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toneart
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4901
Registered: 7-23-2006
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Mood: Skeptical
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Osprey
Cap, Let me help you rephase that last sentence "The author's keen powers of observation displayed in writing the story might have been put to better
use by recognizing the glaring lack of judgement on the part of the imaginary characters in this fictional work (in both instances).
Wasn't me. No accidents, never been to court. I was trying to show that these kinds of local laws, the system, works well, is balanced, swift and
effective. |
Osprey,
Good writing! That is getting lots of acknowledgment here, and well deserved.
Regarding Cap's critique, I would trust your judgment over his any day. He couldn't have read your stories very carefully. Regarding the car accident,
it couldn't have been avoided. Regarding the dog incident...the woman who took you to court was way out of line. The judge was way out of line.
Obviously the judge had gotten out of line in other instances too, thus the tree plant. Your insight after getting some distance from the "court"
cases reflects the clarity of a Budda.
What a perfect answer you had for Cap. That will probably go way over his head too. Maybe he is wearing his aluminum cap.
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Cypress
Elite Nomad
Posts: 7641
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Location: on the bayou
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Mood: undecided
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It's the same as anywhere. The judge is the uncle of the offended party.
 The arresting officer is the cousin of the offended party. The offended/injured party is the sister/brother/mother/ father/lifelong friend etc.
of the #1 witness who saw everything.
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Cap
Nomad
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Registered: 4-20-2007
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Cypress
It's the same as anywhere. The judge is the uncle of the offended party.
The arresting officer is the cousin of the offended party. The offended/injured party is the sister/brother/mother/ father/lifelong friend etc.
of the #1 witness who saw everything. |
The story was written in the first person, so if it was fiction, it could be easily mistaken. It is probably more egregious to make up a story like
this. Had you written "it's the same as anywhere" in your story, I would have never commented. What I was objecting to was the tone of "look how
backward they are down here". I don't care for commentary about other cultures shortcomings, it seems arrogant especially from the perspetive of an
expatriate living in the culture he is mocking. We have our problems too, and the condesention was noticable in your story.
I hope everyone that visits or emmigrates to other countries remembers to represent us better than this.
To the "it couldn't be helped" critique, it is always your fault when you rear end someone elses car, or leave your dog un fenced or unleashed. This
is the case fiction or non fiction.
Fly low, land on roads.
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bajalou
Ultra Nomad
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Registered: 3-11-2004
Location: South of the broder
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Cap
To the "it couldn't be helped" critique, it is always your fault when you rear end someone elses car, or leave your dog un fenced or unleashed. This
is the case fiction or non fiction. |
I agree with the first about the car, but when both dogs are "Unfenced and unleashed" who's at fault?
No Bad Days
\"Never argue with an idiot. People watching may not be able to tell the difference\"
\"The trouble with doing nothing is - how do I know when I\'m done?\"
Nomad Baja Interactive map
And in the San Felipe area - check out Valle Chico area |
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Cap
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personal responsibilty, It doesn't make it less your fault if someone else is doing the same thing. imho
Fly low, land on roads.
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amir
Senior Nomad
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Registered: 5-4-2007
Location: Todos Santos, BCS
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Hey Cap, you're inhaling too much jet fuel up there. Come down to earth and see what's happening on this level.
And when you get down from your high, read the stories again.
--Amir
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toneart
Ultra Nomad
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Registered: 7-23-2006
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| Quote: | Originally posted by amir
Hey Cap, you're inhaling too much jet fuel up there. Come down to earth and see what's happening on this level.
And when you get down from your high, read the stories again.
--Amir |
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Cap
Nomad
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To be fair, I went back and read the original stories over again. I invite you to do the same. If you missed the problem you might be part of it. If
you "feel victimized" by a foriegn court I am sure they would invite you to leave. Tying up the end of a story with anecdotal respect, does not excuse
arrogance.
Leave preconceived notions and biases behind. Take responsibilty for yourself and display courtesy. There are probably other foriegners around that
are apologizing for you after you leave (me).
Fly low, land on roads.
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Baja Bernie
`Normal` Nomad Correspondent
Posts: 2962
Registered: 8-31-2003
Location: Sunset Beach
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Cap
I do believe that you are at distinct disadvantage when reading Ospry's stories...............He has sucked most of us in so many times we have
learned to appreciate that he has an ability to make the most mundane things cause some folks blood to boil at the same time others, like me,
recognize where he is coming from and where his heart resides and that is 'deeply' in Baja AND its people.
