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Bajahowodd
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Registered: 12-15-2008
Location: Disneyland Adjacent and anywhere in Baja
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Two observations.
First, if you want to take issue with the Gringo Gazette, be my guest. However, the woman I spoke to corroborated the idea that the resort owners were
dodging benefits and social security payments by putting their help on 28 day contracts.
Second, as for wonderful tips, if these folks are told to say that the tip is already included,....
I noted from the beginning that it was most, but not all resorts.
That said, given the wage list for various jobs, is it any wonder why people risk life and limb to cross the border to El Norte?
I do not support the political right in the US, but, when they complain that the Mexican government is complicit in encouraging illegal immigration,
one might just consider the paltry wages that are paid as mimimum by law.
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Phil S
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Registered: 10-28-2003
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Mood: After 34 years. Still in love w/ my wife
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I've become friends with many Mexicans (Baja) after spending the last 25 winters in Baja. Non that I've met "like it the way it is". Most 'wish' to
improve their way of life. Most learning it from working with Americans who winter down there. Take away the American 'tourist', go back 50 years to
Cabo & other cities up north, and you have ton's of fewer Mexican workers/residents. Many coming to the Baja for work after the Americans
discovered Baja's climate & fishing sources.!! I can only imagine what their (at the time they moved to Baja) living conditioins were like, but
probably wasn't much of an existence. Tar paper shacks maybe? One room cement block houses (casa's) Perhaps blue tarp homes. What were they doing
at the time? Working on ranches? Working in agriculture? Sweeping streets.? Were talking about a 'poor' population that is very 'migrant' i.e.
traveling from 'picking location to picking location'. I don't think anyone blames them for trying to improve their way of life. But isn't the poor
versus the 'rich' of Mexican population part of the problem? Doesn't the Mexican Gov't have much to do with keeping the poor "poor"? We're not
talking about a 'little' social issue here. We're talking about a third world country with a too many children being born in the poor sections with
very little encouragement to have either one or two kids. (help me out here. I hope that I'm right about this. And I haven't forgotten that this is a
Catholic religion country) But aren't we still living in 'modern times' versus the older days when you would have as many children as you could
afford. I'm hoping the 'modern today generation Mexican uses some restraint is consciously striving to 'hold down the population' of their country.
Egads. Where the heck am I going with this??? I think I'd better end it now before someone tells me I don't know what the heck I'm talking about.
Meow!!1
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Bajahowodd
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"But isn't the poor versus the 'rich' of Mexican population part of the problem? Doesn't the Mexican Gov't have much to do with keeping the poor
"poor"?"
Spot on. In my opinion, it was the decades of PRI rule that allowed, or even promoted it. PAN likely came to power based on a platform of encouraging
the wealthy to create jobs. Looks like after two terms, the PRI might get back into power.
Of course, conditions that encouraged the vast disparity between wealth and poverty were somewhat different, say 30 years ago.
But in recent times, just like in so much of the industrialized world, including the US, government has come to be run by an oligarchy of wealthy
businessmen and bankers.
These oligarchs have little interest in creating jobs in the absence of demand. They would rather hold onto their money. A vicious cycle.
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Wingnut
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This just shows how little most people know about businesses they have never been a part of. I have over 40 years in the Hospitality business as a
Director of Finance or Controller, mostly in hotels including lots of the biggies. These businesses do not make as much profit as you may think. Barry
A is right when he says the % of occupancy will decide your profitability depending on how tight your run the business. Since 2006, the recession has
hit the industry very hard and hotels today are run on the minimum to keep operating. Over the last several years, benefits costs (especially medical)
are rising faster than average rates. Many employess, including management, have received few wage increases and quite a number of positions have been
eliminated or consolidated to save costs. A typical full service hotel usually has payroll costs of between 40% to 48% of its revenues. Maids and
dishwashers or stewards are usually the least higher salaries if you except the tip credited waiters and waitresses. Maids typically earn between
$8.00 to $11.00 in non union hotels in the states. Adjust that level for Mexico's income levels and a $5.00 an hour maids job in Los Cabos is not bad
at all.
