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Skeet/Loreto
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Posts: 4709
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Steph.
Your post concerning the plight of Mexicanos and Americanos in the States United and Baja is a Labor that I undertake each time there is an
opportunity to do so!
I fell in love with the Mexican people many years ago while living in Loreto.I have been successful in explaining to my Mexicano friends about the
Americano cultural.I know from actions that I have been respected for my attempts.
In the States it is more difficult as there is more people to try to explain Mexicanos to my friends here.I am often talked about as being a"Mexicano
Lover" in that I tell many people the good qualities of Baja and its People.
There is much resentment here as in Mexicano brought on by our past as well as the past and actions of both sides.
I do not engage in the "Blame,Shame, and Flame "manner in my attempts to help anyone.in understanding.
Exception:When i blame the Liberals of creating many of the problems with our
Children and their failure to "Accept Responsibility" for their acts.
The past is dead and gone!Live and work today to beter the lives of all of us,think about the future and try to influence childen in a manner that
will help them understand that we are not perfect.
Since getting back to a better life with Christ, I have finally figured to do all I can to help all People to be Kind to each. other. that is that
my purpose in Life
Read that book,!If it can change me it can change you
Skeet/Loreto
"In God we Trust".
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Skeet/Loreto
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Grover
Do you have any idea how we would be if we were all perfect?
It seems as if there is an underlying bias against any one that makes money.
I have been blessed with a chance to benifit from my LaborsI have been very poor and through hard Work and much effort I have been able to take care
of my self without depending on the govt. or someone else to take care of me in my old age.
Now I know that it has been Gods Plan for me.I have recently discovered that my Purpose in Life is to help those in need.
I will use all my talents to do so from now until this ole body wears out.
No more wasting my time trying to convince anyone through "Words"
Actions are better than words and you cannot see them on a forum!
Skeet/Loreto
"In God we Trust"
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Stephanie Jackter
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Location: Arizona
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Thanks for the support, Bedman.
| Quote: | Originally posted by Bedman
for taking the time to fight the Good fight. I whole heartedly agree that Ms. Wilsons' plight is a travesty of the judicial system in Mexico.
I don't always agree with you but, I am glad you took the reins on this one.
Jesse, just exactly What did you see re: the "illegal drugs" she was carrying?
Jesse, does this mean that I can't take my American medications to Mexico? A one month supply of 8 different prescription medications would entail 270
pills.
BEDMAN |
I just look at this as a no-brainer and am shocked by the attitudes I see here. I go to Nogales and buy emphasyma drugs for a friend that wouldn't be
able to afford to eat and get her meds if I didn't. I am encouraged to do that by a pharmacy on every corner in cut-throat competition with each
other.
The fact that a cop could pick me up and I or any other retiree they wanted to tare into could face the same insanity that Dawn Wilson has been put
through makes me angry enough by itself. But to listen to all these other people making her out to be a criminal just burns me up. The time honored
tradition of blaming the victim continues.....If it happened today, I bet a few of the gang around here would say Jesus Christ himself deserved to be
crucified! - Stephanie
When the goin' gets tough, the wierd turn pro
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Enormo
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Skeet/Loreto
I do not engage in the "Blame,Shame, and Flame "manner in my attempts to help anyone.in understanding.
Exception:When i blame the Liberals of creating many of the problems with our
Children and their failure to "Accept Responsibility" for their acts.
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how big of you
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JESSE
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For all of you that think that Mexico has unfair penalties you are wrong, all nations have laws and pealties that are considered unfair by others, for
example, did you know that if you get caught growing 99 plants of pot in the U.S. you spend perhaps only a few months in Jail, but if you get caugh
with 100, mandatory minimum federal laws kick in, and you HAVE to spend a mandatory 15 YEARS!! for 1 more plant!!! theres plenty of more examples, i
for one find it completely inhuman how police in the U.S. are allowed to shoot someone like a dog if you treaten them with a stick, or a rock,
something you almost never see in Mexico, do i think its unfair? yes, would i treaten a cop in the U.S. with a rock or even a nail clipper? HELL NO.
A good friend of mine is doing 10 to 20 years for getting caught with cristal meth at the border, he was running an errand for a friend, he was using
the other persons car, he DID NOT know he was driving a loaded car, the guy was an A student at the University and now he is doing time, did the U.S.
bother to investigate? no. did they care that he was a good citizen going to college and never in trouble? no. did they take into account the letters
from school, from is priest, from his friends? no.
