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Alan
Super Nomad
Posts: 1628
Registered: 4-6-2005
Location: Yucaipa, CA/La Paz
Member Is Offline
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Diver makes a good attempt at providing some basic guidelines but I really don't agree with #7 and #9 of the guide's responsibilities. I realize it
is difficult not to be generous when your arms are still shaking from pulling on fish non-stop, but tipping should not be based on success but rather
how hard the guide worked to put you on fish. Whether they bite or not is out of the control of the panguero but rather the mood of the fish and YOUR
presentation. I have fished with some truly great pangueros who had the eyes of a frigate bird and would spot a marlin in the middle of a school of
dolphin a mile away. I have fished with others who did little more than burn fuel.
Why would a guide have to replace lures? Lost lures are just part of fishing. Did you tie a crappy knot? Did you hang it up in the rocks? Were
you cut off by a wahoo? Feces occur. Get over it. Now if you lost his lure that is a different matter. He depends on that lure to feed his family.
I would never be rude enough to ask a panguero directly what he makes but I have hired pangueros to Captain my own boat and I've been told by the
fleet operators that they pay their pangueros about $20 a day. Knowing the cost of lures in Baja as well as the limited availability I would
definitely try to replace any lure he lost. Because of the limited availability of tackle in Baja I always leave them with spools of leaders, lures,
packs of hooks, spools of fresh line, etc. It's so much easier and cheaper for me to replace when I get home.
For Shari - Can't give Juan any suggestions on how to provide better service because the types of people he takes out to fish are as varied as the
people who visit Baja. I'm sure some have never held a rod in their life and need to have everything done for them. Others insist they know
everything and demand to employ all of their skills they have honed through years of stream fishing for trout.
My personal desire is that I have hired a local expert that will share with me the current location of the fish and the most effective tactics that
are currently working. I also like to feel like we are fishing PARTNERS for the day whether on his boat or mine, and working together we can have a
great day on the water.
In Memory of E-57
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shari
Select Nomad
Posts: 13050
Registered: 3-10-2006
Location: bahia asuncion, baja sur
Member Is Offline
Mood: there is no reality except the one contained within us "Herman Hesse"
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well put Alan...local guides have the local knowledge of where to fish on what day at what tide/weather etc...and the good ones can respond to each
clients needs/desires/skill level etc. Lost lures are a real problem as they are super expensive to replace here and we really appreciate it when
folks bring them down. The partnership idea is right on....fishing buddies have a great trip.
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Skeet/Loreto
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4709
Registered: 9-2-2003
Member Is Offline
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After owning and Fishing from my Panga "The Patricia" for 27 years, I wonder after reading all the Posts, How did I catch all of those Thousands of
Fish!!
I can only find Fault with the Catch and Release> Do you Newbies not realise that each Fish kept in the Panga and given to Him results in Food for
his Family????
Capt. George, several years ago I tried to get you to buy a Panga{ Shoyers 22 FT. I would not trade my Panga for 10 of your Duskys. It is too Short
for the Waters, no wonder you have Back Problems!!.
For anyone who wants a Good Pangero try Alvaro Murillo in Loreto. I have fished with him for 35 years, never with a Deep Finder or GPS. Caught more
Fish than most of you will every seeor find with all those Fancy Machines and Lures!!
Have a Good Day!
"Mosco" Casa of Mucho Mujeres==Loreto
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Capt. George
Super Nomad
Posts: 2129
Registered: 8-21-2003
Member Is Offline
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Skeet
During my short stay in Loreto the Murillo Brothers were "stunned" by the performance of the "Dusky"...
Back issues were introduced mostly by jumping out windows and falling down stairs back in the day fighting fires (and people) in the South Bronx.
Panga? for me?, not even for free........
Hope you are well, we are in St James City Florida, back to Abreojos in July.
adios amigo..................................
\"The penalty good men pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men\" Plato
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Don Alley
Super Nomad
Posts: 1997
Registered: 12-4-2003
Location: Loreto
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Skeet/Loreto
After owning and Fishing from my Panga "The Patricia" for 27 years, I wonder after reading all the Posts, How did I catch all of those Thousands of
Fish!!
I can only find Fault with the Catch and Release> Do you Newbies not realise that each Fish kept in the Panga and given to Him results in Food for
his Family????
Capt. George, several years ago I tried to get you to buy a Panga{ Shoyers 22 FT. I would not trade my Panga for 10 of your Duskys. It is too Short
for the Waters, no wonder you have Back Problems!!.
For anyone who wants a Good Pangero try Alvaro Murillo in Loreto. I have fished with him for 35 years, never with a Deep Finder or GPS. Caught more
Fish than most of you will every seeor find with all those Fancy Machines and Lures!!
Have a Good Day!
"Mosco" Casa of Mucho Mujeres==Loreto |
I know Alvaro, and he's not bringing in many fish these days.
Too many fish on too many tables over the years, not enough left in the sea to grow and breed. Something you oldtimers didn't realize.
