BajaTrooper
Junior Nomad
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Registered: 3-5-2007
Location: somewhere cold and wet
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Copper Canyon
Hello Nomads! I have been absent for comment for some time as I have been traveling for work, that said I must confess that when it was cold and rainy
I always came back to get mt Baja fix here. THANK YOU!
I know this is a little off topic, but as many of you have explored the mainland of Mexico I thought that I would ask for advise and opinions on
driving Copper Canyon.
I plan on leaving from Tucson and entering Mexico at Nogales. I have found a few helpful sites on the route, but personal expirences are always more
reliable.
Have any of you driven in this area, and if you have can you list some "not to miss" sites or "be sure to miss areas"?
I wont be leaving until January...not set on the date yet.
Thanks in advance for you input, and thanks for letting me "warm up" here from time to time. BT
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bajajudy
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Registered: 10-4-2004
Location: San Jose del Cabo,BCS
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I have never done the drive but did take the train from Los Mochis to Chihuahua and back(I would not recommend going both ways by train BTW.....one
way is a better use of your time). We were there in September and not only were the train tracks washed out but also most of the roads. The drive
into the valley from Creel is supposed to be extreme. The drive into the valley of Urique was a piece of cake and along the way you will find little
basket venders with some of the most beautiful and cheap baskets in the Copper Canyon. If you are only going to go to the floor of the canyon once, I
would do this one.
I envy you. That trip is one that I cherish in my memories. The breathtaking scenery and the Tarahumara people make the trip very special indeed.
You will have a blast. If you would like my opinion on specific towns, u2u me. I believe that the train tracks are generally very close to the
roads. Probably the only word of caution is that there are drug lords in these valleys who drive brand new pickups and do not take lightly to your
wandering around on their turf. Judicial police ride the trains looking for signs of crops and probably to protect the tourist from robberies(that is
just an opinion not a fact)
So check the weather before you go and have a good time.
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Mango
Senior Nomad
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Registered: 4-11-2006
Location: Alta California &/or Mexicali
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I've been there twice now and plan to go back as soon as I can. Both times I went I have traveled by train. Once from Los Mochis to Creel and back
and the next time was from Los Mochis to all the way to Chihuahua, with stops at Divisadero and Creel.
I really like the train trip as it lets you relax and enjoy the scenery. Once you get near the canyon rim near Creel the road follows the tracks;
but, the dirrect road west down to Los Mochis that most closley follows the train tracks is very treacherous, requires a river ford, goes through drug
country, and was considered non-existent/mule trail for years.
If you are driving from Nogales to the Copper Canyon area you will most likely head east out of Hermosillo on Mex 16 to get to Creel. Just before the
turnoff south to Creel check out Basaseachic Falls.
Creel is known as "the gateway to Copper Canyon" I've stayed at both the Margarita's Hotel and Hostel in town. Both were excellent; but, different.
They have an ATM in town; and, all around Creel is pretty touristy nowdays. Helicopters fly in and out taking scenic tours, etc..
Still Creel is a nice little funky mountain town with some great places to see right around it. Just outside of town is a Tarahumara reservation with
a nice lake. I'm not sure how the fishing is; but, I'd hire a driver to take you to the, "Valley of the Monks" for some photos, then hike up the wash
to the right for about 1/2 mile to an overlook into the Rio Chinipas (The same valley where Pancho Villa often hid out)
Also near Creel... Cusarare Falls is worth the short/easy 2 mile hike to them.
A road down to the canyon bottom to a nice little town named Batopillas is possible. The road is now much improved from when I rode on the roof of
the bus (so I could jump off) down to the bottom of the canyon years ago. Nonetheless the road is still very narrow, filled with switchbacks, rocks,
ruts, extreme drop offs, etc.. A bus made it down; but, don't try to tow your 5th wheel. Near Batopillas the Lost Mission at Satevo is worth a visit
if you are there. You can also hire people to guide you out to local native villages from here.
There are many other little towns in the area worth a visit. Some I know of and some I don't. You might see if you can take the train from Creel to
Temoris or so. Temoris is not much of a town; but, the train heads through some nice country in that stretch; although, my favorite is between
Temoris and Loreto(near El Fuerte) The train is best traveled West to East to see the scenery; but, a day down to El Fuerte, then back to Creel the
next might be worth your while. (Forget your seat and stand between the rail cars with your head hanging out like a dog.)
