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JESSE
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3370
Registered: 11-5-2002
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| Quote: | Originally posted by DavidE
Godamnit!
Screw the sicarios killing each other. It's extortionists, kidnappers, carjackers, protection rackets, and organized crime sanctioning neighborhood
FRANCHISES for criminals that is hurting honest citizens. How would you like to be freakin' awakened at midnight by a knock on your door by a group of
thugs that announce that for say a thousand pesos mensual your home would be free of breakins, and home invasions?
You guys are fixated on godammned drugs! Drugs are but a COMPONENT of the misery down here. Not a key, not a foundations, merely another brick in the
wall.
Legalized drugs will do Z-E-R-O to reduce the crime rate against citizens, get it through your skull that the end of prohibition did Z-E-R-O to end
the mafia in the USA.
Caleron is trying his best to thwart organized crime not just "Drug Cartels". Thugs have cops quaking in their boots an they refuse to respond to
normal emergency calls.
Damn it must be nice to sit in another country and pontificate about what is wrong in another. Try living HERE and not THERE. I mean LIVE, for months
and years not just a week's vacation.
Thank You For The Cahnce To Rant. |
The main power behind the drug cartels are the HUGE amounts of cash they use to corrupt and buy guns, and only drugs can provide that cash flow.
Legalizing drugs would ABSOLUTELY take away their cash flow, wich could not be replaced by gambling, kidnapping, etc etc
Without drugs, the cartels would be much weaker,and much more easy to deal with.
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Bajahowodd
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9274
Registered: 12-15-2008
Location: Disneyland Adjacent and anywhere in Baja
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Random thoughts:
Did not the PRD come "this" close to winning that last presidential election?
Are not both the PRD and PRI fundamentally democratic socialist parties, with the PRD running a bit to the left of PRI?
Is PAN really the only right leaning party in Mexico?
Didn't Calderon get a masters degree from Harvard?
We already kinda know what those Ivy League guys have done running the US.
Did not Calderon's predecessor Fox actually take that first swing at the hornet's nest with his bat? I refer to the cartels.
Supposing that as a small businesman, Jesse would support a right of center, business oriented party, seems to me that much of why the Calderon era is
left wanting, is the simple fact that PAN has not been able to gain a majority in either house of the Mexican congress.
In my opinion, and with a somewhat limited perspective, it would seem to me that any supposed cozying between the right of center president and a
national labor leader would reflect more negatively on labor.
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CortezBlue
Super Nomad
Posts: 2213
Registered: 11-14-2006
Location: Fenix/San Phelipe
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| Quote: |
Didn't Calderon get a masters degree from Harvard?
We already kinda know what those Ivy League guys have done running the US.
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I don't think Obama was an Ivy League guy
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JoeJustJoe
Banned
Posts: 21045
Registered: 9-9-2010
Location: Occupied Aztlan
Member Is Offline
Mood: Mad as hell
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| Quote: | Originally posted by DavidE
Godamnit!
Screw the sicarios killing each other. It's extortionists, kidnappers, carjackers, protection rackets, and organized crime sanctioning neighborhood
FRANCHISES for criminals that is hurting honest citizens. How would you like to be freakin' awakened at midnight by a knock on your door by a group of
thugs that announce that for say a thousand pesos mensual your home would be free of breakins, and home invasions?
You guys are fixated on godammned drugs! Drugs are but a COMPONENT of the misery down here. Not a key, not a foundations, merely another brick in the
wall.
Legalized drugs will do Z-E-R-O to reduce the crime rate against citizens, get it through your skull that the end of prohibition did Z-E-R-O to end
the mafia in the USA.
Caleron is trying his best to thwart organized crime not just "Drug Cartels". Thugs have cops quaking in their boots an they refuse to respond to
normal emergency calls.
Damn it must be nice to sit in another country and pontificate about what is wrong in another. Try living HERE and not THERE. I mean LIVE, for months
and years not just a week's vacation.
Thank You For The Cahnce To Rant. |
Wrong!
How can you say, Drugs are but a COMPONENT of the misery?' Drugs are the driving force of the Mexican drug cartels, and drugs are the bread and
butter. All the other things the drug cartels are involved in extortionists, kidnappers, carjackers, protection rackets...and other vices all pale in
comparison of the kind of money illicit drugs bring to the Mexican drug cartels.
