clevenhagenjs
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Posts: 19
Registered: 12-23-2004
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Great...Reward people for there illegal activity....
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JESSE
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3370
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| Quote: | Originally posted by clevenhagenjs
Great...Reward people for there illegal activity.... |
If you didnt give them jobs, they wouldnt be over there.
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David K
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Posts: 64854
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Location: San Diego County
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Yah, and if liberals wouldn't reward lazy Americans for not working then we wouldn't need to hire non-Americans.
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David K
Honored Nomad
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Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
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That's pretty funny Hose A!
We have three observations, so far:
1) Reward people for illegal activity. (ie. Bush trying to make a failed immigration program work, so employment seeking people won't be breaking the
law).
2) If you didn't give them jobs, they wouldn't be over there (in U.S.). (ie. Let them stay poor in Mexico, unless Mexico can seriously reform their
financial structure).
3) If the government here (U.S.) didn't pay people not to work, then all able bodied people would work (including ditch digging and house cleaning).
(ie. there would be no jobs available for foreignors).
Hose A or anyone care to discuss these points and what would be a workable solution?
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 64854
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
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Hi Jeff, in regards to why Mexicans are here 'illegally' to work... one opinion I put forward is that the many Americans that live on taxpayer's
extorted funds, doing nothing to contribute to our society, could do these jobs. Young people as well, whose parents continue to support them after
they are 18, could do these jobs.
So, since these jobs need to be filled, and lazy or spoiled Americans won't do them all, Mexicans (and others) gladley violate our borders to make in
one day that takes a week to earn in Mexico.
In my industry, I see it daily...
What is your observation? Why do you think Americans don't do all these jobs? If government didn't help, don't you think these jobs would be filled by
Americans (if they want to eat)?
Finally, do you support the president's efforts to make the failed immigration policy work, so that these otherwise honest Mexicans won't be 'illegal'
doing the work Americans refuse to do, because they don't need to, to survive?
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Braulio
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Posts: 321
Registered: 11-7-2002
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I agree with Hose a and Jeff - it's complex and probably unsolvable by governments. In the history of the world has a wall ever prevented the
migration of people? Maybe an army - but people?
The only solution I see is an equaliztion of the economies (US and Mexico).
Jeff - Yeah - it is a complicated situation - and it's complicated even more because there are activists from either side that aren't interested in
the truth. They only hear snipets of factoids that support their position.
A couple of factors that should be added to the list:
1) Greed of employers.
2) A debilitating increase in the black market economy in the US - something that keeps Mexico mired as a second rate country - imho.
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Eli
Super Nomad
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Location: L.B. Baja Sur
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I doubt that this will be true tomorrow,
But, I just had to read thru this tread twice because somehow or other, I agree with what EVERYBODY sez on both sides. I bet this will never happen
again, go figure.
Hasta....Sara
[Edited on 12-30-2004 by Eli]
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The Sculpin
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Mood: Riding into the Sunset, looking for a sunrise.
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Actually, the problem can be easily solved. You either get rid of the border so BOTH countries have equal access to all the other has to offer, or one
country annexes the other. That way, all the "illegals" will no longer be so, and Baja will look like Orange County.
See............
Easily solved!   
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TMW
Select Nomad
Posts: 10659
Registered: 9-1-2003
Location: Bakersfield, CA
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"or one country annexes the other."
I sure hope the USA doesn't annex Baja. That would bring every environmental wacko and his brother down on us.
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Dave
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6005
Registered: 11-5-2002
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You guys are wasting bandwidth.
You think that "revives bid to legalize illegal aliens" means Mexican illegals and the President thinks this discussion is about little green men from
Mars.
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Bajadtodebone
Junior Nomad
Posts: 36
Registered: 1-8-2005
Location: Kingston Springs TN/Campo Gecko
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Mood: baja dreamin'
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Illegal aliens
Not a defeatist attitude, just an observation. These people are here to stay, why not at least get a handle on who is in this country and why? As
for the issue of it being a religious or political issue, the truth is it is that for us Americans the issues are money and ethics.....more of the
former and less of the latter. Looking at the growth trends it appears to me the Mexican people will regain what they lost (read: taken away)! What
is the old saying about possession being nine points of the law? It was
shocking to me to learn how much of a Mexican community is growing in Nashville. And it extends even into the nations capitol. I guess we could just
stick our head in the sand. I guess this is not a situation begging for a "solution" rather an "adjustment" to changing times and conditions. It is
nothing personal, just history adjusting itself.
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JESSE
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3370
Registered: 11-5-2002
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| Quote: | Originally posted by David K
Hi Jeff, in regards to why Mexicans are here 'illegally' to work... one opinion I put forward is that the many Americans that live on taxpayer's
extorted funds, doing nothing to contribute to our society, could do these jobs. Young people as well, whose parents continue to support them after
they are 18, could do these jobs.
