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oxxo
Banned
Posts: 2347
Registered: 5-17-2006
Location: Wherever I am, I'm there
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Mood: If I was feeling any better, I'd be twins!
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The latest on Visas and Citizenship
I applied for renewal of my FM2 visa last week. I use and pay for an expediter to process my paperwork. By day, he is a manager in the San Lucas
Immigration office. I use him because it is nice to have friends in high places. Here is the latest from his office. Your experience and local
office may vary!
There is no more FM2 and FM3 visa. The FM2 visa has been replaced by the "Inmigrante" visa and the FM3 has been replaced by the "Noninmigrante" visa.
Expatriates continue to call them FM2 and FM3 and Mexican Immigration humors them since gringos are reluctant to use the new nomenclature.
The Noninmigrante (FM3) is a non-resident visa. The holder has unlimited entry and exit privileges throughout the year. It provides some additional
privileges under Mexican law such as obtaining a Senior Card. Requires annual renewal.
The Inmigrante (FM2) is a resident visa. The holder is limited to a maximum 180 days out of Mexico over a 5 year period. If you exceed 180 days in 5
years, you are issued a Noninmigrante (FM3) visa at your next renewal. An Inmigrante visa is the statement by the holder that he intends to become a
legal permanent resident of Mexico (not necessarily a citizen). There are even more privileges allowed under Mexican law. Requires annual renewal.
After 4 renewals (in other words 5 years) of the Inmigrante (FM2) visa with less than 180 days out of country during that period, the holder is
permitted to apply for an Inmigrado visa. This is the permanent resident visa. Once obtained, it is a lifetime visa with no annual renewals
required. It is similar to citizenship except the holder cannot vote in Mexico and you cannot hold land in the "restricted zone", you still have to
get a fideicomiso on your property.
You cannot submit an application for visa renewal more than 30 days prior to expiration of current visa. You must pick up your renewal within 90 days
after it has been issued.
Citizenship is a different ballgame. Citizenship is not processed by the Immigration office. Citizenship is processed by a different Secritariat in
Mexico City. You must hold a Inmigrante (FM2) visa for a minimum of two renewals! Six months after your second renewal (in other words two and a
half years after initial application for Inmigrante (FM2) status) the holder can apply for citizenship. There is no restriction on days out of
country.
(At this point, I said to my friend that this doesn't make sense! I said you are limited to 180 days in 5 years if you want to become a permanent
resident but there are no restrictions for time out of country if you want to become a citizen! My friend smiled at me and said "do you want me to
explain the rules or do you want me to explain logic? It is two different departments with two different sets of rules!")
Citizenship gives full privileges in Mexico including the right to own land in the "restricted zone" (no more fideicomisos), tax benefits when buying
or selling property, voting, and all kinds of other things.
This is the way it was explained to me. I am sure other Nomads have received other and different explanations from other Immigration offices. I
can't explain why. Take what I was told for what it is worth. Buena suerte.
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SFandH
Elite Nomad
Posts: 7217
Registered: 8-5-2011
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Thanks for the info. I'm interested in what the requirements to become a citizen are, besides the previous visa requirements. Anybody have a good link
to a Spanish or English website that spells it out?
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oxxo
Banned
Posts: 2347
Registered: 5-17-2006
Location: Wherever I am, I'm there
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Mood: If I was feeling any better, I'd be twins!
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| Quote: | Originally posted by SFandH
I'm interested in what the requirements to become a citizen are, besides the previous visa requirements. Anybody have a good link to a Spanish or
English website that spells it out? |
As it was explained to me.....the requirements are two and a half years with an Inmgrante visa and fill out the paperwork and pay fees in Mexico City.
If you are over 60, tests for Spanish literacy and history are waived. I have a friend who was a permanent resident for 25 years and over 70 who
received citizenship two years ago. She said she had to take no tests. Which was good for her because she speaks almost no Spanish after 25 years.
?pero, quien sabe?
I have a local friend who is a Mexican national who has walked other gringos through the citizenship process. She says she will fly to Mexico City
with me and walk me through the process (visiting about 6 different government offices over a two day period) when and if I am ready to apply.
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dtbushpilot
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3293
Registered: 1-11-2007
Location: Buena Vista BCS
Member Is Offline
Mood: Tranquilo
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Thanks for the update oxxo, check your u2u
"Life is tough".....It's even tougher if you're stupid.....
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 65117
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Online
Mood: Have Baja Fever
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Yes, well done oxxo!
