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astrobaja
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Fireplace woes!
A few days ago we noticed soot marks around the vigas that but up to our fireplace! Worrysome to say the least! Initially we thought ok some of the
mortor has fallen off and the smoke is taking the path least resistence. We got on the roof to inspect the situation, the idiots had actually left the
viga ends exposed within the flue!!! We scraped the ends with a piece of rebar thankfully its only on the surface but still how incredibly stupid! Not
sure how to remedy this, but I found a product online for high temp chimney repair
http://www.koppclay.com/refractory_mortar_heat_stop.html
Still would have to somehow gouge out some of the viga so that its slightly inset to the flue!
I swear there are days I would like to put our contractor in a set of gallows and throw horsecrap at him!
\"There is a theory which states that if ever anyone discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear
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Santiago
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AB: Let me get this straight; the beam in the photo not only is resting on the wall but goes past the wall and INTO the flue? Is the back of the
wall also the inside of the flue? What is the flue made from, block? Is this in the attic, if you have one, or outside?
Post some more pictures, especially the outside - there's lots of good builders on this board.
Throwing horsepucky at the guy while he is hanging seems useless. I'd start throwing before.
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DENNIS
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| Quote: | Originally posted by astrobaja
I swear there are days I would like to put our contractor in a set of gallows and throw horsecrap at him! |
You're supposed to do that when negotiating the contract. It keeps him thinking of the future...his and yours.
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Santiago
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Is this picture taken from inside the home or from an exterior patio? Does the side of the beam butt the brown wall or does it sit on the wall? Is
the beam there 'for looks' or does it actually support anything?
It might be possible to cut the beam flush with the end wall, dig the end out through the flue and put cement in the hole where the beam end was.
And I'm saying this as gently as I can; wasn't it clearly visible during the frame stage that the beam was in the flue?
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astrobaja
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Santiago,
The 1st pic I posted was one of the small side vigas. The centre vigas rest on top of the firebricks. All 4 vigas are exposed within the flue (flush
with the firebrick. Heres a pic during construction.
\"There is a theory which states that if ever anyone discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear
and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable.There is another theory which states that this has already happened\"
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our website: http://bajadarkskies.com |
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astrobaja
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So as you can see the 1st pic is a interior shot of one of the 2 side vigas. Behind the fireplace is a closet with another large viga which also shows
signs of soot. The ceilings are 14-15 feet or so high.
\"There is a theory which states that if ever anyone discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear
and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable.There is another theory which states that this has already happened\"
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our website: http://bajadarkskies.com |
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Santiago
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OK, Now I get it. The ends of the two ridge beams and the ends of the two sloped beams are all inside the flue. Right? And I see why it was not
visible during construction - you would actually have to climb up on the roof and look down the flue to see if there are beam ends in it; not
something you would consider needing to do. The top of the chimney must be 2 or 3 feet above the roof ridge? The only thing I can think of right
away is to remove the top part of the chimney down to the roof jack (there is a roof jack, right?) so you can get to the ends of the beam to grind
them back far enough.
Mucho problemo.
Maybe Diver will jump in here - he's better at this stuff than I am.
Why didn't the building inspector catch this????
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vandenberg
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Looking at your pictures, one gets the impression that the center beam and the roof support timbers are inside the flu area? Tell me I'm wrong please,
otherwise it's the guy who designed this, who should get hung.
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Santiago
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Van: My impression is that the masonry is carrying the load and the 4 beams don't actually come together; it's just that the ends were left wild to
stick into the flue. Maybe AB could post a photo looking down into the flue from on top.
I'm assuming that his fireplace does not have flue liners like these that are inside a brick chimney. Instead, I suspect that the flue and the
chimney are the same.
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DENNIS
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Santiago
Why didn't the building inspector catch this????
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This is really considered rural, way up in the Sierra. Even where I live, it's rural. No inspectors or building permits, studies or anything.
That will soon change.
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Santiago
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AB: I called my mason and sent him your pictures. He said that you might get lucky and find a liner like in the picutres above that would fit into
your flue that you could slide down from the top and grout them in. Long shot but it might work.
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astrobaja
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Santiago: The only consolation I find is that the "maestro" (I use the term very loosely here!) will be the one in the flue grinding those vigas back
not me! We have been in contact with him and he said he would come out.
The top of the chimney is two feet high above the roofline, its made of concrete and has a little roof that will need to be removed. one good thingis
its big enough that a person will fit inside (not santa sized though).
