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longlegsinlapaz
Super Nomad
Posts: 1685
Registered: 11-18-2005
Location: La Paz
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HOT WATER ON DEMAND UNITS
I did a search & found a few comments on hot water on demand units from mid-2006. Does anyone have any follow-up information? I've done some
research on-line, but realize manufacturers can & do hype their units & make it sound like the best on the market. I'm interested in some
personal experiences...the pros & cons & lessons-learned. Ideally I'd want it inside the bano/laundry area, which would mean it would be 35'
from the kitchen & dishwasher. Close enough? Too far? I'm curious as to why most of the manufactures talk about distance to hot water heater,
even in new construction scenarios. In my mind, this unit would be in lieu of a hot water heater...flaw in my thought processes?? I'll have a water
pressure holding tank & would like to eliminate any need for a conventional hot water heater & the LP it takes to keep the water hot 24-hours
a day. The pilotlight-free unit sounded best until I read someone's comment about that makes it harder to diagnose problems! And here I was hoping
that these would be problem/maintenance-free! Pros? Cons? Lessons-learned?
Warnings? Recomendations? (and NO! Foregoing hot water all together ISN'T a
feasible option!)
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wiltonh
Nomad
Posts: 302
Registered: 2-2-2007
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The on demand hot water unit that we saw in Costa Rica was mounted just behind the shower head. It worked ok but it was scary looking up at the
shower head and seeing 220 volt AC wires coming out of the wall and extending down very near the shower head.
--Wilton
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Taco de Baja
Super Nomad
Posts: 1913
Registered: 4-14-2004
Location: Behind the Orange Curtain, CA
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Mood: Dreamin' of Baja
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They only work ok. They have positives and negatives.
Positive: unlimited hot water.
Positive: save energy, only heat what you need.
Negative: High startup cost
BIG Negative (that they bury in the fine print): We had a "household" sized unit, but you could
only have one hot water faucet on at a time....If you were taking a shower and someone turned on hot water in the kitchen or another bathroom, you
would lose all hot water to the shower. Don't even think of taking a shower while the washing machine was on  .... They make larger units that can handle two sources at the same time, but they cost a whole heck of a lot more.
Negative: you have to install a 5-6" diameter, double walled exhaust vent in your roof to handle the extra BTU's.
Negetive The “pilot light free” one we had operated by 2 D-cell batteries. In the beginning they would last around 9 months. Then
they were gone by 1 month (they still tested above 1 volt each…But the unit would not spark). I finally had to hot wire in a plug in transformer to
the battery terminals, that produced a constant 3 volts. In addition if the flow of water was, too low, the pizio-electric spark would not kick in,
and there would be no hot water 
[Edited on 2-12-2007 by Taco de Baja]
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movinguy
Nomad
Posts: 257
Registered: 3-19-2004
Location: Chula Vista, CA and Tijuana, MX
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"In addition if the flow of water was, too low, the pizio-electric spark would not kick in, and there would be no hot water."
That is correct - I stayed somewhere recently where I had to leave the sink faucet on to get the shower to heat. Not exactly a prudent use of water
in a place like Baja . . .
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El Jefe
Super Nomad
Posts: 1027
Registered: 10-27-2003
Location: South East Cape
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No, no, no, don't use one! We go two high end Bosch units, one for each end of the house. We could never get a good hot shower with them. The water
would get hot after running about five gallons and as soon as you turned it down a bit it would go stone cold.
The poblem is with the flow rate, pressure etc. During use pressure tanks vary in pressure from about 20 to 45 psi. At the highest pressure the heater
worked almost, but woe be to the user who tried to take a shower when the pressure was lower. I would hear profanities from the bahroom as my dear
wife tried in vain to take a comfortable shower. Not condusive to cuddling on a cool winter night let me tell you!
Needless to say, I changed out to a regular old 30 gallon tank type heater and all is good with the world. I expect to change out the guest bath side
soon.
If you do decide to get a tankless heater, I've got a couple in perfect condition I will sell to you cheap.
Good luck with your project. tom
No b-tchin\' in the Baja.
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El Jefe
Super Nomad
Posts: 1027
Registered: 10-27-2003
Location: South East Cape
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Oh ya, my neighbor replaced his thankless water heater too. Now all is good in the hood!
No b-tchin\' in the Baja.
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Capt. George
Super Nomad
Posts: 2129
Registered: 8-21-2003
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does this mean I will have "dirty" neighbors in La Paz???
\"The penalty good men pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men\" Plato
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Steve in Oro Valley
Nomad
Posts: 105
Registered: 11-14-2002
Location: Near Tucson
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I installed an CEC POWERSTAR electric tankless water heater which utilized two (2) 220v lines and has worked great in my mothers casita for 18 months
. Some of these units use only one (1) 220v line and appear to be too minimal in hot water output
I sized it to provide instant hot water (50 degree rise in temp) for her shower and bathroom sink. Hot water comes in about 4 seconds and lasts.
She uses the water source one at a time, never simultaneously....It is mounted under sink against the wall inside the vanity. Our water in the ground
here in Oro Valley varies about 60 degrees in winter and 80 degrees in the summer. No complaints from grammy yet.....
I do not notice any extra cost in the electric bill...
I did not and would not use a gas powered unit for this small addition as I did not want to install a vent and worry about malfunction and pilot
light problems....
