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vseasport
Nomad
Posts: 322
Registered: 2-28-2009
Location: Buena Vista, BCS
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Fact or fiction?
Fact or fiction?
Not much of a fishing report this week because there are not that many fishing. Off shore the showing of striped marlin and dorado has continued for
the few boats out there. In shore yellowtail are in the neighborhood but finding live bait has been problematic.
Fact or fiction Fluorocarbon has little or no stretch? At a Super Bowl party I posed this question. (Heck, the game wasn't worth watching and we
needed something to talk about.) The consensus was fact. I also asked seasoned sport writers and skippers who made their living sportfishing. The
result was the same. Everyone I spoke with agreed that fluorocarbon did not stretch much.
As it has turned out I and everybody I asked have been mis-informed. Fluorocarbon does stretch. In fact it may stretch more than monofiliment.
Last fall we switched all of our mono and florocarbon to Momio and it didn't take long for me to be convinced it is the highest quality product on the
market today. Speaking with the folks at Momoi we started a dialog about the characteristics of fluorocarbon. That is when I discovered my
perception was all wrong.
Hi-Liner Fishing Gear and Tackle that distributes Momoi in the US has a $10,000 machine specifically built to test line strength. They have
determined that their monofiliment can be stretched 100 times and will return to it's original length and strength without fatigue. They boast theirs
is the only mono produced with this ability. Putting fluorocarbon on the same machine they have found that it stretches as much or more than mono
before breaking.
How could I and so many others not be aware of this? I believed what Hi-liner was telling me to be true but wanted to do a little more research just
be certain. And there it was on Seaguar's web site.
"MYTH: Fluorocarbon has very little stretch or none at all.
FACT: Yes, fluorocarbon lines and leaders do stretch, but not as much as mono. Line typically has more stretch than leader. All Seaguar lines and
leaders provide the optimum amount of shock impact/stretch."
So it seems not everyone completely agrees to the degree of stretch, but I have come to the conclusion it has a considerable amount.
Posted are a collection of "Baja centerfold" photos captured on Jen Wren Boats last year.
7
Mark Rayor
teamjenwren.com
markrayor.blogspot.com
www.facebook.com/JenWrenSportfishing
US cell 310 308 5841
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captkw
Ultra Nomad
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Location: el charro b.c.s.
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Great info
its how the human mind works..if you perceive what everybody else is "told"it becames fact..just like the fact that japan was more than ready to
surrender but we had too drop the bomb !! 99.9 folks in the USA think that dropping the bomb (2) made the war end....That's because they have been
told over and over and over and over that lie..and as such it becomes a fact of their little minds and nothing will change their notion that they know
the facts ! !!
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Osprey
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3694
Registered: 5-23-2004
Location: Baja Ca. Sur
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Mark, the Momoi line sounds wonderful. Since you have a working relationship with them, how about asking them if they would be interested in a Nomad
field test. If they could send some line to a number of saltwater fishermen Nomads, I for one would be glad to use it, test it and report how it held
up against other lines used in this area, by local fishermen, for gamefish on standard salt water gear. OR WE COULD MAKE IT AN ALL OUT CONTEST -- we
would bet them against some reasonable odds for some small wager. Seems like it could be an advertising win/win for them.
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Barry A.
Select Nomad
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Location: Redding, Northern CA
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| Quote: | Originally posted by captkw
its how the human mind works..if you perceive what everybody else is "told"it becames fact..just like the fact that japan was more than ready to
surrender but we had too drop the bomb !! 99.9 folks in the USA think that dropping the bomb (2) made the war end....That's because they have been
told over and over and over and over that lie..and as such it becomes a fact of their little minds and nothing will change their notion that they know
the facts ! !! |
Cap't, there is gobs of info that refute the contention that "Japan was ready to surrender before the bomb". They were totally ready and able to
defend the homeland, and there are reams of plans and documents now available that prove that unconditionally. Do a little research.
http://vfw7016.org/JapanInvasionPlan.pdf
The "bomb drops" saved 100's of thousands of lives, if not millions, on both sides.
Edited to add the link.
Barry
[Edited on 2-8-2014 by Barry A.]
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captkw
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Posts: 3850
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Location: el charro b.c.s.
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Mood: new dog/missing the old 1
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As I stated in my post
Great example Barry..I've done Much research on this matter and It's clear..japan was attemping to surrender and not lose "Face" your welcome to
belive that old lie...But the known facts state otherwise..Most folks are not ready to look into it and just accept what they have told over and over
and over again !! I was surprised myself when I started to challenge and look into this subject...."good day"
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chuckie
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Location: Kansas Prairies
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mmmmph
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Skipjack Joe
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My research goes with captkw. Furthermore, the lie is repeated because the truth is historically embarassing.