Give yourself some time and you just may come to appreciate his writing style and the fact that in almost all cases he attempts; and normally with
some results, to make his readers think................just a smidgen outside of the box.
Hope you hang around long enough to get a feel for crazy, fun loving , and knowledgeable Baja Folks who haunt these halls. We all don't get
along...........in fact I won't even talk to a few and I know a few feel the same about me..........That is reality! Another reality is that while we
may not care overly much for each other we do have the tendency to protect our own against newcomers until they learn the ground rules....no they may
not write them all by themselves, but we do change and grown with time.
So, Welcome!
My smidgen of a claim to fame is that I have had so many really good friends. By Bernie Swaim December 2007
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Lee
Ultra Nomad
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Registered: 10-2-2006
Location: High in the Colorado Rockies
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What's your problem?
| Quote: | Originally posted by Cap
What I was objecting to was the tone of "look how backward they are down here". I don't care for commentary about other cultures shortcomings, it
seems arrogant especially from the perspetive of an expatriate living in the culture he is mocking. We have our problems too, and the condesention was
noticable in your story.
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The only arrogance coming through this thread is yours. Can't find the condescension in the story either. Let's talk about Cabo Boys. Is that
your thing? You're familiar with arrogance and condescension, aren't you?
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amir
Senior Nomad
Posts: 559
Registered: 5-4-2007
Location: Todos Santos, BCS
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Mood: chiropractic
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Cap,
Osprey is a literary writer. Osprey writes stories.
You can write your own stories, Cap, and you can construct your own themes, styles, morals, whatever.
Don't go around telling Osprey how to write his stories, what emotions to portray, or what morals to conclude. We wouldn't want to put our own words
in other's peoples mouths, now, would we?
--Amir
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CaboRon
Ultra Nomad
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Location: The Valley of the Moon
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Wonderfull Stories
| Quote: | Originally posted by amir
Cap,
Osprey is a literary writer. Osprey writes stories.
You can write your own stories, Cap, and you can construct your own themes, styles, morals, whatever.
Don't go around telling Osprey how to write his stories, what emotions to portray, or what morals to conclude. We wouldn't want to put our own words
in other's peoples mouths, now, would we?
--Amir |
Thankyou Amir for
putting this so well.... I have read many of Osprey's posts... and at first, and even now, find myself so imersed in the story that I forget
reality.... now that is GREAT storytelling... Also, I don't feel Osprey has a condesending bone in his body.. .. Keep the great stories comming!!! Caboron
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Cap
Nomad
Posts: 202
Registered: 4-20-2007
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Baja Bernie
I do believe that you are at distinct disadvantage when reading Ospry's stories...............He has sucked most of us in so many times we have
learned to appreciate that he has an ability to make the most mundane things cause some folks blood to boil at the same time others, like me,
recognize where he is coming from and where his heart resides and that is 'deeply' in Baja AND its people.
Give yourself some time and you just may come to appreciate his writing style and the fact that in almost all cases he attempts; and normally with
some results, to make his readers think................just a smidgen outside of the box.
Hope you hang around long enough to get a feel for crazy, fun loving , and knowledgeable Baja Folks who haunt these halls. We all don't get
along...........in fact I won't even talk to a few and I know a few feel the same about me..........That is reality! Another reality is that while we
may not care overly much for each other we do have the tendency to protect our own against newcomers until they learn the ground rules....no they may
not write them all by themselves, but we do change and grown with time.
So, Welcome! |
This was very gracious, thank you.
I admitted to mistaking this story for an actual experience. My other mistake was reading a thread on this forum, just prior to this one that was
dealing with border control. I was appauled at some peoples attitudes toward other human beings. I have lived and worked all over Latin America, and
seen the attitudes that people bring down here. The culture in most countries is far more civil, and polite than ours. I have a problem with good old
boys coming down, stirring things up and then complaining about how they (we) do things. This is where the writer "got me". Thank you for pointing out
that this was his intention. My intention was to offer a solution that works every time: Courtesy, and personal responsibility. Enjoy our differences,
and try to learn why they do things the way they do. Walk a mile in someones shoes. I almost never see, or hear this point of view expressed, and I
went overboard. I have a tendency to defend my own as well. In my defense, there have been several (unkind) messages deleted from the board that some
of my responses were directed to (moderator?)