Now regarding contracts, consider this. Benefits run around 32 to 38 percent of wages. Since benefits are not covered under any government requirement
that does not concern taxes or overtime, all benefits are paid at the company's preference. Generally, annual reviews are made of the competition and
how many and how much is determined by competition. In the US, with all the problems with illegal hiring being highlighted, it has become very
difficult to hire maids in almost all localities. Hotels being hammered from the recession are hiring more "Contract" employees than ever. Why,
because they are saving the 30%+ costs on benefits. These employees are hired by a service which pays them directly and the hotel is billed at a rate
per hour, yes usually higher than it's own employees. But they pay no benefits. Considering that in the US, it's due to limitations due to hiring
illegal immigrants, it's more than probable that some hotels are using "Contracts" in Mexico after their occupancies have taken such a huge loss
during the recession. So lets look at why this is not such a bad thing for the employees.
The hotel, if it did not hire Contracted employees would have constant problems in keeping all of it's employees working. If one maid does 13 rooms,
you woul d have how many maids needed daily? With occupancy varying from 20% to 50% you would have a lot of people with few hours to earn a living.
The hotel would not be able to keep hiring and laying off employees. People would just not keep coming back. However, with monthly forecasting, they
would be able to determine how many shifts are needed with the occupancy ups and downs and by offering a 28 day contract, the employee is guaranteed
work. I am sure the contract pays even if the occupancy drops. This saves the hotel tons of money on benefits and insures it has enough people to
work. I would think that most of the hotels in Cabo would use a combination of Contract and regular employees, retaining those who have proven their
work and are properly trained. See my follow up on profits.
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jakecard
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Wingnut, the figure Bajahowodd reported reading was $5.60 per day, not $5.00 per hour.
Still have the same opinion?
Jake
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Wingnut
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Most hotels are not that profitable when you consider the immense costs in running these operations. That is why management companies have such a high
profile in running the hotel for the actual owners. Through combined purchasing and common operational expertise, they can run a hotel more
efficiantly than stand alone ownership. In the States, hotels profits run the gamet. The average full service hotel is going to see profits of 20% to
30% before taxes and fixed charges. This is referred to as the Gross Operating Profit which most management companies are judged on. The Net Operating
Profit, (after ownerships costs such as taxes, insurance and other costs including depreciation and asset purchases), will vary from less than 10% to
15%. During the recession, many hotels were running at losses, some even at the GOP level as business just dried up. Owners were required to put in
large capital outlays to keep the operations going. A number went into foreclosure.
Hotels are run like most other businesses, to stay profitable they do what they have to and no employees are guaranteed work or income. Being a very
labor intense business, decisions are made on how to stay profitable. Most company's, including the Sheraton, do the best they can for their
employees, because if they don't the employees can create a disaster in service related problems and their guests won't return. But they can not make
guarantees they can't keep. And if you think this isn't tough enough, add another layer with union representation and you might as well close the
doors. Unions are effective only in market areas where business stays constant, like New York or Las Vegas. Although due to the recession, even these
high revenue cities are having problems.
Most people are not used to tipping the maids when they travel, but wait staff is almost universally tipped except in those all inclusive places. Most
company's have policies regarding not allowing the employee to "ask" for a gratuity. In some places an automatic gratuity is posted to the bill. Most
hotels require the bill to be presented to guest without a tip, and the guest determines the amount depending on how they view their service. No hotel
wants any employee asking for a tip. So I can see how the Sheraton won't allow it. It is considered grounds for termination, but usually is only
enforced after several violations. No hotel wants to get a reputation for hounding guests for "tips". I am not up to date on Mexico's rules of
taxation on earnings or other employment issues, but I would think they are similar to the US.
