BajaNomad
Not logged in [Login - Register]

Go To Bottom
Printable Version  
Author: Subject: July '23 Baja Bound Bulletin with articles by Martina, GregN, and David K.
David K
Honored Nomad
*********


Avatar


Posts: 64345
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline

Mood: Have Baja Fever

[*] posted on 7-27-2023 at 09:48 PM
July '23 Baja Bound Bulletin with articles by Martina, GregN, and David K.


Baja Bound Bulletin

Edit: scroll down if you use a cell phone to view...

[Edited on 7-30-2023 by David K]




"So Much Baja, So Little Time..."

See the NEW www.VivaBaja.com for maps, travel articles, links, trip photos, and more!
Baja Missions and History On Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/groups/bajamissions/
Camping, off-roading, Viva Baja discussion: https://www.facebook.com/groups/vivabaja


View user's profile Visit user's homepage
David K
Honored Nomad
*********


Avatar


Posts: 64345
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline

Mood: Have Baja Fever

[*] posted on 7-27-2023 at 09:58 PM


My article is about the Jesuit explorer Fernando Consag who had a sea expedition in 1746 to prove California was not an island (once again as many still didn't trust the many previous explorers).
Next, he did a long overland expedition in 1751 and another in 1753, all for seeking mission sites. Read the article and see what was Padre Consag's discoveries.




"So Much Baja, So Little Time..."

See the NEW www.VivaBaja.com for maps, travel articles, links, trip photos, and more!
Baja Missions and History On Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/groups/bajamissions/
Camping, off-roading, Viva Baja discussion: https://www.facebook.com/groups/vivabaja


View user's profile Visit user's homepage
David K
Honored Nomad
*********


Avatar


Posts: 64345
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline

Mood: Have Baja Fever

[*] posted on 7-30-2023 at 06:12 AM
If you use a cell phone to view...


You won't see the captions for the illustrations... Baja Bound Bulletin

I will add them here:



Map showing Mission de San Ignacio at the center-bottom, plus three proposed missions that are labeled as empezada (started). To the west is Mission de San Juan Bautista Emp. (empezada). To the northwest is Mission de los Dolores del Norte empezada. To the northwest of Dolores is Mission S M Mag. (Santa María Magdalena) empezada.



Map drawn by Consag in 1747 following his sea expedition. Note that his latitude figures are one degree too high. View Larger



Don Laylander's map with Cochimí placenames.



Discovered by Padre Consag on his 1753 expedition, this year-round stream of water at Calamajué was undrinkable. The 1766 mission was built on the upper left edge of this photo. Seven months later, this mission was moved about 30 miles north.


[Edited on 7-30-2023 by David K]




"So Much Baja, So Little Time..."

See the NEW www.VivaBaja.com for maps, travel articles, links, trip photos, and more!
Baja Missions and History On Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/groups/bajamissions/
Camping, off-roading, Viva Baja discussion: https://www.facebook.com/groups/vivabaja


View user's profile Visit user's homepage
liknbaja127
Nomad
**




Posts: 462
Registered: 1-17-2012
Member Is Offline


[*] posted on 7-30-2023 at 07:32 AM


Thanks for your help Dave.
View user's profile
David K
Honored Nomad
*********


Avatar


Posts: 64345
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline

Mood: Have Baja Fever

[*] posted on 7-30-2023 at 10:17 AM


Quote: Originally posted by liknbaja127  
Thanks for your help Dave.


De nada!
There is just so many great things in Baja... from the past to the present, where you can still see what things looked like in the past!

I am trying to make it easier to help others find or know about them as I modify my website: www.vivabaja.com where there is just "so much Baja" (and for me) "so little time" (compared to when I was younger)!

[Edited on 7-30-2023 by David K]




"So Much Baja, So Little Time..."

See the NEW www.VivaBaja.com for maps, travel articles, links, trip photos, and more!
Baja Missions and History On Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/groups/bajamissions/
Camping, off-roading, Viva Baja discussion: https://www.facebook.com/groups/vivabaja


View user's profile Visit user's homepage
Lance S.
Nomad
**




Posts: 132
Registered: 2-16-2021
Member Is Offline


[*] posted on 7-30-2023 at 12:14 PM


"The diary again gives much detail of the land, the people and the difficulties suffered. Many times, the expedition’s meals were provided by roasting agaves and collecting the abundant shellfish."

This is only true for the Cochimi footmen. Consag and the military contingent were fed well enough, they carried food for themselves. The cochimi, who found the routes, cleared the roads, set up camp, acted as translators, they had to fend for themselves.
They were sick and malnourished, Consag gave his permission for them to go to the coast for shellfish. Consag gave his permission for them to stop long enough to roast agave. Unfortunately they were not familiar with the variety and it just made them sicker.
View user's profile
David K
Honored Nomad
*********


Avatar


Posts: 64345
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline

Mood: Have Baja Fever

[*] posted on 7-30-2023 at 12:30 PM


Sounds like the Cochimí could have used a union?
Where did you read the Spanish soldiers and the padre had different food? Very likely they did, as agents of the King.




"So Much Baja, So Little Time..."

See the NEW www.VivaBaja.com for maps, travel articles, links, trip photos, and more!
Baja Missions and History On Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/groups/bajamissions/
Camping, off-roading, Viva Baja discussion: https://www.facebook.com/groups/vivabaja


View user's profile Visit user's homepage
Lance S.
Nomad
**




Posts: 132
Registered: 2-16-2021
Member Is Offline


[*] posted on 7-30-2023 at 10:07 PM


A few authors have brought it up, maybe Aschmann? The diary itself is very telling.