I'm envious, and need to get back.  Take a warm jacket, gloves, and warm hat
for night and early morning up around Creel. It can be cold there during the winter. It will be hot at the canyon bottoms.
Have a great trip!
Bring your wide angle lens: (To big for any camera)
Valley of the Monks:
As bajajudy said, lots of nice baskets for sale:
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Ken Cooke
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8947
Registered: 2-9-2004
Location: Riverside, CA
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Mood: Pole Line Road postponed due to injury
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I traveled there via 4WD in December '06 through January '07. I would recommend 4WD as it makes the trip much more safe, although the dirt roads turn
into mud, and there ARE NO GUARDRAILS on many of the dirt roads. In addition, the roads tend to freeze over at night, so please exercise cautiuon.
As a potential traveler to the Copper Canyon, you will see that people tend to be "buttoned-lipped" about routes taking you into and through the
canyons. Coming from an experienced Baja traveler, I find this to be nonsense. Doug Rhodes of Paraiso Del Oso is able to plot your route via email,
and his guest ranch was excellent. His ranch was able to set up nice horseback rides for me and others at the ranch, and I had an excellent time.
The food his staff served was also great. I loved the drinks there as well during their '07 New Years celebration.
Doug Rhodes can be contacted at: Doug@OnlyMyEmail.com
Enjoy your trip, be safe, and take lots and lots of pictures. Also, the town of Creel is your major jumping off point. Be sure to travel in and out
of Creel when there are no major snowstorms in the forecasts. Also, be sure to carry tire chains as these roads turn into ice very quickly.
Here is what the locals have to endure in order to get into town. Mud is everywhere during daytime hours.:
Be ready for scenes like these where 2WD vehicles are backing up the icy, snowy roads:
The basketweavers of Divisadero:
There ain't no Pemex stations in El Fuerte  :
The view from Paraiso Del Oso:
[Edited on 11-5-2007 by Ken Cooke]
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wilderone
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Registered: 2-9-2004
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I would suggest crossing at Douglas, AZ since you need to go east a bit anyway, and I 10 is a lot faster than Mex. 2. Then, make a stop at Paquime to
see the ruins, into Mata Ortiz if art pottery interests you; maybe check out Cuarenta Casas, Basaseachic (sp?) Falls, then drive on to Creel. Take
the local bus into Batopilas and spend a night or two there - hike to Satevo. The return bus to Creel leaves very early - about 5:30 am. Then drive
on to Divisidero, spend the night on the canyon rim at one of the nice hotels - horseback ride into the canyon, and hiking trails around there. Then
from Divisidero, take the train into El Fuerte. At El Fuerte, spend a night or two, hike to see the pictographs or birdwatching, and then take the
train back to Divisidero to get your car (park at hotel with permission). Get a good map of Chihuahua and have fun. Take warm clothing. Depending
on how long your trip is, the above are the "must sees" and does not involve any 4WD concerns.
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bajajudy
Elite Nomad
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Location: San Jose del Cabo,BCS
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Was your weaver taken at Mirador?
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bajajudy
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The food at Divisadera was really good.
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bajajudy
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We had a great time in Chihuahua. This little boy caught my eye.
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Mango
Senior Nomad
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Registered: 4-11-2006
Location: Alta California &/or Mexicali
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Mood: Bajatastic
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| Quote: | Originally posted by bajajudy
Was your weaver taken at Mirador? |
It sure looks like the same lady that was weaving the baskets in my photo. My photo was taken just a little ways away just outside Hotel Divisadero
Barrancas on their front steps. The hotel is closer to the San Rafael stop; but, is between there and Divisadero. Nice place; but, expensive.
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bajagrouper
Senior Nomad
Posts: 964
Registered: 8-28-2003
Location: Rincon de Guayabitos, Nayarit, Mexico
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Mood: happy and retired
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This is a web site of a fellow from Washington that has a small B&B type place in CCanyon, if you go to his site I am sure he will be more that
happy to give you driving directions vthrough the canyon: http://home.comcast.net/~ramsay52/
[Edited on 11-5-2007 by bajagrouper]
I hear the whales song
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Mango
Senior Nomad
Posts: 685
Registered: 4-11-2006
Location: Alta California &/or Mexicali
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BTW - BajaTrooper. What type of vehicle will you be driving and how long do you have to explore?
