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Curt63
Super Nomad
Posts: 1171
Registered: 3-28-2009
Location: San Diego, Ca.
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Mood: Fish tacos and Tecate
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Restrictions on quad riding on beach in BCS?
I seem to recall some BN posts mentioning restrictions on riding quads on beaches in certain areas in BCS (interferes with Sea Turtle
reproduction/eggs??)
Does anyone know of these specific areas and where it is heavily enforced.
I'll be exploring La Paz, East Cape, Los Cabos and Todos Santos in a few weeks and dont need any trouble.
Cheers
No worries
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Packoderm
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If I recall correctly, some gringos made up some rules about that. They seem to want some enforcement as well.
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BigWooo
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Packoderm
If I recall correctly, some gringos made up some rules about that. They seem to want some enforcement as well. |
Mexican law actually prohibits driving in the maritime federal zone, although it only seems to be enforced in the more populated areas.
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Paulclark
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It is illegal to ride on the beach -- however enforcement is very low. I don't know about the Todos Santos side , but on the East Cape (Cabo Pulmo
and south) the beaches are patrolled during turtle season and in the Zacatitos area and south to Cabo San Lucas they do enforce no quads on the beach.
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Bob and Susan
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a couple of years ago i talked to the delagato of profepa and
he said it was illegal to drive on the beaches but
there wasn't enough people to enforce it everywhere
education will correct the problem later
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dtutko1
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In the Pescadero and Todo Santos area there are signs at all/most entrances to the beach prohibiting riding on the beach, but most gringos feel it is
there right to destroy turtle nests and ride regularly.
Dorado Don
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David K
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| Quote: | Originally posted by dtutko1
...but most gringos feel it is there right to destroy turtle nests and ride regularly. |
That's the silliest thing I have read yet!
So, Mexican nationals don't ride on the beach? How about horses, or just people walking??? A foot will go deeper into the sand than a quad tire.
Everyone should stay away from turtle nests, but a quad is probably the least harmful way to travel the beach.
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Lee
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Location: High in the Colorado Rockies
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MX nationals AND gringoes break a law by riding quads on beaches
For whatever reason MX made this law, PROFEPA is aware of it, and given the chance, WILL enforce it.
The Todos people are more militant about turtle nests being disturbed. (PROFEPA is known to appear on Todos beaches enforcing fish limit and, I
assume, vehicle laws.)
My experience is that MX nationals care less about tearing up beaches or running over turtles than gringoes. Many gringoes are simply ignorant of
the law.
I rarely see quads going at a slow speed; I do see most full throttle and reckless.
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mtgoat666
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| Quote: | Originally posted by David K
| Quote: | Originally posted by dtutko1
...but most gringos feel it is there right to destroy turtle nests and ride regularly. |
That's the silliest thing I have read yet!
So, Mexican nationals don't ride on the beach? How about horses, or just people walking??? A foot will go deeper into the sand than a quad tire.
Everyone should stay away from turtle nests, but a quad is probably the least harmful way to travel the beach. |
dk:
as usual you are so full of it your eyes have turned brown:
It is widely recognized that beach driving can cause serious ecological impacts by potentially destroying nesting areas for sea turtles and birds such
as the piping plover and damaging or destroying vegetation and dunes. Shore erosion can be accelerated by careless beach driving and vehicles on the
beach can be a safety hazard to beach goers.
Beach driving:
Vehicles can crush developing eggs and pre-emergent hatchlings, and the tire ruts can trap hatchlings in the sand, exhausting them and making them
even more vulnerable to predators. Hatchlings can escape from a 3-cm-deep footprint, but not from a tire rut of the same depth. At night vehicles
disturb nesting females and crush hatchlings on their way to the water.
Human presence on the beach:
Foot traffic can also damage eggs and hatchlings, and uncontrolled visitations at night can cause turtles to abort nesting attempts.
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David K
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Goat, you are agreeing with me about the human foot impact... However, you blindly use the word 'vehicles' without consideration as to the many
different vehicles there are. Not all vehicles (or operators) cause damage... A quad, with wide, high floatation tires, driven normally, will barely
depress into the sand.
You also totally missed where I said everyone should just stay away from the nests.
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CortezBlue
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| Quote: | Originally posted by David K
Goat, you are agreeing with me about the human foot impact... However, you blindly use the word 'vehicles' without consideration as to the many
different vehicles there are. Not all vehicles (or operators) cause damage... A quad, with wide, high floatation tires, driven normally, will barely
depress into the sand.
