| Pages:
1
2
3 |
arrowhead
Banned
Posts: 912
Registered: 5-5-2009
Member Is Offline
|
|
Bribery study in Mexico says police the problem
http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/2010/mar/25/bribery-study...
| Quote: | Bribery study in Mexico says police the problem
By ALEXANDRA OLSON, Associated Press Writer
Thursday, March 25, 2010 at 4:43 p.m.
MEXICO CITY — Police are the biggest culprits when it comes to demanding bribes in Mexico, a study on corruption says.
The questionnaire and analysis, conducted by the U.S.-based BRIBEline, found that 85 percent of bribe demands came from people associated with
Mexico's government. Forty-five percent of total demands came from police, 12 percent from federal government officials and the rest from local
officials, the judiciary, the military or ruling party officials.
Published Thursday, the Mexico analysis was based on 151 reports received from July 2007 to January 2010.
"The rate of extortion demands in Mexico is very high, and the level of police extortion is high," said Alexandra Wrage, president of the nonprofit
association TRACE International that set up BRIBELINE and helps companies combat bribery. "This is sort of frightening."
The BRIBEline Web site, available in 21 languages, was set up in 2007 and allows people around the world to anonymously report bribe requests, using a
multiple choice questionnaire. The goal is to study bribe patterns in countries around the world.
Almost 50 percent of Mexican respondents said extortion was the purpose of bribe demands, including payment to avoid harm to personal or commercial
interests. Less than 30 percent said they were asked to pay bribes to get preferential treatments, such as winning business contracts.
BRIBEline does not measure how widespread bribery is any country, but other studies have said it is pervasive in Mexico.
Mexican President Felipe Calderon has acknowledged that police corruption is entrenched. Since he took office in late 2006, thousands of police
officiers have been arrested or fired for corruption, including ties to drug cartels and other criminal gangs.
About 65 percent of the bribe requests in Mexico were for less than $5,000. Wrage said that would make it difficult for a company to track how much
money it loses to bribes.
More than 60 percent of Mexican respondents said they were asked to pay the same bribe repeatedly over the course of a year.
Mexico's Interior and Public Safety departments did not respond to requests for comments on the report. |
Be sure to read the reader's comment from our own Bajagringo, who insists that Mexico cannot hold a candle to the level of corruption in the US. Like
I've been saying all along, Mexico is chock full of America-hating Americans.
No soy por ni contra apatía.
|
|
|
Woooosh
Banned
Posts: 5240
Registered: 1-28-2007
Location: Rosarito Beach
Member Is Offline
Mood: Luminescent Waves at Rosarito Beach
|
|
Looks like Janet got unjustly pounded today by the Union Tribune editorial staff...
"Napolitano off base in comments about battle against cartels
Homeland Security Secretar y Janet Napolitano has a knack for sticking her foot in her mouth. Even in an administration where high-level officials
starting with Vice President Joe Biden are known to say the wrong thing into open microphones, Napolitano's special gift is that she charges into
very sensitive areas and then, with reckless abandon, utters insensitive remarks. In the process, she takes an already tense situation and increases
the tension. When she is not falsely claiming that some of the 9/11 hijackers came to the United States across the Canadian border, or proclaiming
that “the system worked“ after the attempted bombing of a jetliner on Christmas Day was averted by quickthinking passengers, Napolitano makes time to
alienate one of our closest allies and a full-fledged partner in one of the most important armed conflicts in the history of the hemisphere: the
Mexican War against drug cartels.
When Napolitano was asked during a recent interview on MSNBC what could be done to prevent additional drug violence, like the killing of three people
connected to the U.S. consulate in Ciudad Juarez, she said: “President Calderón of Mexico has been deeply involved, even sending in the military into
Juarez. That hasn't helped.“
Come again? The Mexican government's decision to use the military to fight, capture and, if necessary, kill druglords hasn't helped? The military's
seizure of millions of dollars of cash and drugs hasn't helped turn up the pressure on the drug traffickers? Mexican officials, who are already under
tremendous pressure, were understandably upset at having their efforts criticized as inadequate. And, they noted, the Mexican military has scored some
impressive takedowns of high-level cartel chieftains, including leaders of Tijuana's Arellano Félix organization and the killing of Arturo Beltran
Leyva during a raid last year on an apartment in Cuernavaca. Other important arrests followed.