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Ken Cooke
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8947
Registered: 2-9-2004
Location: Riverside, CA
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Mood: Pole Line Road postponed due to injury
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Instrucciones:
First, you travel to Bisbee, AZ for a good nights sleep (via Hwy 80).
Next, you wake up real early - say, 7 a.m., and drive down to Douglas, AZ where you will cross into Agua Prieta, Sonora). You stop at the border
(inside Mexico), get your tourist visa and vehicle permits. Then, you drive clear to Creel, Chihuahua - hoping to make it before sunset (since you
will be driving in the forest w/o streetlamps to light your way). Then, you will have reserved your motel somewhere in Creel. From there, the next
day, you can drive to Divisadero in about 2 hours.
From Divisadero (where you can shop for plenty of Tarahumara-made items), you can travel into the canyon, but beware of iced over routes and thick mud
that will stop you, or possibly throw you towards or possibly over a cliff!
The 4WD group I traveled with stayed at Paraiso Del Oso, Cerocahui, Chihuahua, Mexico ("Where Horses Climb Mountains")
Paraiso Del Oso, Cerocahua, Chihuahua, Mexico
Mile Description
0.0 Pemex station on south side of Creel
1.0 Right turn marked for San Rafael
17.1 Pass Pitorreal turnoff - continue straight
28.0 Continue straight - left turn goes to Divisadero, the Posada Barrancas train station, and the Tarahumara Mansion Hotel.
31.0 Turn right
34.7 Asphalt pavement ends, concrete pavement continues to railroad crossing.
34.9 Straight across railroad tracks at San Rafael
38.9 Turn right - "low road" continues left here. The low road is more scenic but use caution during the rainy season. Drop down 6 rows for the low
road option road log.
39.4 Road stops climbing (~7840' elevation)
42.0 Turn left by a small group of houses
58.8 Turn left - Bahuichivo is visible on the left
59.1 Low road rejoins here - continue straight
59.6 Cross railroad tracks at Bahuichivo train station
Good luck, and enjoy your drive! 
[Edited on 11-5-2007 by Ken Cooke]
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Ken Cooke
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8947
Registered: 2-9-2004
Location: Riverside, CA
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Mood: Pole Line Road postponed due to injury
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Eating some good snacks at Divisadero:
Shopping like a fool in Divisadero:
Horseback riding with Angelia and Brad!!!:
The view from Divisadero in late December '06:
[Edited on 11-5-2007 by Ken Cooke]
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Ken Cooke
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8947
Registered: 2-9-2004
Location: Riverside, CA
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Mood: Pole Line Road postponed due to injury
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Here is what a "Wild Night On The Town of Creel, Chihuahua" looks like!! 
Searching for spare tires in Cerocahui looked like this. Exactly. No OEM direct-fit tires for miles!
I videotaped every inch of our adventure. From tire-spinnin' action on ice to baskets being woven in slow-motion. Maybe NBC or ESPN will buy the
videotapes for $50 million??? 
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wilderone
Ultra Nomad
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The "wild night on the town in Creel" photo reminds me of me and my friends' wild night in Creel. We went to a ladies bar, thinking it was for ladies
only.
Baja Trooper, be aware too that you need to get auto registration at the border. You'll need visa, title, registration, driver's license (and two
copies of everything) and pay with credit card (about $30 I think). Bring copies with you so you don't have to stand in another line.
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Mango
Senior Nomad
Posts: 685
Registered: 4-11-2006
Location: Alta California &/or Mexicali
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Ken, I think I spent part of a wild night in Creel in that same bar/restaurant - as wild as Creel gets anyways. Thanks for the photos. It looks
like you had a nice time; but, a little cold.
Try heading back in October sometime, it is usually pretty dry and the weather is not too hot nor too cold.
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BajaTrooper
Junior Nomad
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Registered: 3-5-2007
Location: somewhere cold and wet
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Thank you all for the great information and thank you Judy and Ken for the wonderful photographs! We are very excited to make this journey and I will
share what adventures we have. The vehicle is a 1989 Izuzu Trooper, we have spent quite a bit fixing her up and the trooper did well on Mex 5 and
Laguna Salada. Ken, thanks for the details as well! It looks like it will be the first week of the new year of the departure, so if any of you think
of more please share when you can, BT
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