You also totally missed where I said everyone should just stay away from the nests. |
How about Toyota Pick Ups with poorly engineered computer chips or gas pedals?
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tiotomasbcs
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Location: El Pescadero
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If people would only drive their quads below the low tide line it wouldn't be too bad. But they don't! Gringos & Mexicans alike race all over
the dunes, vegetation & other areas areas destroying the natural beauty. A few people always screw it up for the majority!!In Pescadero we
have full size pick-ups that drive up on the beach, pic nic, and then drive away leaving all their trash! Difficult & dangerous to confront
people so we pick it up. Except diapers! I draw the line with diapers!! Car ads on TV & magazines always show pick-ups on the beach. Bad
example.
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TonyC
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Thought, sea turtle, or not, us, or nationals....no driving on any beach. 
[Edited on 4-27-2010 by TonyC]
[Edited on 4-27-2010 by TonyC]
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gnukid
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4411
Registered: 7-2-2006
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| Quote: | Originally posted by tiotomasbcs
If people would only drive their quads below the low tide line it wouldn't be too bad. But they don't! Gringos & Mexicans alike race all over
the dunes, vegetation & other areas areas destroying the natural beauty. A few people always screw it up for the majority!!In Pescadero we
have full size pick-ups that drive up on the beach, pic nic, and then drive away leaving all their trash! Difficult & dangerous to confront
people so we pick it up. Except diapers! I draw the line with diapers!! Car ads on TV & magazines always show pick-ups on the beach. Bad
example. |
Below the median low tide line is a critical area for sea life to flourish, eggs are laid here, crabs live here, birds feed here.
Actually if you look at most beach areas in BCS, though not all, when they do draw the lines for properties, they take into account the federal zone
which is 20 meters from the median high tide line and above that is often a designated 7 meter zone for transit of vehicles and boats and concessions
and so forth. If there is no 7 meter zone there begins either a concession zones or property zones-it varies based on the land. In between the
properties will be periodic arroyo accesses. This is not always the case but it started out often in this manner as far as every beach front titling
document I have seen on the sea of cortez in BCS and often on the pacific. It depends.
It is legal and safe to use the beach accesses and the 7 meter zone when available and designated for vehicle traffic but one should not drive in the
tidal zone or the federal zone not use the beach for off road sport.
There are some beaches where it is common to use the entire beach for driving such as many hard pack areas and others where it is not common, you
should respect the common use. Generally one should consider whether you need to use the beach to transit or not for your purpose and avoid it if
possible. And you should consider the type of vehicle you have and what affect it would have. There are huge 750 4x4 quads and 2 wheel 250s which are
quite different.
Nowadays if you need to burn some gas in your wheeler or quad it advised to use arroyo trails which are often designated for such activity. This is
really where the problem lies, there are may gringos who love to burn up and down the beach starting at 5am in a manner which is illegal and against
common courtesy with no purpose other than to make noise and destroy the beach-they receive the wrath of the community.
It is best however that you don't get into a conflict with someone over this practice since it will result in a confrontation and you may be in the
wrong in specific cases that we have recently seen where aggressive gringos were put in jail for trying to stop some peoplefrom using quads in the 7
meter 'malecon' zone and on beach accesses as opposed to specifically in the tidal zone.
Because of recent conservation efforts there is an increase in sealife on reefs and we see more turtles this year which is demonstrable due to reduced
abusive practices.
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redmesa
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Posts: 580
Registered: 3-12-2008
Location: Van Isle and Bahia Asuncion
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People walking or fishing on the beach do not generally travel 5 to 10 miles and then repeat that route over and over. I do not run around and make
figure 8's in the sand. No one has even mention the noise pollution created by any motor vehicle on the beach or the danger to the people on the
beach. There is absolutely no rational reason to have a motor vehicle on any beach. It is all a negative for a few motorholics to have a buzz. To
argue that walking on the beach has even the remotest relationship to motorized vehicles is totally specious.
There I said it. I too have love my dirt bikes, jeeps and other off road fun stuff but not on the beaches of the world.
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Cypress
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Far too many people are either unable to walk any distance or choose not too. The later will lead to the former, and the results are the same.
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classicbajabronco
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Registered: 1-2-2010
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| Quote: | Originally posted by gnukid
| Quote: | Originally posted by tiotomasbcs
If people would only drive their quads below the low tide line it wouldn't be too bad. But they don't! Gringos & Mexicans alike race all over
the dunes, vegetation & other areas areas destroying the natural beauty. A few people always screw it up for the majority!!In Pescadero we
have full size pick-ups that drive up on the beach, pic nic, and then drive away leaving all their trash! Difficult & dangerous to confront
people so we pick it up. Except diapers! I draw the line with diapers!! Car ads on TV & magazines always show pick-ups on the beach. Bad
example. |
Below the median low tide line is a critical area for sea life to flourish, eggs are laid here, crabs live here, birds feed here.
