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RFClark
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John,
It was about 44 sacks of concrete and a lot of steel. The upper 2 - 40’ containers are 800 sq ft of bedrooms and living space. The concrete today is
the roof for the downstairs and the deck for the upstairs. More soon, we still have to pour the roof deck and the roof walkway.
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AKgringo
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Maybe it is going to be a guest room?
If you are not living on the edge, you are taking up too much space!
"Could do better if he tried!" Report card comments from most of my grade school teachers. Sadly, still true!
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SFandH
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Airbnb.
That's quite a project. More power to ya. Way beyond my capabilities to manage. But I'm lazy. 
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RFClark
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SH&H,
Me too! Hire good people and see that they have what they need to get the job done! I end up being the gopher! It’s an easy retirement job!
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John Harper
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Quote: Originally posted by RFClark  | John,
It was about 44 sacks of concrete and a lot of steel. The upper 2 - 40’ containers are 800 sq ft of bedrooms and living space. The concrete today is
the roof for the downstairs and the deck for the upstairs. More soon, we still have to pour the roof deck and the roof walkway.
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That's what I thought, a deck over the concrete after?
At least your biggest burden (wallet) is getting lighter day by day.
It's great to have a project. Good plan, keep them supplied, fed, watered, paid, and working, you do all the BS running around that wastes
production time.
John
[Edited on 9-28-2022 by John Harper]
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RFClark
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John,
This deck/roof gets a smooth finish tomorrow. Later in the week we pour the 12’X 12’ viewing deck on top of the 2nd level and a 4’ walkway that
forms the roof for the 4’ between the 2 40’ containers.
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surabi
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There is no such thing as a sack of concrete. They are sacks of cement. Concrete is what you get when you mix cement, sand, gravel and water.
And no, substituting rock for sand in the mix is not better. Sand, cement, and water are what create the chemical reaction that makes the concrete.
There is no chemical interaction with the gravel, it is just there for strength. Cutting back on the sand will make your mix too cement-rich, which
makes it weaker, not stronger.
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AKgringo
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Actually, you can buy sacks of pre-mixed cement (just add water) but it would be very expensive for a pour that size.
If you are not living on the edge, you are taking up too much space!
"Could do better if he tried!" Report card comments from most of my grade school teachers. Sadly, still true!
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surabi
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Pre-mixed cement is premixed cement. That isn't the same thing as concrete. Concrete is the material formed by mixing cement, sand, water and gravel.
[Edited on 9-29-2022 by surabi]
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RFClark
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Surbi,
Sorry, 44 sacks of cement and google it. For this pour cement, gravel, sand and water are stronger. That said the argument about cement with rock vs
pump grout has gone on forever. You can't get chopped fiber in your mix locally here so for me there’s no choice.
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surabi
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| Quote: Originally posted by RFClark | Surbi,
Sorry, 44 sacks of cement and google it. For this pour cement, gravel, sand and water are stronger. That said the argument about cement with rock vs
pump grout has gone on forever. You can't get chopped fiber in your mix locally here so for me there’s no choice. |
You didn't understand what I was saying. Of course you need gravel or some equivalent to make concrete. I was saying you can't change the recommended
proportion of sand in a mix and substitute it with gravel, thinking that will make it stronger. The sand to cement ratio needs to be followed. How
much gravel you throw into that mix is up to you. The gravel isn't part of the chemical interaction involved in mixing cement. It is just bound
together by the cement mix.
What makes your concrete pour strong is keeping it damp as long as possible. It needs to be hosed down several times a day for days.
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mtgoat666
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| Quote: Originally posted by surabi |
There is no such thing as a sack of concrete. They are sacks of cement. Concrete is what you get when you mix cement, sand, gravel and water.
And no, substituting rock for sand in the mix is not better. Sand, cement, and water are what create the chemical reaction that makes the concrete.
There is no chemical interaction with the gravel, it is just there for strength. Cutting back on the sand will make your mix too cement-rich, which
makes it weaker, not stronger. |
Surabi,
On this you are very wrong! Every home improvement store sells bags of concrete mix. The bags are pre-mixed cement, aggregate and additives — just
add water. No one mixes their own concrete ingredients, well, except the plants that sell ready mix or concrete mix.
