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surfer jim
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and now.....random targets.....
Turned on computer and latest news story says the "hitmen" are now also doing random targets around Tijuana....shoppers, restaurants,
movies.......gunmen enter and just start shooting......where does it go from here?
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woody with a view
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hey Jim
got a link?
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surfer jim
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was on YAHOO NEWS......(Reuters)
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movinguy
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http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20081209/wl_nm/us_mexico_drugs
Tragic - but I would still question how "random" they are.
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surfer jim
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Thank you....that's it.....
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fishbuck
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I was just there last night and this morning. Went to Revo and also Rio Plaza. Very quite.
They are now searching cars entering Mexico and also at the toll boths.
"A ship in harbor is safe, but that is not what ships are built for." J. A. Shedd.
A clever person solves a problem. A wise person avoids it. – Albert Einstein
"Life's a Beach... and then you Fly!" Fishbuck
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Hook
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Care to enlighten us on how you reached this conclusion?
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movinguy
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| Quote: |
Care to enlighten us on how you reached this conclusion? |
I am in Tijuana 2-3 times a week. While they may be in denial, the locals believe that the "collateral" damage - even children, unfortunately - were
related to or associated with the wrong people.
As I said, they may be rationalizing this as the walls close in around them. Or they may be right. Sucks either way.
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Mexicali_Kid
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| Quote: | | Quote: | | Quote: | Originally posted by movinguy
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Care to enlighten us on how you reached this conclusion? |
I am in Tijuana 2-3 times a week. While they may be in denial, the locals believe that the "collateral" damage - even children, unfortunately - were
related to or associated with the wrong people.
As I said, they may be rationalizing this as the walls close in around them. Or they may be right. Sucks either way. |
Some associated with the wrong people and some are targets of kidnappings, and some are just in the wrong place at the wrong time.
I have lost three friends to the narco war in the last year and have thought long and hard about each death. I hope there are no more. But I know
there will be.
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fishingmako
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Mood: always up
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Came across the Border at 10:30 am today,12/10 at San Ysidro got a green light and the the police jumped out in the road and waved me into customs,
they didn't look or ask too manny questions, but now you have to go thru the Military there that want to check you and they want to know a lot of
info, and they write it all down, DRIVERS LIC INFO, VEHICLE INFO, ETC. I asked them if they are doing it randomly, they said for now, but they will
start checking everyone, they are looking for weapons and they don't care who or what you look like so be aware.
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gnukid
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When you look at crimes in order to solve the crime, you ask who had the motive and who benefits from the crime? In the case of the reported random
shootings, ask youself who has the motive and who benefits? Now try to determine if the evidence is what is seems to be and if it is as it seems or is
it setup to mislead, perhaps the scene is misleading from other criminal activity.
Lets take the report on yahoo on its own first. Random shootings have the intended effect of intimidating, they show arrogance or intend to
demonstrate superiority. Like highway shooters the targets are seemingly random.
There is no racial motive or intended victim? Hos do cartels act? Do they act within guidelines and have intended victims? Yes. Independent Cartels
have one goal, moving the cache of product with open routes. Their goals and actions are quite defferent than the type outlined here in the yahoo
story, even though they seem similar they are clearly not!
So simplistically the message of the report is be intimidated, be scared of random shooters, you are powerless.
Now who would benefit, who would have the motive? Who would act in collusion? Yahoo?
So it seems that there are some assumptions we can make about the extensive reports of intended and random shootings, they are, that is the reports
are simply designed to intimidate people to feel powerless precipitating a call for help from the federal government as the result. There is no other
motive, no other intent so it seems.
Its possible to see the connection, that is random and intended violence precipitates the call for A Mexico Plan.
Now look at other similar cases of terror and look at the culprits? All too often, in almost every case Government pro and counter intelligence
agencies are behind these attacks to bring on a call for military defense intervention as we have seen repeatedly throughout the world by US black
operations often labeled false flag--that is the attack occurs under pretense of a foreign attacker which precipitates an invasion in defense of the
attack by the USA.
This is now become the oldest and most tired "intelligence agency" operation which have footprints or fingerprints. The call to highlevel officials
demonstrating internal knowledge, the demonstrated intimate knowledge of codes, access, systems and tools. This report like so many are part of the
operation I'll label-'theater of intimidation precipitating intervention' and frankly enough is enough, its all too clear who benefits, whose
fingerprint is left and which result is intended.
Now, I for one know that the public is aware and very few if anyone is buying it anymore.
In particular, the Mexican people know who is doing it and peace officers know who, I think at this point everyone knows who is behind the attack on
innocents.
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surfer jim
Super Nomad
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help me out here....if "everyone knows"......(except me I guess)......WHO is doing it ?.....tell me and I will stay out of their way........
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woody with a view
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either that , or i need to double-up the aluminum foil on my propeller hat!!!
[Edited on 12-11-2008 by woody in ob]
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fdt
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Can someone please tell us Tijuana residents were exactly there have been ANY random shootings? We have no knowledge of them.
A well informed Baja California traveler is a smart Baja California traveler!
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toneart
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Gnukid,
How do you know this?
While not out of the realm of possibility, for one to know this, it would place them inside the operations. It is doubtful, if you are on the inside,
that you would be chatting about it here on the BajaNomad.
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Woooosh
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The first American killed will close down the whole city. If the intent of the narcos with killing innocents is to "clear the streets" there's not
much the 4% of clean police can do to stop them.
\"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing\"
1961- JFK to Canadian parliament (Edmund Burke)
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gnukid
Ultra Nomad
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Registered: 7-2-2006
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You can have it however you like?