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shari
Select Nomad
Posts: 13048
Registered: 3-10-2006
Location: bahia asuncion, baja sur
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Mood: there is no reality except the one contained within us "Herman Hesse"
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SF&H...there is an excellent agent in DF who helped me with my citizenship after twice trying to get it...he has also helped everyone I know who
became citizens and is a great guy and makes it very easy. He picks you up at the airport, you can stay in a nice suite he has in his house if you
want for no extra charge, he does all the running around and you just go sign the papers and he takes you everywhere and gets your passport in a 2 day
period...you have to go once to file the paperwork, and again to pick up your documents and passport. He is highly recommended....here is is contact
info...
Gilberto Pineula
dialing from mexico... 045-555-529-8701 maybe bajablanca has his email or contact Alonso Lopez in La Paz who works with him here in baja sur and
can set it all up for you too.
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RnR
Senior Nomad
Posts: 839
Registered: 5-1-2010
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Great Info! Thanks, Oxxo.
I was on track for citizenship on the five year program. (Four renewals on the FM2/Inmigrante visa) Oxxo's info just knocked two years+ off of this
timeline. WoooHooo.
Let's take this one step further to what happens at the fideicomiso/citizenship interface. If property ownership is transferred to the "new" Mexican
citizen and the fideicomiso is terminated, are capital gains taxes due on the property at the time of transfer??
And if so, at what rate?? And, which country is going to be standing in line with their hand out? (The USA, or Mexico, or BOTH????)
This seems to be the one of (if not) the primary reason for pursuing full Mexican citzenship. Anybody actually go through this process to full
ownership of property as a Mexican citizen?
If not, maybe I'll have a definitive answer in about three years .....
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Lee
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3578
Registered: 10-2-2006
Location: High in the Colorado Rockies
Member Is Offline
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Maybe Gilberto has changed his attitude or policy, you have to speak at a conversational Spanish level with Gilberto in person, by phone, or he won't
do business with you. Shari, has that changed?
| Quote: | Originally posted by shari
SF&H...there is an excellent agent in DF who helped me with my citizenship after twice trying to get it...he has also helped everyone I know who
became citizens and is a great guy and makes it very easy. He picks you up at the airport, you can stay in a nice suite he has in his house if you
want for no extra charge, he does all the running around and you just go sign the papers and he takes you everywhere and gets your passport in a 2 day
period...you have to go once to file the paperwork, and again to pick up your documents and passport. He is highly recommended....here is is contact
info...
Gilberto Pineula
dialing from mexico... 045-555-529-8701 maybe bajablanca has his email or contact Alonso Lopez in La Paz who works with him here in baja sur and
can set it all up for you too. |
US Marines: providing enemies of America an opportunity to die for their country since 1775.
What I say before any important decision.
F*ck it.
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oxxo
Banned
Posts: 2347
Registered: 5-17-2006
Location: Wherever I am, I'm there
Member Is Offline
Mood: If I was feeling any better, I'd be twins!
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Evidently, the requirement is that to obtain citizenship, you must hold Inmigrante (FM2) status for 5 years (which means less than 180 days out of
country).
But.......look what I just found in a Google search!
two years of residency if to the judgment of the Secretariat, she or he has performed or created outstanding works in a cultural, social,
scientific, technical, artistic, sports or business area that benefit the nation, in which case, the foreigner is not required to have resided in the
country for the number of years prescribed in the law;
Now this gets interesting! If an expediter can prove you provided "outstanding works" it looks like a two and a half window of opportunity does
exist! I appears that a creative expediter can put together a package with some recommendations from local nationals about your "outstanding works"
in Mexico and fast track your citizenship!
Again.......it is nice to have friends in high places!
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Bill Collector
Nomad
Posts: 374
Registered: 1-13-2004
Location: Buena Vista, BCS
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We became Mexican Citizens 5 years ago. We removed our fideicomiso without any capital gains due on our property. The process took about 6 months to
complete, it was easy. Our property taxes didn't increase, we thought it might but it didn't happen.
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bajaguy
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9247
Registered: 9-16-2003
Location: Carson City, NV/Ensenada - Baja Country Club
Member Is Offline
Mood: must be 5 O'clock somewhere in Baja
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| Quote: | Originally posted by soulpatch
Great news.
My wife, the Spanish teacher, would be the logical choice to get her citizenship first.
Me, the Spanish learner, may be a bit behind her......
I wonder how THAT"s gonna work out.
Of course, we'll be living in Nayarit and there is probably a whole 'nother set of rules and regulations there but we will see once we are living
there in December. |
Frank............
two years of residency if to the judgment of the Secretariat, she or he has performed or created outstanding works in a cultural, social, scientific,
technical, artistic, sports or business area that benefit the nation, in which case, the foreigner is not required to have resided in the country for
the number of years prescribed in the law...........
I think you have the requsite skills, knowledge and ability (former employment history) to contribute significantly to your new home.......just get in
good with the local FD's and the Jefes..........a little updated and ongoing training goes a long way!!!