These situations happen in both sides of the border, and both law systems are just as unfair and cruel as they can get.
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Enormo
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It's not the laws/penalties in mexico that are unfair it's the lack of a single law... 'innocent until proven guilty'.
Napoleanic law empowers those in power to abuse the rights of the 'have nots.' This is not to say that everyone who is in power is corrupt in Mexico
(or any of the other of the 'developing countries' that make up the majority of our planet).
However, where there are human beings there will be abuse of power. Mexico is no exception. And the insinuation of guilt until innocence is proven is
simply damning to those who, for whatever reason, are considered enemies of the state. (and by state I mean the whole government, a branch of
government, a group within a government, a judge, a cop... whomever is granted power). And, no, I am not a left wing conspiricy theorist.
And from everything I've read this woman was neither a drug abuser, nor an addict, nor a trafficker. She was just carrying her prescriptions.
This begs the question, 'Could there have been any other motive for her encarceration." Well, in a land where there is such disparity between the
haves and have nots and you are guilty until proven innocent, you have to wonder.
[Edited on 3-1-2004 by Enormo]
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Enormo
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| Quote: | Originally posted by JESSE
For all of you that think that Mexico has unfair penalties you are wrong, all nations have laws and pealties that are considered unfair by others, for
example, did you know that if you get caught growing 99 plants of pot in the U.S. you spend perhaps only a few months in Jail, but if you get caugh
with 100, mandatory minimum federal laws kick in, and you HAVE to spend a mandatory 15 YEARS!! for 1 more plant!!! theres plenty of more examples, i
for one find it completely inhuman how police in the U.S. are allowed to shoot someone like a dog if you treaten them with a stick, or a rock,
something you almost never see in Mexico, do i think its unfair? yes, would i treaten a cop in the U.S. with a rock or even a nail clipper? HELL NO.
A good friend of mine is doing 10 to 20 years for getting caught with cristal meth at the border, he was running an errand for a friend, he was using
the other persons car, he DID NOT know he was driving a loaded car, the guy was an A student at the University and now he is doing time, did the U.S.
bother to investigate? no. did they care that he was a good citizen going to college and never in trouble? no. did they take into account the letters
from school, from is priest, from his friends? no.
These situations happen in both sides of the border, and both law systems are just as unfair and cruel as they can get. |
While possibly quite true your examples are a bit simplistic and anecdotal. Are you really willing to threaten a Mexican police officer's life without
expecting them to protect themselves with lethal force? Sounds rather exagerated to me.
I'm not familiar with the nuts and bolts workings of the Mexican legal system so I can't comment specifically on it but I would hardly call the U.S.
legal system "unfair" and "cruel." It's a system that has a relatively rigorous sets of checks and balances that affords the defendants numerous
rights that some even consider too lenient. Not to mention the numerous laws and organizations set up specifically to insure the absence of cruel and
unfair treatment.
I'm not saying it's perfect(after all the more money you have the better legal counsel you can hire... etc.) but the U.S. legal system is often seen
by those around the world as a blueprint for a fair and mature legal system.
And I'm not putting down Mexico's legal system either. It's just that your argument seems to be askew for the thread's topic. Getting caught growing
pot plants and crossing the border with crystal meth seems to be a different issue than getting caught with prescription medication.
[Edited on 3-1-2004 by Enormo]
[Edited on 3-1-2004 by Enormo]
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Nikon
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Not much to add to Enormo's points, except to say it's a well established fact of life here that you don't use an object to threaten a police officer.
So if you do, it's tantamount to suicide, which is what's often intended by the perp. I've never heard our justice system described as cruel before.
But there was that beating of the immigrantes by the freeway, maybe that's what gave you that impression? Is there a MCLU? Pretty funny, isn't it?
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JESSE
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I have actually gotten into fights with Mexican cops during my youth and was never treatened with a gun, for all you that dont know it, a Mexican cop
will go to jail if he shoots someone that did not shoot first, in fact, it is rare to hear that a Mexican cop killed someone without being shot at
first.
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FrankO
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This certainly has morphed from an/inquiry/concern for Dawn Wilson to a mini debate over opposing justice systems. Yes, our system is flawed, but the
adversarial judicial system where innocence is presumptive certainly is superior to napoleanic law. I have no problem w/cops shooting an attacker,
just one less scumbag to flock w/me and my family.