I hope you will accept this in the same spirit you wrote your response, you seem like a gentleman.
Again, thank you.
Fly low, land on roads.
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Crusoe
Senior Nomad
Posts: 731
Registered: 10-14-2006
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OSPREY........You are the best!!!!! ++C++
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Osprey
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3694
Registered: 5-23-2004
Location: Baja Ca. Sur
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Cap, you are among friends. You walked into the middle of a movie. No way around that. Over the last few years I have played the part of "mirror
man" to explain just how courteous we should be while living among the most courteous of cultures. I used my license liberally and set the
fines/punishment to highlight what disrespect for people or their laws will get you in Mexico -- in other posts I've advised newcomers about the
weight and value of a "con su permiso" demeanor and attitude -- my stories sometimes overflow with that sentiment and my fans are just being
supportive.
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amir
Senior Nomad
Posts: 559
Registered: 5-4-2007
Location: Todos Santos, BCS
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Mood: chiropractic
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Thank you for adjusting your posture, Cap (no pun intended).
Osprey is a powerful writer. Your words are well crafted, too.
I hope to see more of your activity full of your passion on this Board.
Courtesy and personal responsibility are two wonderful rules to follow while abroad, at home, or anywhere, really! I'm glad you bring these tools to
Nomad discussions.
Bienvenido.
Are you the captain of that plane in your avatar? WOW!
--Amir
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Baja Bernie
`Normal` Nomad Correspondent
Posts: 2962
Registered: 8-31-2003
Location: Sunset Beach
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Mood: Just dancing through life
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Cap
I share your attitude and your concern for relations with and between others. I had a sense of you when I said, "Welcome."
Here is a quote by me, "Baja is About People Helping People," you will notice that it excludes no one. I have found that most folks here may not say
so but they do practice what it says. There are a few flamers who either reside here or show up for short durations and then find that Nomads have a
way of either converting their aggressive thinking or fail to take their bait. When this happens these irritant fishers of men either change or fall
overboard. In either case and civilized behavior returns for a reasonable time.
I might suggest that you click on the search button above and then type in Osprey and then go back in time and read his many wonderful
stories............They are well worth the time and I 'know' you will get a better feeling for the man behind them.
Have a Great Baja Day!!
My smidgen of a claim to fame is that I have had so many really good friends. By Bernie Swaim December 2007
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DianaT
Select Nomad
Posts: 10020
Registered: 12-17-2004
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Osprey,
Just had a chance to read these stories and so glad I did. Your ability to write fiction in the first person that makes the reader forget it is
fiction is a real talent.
Have not read your other newer one yet, but look forward to it later.
A loyal fan
Diane
[Edited on 6-22-2007 by jdtrotter]
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Lee
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3597
Registered: 10-2-2006
Location: High in the Colorado Rockies
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Feel the love!
| Quote: | Originally posted by Baja Bernie
Another reality is that while we may not care overly much for each other we do have the tendency to protect our own against newcomers until they
learn the ground rules....no they may not write them all by themselves, but we do change and grown with time. |
| Quote: | Originally posted by Cap
I have a tendency to defend my own as well. In my defense, there have been several (unkind) messages deleted from the board that some of my responses
were directed to (moderator?)
I hope you will accept this in the same spirit you wrote your response, you seem like a gentleman.
Again, thank you. |
Bernie: You da Hombre. Good words and a noble graciousness from your post.
Cap: You're among good company here. Many here defend their own (MX) and you got real real fast. Yo Brother!
Amir: You grease the wheel, mi Amigo.
Osprey: You have a way of hitting the mark with your words. I love it.
Lee
Defender of Mexican Women (as per Dennis)
(Not that they need any defending.)
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Baja Bernie
`Normal` Nomad Correspondent
Posts: 2962
Registered: 8-31-2003
Location: Sunset Beach
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Mood: Just dancing through life
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Lee
You should have been a lawyer............You sum up so well!
Scary!
Imagine us all on some secluded beach, Corona in hand, and discussing the ills of the world...........Would be fun!
But scary too.
My smidgen of a claim to fame is that I have had so many really good friends. By Bernie Swaim December 2007
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