So, since these jobs need to be filled, and lazy or spoiled Americans won't do them all, Mexicans (and others) gladley violate our borders to make in
one day that takes a week to earn in Mexico.
In my industry, I see it daily...
What is your observation? Why do you think Americans don't do all these jobs? If government didn't help, don't you think these jobs would be filled by
Americans (if they want to eat)?
Finally, do you support the president's efforts to make the failed immigration policy work, so that these otherwise honest Mexicans won't be 'illegal'
doing the work Americans refuse to do, because they don't need to, to survive? |
David,
I dont want to sound racist, and since i dont live in the US my opinion can be inacurate, but i was watching a show that my girlfriend likes the other
day, Jessica Simpson reality show. Turns out they wanted to landscape their huge yard and plant lawn, so they go and hire these guys from a company
that helps jobless people, about 5 black guys and 2 white guys, so they show up next morning and all they did was waste the day working very poorly,
taking lots of breaks, and not doing much, so the owners of the house are angry and frustrated, they pay those guys and tell them they will call
them. So next day, they hire another contractor, this guys shows up
with 7 Mexicans ( looked like illegals to me) and wham bam they go at it hard and get the job done before the day is over.
Seemed to me that the illegals where more hungry, more willing to work hard, than the jobless guys, you work in the business Dave, could that be the
case?
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azusa_bob
Banned
Posts: 55
Registered: 1-12-2005
Location: Rose ah ree toe
Member Is Offline
Mood: Hot to Trot!!
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I say let 'em in!
How many times have you read a gringo post here asking about work in Mexico?
How many of you know gringos in Baja who work illegally?
How many times have you read a gringo post here asking or advising on how to smuggle goods across the border to avoid the "unfair" tax that Mexico law
provides for?
How can these same people (hypocrites) insist that breaking their breaking of the "unfair" Mexican law is reasonable, all-the-while insisting that
poor Mexicans cannot even pick up our trash or wipe our babies asses for 5 bucks an hour?
If your family was starving, would you consider it immoral NOT to hop a fence (and risk your life) and do whatever dirty work you could to feed them?
Do you think that these poor workers enjoy living as fugitives, and being away from their families for years at a time?
And next time that you get your car washed, buy produce, or eat in a restaurant ask yourself, "How much would this wash/corn/pizza cost me if this
estabishment hired my lazy, dope-smoking 17 year old son/daughter?"
:moon::moon:
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 64854
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline
Mood: Have Baja Fever
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| Quote: | Originally posted by JESSE
| Quote: | Originally posted by David K
Hi Jeff, in regards to why Mexicans are here 'illegally' to work... one opinion I put forward is that the many Americans that live on taxpayer's
extorted funds, doing nothing to contribute to our society, could do these jobs. Young people as well, whose parents continue to support them after
they are 18, could do these jobs.
So, since these jobs need to be filled, and lazy or spoiled Americans won't do them all, Mexicans (and others) gladley violate our borders to make in
one day that takes a week to earn in Mexico.
In my industry, I see it daily...
What is your observation? Why do you think Americans don't do all these jobs? If government didn't help, don't you think these jobs would be filled by
Americans (if they want to eat)?
Finally, do you support the president's efforts to make the failed immigration policy work, so that these otherwise honest Mexicans won't be 'illegal'
doing the work Americans refuse to do, because they don't need to, to survive? |
David,
I dont want to sound racist, and since i dont live in the US my opinion can be inacurate, but i was watching a show that my girlfriend likes the other
day, Jessica Simpson reality show. Turns out they wanted to landscape their huge yard and plant lawn, so they go and hire these guys from a company
that helps jobless people, about 5 black guys and 2 white guys, so they show up next morning and all they did was waste the day working very poorly,
taking lots of breaks, and not doing much, so the owners of the house are angry and frustrated, they pay those guys and tell them they will call
them.So next day, they hire another contractor, this guys shows up
with 7 Mexicans ( looked like illegals to me) and wham bam they go at it hard and get the job done before the day is over.
Seemed to me that the illegals where more hungry, more willing to work hard, than the jobless guys, you work in the business Dave, could that be the
case? |
Yes sir Jesse, that is how I see it... There are people who want to work those construction jobs here, and then there are people who don't want to
'really' work but still want to get paid. They have no pride in themselves or their work.
My Oaxaca amigo tries to always do high quality work. His American born cousin is also a good worker... so, it isn't always a national thing.
Most of those who want to work (here in north SD County) come here from Oaxaca and some from Guatemala. I have never seen a black American looking for
a job where the people wait to get picked up. I only once saw a white American amongst the latinos.
I might also guess, that Americans (white or black) would not get hired as much because builders know that latinos are better workers!
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