[Edited on 3-2-2004 by FrankO]
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Enormo
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| Quote: | Originally posted by JESSE
I have actually gotten into fights with Mexican cops during my youth and was never treatened with a gun, for all you that dont know it, a Mexican cop
will go to jail if he shoots someone that did not shoot first, in fact, it is rare to hear that a Mexican cop killed someone without being shot at
first. |
and I have friends who have gotten into fights with cops here... and had their ass handed to them... but fights none the less... once again
interesting yet anecdotal
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Skeet/Loreto
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Grover: They do not all think that it is all a sham~~~~.
You are using a Large Paint brush as I have done in my past posts with my comments of the Lefty's>
Skeet./Loreto
"In God we Trust"
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Enormo
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Actually Jesse, you do have a point about San Diego police. About ten years back or more(as I remember it) San Diego led the nation in police 'victim'
mortality rate.
I'm not sure what that means... maybe they were just better shots.
Either way there's not much reason to resist police in the states... unless your looking for trouble.
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Enormo
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Another thought Jesse: Grover's post just above, that would be the U.S. version of corruption. It's institutionalized. The victims are rarely a single
person acutely persicuted but rather populations of those who belong to our system(not to say that there aren't individual instances of injustice in
this country). Lobbies, beurocrats, politicians, corporate interests and even public interest groups all exploiting laws, regulations and whatever
political leverage they may have. It's the American Way!
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Pescador
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Jesse, I find the comments interesting, but the fact that really disturbs me is that Americans and Canadians come to Mexico and seem to expect that
the laws there are the same as at home. Well they are not. If you want the laws like they are at home then stay home. The old saying as When in
Rome do as the Romans seems so appropriate. Only when I was in College did I spend lots of nights talking about how things should be. Now that I am
a little older I spend time trying to figure out how things really are and learning how to act accordingly. Mexico attracts a lot of us for the
simplicity and the more relaxed way of life and then we want to have philosophical discussions about how things should be. I'll bet the law
enforcement and the judges are really listening.
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jrbaja
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Very mature *****.
**************************
I don't have much time fer chicken kicken today as I am listening to some other gringo piece talking about their problems getting work done here in
Los Barriles. Typical!
If yall don't like what goes on here, including your whining about everything that is Mexico, why don't you just stay home in your perfect
environments.
And that includes coming here to buy your drugs at a discount.
I guess they are not always that great a deal are they. You characters should be smarter than that. Where'd ya go to school anyway? america?
Hypocrites!
Especialy you obnoxious, know it all gringo types ******.
[Edited on 3-5-2004 by BajaNomad]
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Me No
Banned
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Registered: 11-24-2003
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JR, Why don't you tell us how you really feel. 
Here's a true story from last weekend SF 250. We go out to the remote location, Morelia Junction, where we are to pit the 100x bike. We do our pit
duties, and then head up a small hill, that has the best vantage point, to see the cars come through. A group of gringos have been up there since
early mourning, and were all smiles. Then a parade of Mexicans show up who had watched the cars at the start and had come out to see them again. You
should have heard this one gringo lady, " I hope they don't come up here", "they do nothing but litter", "I spent 15 minutes cleaning up trash when I
got here and will go crazy if they come back up here and through their trash around". I explain that it is there country, and they do things
different here, and to expect to be standing shoulder to shoulder with them any minute. Well she circled her chairs and tried to form a barracade to
keep them out of her space. So when the cars arrived and I saw her standing shoulder to shoulder with some of them that were drinking beer, I just
had to laugh, wishing JR was there to set her straight.
As far as Dawn Wilson, yea It stinks, but she made many blunders herself. Pleading guilty was probably the biggest one. Carrying too many drugs the
next, and I'm willing to bet, when she originally got stopped she fit the stereotypical american attitude.
As for me, I tread lightly in foreign countries. If ever I encounter authorities, piety is the rule.
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Enormo
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| Quote: | Originally posted by jrbaja
Hypocrites!
Especialy you obnoxious, know it all gringo types *****. |
Yeah! WAY more obnoxious than you know it all Mexicano types.
[Edited on 3-5-2004 by BajaNomad]
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Enormo
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Hey, where did Stephanie go and who's *****?
Seriously, though, I still don't know why some people are peeed at her. Seems to me she was just pointing out the highly questionable circumstances
around this girls arrest. There aren't any gringo apoligists in this room are there?
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elgatoloco
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It is unfortunate that she was not up to speed on the local laws on drug possesion. Prescripted or otherwise.
It sucks big time that the cops had to foul up good police work by maxing out her ATM card while she was in custody. 
MAGA
Making Attorneys Get Attorneys
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