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Cypress
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Location: on the bayou
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All I can catch down here in the marsh are red fish. Mighty good to eat, but not as glamorous as marlin. 
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Barry A.
Select Nomad
Posts: 10007
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Location: Redding, Northern CA
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Skipjack Joe
My research goes with captkw. Furthermore, the lie is repeated because the truth is historically embarassing. |
Conflicts in interpretation of the historical record, bias, and agenda by people supposedly in the know (but weren't really). At the least, I would
not call the Administrations position "lies"------like Iraq, a decision had to be made on the "best evidence" available, and subsequent investigations
have substantiated that decision, in both cases.
I am biased in that my Uncle was in on the ground-floor of the Manhattan Project, was in charge of all info concerning the Nagasaki bomb, and in fact
was aboard the aircraft as 'Weaponeer' when the bomb was dropped on Nagasaki. He retired as a Vice-Admiral. I have had long conversations with him
on the subject, and in fact he has written a book about it, but it was never published, but was directed and distributed to all Family members so the
truth from his perspective would be known. Because of his position, and his character, I believe him.
Barry
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monoloco
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6667
Registered: 7-13-2009
Location: Pescadero BCS
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Osprey
Mark, the Momoi line sounds wonderful. Since you have a working relationship with them, how about asking them if they would be interested in a Nomad
field test. If they could send some line to a number of saltwater fishermen Nomads, I for one would be glad to use it, test it and report how it held
up against other lines used in this area, by local fishermen, for gamefish on standard salt water gear. OR WE COULD MAKE IT AN ALL OUT CONTEST -- we
would bet them against some reasonable odds for some small wager. Seems like it could be an advertising win/win for them. |
I will volunteer for that duty, no one can abuse perfectly good fishing equipment better than me. Heck, this year, while battling
one of his buddies, I had a bull dorado jerk a rod holder right off the boat, sending the rod and reel overboard. I guess it didn't make much
difference what brand of line I was using on that one.
"The future ain't what it used to be"
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vseasport
Nomad
Posts: 322
Registered: 2-28-2009
Location: Buena Vista, BCS
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Osprey
Mark, the Momoi line sounds wonderful. Since you have a working relationship with them, how about asking them if they would be interested in a Nomad
field test. If they could send some line to a number of saltwater fishermen Nomads, I for one would be glad to use it, test it and report how it held
up against other lines used in this area, by local fishermen, for gamefish on standard salt water gear. OR WE COULD MAKE IT AN ALL OUT CONTEST -- we
would bet them against some reasonable odds for some small wager. Seems like it could be an advertising win/win for them. |
Osprey, I must admit reading your reply made me smile.
It was eye opening to learn that Momio has the lion's share of the market over the entire East coast. They sell more line in America than any other
manufacture. They don't need a contest to prove their line is the best. It is only the West coast guys that aren't aware. I'm jazzed that a buddy
turned me onto it.
If I could get Momio to give me product I would certainly use it. Fact is I just spent more than $1,000 for some product I purchased just to start
our season.
The perception that manufactures are giving us product is as off base as believing fluorocarbon has no stretch. In the old days we could get some of
the gear companies to throw us a bone. The fact is today everybody is working on tight margins and must account for their inventory.
That is not to say I don't get certain perks. Accurate doesn't give us reels but they do endorse us and just that benefit from a major manufacture is
huge. So, they scratch my back and I scratch theirs. It is about networking not getting product.
Some guys don't care and fish with budget tackle. That is okay. They are most likely the same guys looking for the least expensive charter which is
also okay. Others demand quality and are willing to pay for it. If you appreciate quality, spool up a reel or two with Momio and you will see for
yourself.
I was surprised to find Momoi in Minerva's and also several So CA tackle shops. It has always been there and I just looked right through it at the
brands I was familiar with.
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LancairDriver
Super Nomad
Posts: 1593
Registered: 2-22-2008
Location: On the Road
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Barry A.
| Quote: | Originally posted by Skipjack Joe
My research goes with captkw. Furthermore, the lie is repeated because the truth is historically embarassing. |
Conflicts in interpretation of the historical record, bias, and agenda by people supposedly in the know (but weren't really). At the least, I would
not call the Administrations position "lies"------like Iraq, a decision had to be made on the "best evidence" available, and subsequent investigations
have substantiated that decision, in both cases.
I am biased in that my Uncle was in on the ground-floor of the Manhattan Project, was in charge of all info concerning the Nagasaki bomb, and in fact
was aboard the aircraft as 'Weaponeer' when the bomb was dropped on Nagasaki. He retired as a Vice-Admiral. I have had long conversations with him
on the subject, and in fact he has written a book about it, but it was never published, but was directed and distributed to all Family members so the
truth from his perspective would be known. Because of his position, and his character, I believe him.