If Mexico legalized or decriminalized the illegal drugs it would deal a serious blow to the Mexico drug cartel businesses just like it hurt Al Capone
and the Mafia when they ended Prohibition in the 30's and it radically decreased his Mafia's annual income. It wasn't the FBI and Eliot Ness that
dealt serious blows the the Mafia. It was the end of Prohibition that weakened the Mafia and all the bloodshed of the era.
Sure the drug cartels could do other criminal actives but things like kidnapping are time consuming and depending on who you kidnap the income isn't
that great.
The only thing not working is the Mexico/US "war on drugs" and really the USA needs to work on the "demand" side and the American citizen's
insatiable appetite for illicit drugs which has the Mexican drug cartels falling all over themselves trying to serve the demand of junkies from
America. It doesn't help either that the USA is supplying the Mexican drug cartels with all those weapons and limitless amount of cash from buying
drugs.
-------------------------
From Wikipedia The Mafia during Prohibition
By the 1920s The United States and the provinces within Canada had adopted prohibition (a law forbidding the sale of alcohol).[1] It was during that
era that North America gave birth to some of the largest crime syndicates, most vicious criminals, and mafia leaders. Al Capone, Bugs Moran, Johnny
Torrio, The Purple Gang, and Peter Licavoli became household names.[2] For the Mafia and the gangsters, prohibition meant employment, easy money, good
times, shiny new cars, and new suits.[3] The tainted money, prostitution, loan sharking, bookmarking, extortion and other criminal rackets paled in
comparison to the intake from bootlegging.[4] Prohibition created an atmosphere that allowed crime to fester, an atmosphere which the mafia exploited.
[Edited on 5-31-2011 by JoeJustJoe]
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GrOUper-GAr
Nomad
Posts: 107
Registered: 1-9-2010
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by DavidE
Godamnit!
Screw the sicarios killing each other. It's extortionists, kidnappers, carjackers, protection rackets, and organized crime sanctioning neighborhood
FRANCHISES for criminals that is hurting honest citizens. How would you like to be freakin' awakened at midnight by a knock on your door by a group of
thugs that announce that for say a thousand pesos mensual your home would be free of breakins, and home invasions?
You guys are fixated on godammned drugs! Drugs are but a COMPONENT of the misery down here. Not a key, not a foundations, merely another brick in the
wall.
Legalized drugs will do Z-E-R-O to reduce the crime rate against citizens, get it through your skull that the end of prohibition did Z-E-R-O to end
the mafia in the USA.
Caleron is trying his best to thwart organized crime not just "Drug Cartels". Thugs have cops quaking in their boots an they refuse to respond to
normal emergency calls.
Damn it must be nice to sit in another country and pontificate about what is wrong in another. Try living HERE and not THERE. I mean LIVE, for months
and years not just a week's vacation.
Thank You For The Cahnce To Rant. |
10 years ago, It was hard to find in Baja. Now, you see it even in remote campos, small towns, and non-border cities.
For areas basically forced to police themselves,
Meth is a game changer. (& with it comes its Tw!sted LogiC & whack criminal FaLLout).
To call THIS drug, "just another brick in the wall", is a total understatement.
! PrEFeRiR!A eSTaR eN baJa !
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CortezBlue
Super Nomad
Posts: 2213
Registered: 11-14-2006
Location: Fenix/San Phelipe
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | If Mexico legalized or decriminalized the illegal drugs it would deal a serious blow to the Mexico drug cartel businesses just like it hurt Al Capone
and the Mafia when they ended Prohibition in the 30's and it radically decreased his Mafia's annual income. It wasn't the FBI and Eliot Ness that
dealt serious blows the the Mafia. It was the end of Prohibition that weakened the Mafia and all the bloodshed of the era.
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Mexico decriminalized drugs a few years ago.
The problem is the USA, if you look at the supply and demand model.
As long as there is a demand someone will try to supply it.
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motoged
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6481
Registered: 7-31-2006
Location: Kamloops, BC
Member Is Offline
Mood: Gettin' Better
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| Quote: | Originally posted by CortezBlue
| Quote: | Didn't Calderon get a masters degree from Harvard?
