when cops extort and rape tourists whose only crime has been to come across the border to buy trinkets?
I feel very sorry for those victims. We all should. - Stephanie
When the goin' gets tough, the wierd turn pro
|
|
|
| Pages:
1
2
3 |
![[*]](images/xmbforum/default_icon.gif){kind=icon}