Actually if you look at most beach areas in BCS, though not all, when they do draw the lines for properties, they take into account the federal zone
which is 20 meters from the median high tide line and above that is often a designated 7 meter zone for transit of vehicles and boats and concessions
and so forth. If there is no 7 meter zone there begins either a concession zones or property zones-it varies based on the land. In between the
properties will be periodic arroyo accesses. This is not always the case but it started out often in this manner as far as every beach front titling
document I have seen on the sea of cortez in BCS and often on the pacific. It depends.
It is legal and safe to use the beach accesses and the 7 meter zone when available and designated for vehicle traffic but one should not drive in the
tidal zone or the federal zone not use the beach for off road sport.
There are some beaches where it is common to use the entire beach for driving such as many hard pack areas and others where it is not common, you
should respect the common use. Generally one should consider whether you need to use the beach to transit or not for your purpose and avoid it if
possible. And you should consider the type of vehicle you have and what affect it would have. There are huge 750 4x4 quads and 2 wheel 250s which are
quite different.
Nowadays if you need to burn some gas in your wheeler or quad it advised to use arroyo trails which are often designated for such activity. This is
really where the problem lies, there are may gringos who love to burn up and down the beach starting at 5am in a manner which is illegal and against
common courtesy with no purpose other than to make noise and destroy the beach-they receive the wrath of the community.
It is best however that you don't get into a conflict with someone over this practice since it will result in a confrontation and you may be in the
wrong in specific cases that we have recently seen where aggressive gringos were put in jail for trying to stop some peoplefrom using quads in the 7
meter 'malecon' zone and on beach accesses as opposed to specifically in the tidal zone.
Because of recent conservation efforts there is an increase in sealife on reefs and we see more turtles this year which is demonstrable due to reduced
abusive practices. |
I have never ever in 7 years seen a turtle lay their eggs below the tide line...I have no idea where you could even come up with this from. You try
digging a 2-3' hole in the wet hard sand in the tide zone and see how long it takes you with the waves continuously filling in the hole....Turtles lay
their eggs way way up the beach in the soft deep sand far away from the waves....If turtles laid their eggs in this zone....there would be no such
thing as sea turtles because they would be extinct as all the eggs would all get washed out to sea.....ever notice how much the beach is continuously
changing in the tidal zone.....with a change in swell direction it's not uncommon to lose 10' of beach...
And how in the hell would a quad driving on the beach have any effect on the sealife on a submerged reef
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Osprey
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Location: Baja Ca. Sur
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Sea turtles take their time choosing nesting spots. They crawl above the wet beach, keep going away from the water until they find sand with little
salt. Not failsafe but that's their way of finding a safe, dry nesting spot. Storms change all that at times. One storm in Mazatlan ruined 1.5M eggs
laid far up on the beach.
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Pacifico
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Registered: 5-26-2008
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Here's something I found:
http://www.seaworld.org/infobooks/seaturtle/strepro.html
"Females of most species usually come ashore at night, alone, most often during high tide. A female sea turtle crawls above the high tide line
and, using her front flippers, digs out a "body pit." Then using her hind flippers, she digs an egg cavity. The depth of the cavity is determined by
the length of the stretched hind flipper."
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gnukid
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4411
Registered: 7-2-2006
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Pacifico
Here's something I found:
http://www.seaworld.org/infobooks/seaturtle/strepro.html
"Females of most species usually come ashore at night, alone, most often during high tide. A female sea turtle crawls above the high tide line
and, using her front flippers, digs out a "body pit." Then using her hind flippers, she digs an egg cavity. The depth of the cavity is determined by
the length of the stretched hind flipper." |
Awesome, had a chance to study with a leading phd candidate on this subject at the camp south of Todos Santos, she related there is little known about
Turtles habits for certain. Her thesis was that the females try to return to the exact location of their birth and lay eggs there, perhaps, she
thought, they prefered high tide combined with swell action that allowed them to arrive when ready to lay eggs and make it up enough to lay eggs
protected from the following swells.
So, weather, wind, tide, timing, location all related to allowing the female to lay eggs. Some turtles have been known to travel across the world
every other year as well. ... like Baja nomads...
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