Woke!
Hands off!
“Por el bien de todos, primero los pobres.”
“...ask not what your country can do for you – ask what you can do for your country.” “My fellow citizens of the world: ask not what America
will do for you, but what together we can do for the freedom of man.”
Pronoun: the royal we
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surabi
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| Quote: Originally posted by mtgoat666 | | Quote: Originally posted by surabi |
There is no such thing as a sack of concrete. They are sacks of cement. Concrete is what you get when you mix cement, sand, gravel and water.
And no, substituting rock for sand in the mix is not better. Sand, cement, and water are what create the chemical reaction that makes the concrete.
There is no chemical interaction with the gravel, it is just there for strength. Cutting back on the sand will make your mix too cement-rich, which
makes it weaker, not stronger. |
Surabi,
On this you are very wrong! Every home improvement store sells bags of concrete mix. The bags are pre-mixed cement, aggregate and additives — just
add water. No one mixes their own concrete ingredients, well, except the plants that sell ready mix or concrete mix. |
What on earth are you talking about, "no one mixes their own concrete"??? Of course they do. What do you think RFClark's photos depict? There are
piles of sand and gravel his crew is mixing. Almost every build in Mexico, aside from big commercial projects, has piles of sand, gravel and bags of
cement, with workers either mixing it with shovels or using a cement mixer.
And a bag of concrete mix isn't a bag of concrete. Concrete is the word for the finished product. A "bag of concrete" would be hard as a rock, not
powdered ingredients you add water to.
Calling a bag if mix "concrete" is like calling a cup of flour, some eggs and some milk on the counter a cake.
[Edited on 9-29-2022 by surabi]
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mtgoat666
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| Quote: Originally posted by surabi | | Quote: Originally posted by RFClark | Surbi,
Sorry, 44 sacks of cement and google it. For this pour cement, gravel, sand and water are stronger. That said the argument about cement with rock vs
pump grout has gone on forever. You can't get chopped fiber in your mix locally here so for me there’s no choice. |
You didn't understand what I was saying. Of course you need gravel or some equivalent to make concrete. I was saying you can't change the recommended
proportion of sand in a mix and substitute it with gravel, thinking that will make it stronger. The sand to cement ratio needs to be followed. How
much gravel you throw into that mix is up to you. The gravel isn't part of the chemical interaction involved in mixing cement. It is just bound
together by the cement mix.
What makes your concrete pour strong is keeping it damp as long as possible. It needs to be hosed down several times a day for days.
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Actually, when you buy ready mix and concrete mix, you can get an almost infinite variety of mix designs.
And, the easiest way to cure concrete often is not keeping it wet with a hose — much easier to apply curing compound, a sealant sprayed over the
surface to retard evaporation/moisture loss.
In Baja, probably an important thing is to avoid concrete pours in hot weather. You need to add retarders if temp is over about 85 F, do pours at
nights when air is cooler. if I were pouring in baja, I would just skip summer, and have work done in winter.
In my work we do concrete occasionally, our summer pours in the desert often start at 3 AM to get it in place before truck is hot or day is hot. And
we sometimes have our ready mix made with ice plus water, as the raw ingredients in stock at plants are often quite warm to begin with in the summer-
hard to mix concrete and meet temp spec when your raw materials are all starting out at temps over 80 F.
Woke!
Hands off!
“Por el bien de todos, primero los pobres.”
“...ask not what your country can do for you – ask what you can do for your country.” “My fellow citizens of the world: ask not what America
will do for you, but what together we can do for the freedom of man.”
Pronoun: the royal we
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mtgoat666
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| Quote: Originally posted by surabi | | Quote: Originally posted by mtgoat666 | | Quote: Originally posted by surabi |
There is no such thing as a sack of concrete. They are sacks of cement. Concrete is what you get when you mix cement, sand, gravel and water.
And no, substituting rock for sand in the mix is not better. Sand, cement, and water are what create the chemical reaction that makes the concrete.