Regarding the so called lost missions. Since they were actual locations and always in regions that had yet to be converted I like Browne's term for them. "Pioneer Foundations".
View user's profile
Tioloco
Super Nomad
****




Posts: 1152
Registered: 7-30-2014
Member Is Offline


[*] posted on 7-30-2023 at 10:32 PM


Any info on the stream at Calamajue?
I never tasted it. Somebody know why it is not drinkable?
View user's profile
mtgoat666
Select Nomad
*******




Posts: 17024
Registered: 9-16-2006
Location: San Diego
Member Is Offline

Mood: Hot n spicy

[*] posted on 7-30-2023 at 11:09 PM


Quote: Originally posted by David K  
Sounds like the Cochimí could have used a union?


Never heard of slaves being unionized

Hard to unionize when the church is forcing your labor at the point of a sword!




Woke!

“...ask not what your country can do for you – ask what you can do for your country.” “My fellow citizens of the world: ask not what America will do for you, but what together we can do for the freedom of man.”

Prefered gender pronoun: the royal we

View user's profile
David K
Honored Nomad
*********


Avatar


Posts: 64345
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline

Mood: Have Baja Fever

[*] posted on 7-31-2023 at 11:10 AM


Quote: Originally posted by Tioloco  
Any info on the stream at Calamajue?
I never tasted it. Somebody know why it is not drinkable?


If you have been there, then the heavily salted edge of the stream and salt grass growing in it is a pretty clear indication it is not drinkable. One guidebook says that at the source it is drinkable and another says the water is warm where it emerges from the ground.

One thing for sure, a geologist and historian would both enjoy spending more time in Calamajué Canyon, at the gold ore mill, and at the mission... I sure would.
All my times there were enroute to somewhere else and beyond camping (1967, 1975) or just a short stop to take photos (1974, 1979, 2001, 2012, 2016), I have not spent free time wandering about. So much Baja, so little time!




"So Much Baja, So Little Time..."

See the NEW www.VivaBaja.com for maps, travel articles, links, trip photos, and more!
Baja Missions and History On Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/groups/bajamissions/
Camping, off-roading, Viva Baja discussion: https://www.facebook.com/groups/vivabaja


View user's profile Visit user's homepage
David K
Honored Nomad
*********


Avatar


Posts: 64345
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline

Mood: Have Baja Fever

[*] posted on 7-31-2023 at 11:42 AM


Quote: Originally posted by mtgoat666  
Quote: Originally posted by David K  
Sounds like the Cochimí could have used a union?


Never heard of slaves being unionized

Hard to unionize when the church is forcing your labor at the point of a sword!


Lack of knowledge leads to misguided actions.

*The 'church' never held the sword.

*The Jesuits respected the Natives and that is why they arranged to control the soldiers and paid for their mission program. They saw the brutality of the King's soldiers (in 1683) and vowed to not allow such activity which is counter-productive to their goals of a Christianized California.

*The King granted the Jesuits autotomy of California, and authority over the few troops assigned, as long as they financed their activities.

In 1767, the King (under false information) ordered the Jesuits removed and ended their autonomy of California.

The new civil authority ended the kindness afforded the Natives, and installed the Franciscan missionaries in 1768 (and five years later, the Dominicans). The Spanish governor is who ordered Natives moved about for labor needs, closed two of their missions, and other actions 'for the good of the many.'

Padre Junípero Serra tried to protect the Natives from these new soldiers' brutality and even traveled to Mexico City to gain some protective powers over the troops. Not all padres were so kind, but practices of the 1700s can not be compared to practices 300 years later for judgement. Yes, some things do seem very wrong by today's standards. When I was a kid, a nun could hit you with a ruler for not paying attention. 60 years later, an attorney would be called to remove the nun. Standards change!

Missionaries were still teaching the Natives how to live differently by growing and raising food instead of hunting and gathering. Because of the introduction of foreign diseases, from before the mission period by pearl hunters and pirates and later by soldiers, the Native population was in decline. The Dominican missionaries began inoculating the Natives at some missions against at least one disease to try and save them.

Your anger or blame should be directed at the heartless Spanish government of the late 1700s for the terrible events. The pearlers and pirates deserve blame for infecting the virgen land. However, everywhere new people contact another population, the spread of diseases are simply a fact.




"So Much Baja, So Little Time..."

See the NEW www.VivaBaja.com for maps, travel articles, links, trip photos, and more!
Baja Missions and History On Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/groups/bajamissions/
Camping, off-roading, Viva Baja discussion: https://www.facebook.com/groups/vivabaja


View user's profile Visit user's homepage

  Go To Top

 






All Content Copyright 1997- Q87 International; All Rights Reserved.
Powered by XMB; XMB Forum Software © 2001-2014 The XMB Group






"If it were lush and rich, one could understand the pull, but it is fierce and hostile and sullen. The stone mountains pile up to the sky and there is little fresh water. But we know we must go back if we live, and we don't know why." - Steinbeck, Log from the Sea of Cortez

 

"People don't care how much you know, until they know how much you care." - Theodore Roosevelt

 

"You can easily judge the character of others by how they treat those who they think can do nothing for them or to them." - Malcolm Forbes

 

"Let others lead small lives, but not you. Let others argue over small things, but not you. Let others cry over small hurts, but not you. Let others leave their future in someone else's hands, but not you." - Jim Rohn

 

"The best way to get the right answer on the internet is not to ask a question; it's to post the wrong answer." - Cunningham's Law







Thank you to Baja Bound Mexico Insurance Services for your long-term support of the BajaNomad.com Forums site.







Emergency Baja Contacts Include:

Desert Hawks; El Rosario-based ambulance transport; Emergency #: (616) 103-0262