The cost is in running separate two 220v lines needed to provide the required heat. The Powerstar unit we used cost $400 plus and also of course the
wires and electrician are extra....
Steve in Oro Valley
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shari
Select Nomad
Posts: 13048
Registered: 3-10-2006
Location: bahia asuncion, baja sur
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Mood: there is no reality except the one contained within us "Herman Hesse"
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For years we had a very neat little unit only cost us $40 and it's a shower head that has a coil in it and heats the water as it comes through the
shower head. It worked great and our electric bill was around $15 a month so doesnt use much power, just the few minutes when you're showering. Most
people have that type here and the only problem is you can get a shock when you touch the shower head. they are simple to install and you don't need
copper or cpvc pipe, just regular pvc. Most hardware stores have em.
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 64854
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
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Mood: Have Baja Fever
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Getting a shock when taking a shower is NOT a good thing Shari...
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Oso
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 2637
Registered: 8-29-2003
Location: on da border
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Mood: wait and see
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You mean one of these?
All my childhood I wanted to be older. Now I\'m older and this chitn sucks.
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Oso
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 2637
Registered: 8-29-2003
Location: on da border
Member Is Offline
Mood: wait and see
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Actually, we had an on demand water heater for showers in Cuajimalpa, a small village in the D.F. about 40 years ago.
First it would demand that we use a handpump to fill the tinaco upstairs on the azotea, so we could have a gravity flow.
Then it demanded that we chop some firewood and kindling.
Then it demanded that we light a fire under the tank in the bathroom.
Then it demanded that we wait half an hour for the water to heat up.
Then it demanded that we shower together (well that wasn't such a demand) as quickly as possible before the hot water ran out.
All my childhood I wanted to be older. Now I\'m older and this chitn sucks.
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Capt. George
Super Nomad
Posts: 2129
Registered: 8-21-2003
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getting shocked in the shower is a good thing for depression! I like it much better then those wires they keep attaching to my head!
maybe after all those earthquakes, ya don't even feel a little electric shock now and then??
gotta get two of those!
\"The penalty good men pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men\" Plato
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Bob and Susan
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8813
Registered: 8-20-2003
Location: Mulege BCS on the BAY
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Mood: Full Time Residents
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Here is one of those Hot Water Shower Heads
They take A LOT of electricity!!!
25 amps
2750 watts
$50
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=11007...
They are used a lot for washing horses when it’s cold.
People sure love those horses.
I am with David though…
water + electricity = DANGER!!!
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Bob and Susan
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8813
Registered: 8-20-2003
Location: Mulege BCS on the BAY
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Mood: Full Time Residents
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We have a BIG tankless unit for the garage…
Here is my source…nice people from Flordia…
http://excelamerica.com/
Washer works GREAT!!!
NO problems
The BIG unit was TOO hot for just a shower so we’re using smaller units for each casita.
You do HAVE to have a pressurized water supply…ours is 50 lbs
I’ll have one for each shower.
The cold water does go thru the unit and comes out HOT!!!
Unlimited supply
In our case we’re trying to cut down on propane usage.
Remember... when you have a regular hot water heater you’re heating water ALL day weather you’re using it or not.
BURNING propane!!!
We’ve noticed...you do have to leave the water on to get an even flow of hot water.
No turning the water ON AND OFF to conserve water.
I think if I had electricity, I’d go with a regular electric hot water tank and pay the bill but…
when you live in a place with no water, no electricity, no telephone, no services…
You just suffer…
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Capt. George
Super Nomad
Posts: 2129
Registered: 8-21-2003
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Save Water - Stay Dirty
PU
\"The penalty good men pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men\" Plato
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prt328
Junior Nomad
Posts: 51
Registered: 2-13-2007
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Sounds like we have a similar setup. I put in a 16,000L unit (whole house) from Home Depot. There were issues at first, but it seems to be settling
down. Water pressure to the tank had to be increased to 45 lbs to get water to the far end of the house. I had to remove the flow restrictors from
the shower heads as the unit need to see a drop in pressure to fire. Haven't had it long enough to know the battery life but I keep 2 D cells nearby
(it only uses 1). Water is scalding hot WHEN it gets there - it takes 2-3 minutes to reach the far end (40? feet) of the house.
I kept a small "old fashioned" water heater next to the tankless "just in case" and have it plumbed in parallel with valves. The pilot is lit only
if/when I need it.
Hope this helps.
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Bob and Susan
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8813
Registered: 8-20-2003
Location: Mulege BCS on the BAY
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Mood: Full Time Residents
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i think this is the best advice yet
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Capt. George
Super Nomad
Posts: 2129
Registered: 8-21-2003
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I beg to differ.
staying dirty still wins.
\"The penalty good men pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men\" Plato
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longlegsinlapaz
Super Nomad
Posts: 1685
Registered: 11-18-2005
Location: La Paz
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I was hoping for more positive experiences/information, but I guess that's why I asked in the first place!!! Looks like Steve in Oro Valley is the
only success story! Capt. George, I refuse to wash dishes & laundry in the pool!  Not being a techie-nerd, I guess I'll be sticking to the good old standby gas water heater! At least I know how to make it work &
historically they've been relatively trouble-free for me! It's really too bad that conservation can't be simplified! Thanks for all the input
everyone....well, maybe except for Capt. George! 
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