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elskel
Nomad
Posts: 449
Registered: 10-9-2006
Location: Laguna Beach & Pescadero BCS
Member Is Offline
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When working with Senior Gilberto Pineula as an agent, what type of costs are we talking about to get through the citizenship process.
Thanks Brian
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bajajudy
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6886
Registered: 10-4-2004
Location: San Jose del Cabo,BCS
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by shari
SF&H...there is an excellent agent in DF who helped me with my citizenship after twice trying to get it...he has also helped everyone I know who
became citizens and is a great guy and makes it very easy. He picks you up at the airport, you can stay in a nice suite he has in his house if you
want for no extra charge, he does all the running around and you just go sign the papers and he takes you everywhere and gets your passport in a 2 day
period...you have to go once to file the paperwork, and again to pick up your documents and passport. He is highly recommended....here is is contact
info...
Gilberto Pineula
dialing from mexico... 045-555-529-8701 maybe bajablanca has his email or contact Alonso Lopez in La Paz who works with him here in baja sur and
can set it all up for you too. |
I have called this guy about 10 times, sent him at least as many emails and have never heard one word from him.
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RnR
Senior Nomad
Posts: 839
Registered: 5-1-2010
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Bill Collector
We became Mexican Citizens 5 years ago. We removed our fideicomiso without any capital gains due on our property. The process took about 6 months to
complete, it was easy. Our property taxes didn't increase, we thought it might but it didn't happen. |
This is EXACTLY what I was hoping to hear!
A first hand account that debunks a persistent myth...
Thank you. 
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BajaBlanca
Select Nomad
Posts: 13212
Registered: 10-28-2008
Location: La Bocana, BCS
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Gilberto will respond if you speak Spanish to him. He got in trouble for taking gringos to become CITIZENS and having them not at least communicate
the very basics in English.
He takes 24 hours to answer emails but he does answer them. I had a wonderful experience with him - two days to start process. Six months later,
another 2 days to finish the process. The passport is gotten as soon as you become a citizen and is charged separately and picked up the next day.
gpcpineda@hotmail.com
tel: 55 5529-8701
cel: 045 55 5419-6812
He is 100% on the up and up. The people in immigration told me that he is one of their preferred attorneys because he is so organized. I did take the
history test - one can get the questions and study beforehand and if you are 60 plus, no test, but you must understand basic Spanish.
I cannot remember the cost and my husband (who remembers in detail) is not here at the moment....but we paid half upon starting the process and the
balance at the end.
you need a CURP number
your immigration card or FM2
A letter saying you have commited no crimes (from your local delegado's office)
photographs
passport
original birth certificate - no exceptions
and if you have your husband's name added as your married name, a letter that states your married name is the same person as your single name. I had
my Brazilian passport with my single name and went with that.
as a latin american citizen (CHile,Bolivia etc.) one only waits 2 years with FM2
If you are married to a Mexican or have Mexican kids, there is NO wait time.
[Edited on 9-3-2012 by BajaBlanca]
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bajajudy
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6886
Registered: 10-4-2004
Location: San Jose del Cabo,BCS
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| Quote: | Originally posted by BajaBlanca
Gilberto will respond if you speak Spanish to him. He got in trouble for taking gringos to become CITIZENS and having them not at least communicate
the very basics in English.
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All my communications have been in Spanish
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shari
Select Nomad
Posts: 13048
Registered: 3-10-2006
Location: bahia asuncion, baja sur
Member Is Offline
Mood: there is no reality except the one contained within us "Herman Hesse"
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You have to be married to a mexican for 2 years to qualify for citizenship.
the test consists of just a few questions...I think it was 5 and you had to get 3 right...the test questions are taken out of a list of 100
questions....I remember one of my questions wasnt on the cheat sheet...dang.
I dont know if gilberto speaks english...I only spoke spanish to him and at that time he didnt answer emails nor will he call you back...ever...you
have to call him. It's a common mexican thing....never expect to get called back even if they say they will...you have to call them back.
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elskel
Nomad
Posts: 449
Registered: 10-9-2006
Location: Laguna Beach & Pescadero BCS
Member Is Offline
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approximately, how much money are we talking about?
thanks brian
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SDRonni
Nomad
Posts: 481
Registered: 8-28-2006
Location: Serra Mesa/Rosarito
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Bill Collector: Was there a fee (and how much) to dissolve the fideicomiso and change title to you as an individual rather than through the trust?
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Bill Collector
Nomad
Posts: 374
Registered: 1-13-2004
Location: Buena Vista, BCS
Member Is Offline
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The total cost to drop the fideicomiso was around $3,000 US dollars, that was having someone do all the work. We were told as Mexican Citizens we
couldn't have a fideicomiso on our property.
Barb
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