We already kinda know what those Ivy League guys have done running the US. |
I don't think Obama was an Ivy League guy |
He must have been referring to George Dubya....sh#t-faced and snorting lines while working on his degree....THAT guy !!!
Don't believe everything you think....
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DENNIS
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 29510
Registered: 9-2-2006
Location: Punta Banda
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by CortezBlue
Mexico decriminalized drugs a few years ago.
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I always thought that was more "lip service" than anything else. Never heard anything more about it. If there actually is something to it, I doubt
Joe Tourist will ever know about it.
Anyway....it's Mexico, a foolish place to believe anything.
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Bajahowodd
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9274
Registered: 12-15-2008
Location: Disneyland Adjacent and anywhere in Baja
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"After growing up in Morelia, Calderón moved to Mexico City, where he received a bachelor's degree in law from the Escuela Libre de Derecho. Later, he
received a master's degree in economics from the Instituto Tecnológico Autónomo de México (ITAM) and a Master of Public Administration in 2000 from
the John F. Kennedy School of Government at Harvard University." -wiki
'nuff said.
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Iflyfish
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3747
Registered: 10-17-2006
Member Is Offline
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I am sickened to my core about the killing, kidnapping, torture and terror caused by the Cartels. I love Mexico and have traveled for over 45 years
through out the Republic. I am heartsick to see this country that I love degraded and the population living in fear of these psycho and sociopaths who
work for the Cartels. I do not live in Mexico and so am not living on a daily basis with the sort of terror that you must live with. I have not had to
move from my home in the face of this sort of horror.
I care deeply about the fact that there are places that I love that I can no longer visit. I considered retiring in Mexico. I have family that I love
in Mexico. Mexico is a part of me.
Listening to Calderon discussing the situation with Charlie Rose raised for me two very important issues. One is that there is an increased prosperity
in Mexico and there is a bright future for Mexico developing a middle class and I saw that with my own eyes. Secondly I missed the siege of Morelia by
less than an hour and saw first hand some of the devistation caused by this one battle with La Familia. This is not a matter of idle speculation on my
part. I have family in Mexico.
What I gathered from Calderon's comments was that he was open to legalization of drugs in the USofA, not in Mexico. I too question the wisdom of
legalization in Mexico with out legalization in the USofA, the largest consumer of illicit drugs and the major source of revenue and weapons for the
Cartels.
I can understand the outrage toward the Cartels and also why my comments may be seen as pontificating from afar. I do however live in the USofA and
believe that our side of the border needs desperately to change its drug laws so that the problem of addiction can be dealt with via medical
intervention and social stigma. In my opinion this offers the best hope to undermine the Cartels in Mexico.
The end of Prohibition did not ELIMINATE the Mafia, it did however weaken it significantly and many in the business put their money into legitimate
enterprises including the manufacture and sale of alcohol i.e. the Kennedy Family etc. There is a huge amount of cash in Mexico that currently needs
to be laundered that could be invested in legitimate enterprise and contribute to the overall economy of that great country.
Drugs and criminals will not go away. I do however believe that the enterprise named the "War on Drugs" is a total failure that underlies much of the
problem that we see. Sometimes the solution becomes the problem. I believe that this is the case with the "War on Drugs".
The USofA did not enforce a death penalty for kidnapping till after the high profile Lindberg case and I would also advocate for such a penalty in
Mexico. This law greatly reduced the incidence of kidnapping in the USofA.
The legal system in Mexico must also be overhauled in my opinion if real justice is to become part of the fabric of the country. I believe what
Calderon says about this is spot on. There are however entrenched and powerful interests that mitigate against such reform. The old system is rife
with corruption and will be difficult to change.
There are no simple solutions to these issues and that is clear. It is also clear to this writer that the "War on Drugs" is a very expensive failure.
The Colombians used Death Squads may be repeating itself in Mexico. This is a two edged sword but is one idea that is at times supported by some on
this board. Once the Dogs of War are released it is never clear who they will bite.
http://www.borderlandbeat.com/2011/03/evidence-of-extrajudic...
Again I believe that the only approach that has a chance of changing the paradigm is legalization of drugs in the USofA.
Iflyfish
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