How could Napolitano say something so foolish? From her office on the Potomac, she evidently can't see what has been helpful in Mexico and what hasn't
been. Of course, the Mexican military can't prevent every act of violence, any more than U.S. intelligence agencies can prevent ever y act of
terrorism. Yet imagine what the situation would look like if this battle was being carried out solely by Mexico's local law enforcement, which is
often corrupt or outgunned or both. Also, Napolitano must have forgotten that Calderón is a friend and ally, and that President Barack Obama has
committed himself and his administration to helping Calderón win the drug war, and that Congress has promised $1.4 billion in aid to Mexico through
the Merida Initiative. This week, Secretary of State Hillary Clinton lead an unusually large delegation of senior administration officials to Mexico
City, and pledged even more support for Calderón's war against the cartels.
Napolitano should choose her words more carefully in the future or her future in government service could be short-lived."
\"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing\"
1961- JFK to Canadian parliament (Edmund Burke)
|
|
|
monoloco
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6667
Registered: 7-13-2009
Location: Pescadero BCS
Member Is Offline
|
|
I guess it depends on how you look at corruption. Most of the corruption in Mexico is petty compared with the multi-trillion dollar daylight robbery
by bankers that took place in the US with the collusion of government and the Federal Reserve. In the US corruption is more institutionalized and not
as in your face.
|
|
|
Lobsterman
Super Nomad
Posts: 1682
Registered: 10-7-2008
Member Is Offline
|
|
Good point!
|
|
|
MrBillM
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 21656
Registered: 8-20-2003
Location: Out and About
Member Is Offline
Mood: It's a Zip-a-Dee-Doo-Dah Day
|
|
Those Wascally Bankers
Have you noticed that Loco can work the evil conspiracies of American and International Bankers into ANY subject ?
You might be discussing the best cleaner to rid your toilet bowl of its brown ring and he could bring those evil Bankers in.
Those Birchers ARE focused.
|
|
|
monoloco
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6667
Registered: 7-13-2009
Location: Pescadero BCS
Member Is Offline
|
|
So MrBill, you don't think that there was corruption involved with the current banking scandals? Maybe it was all just a big mistake that no one could
have seen coming.
[Edited on 3-26-2010 by monoloco]
|
|
|
arrowhead
Banned
Posts: 912
Registered: 5-5-2009
Member Is Offline
|
|
| Quote: | Originally posted by monoloco
So MrBill, you don't think that there was corruption involved with the current banking scandals? Maybe it was all just a big mistake that no one could
have seen coming.
|
Well, you obviously have no clue as to the meaning of the word "corruption". Let us review:
Corruption: lack of integrity or honesty (especially susceptibility to bribery); use of a position of trust for dishonest gain.
Now as to monoloco's argument, one could say that what happened to the economy in the US was a combination of patronage, greed, stupidity and neglect.
Corruption does not come under that. No government official or investment banker was paid under the table to make a mortgage where the borrower was
not qualified. Instead, the government, specifically the Democrats, rewrote the mortgage underwriting guidelines at Fannie Mae so more people could
qualify to buy a house. People who should never have qualified for a mortgage. Furthermore, no government official was paid under the table to do
something that he was supposed to do anyway.
What we have here is called a classic "Red Herring Argument", or "Ignoratio Elenchi." The name of this fallacy comes from the sport of fox hunting in
which a dried, smoked herring, which is red in color, is dragged across the trail of the fox to throw the hounds off the scent. Thus, a "red herring"
argument is one which distracts the audience from the issue in question through the introduction of some irrelevancy. This frequently occurs during
debates when there is an at least implicit topic, yet it is easy to lose track of it. By extension, it applies to any argument in which the premises
are logically irrelevant to the conclusion.
So, all the BajNomads can either stick to the subject of the thread, or they can run off after that red herring and discuss monoloco's new theme about
the problems he sees with the US.
By the way, here is an extra credit test for monoloco. Who was it that said: ¡Ya basta de corrupción!
a. Abraham Lincoln
b. Miguel de Cervantes
c. Felipe de Jesús Calderón Hinojosa
No soy por ni contra apatía.