There is no chemical interaction with the gravel, it is just there for strength. Cutting back on the sand will make your mix too cement-rich, which
makes it weaker, not stronger. |
Surabi,
On this you are very wrong! Every home improvement store sells bags of concrete mix. The bags are pre-mixed cement, aggregate and additives — just
add water. No one mixes their own concrete ingredients, well, except the plants that sell ready mix or concrete mix. |
What on earth are you talking about, "no one mixes their own concrete"??? Of course they do. Almost every build in Mexico, aside from big commercial
projects, has piles of sand, gravel and bags of cement, with workers either mixing it with shovels or using a cement mixer.
And a bag of concrete mix isn't a bag of concrete. Concrete is the word for the finished product. A "bag of concrete" would be hard as a rock, not
something you add water to. |
Two comments:
I do concrete work occasionally, would never allow on site mixing of raw ingredien…. Mexican concrete made on site by hand mixing ingredients is
usually pretty poor quality.
And the bags of concrete mix are just that, concrete mix. So perhaps I agree with your last irrelevant point!
Woke!
Hands off!
“Por el bien de todos, primero los pobres.”
“...ask not what your country can do for you – ask what you can do for your country.” “My fellow citizens of the world: ask not what America
will do for you, but what together we can do for the freedom of man.”
Pronoun: the royal we
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surabi
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" I do concrete work occasionally, would never allow on site mixing of raw ingredien…. Mexican concrete made on site by hand mixing ingredients is
usually pretty poor quality."
It's only poor quality if they don't mix it right, use beach sand, or don't use the correct ratios of materials. Regardless, that is how almost all
house construction is done in Mexico, and millions of Mexican laborers would be out of work if it wasn't. It's also done like that in other places all
over the world. And plenty of it has been standing for a hundred years, and more. Are you under the impression that there were ready-mix cement pumper
trucks and bags of concrete mix available at building supply stores 100 years ago?
[Edited on 9-29-2022 by surabi]
[Edited on 9-29-2022 by surabi]
[Edited on 9-29-2022 by surabi]
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JDCanuck
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I wondered why I saw so many cement blocks apparently dissolving in the rain, and not all that old either. Perhaps it was the salt in the sand doing
it? Never saw that anyplace in old cement blocks before.
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mtgoat666
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| Quote: Originally posted by lencho | | Quote: Originally posted by surabi | | It's only poor quality if they don't mix it right, use beach sand, or don't use the correct ratios of materials. |
Which you have to admit still happens a lot, though much less now than it did 30 years ago. Many uneducated laborers don't
understand how concrete works and how important the mix is.
I have a vague theory that it has to do with the transition from adobe (which is much more forgiving than concrete). |
Hand-mixing the raw ingredients on site is typically done by “eye-balling” the volumes of individual ingredients. There is little control over
mix ratios, so varying batch quality. It is hit or miss whether each batch is mixed to spec.
Woke!
Hands off!
“Por el bien de todos, primero los pobres.”
“...ask not what your country can do for you – ask what you can do for your country.” “My fellow citizens of the world: ask not what America
will do for you, but what together we can do for the freedom of man.”
Pronoun: the royal we
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RFClark
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Goat,
Good concrete is a ratio of ingredients. Most batch plant mix doesn’t use 3/4” rock these days because of pumping. If you use a standard 5 gal
pail you get the same ratio every time. Ever watch a batch plant load a truck? The Romans mixed concrete by hand, on site 2,000 plus years ago, much
of which is still standing! The elevated Metro in Mexico City that collapsed was batch plant mix! The results depend on the crew!
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surabi
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| Quote: Originally posted by mtgoat666 |
Hand-mixing the raw ingredients on site is typically done by “eye-balling” the volumes of individual ingredients. There is little control over
mix ratios, so varying batch quality. It is hit or miss whether each batch is mixed to spec.
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No it isn't. They mix one bag of cement to a specific number of 5 gallon pails of sand. They don't "eyeball" it. It seems like you're just making
things up now to try to prove you are right.
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