Yeah a building inspector WOULD have caught that BUT since we live so far away from pretty everything nobody even knew we were building here! Heck we
did'nt even need a permit!!
\"There is a theory which states that if ever anyone discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear
and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable.There is another theory which states that this has already happened\"
Douglas Adams
our website: http://bajadarkskies.com |
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Santiago
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| Quote: | Originally posted by astrobaja
Santiago: The only consolation I find is that the "maestro" (I use the term very loosely here!) will be the one in the flue grinding those vigas back
not me! We have been in contact with him and he said he would come out.
The top of the chimney is two feet high above the roofline, its made of concrete and has a little roof that will need to be removed. one good thingis
its big enough that a person will fit inside (not santa sized though).
Yeah a building inspector WOULD have caught that BUT since we live so far away from pretty everything nobody even knew we were building here! Heck we
didn't even need a permit!! |
Good! I'm glad the guy will fix his problem - if nothing else, the next time HE will crawl up on the roof to make sure his workers didn't do this. I
was only kidding about the inspector - I realize that you have to drive through the boonies just to get to your spot - that's what makes it special.
If I were you, I would never clean the soot off the beam - will make a great story through the years.
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capt. mike
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looking at that elevational shot of the FP front i'd say he left his level at home too.
or it's an illusory image from camera tilt.
people do what you inspect, never what you expect.
the best stories are when the people give $$ to the builder and leave for 4 months and then come back thinking it will be DONE and RIGHT.
price, service, quality - pick any 2.
formerly Ordained in Rev. Ewing\'s Church by Mail - busted on tax fraud.......
Now joined L. Ron Hoover\'s church of Appliantology
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arrowhead
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You may just want to insert a metal flue pipe, like the way they now build chimneys NOB, and leave the wood alone. I imagine those beams are bearing
the weight of the roof and taking off wood at the point where all the roof weight is transferred to the chimney cannot be too good.
No soy por ni contra apatía.
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Packoderm
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I think I'd just put in a wood burning stove insert and run the metal flue up and to one side of the beam. That would be easy-peasy and save on
precious wood.
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monoloco
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In the states there are companies who reline chimneys by putting a type of inflatable hose like form into it then pouring concrete around it. The form
is then deflated and pulled out. You may be able to find someone in SoCal with one you could rent.
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astrobaja
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Thanks for all the input and ideas!
At this time the fireplace is our main source of heat since our in floor hydronic system is not yet working properly (thanks to Soltec of Rosarito!),
but next month we hope to have it up and running.
Its too bad we just noticed it cause it gets to below freezing here at night, good thing the adobe walls have lots of thermal mass and hold heat
well!
One thing we do have is almost limitless supplies of dead wood to cut up, so sure an insert would be more efficient but the fireplace is mainly about
asthetics.
The fireplace does not have a liner like in the pic you posted Santiago, and its so big that it mmay be difficult to find a liner to fit. I'm thinking
chop out 1/4 to 1/2 inch of the vigas and apply that high temp flue repair mortor like in the link at the top of the thread. Just to apply it from the
top down to just below the problem area.....
\"There is a theory which states that if ever anyone discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear
and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable.There is another theory which states that this has already happened\"
Douglas Adams
our website: http://bajadarkskies.com |
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astrobaja
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An update:
Mario our head albinile was nice enough to come out 2 days later on a Sunday to fix our problem. We concluded it would be easier to break into the
side of the fireplace near the viga than go in from the top (it was raining, verging on snow that day). He brought a product made by Cemenquin, a
mortor for high temp applications. So he chipped out about a 1/2 inch on all four exposed vigas used a small piece of wire mesh and remortered the
area. Luckily we had leftover firebricks to patch up the hole.
In time we may decide to do some sort of liiner but we will see if this patch holds and inspect it from time to time. After he was done we took Mario
and his tag along nephew to the park to see the snow (neither Marios nephew or his helper from Mexicali had ever seen snow before!). So now on to
fixing our other issues!
\"There is a theory which states that if ever anyone discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear
and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable.There is another theory which states that this has already happened\"
Douglas Adams
our website: http://bajadarkskies.com |
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DENNIS
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Sounds like a good fix, Mike. Just a suggestion...I might drill a small hole, easy to patch and cover, in that Viga near the hot end and insert a
thermometer and see how hot it may still be getting up to.
Just a thought.
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