You can believe that the violence in TJ or Iraq and Afghanistan is just part of life that is unstoppable or you can look at the evidence available,
follow the time-line, look at the facts of who benefits, who has the ability, whose footprint remains and pursue coming to some logical conclusions.
Of course, there is a programmed response among Americans; it is defined by arrogance and elitism and above all the inability to think for oneself.
Incredibly convenient isn't to have infighting, the type which is condescending devoid of any logic among the general population as demonstrated by
the previous posters.
I am neither an investigative journalist nor a government employee. My observations of the obvious is not substantial, but as opposed to the opinion
that golly gee who can figure this out, the conclusions are obvious to those who look at history and at the present. When we are open to empirical
discussion and think for ourselves and drop the American Arrogant style we become far more able to discuss and to make rational conclusions.
Of course, we have history to learn from, USA has consistently backed black operations which cause terror to precipitate intervention: The USA has
lied and killed its own and other countries to provoke conflict and war and they publicly admit it in declassified documents.
The USA did in Mexican wars 1819, 1846-48, Spanish-American war 1898 - The surprise explosion of the battleship Maine, World War I 1914 when a U-boat
torpedo hit ocean liner Lusitania, World War 2 1939 The U-boat torpedo hit ocean liner Athenia, the Korean with incursions, the Vietnam with the
Tonkin incident, the Grenada invasion, the Panama invasion, the Iraq-Iran war, Desert Storm, etc... etc... War on drugs and the Columbia Plan and now
the Mexico Plan.
Hmmm, so how is it then that nice people like Jim and Woody are able to deny such things in their minds? Surely, its clear that theirs and others
denial is not based in empirical thought of their own, while instead their response is pre-programmed, in utter denial of any and all facts and yet
they are smug, arrogant and certain without question.
So here we are. The reported violence is a form of terrorism. There is terrorism in the form of journalistic theater and actual victims such as the
ones we know about here.
If we are to be outraged and angry, should we be angry at each other? It certainly comes easier and with less threat to spout obscenities at seniors
on BN while instead we can and we should target our outrage at the historical perpetrators of these attacks which precipitate Militaristic
intervention. We should be absolute in our understanding of the role of the Military and government in these attacks. We are a community that together
can end the lies and the attacks and the increasing control and intimidation tactics if we see each other as a community of common goals and common
interests that must at all costs work together against the enemy.
Now, for Jim and Woody, I hold no ill will toward you, I don't lay blame on you though I ask you to consider the issues more broadly, review the
history and consider the issues with an open mind and open discussion. Take time to consider the issues and evolve your conclusions toward one that
considers the whole of us as a community with a clear enemy, one that is theatrical, patternistic, immoral and clearly one which is powerful and
clearly evil.
Jim and Woody if you are unwilling to take the time and energy to consider the history and the present and yet persist in arrogance, be aware that
arrogance, self-importance and denial of the clear historical and present facts before us is in particular a piece of the theater which reinforces the
terror because it leaves us with only one other conclusion: the terror has no target nor reason - we are powerless, which by the way is false.
[Edited on 12-12-2008 by gnukid]
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woody with a view
PITA Nomad
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what you are saying makes sense but without more than one incident from every conflict going back 200 years i can't commit to more than a maybe. i
agree with the arrogant american scenario but also in the information that is diseminated (sp?) to us, and that it is generally truthful. i don't
believe that the u.s. was involved in 9-11 but i remember oliver north was guilty as hell for selling weapons for coaine in central america. who is
perfect? i'd rather have my american freedoms (and the things that go with) more than anything you, or anyone else can offer.
whatsa matter? you don't like my twirly hat?
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gnukid
Ultra Nomad
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I named a few incidents that are documented, acknowledged and publicly known as declassified black intelligence operations. These are a few from a
long list that are available for any interested person to look into, many books are published, many declassified documents etc... The point I was
making to you, was not to "teach" about every incident, that's up to you, I am neither interested nor an expert, but the ones I noted are a few in a
long line of operations which have provoked funding and militaristic intervention as we see with Plan Mexico.
On the other hand, there has never been an unprovoked independent attack on the US except possibly Perl Harbor which we have since learned was
provoked and a great deal of evidence is available and published now-which is really sad.
So, knowing that there are few in any unprovoked attacks except those by the US military black operations which by the way increases their budgets
yearly at a level far exceeding any other funded operation worldwide, even exceeding our known military expenditures, how long will it take for anyone
or everyone to come to the obvious conclusions?
The only thing more surprising than the history and consistency of USA backed violence against our own people and foreign nations is that sheer
Arrogance in denial by Americans of the facts before them which itself is fantastic. The level of programming achieved by the media machines to stop
independent thought and cause extreme, caustic arrogant self-importance must be a grand achievement of the propaganda machine which runs integral with
military control mechanisms.
No wonder then, that I receive a daily job offer to go work for the Navy as a Communications Specialist...
Well, I appreciate our community, your comments Jim and all of the people in Baja who have taught me so much about community and about thinking and
doing for yourself with respect for others. We can and we will end this nonsense just as soon as we each use our mental capabilities to see and
interact fully and independently. With that the false flag theater loses its power like a soapy bubble popped as it blows in the wind.
[Edited on 12-12-2008 by gnukid]
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k-rico
Super Nomad
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Location: Playas de Tijuana
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gnukid,
Boil it down for me. Why is the US causing the violence in Mexico and how is it doing it? What's the motive, what are the means?
Try to be brief.
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