Whenever I travel to Mexico and Cabo especially, I stay in locally owned and run hotels and always tip if it is not added to the bill. I always leave
something for the maid at the end of the stay, regardless of the billing because I know that it's one of the hardest jobs in the industry. (If anyone
disputes that, then they have never tried it and I challenge you to attempt it). Additionally, I usually eat and drink in local businesses and always
tip accordingly.
Tourism brings huge dollars and employment to Los Cabos and quite a number of hard working Mexican's work in the industry and provide a good life for
themselves and their families. No their economy is not what the US's is, but barring the recession, it creates enough economy to support all those
resorts in and around Cabo, quite a number of which are locally owned. Right now, Los Cabos is just getting by, just like most of America is due to
the insane inablility of our political leaders to solve problems. So if you care about the Mexican workers, go local and tip well. I guarantee they
need it and appreciate it.
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Wingnut
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Jakecard, I must have misread his comment, but even so, the $5.60 per day earnings are a factor of Mexico's economy and their government. If they
don't value their citizen's livelihood then you can not expect the businesses to do so. All I am saying is that there is probably more issues with the
overall business that caused them to do Contracts versus hiring employees with benefits. No matter whether they offer benefits or not, if Mexico
requires a "retirement or social security tax", using contracts could be voiding that requirement and I doubt that Mexico would let it go on very
long. Even US companies in business must follow Mexico rules. So if Contracts were being used, I doubt that the taxation for social security is being
not paid because the government would raise hell. Most likely it's just benefits like medical, vacation and other such costs. You can't get away from
paying taxes. If the Mexican's social security is optional, then they wouldn't pay it, but I know it is required of any business and even if they use
Contracts, they still have to pay the tax.
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jakecard
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Wingnut wrote: "If they don't value their citizen's livelihood then you can not expect the businesses to do so."
Why not?
Jake
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Wingnut
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Jakecard, because that would be living in Utopia. While businesses have to compete in the same marketplace, they would soon go out of business if they
did not stay comparable and then who would help the poor worker? Come on, socialism and communism are lost causes. Nice if they would work, but they
are not feasible unless freedoms are lost. Take your pick.
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Bajahowodd
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9274
Registered: 12-15-2008
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Methinks Wingnut spends way too much time watching Fox News.
"Whenever I travel to Mexico and Cabo especially, I stay in locally owned and run hotels"
And, where might they be?? My experience over three decades is that in the Los Cabos area, you can stay at a multi-national corporation owned hotel or
one that may be owned by an Ex-pat, who is not Mexican.
All this said, I have to go back to my post that when resort operators get away with charging anywhere from $150 to $1,000 per night, it is
reprehensible that they would screw their workers by using short term contracts. Dignity, for God sake. At least allow these folks to feel that they
are part of a team, as opposed to worrying every four weeks if they will be terminated. It's a bullying technique that also allows these resort
operators to shirk their social responsibility.
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shari
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Registered: 3-10-2006
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Mood: there is no reality except the one contained within us "Herman Hesse"
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Phil S
And I haven't forgotten that this is a Catholic religion country) But aren't we still living in 'modern times' versus the older days when you would
have as many children as you could afford. I'm hoping the 'modern today generation Mexican uses some restraint is consciously striving to 'hold down
the population' of their country. |
The old custom of having lots of kids is changing today in Mexico as families can no longer afford to feed,clothe and school lots of kids...before
they didnt have to pay for much and now they do. I was surprised and pleased at the campaign at hospitals to encourage birth control.
When Sirena had her baby, the doctors were strongly suggesting and convincing the new moms to allow the doctor to insert a little tube in the new
mother's arms containing birth control for up to 3 years...great idea I thought. We saw a few farm worker moms giving birth who were under 20 years
old and already had 3 little kids.
the practise of hiring and firing workers in a short term, or hiring contract workers is very common here too so they dont have to pay any health
insurance and other benefits...sad but true.
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