Barry |
Since this thread has already been hopelessly hijacked, I'll add another item of historical interest for Barry, involving his Uncle.
http://thelibertarianrepublic.com/complete-footage-bombing-n...
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bajagrouper
Senior Nomad
Posts: 964
Registered: 8-28-2003
Location: Rincon de Guayabitos, Nayarit, Mexico
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Mood: happy and retired
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Next you will say Columbus did not discover North America..........
I hear the whales song
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Barry A.
Select Nomad
Posts: 10007
Registered: 11-30-2003
Location: Redding, Northern CA
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Mood: optimistic
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| Quote: | Originally posted by bajagrouper
Next you will say Columbus did not discover North America.......... |
He didn't-------------the Norsemen did. 
---------and before them, the ancestors of the American Indian did.
---------etc.???
barry
[Edited on 2-9-2014 by Barry A.]
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Skipjack Joe
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8084
Registered: 7-12-2004
Location: Bahia Asuncion
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You are right. This thread has been hijacked. And I will no longer take part in it. Not because I have high principles but because there is no end to
this subject matter.
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Barry A.
Select Nomad
Posts: 10007
Registered: 11-30-2003
Location: Redding, Northern CA
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Mood: optimistic
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Skipjack Joe
You are right. This thread has been hijacked. And I will no longer take part in it. Not because I have high principles but because there is no end to
this subject matter. |
I agree, SkipJack, but I didn't bring the subject up.
Nuff said on that.
Barry
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Pescador
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3587
Registered: 10-17-2002
Location: Baja California Sur
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We tried Momoi but it breaks very close or under stated test and it just did not hold up to the abuse we give it with big yellowtail that are caught
on the rocks in our area. The theory that it is close to invisible is very good and it would always be good to have less visibility of line and this
becomes especially true when fish get a little on the skittish side.
In our case the solution was to use 80 lb spectra with 60 lb Green Berkley Big Game topshotted by threading the mono into the hollow spectra and
then serving the connection.
When we tried this with Seagur, Momoi, and one other, we simply did not get the strength needed and had line breaks. I think that is partly
because the shock strength is generally way below the slow breaking strength. When a yellowtail does violent head shakes something has to take up
that impact and shock and even with a rod with a more limber tip, we still got the breakage with Floro.
Another interesting side was that we would put on floro with one rod and green on another and we still seemed to get more bites on the green. That
can not be generalized to all fishing conditions because it is very specific to our area and fishing from 150-300 ft of depth.
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Osprey
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3694
Registered: 5-23-2004
Location: Baja Ca. Sur
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P.S. FWIW
Thanks for the info Jim. I've only had one break with my Brazilian Bear mono but it was a big blue marlin that got way out ahead of me when I was
asleep at the brain.
Never lost a fish to the failure of my Jinkai leaders.
[Edited on 2-9-2014 by Osprey]
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vseasport
Nomad
Posts: 322
Registered: 2-28-2009
Location: Buena Vista, BCS
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Pescador
We tried Momoi but it breaks very close or under stated test and it just did not hold up to the abuse we give it with big yellowtail that are caught
on the rocks in our area. The theory that it is close to invisible is very good and it would always be good to have less visibility of line and this
becomes especially true when fish get a little on the skittish side.
In our case the solution was to use 80 lb spectra with 60 lb Green Berkley Big Game topshotted by threading the mono into the hollow spectra and
then serving the connection.
When we tried this with Seagur, Momoi, and one other, we simply did not get the strength needed and had line breaks. I think that is partly
because the shock strength is generally way below the slow breaking strength. When a yellowtail does violent head shakes something has to take up
that impact and shock and even with a rod with a more limber tip, we still got the breakage with Floro.
Another interesting side was that we would put on floro with one rod and green on another and we still seemed to get more bites on the green. That
can not be generalized to all fishing conditions because it is very specific to our area and fishing from 150-300 ft of depth.
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Fact, Momoi 30# Diamond mono breaks at 58#s, maybe 56 or 57 on a bad day. Momoi Hi-Catch 30# breaks at 38#. Now, maybe not if you store your line in
the sun for a long period but then Avets preform as well as Accurates they just cost less. Nothing wrong with saving $$$
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captkw
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3850
Registered: 10-19-2010
Location: el charro b.c.s.
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vSEASPORT
Hola,Nice Pics and Info...I tried to find their website with no luck...and I as a west coast guy have never heard of it...thanx for sharing...do you
know the website for them??
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