|
|
|
monoloco
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6667
Registered: 7-13-2009
Location: Pescadero BCS
Member Is Offline
|
|
It is corruption when politicians and government officials neglect to enforce laws
or due the bidding for commercial interests that are not in the public interest to be rewarded later with plumb jobs in the industry they aided. Do
you not think that there was a quid pro quo when Robert Rubin left his position at Citi to be Treasury Sec and cheer lead the abolition of
Glass/Stegall (that Citi was already out of compliance with) then resigned to go back to Citi Group where he made 10's of millions of dollars? This is
only one example of the kind of high level corruption that exists in our government's incestuous relationship with banking and industry. Just because
they are way more clever and organized than taking envelopes full of cash under the table doesn't make them any less corrupt
|
|
|
monoloco
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6667
Registered: 7-13-2009
Location: Pescadero BCS
Member Is Offline
|
|
As far as Ya basta de corruption, I am sure it's be said by many.
|
|
|
Bajahowodd
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9274
Registered: 12-15-2008
Location: Disneyland Adjacent and anywhere in Baja
Member Is Offline
|
|
Who's Being Anti-semantic?
I suppose one could throw ethics and morality into the stew, as well.
|
|
|
BajaBruno
Super Nomad
Posts: 1035
Registered: 9-6-2006
Location: Back in CA
Member Is Offline
Mood: Happy
|
|
It may be important for some to understand that the BribeLine/Trace information is a report, not a scientific study. Voluntary reports on a survey
site are not considered reliable by any researcher. They may indicate certain trends, but there is no way to determine the significance of the data,
except to say that some people were asked for a bribe on some occasion.
There is no way to determine the prevalence of the problem, or even the extent, since many people are happy to pay bribes to escape punishment or
regulatory obligations, some don't have access to the internet or know about the reporting opportunity, and there is no control group to know how many
people are not asked for bribes.
These kind of reports generate a lot of sensationalism, but not much useful data.
Christopher Bruno, Elk Grove, CA.
|
|
|
Bajahowodd
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9274
Registered: 12-15-2008
Location: Disneyland Adjacent and anywhere in Baja
Member Is Offline
|
|
Good point. And, unfortunately, the back bone of the internet.
|
|
|
arrowhead
Banned
Posts: 912
Registered: 5-5-2009
Member Is Offline
|
|
| Quote: | Originally posted by monoloco
It is corruption when politicians and government officials neglect to enforce laws... |
Still chasing that red herring?
No soy por ni contra apatía.
|
|
|
arrowhead
Banned
Posts: 912
Registered: 5-5-2009
Member Is Offline
|
|
| Quote: | Originally posted by BajaBruno
There is no way to determine the prevalence of the problem, or even the extent... |
Your statement is catagorically untrue. There is a large volume of research in this area. Try reading this report (by Mexicans):
http://www.yale.edu/macmillan/mexicosdemocracy/sandoval.pdf
...or look at this report:
http://www.transparency.org/policy_research/surveys_indices/...
This is a very well studied area. You should see how many Spanish language studies there are on this subject.
No soy por ni contra apatía.
|
|
|
MrBillM
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 21656
Registered: 8-20-2003
Location: Out and About
Member Is Offline
Mood: It's a Zip-a-Dee-Doo-Dah Day
|
|
Manzanas, Naranjas y Otras Frutas
It's just that Loco and his fellows in the Welch Warrior Legion zero in on a particular favorite subject such as "International Bankers" and attempt
to drive every discussion, no matter how unrelated, back to that single obsession.
Now, MOST of us wouldn't think that say, Gustalfo Gordo Gonzales' corrupt act in accepting a Pig Taco or a Pole Polish from Juanita Maria Esperanza
Burrita down at "s y Mas" was a result of Citibank's activities in derivatives, but those in the Loco Legion could explain where that was the case
and, in fact, was determined back in 1916 before Gustalfo or Juanita were around.
WHATEVER the question, the answer lies with the Bankers. And, of course, Bush.
[Edited on 3-26-2010 by MrBillM]
|
|
|
BajaGringo
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3882
Registered: 8-24-2006
Location: La Chorera
Member Is Offline
Mood: Let's have a BBQ!
|
|
| Quote: | Originally posted by arrowhead
Be sure to read the reader's comment from our own Bajagringo, who insists that Mexico cannot hold a candle to the level of corruption
in the US. Like I've been saying all along, Mexico is chock full of America-hating Americans. |
Sorry to ruin your day but that must be another BajaGringo. I don't even have an account there to log on and comment. As far as "American-hating
Americans", you seem to be holding that title down all on your own based on the endless flaming posts and accusations you seem to hurl at
anyone/everyone who fails to share your point of view here on the forum.
But have a nice day regardless...
|
|
|
Donjulio
Nomad
Posts: 376
Registered: 5-19-2009
Member Is Offline
|
|
| Quote: | Originally posted by arrowhead
| Quote: | Originally posted by monoloco
So MrBill, you don't think that there was corruption involved with the current banking scandals? Maybe it was all just a big mistake that no one could
have seen coming.
|
Well, you obviously have no clue as to the meaning of the word "corruption". Let us review:
Corruption: lack of integrity or honesty (especially susceptibility to bribery); use of a position of trust for dishonest gain.
Now as to monoloco's argument, one could say that what happened to the economy in the US was a combination of patronage, greed, stupidity and neglect.
Corruption does not come under that. No government official or investment banker was paid under the table to make a mortgage where the borrower was
not qualified. Instead, the government, specifically the Democrats, rewrote the mortgage underwriting guidelines at Fannie Mae so more people could
qualify to buy a house. People who should never have qualified for a mortgage. Furthermore, no government official was paid under the table to do
something that he was supposed to do anyway.
What we have here is called a classic "Red Herring Argument", or "Ignoratio Elenchi." The name of this fallacy comes from the sport of fox hunting in
which a dried, smoked herring, which is red in color, is dragged across the trail of the fox to throw the hounds off the scent. Thus, a "red herring"
argument is one which distracts the audience from the issue in question through the introduction of some irrelevancy. This frequently occurs during
debates when there is an at least implicit topic, yet it is easy to lose track of it. By extension, it applies to any argument in which the premises
are logically irrelevant to the conclusion.
So, all the BajNomads can either stick to the subject of the thread, or they can run off after that red herring and discuss monoloco's new theme about
the problems he sees with the US.
By the way, here is an extra credit test for monoloco. Who was it that said: ¡Ya basta de corrupción!
a. Abraham Lincoln
b. Miguel de Cervantes
c. Felipe de Jesús Calderón Hinojosa |
This has truly got to be one of the most ignorant and idiotic agruments against this point that I have seen. If you think the economic collapse wasn't
orchestrated you are just plain ignorant. Your college education and law degree doesn't even enter into the equation.
[Edited on 3-26-2010 by Donjulio]
|
|
|
monoloco
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6667
Registered: 7-13-2009
Location: Pescadero BCS
Member Is Offline
|
|
| Quote: | Originally posted by MrBillM
It's just that Loco and his fellows in the Welch Warrior Legion zero in on a particular favorite subject such as "International Bankers" and attempt
to drive every discussion, no matter how unrelated, back to that single obsession.
Now, MOST of us wouldn't think that say, Gustalfo Gordo Gonzales' corrupt act in accepting a Pig Taco or a Pole Polish from Juanita Maria Esperanza
Burrita down at "s y Mas" was a result of Citibank's activities in derivatives, but those in the Loco Legion could explain where that was the case
and, in fact, was determined back in 1916 before Gustalfo or Juanita were around.
WHATEVER the question, the answer lies with the Bankers. And, of course, Bush.
[Edited on 3-26-2010 by MrBillM] |
Come on now, we are talking about corruption here, surely you don't think
that it's a coincidence that the guys who run the Fed and Treasury reads like the Goldman Sachs reunion list. It's not just banking though, I'm pretty
sure some nice favors get done to facilitate defense dept. contracts, and all those high paid lobbyists on the hill are mostly all ex-congressmen or
staffers. If anyone thinks that there isn't high level corruption in the US government they are living in la la land.
|
|
|
BajaBruno
Super Nomad
Posts: 1035
Registered: 9-6-2006
Location: Back in CA
Member Is Offline
Mood: Happy
|
|
arrowhead, I was referring to the BribeLine/Trace methodology--and not that it was impossible to determine those factors from a properly designed
survey. I wasn't even saying that bribery doesn't exist--just that BribeLine/Trace internet surveys are not the way to determine it. Proper research
has been done, but it is pseudo research like BribeLine/Trace who get the press coverage. Please excuse me if I was unclear.
Christopher Bruno, Elk Grove, CA.
|
|
|
JESSE
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3370
Registered: 11-5-2002
Member Is Offline
|
|
| Quote: | Originally posted by arrowhead
http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/2010/mar/25/bribery-study...
Be sure to read the reader's comment from our own Bajagringo, who insists that Mexico cannot hold a candle to the level of corruption in the US. Like
I've been saying all along, Mexico is chock full of America-hating Americans. |
Your such an idiot.
|
|
|
| Pages:
1
2
3 |
![[*]](images/xmbforum/default_icon.gif){kind=icon}