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Santiago
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3533
Registered: 8-27-2003
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Don Alley
Too many fish on too many tables over the years, not enough left in the sea to grow and breed. Something you oldtimers didn't realize.
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Thanks Don for saying it - I was going to but figured why waste the electrons.
Honestly, if I never kill another fish in my life I will never equal the balance from the 1000s of fish my father killed. The only thing he ever
threw back were suckers and grunts - and he fished every day until he got his limit. I love the man and he's been dead these 10 years but jesus -
couldn't he and his buddies have throttled it back a bit?
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Skipjack Joe
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8088
Registered: 7-12-2004
Location: Bahia Asuncion
Member Is Offline
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For most people around the world a fish isn't considered 'caught' unless it's killed. And since the object is to 'catch' fish, releasing one is a
waste of time. It doesn't accomplish the objective of a fishing trip. I've seen 5 inch fish kept for no good reason at all. It gets to the essence of
why people fish. Food is way down on the list of reasons. Look at those hero shots of guys on bloody decks for some ideas.
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pascuale
Nomad
Posts: 224
Registered: 2-20-2005
Location: Somewhere South
Member Is Offline
Mood: Lets fish!
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Skeet/Loreto
After owning and Fishing from my Panga "The Patricia" for 27 years, I wonder after reading all the Posts, How did I catch all of those Thousands of
Fish!!
I can only find Fault with the Catch and Release> Do you Newbies not realise that each Fish kept in the Panga and given to Him results in Food for
his Family????
Capt. George, several years ago I tried to get you to buy a Panga{ Shoyers 22 FT. I would not trade my Panga for 10 of your Duskys. It is too Short
for the Waters, no wonder you have Back Problems!!.
For anyone who wants a Good Pangero try Alvaro Murillo in Loreto. I have fished with him for 35 years, never with a Deep Finder or GPS. Caught more
Fish than most of you will every seeor find with all those Fancy Machines and Lures!!
Have a Good Day!
"Mosco" Casa of Mucho Mujeres==Loreto |
Doubt it old timer. the reason old people are so grumpy is because all they do is whine about "the way it used to be". You used to catch fish because
there were fish, and since you "caught more than we'll ever see", theres not alot left. What a man! Thanks.
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gibson
Banned
Posts: 250
Registered: 2-6-2007
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Skeet/Loreto
After owning and Fishing from my Panga "The Patricia" for 27 years, I wonder after reading all the Posts, How did I catch all of those Thousands of
Fish!!
I can only find Fault with the Catch and Release> Do you Newbies not realise that each Fish kept in the Panga and given to Him results in Food for
his Family????
Capt. George, several years ago I tried to get you to buy a Panga{ Shoyers 22 FT. I would not trade my Panga for 10 of your Duskys. It is too Short
for the Waters, no wonder you have Back Problems!!.
For anyone who wants a Good Pangero try Alvaro Murillo in Loreto. I have fished with him for 35 years, never with a Deep Finder or GPS. Caught more
Fish than most of you will every seeor find with all those Fancy Machines and Lures!!
Have a Good Day!
"Mosco" Casa of Mucho Mujeres==Loreto |
taking "silly old coot" to a whole new level
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DianaT
Select Nomad
Posts: 10020
Registered: 12-17-2004
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Skeet/Loreto
After owning and Fishing from my Panga "The Patricia" for 27 years, I wonder after reading all the Posts, How did I catch all of those Thousands of
Fish!!
I can only find Fault with the Catch and Release> Do you Newbies not realise that each Fish kept in the Panga and given to Him results in Food for
his Family????
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Some have been criticized for catching too many fish that they share with the guide and the people in small fishing villages. I can and do defend
that practice when appropriate.
On the other hand, if someone hires someone and pays them well to take them out fishing and what they prefer is "catch and release" so be it. They
are paying for a service, unless of course the panga operator insists that keeping fish is a part of the deal. 
Diane
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DENNIS
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 29510
Registered: 9-2-2006
Location: Punta Banda
Member Is Offline
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Catch and release would be like hunting deer with a tranquilizer gun. Why bother?
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Osprey
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3694
Registered: 5-23-2004
Location: Baja Ca. Sur
Member Is Offline
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I wouldn't be too harsh on us Old Timers -- try to remember how you got here, to this place where you can touch the keyboard -- I'll exempt all you
issues of parthenogenic generation.
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DianaT
Select Nomad
Posts: 10020
Registered: 12-17-2004
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by DENNIS
Catch and release would be like hunting deer with a tranquilizer gun. Why bother? |
Difficult to explain, but it is the only way I have trout fished for years and love it----then again, I could float down the Clark Fork or Blackfoot
in Montana all day, catch no fist, and still enjoy it-----well, not quite as much. 
Of course we are such hardcore fisher people that we went surf fishing near BA recently and once we spotted the neat tide pools---well
Diane
BTW---I like to hunt deer with a camera. 
[Edited on 3-27-2008 by jdtrotter]
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Pompano
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8194
Registered: 11-14-2004
Location: Bay of Conception and Up North
Member Is Offline
Mood: Optimistic
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The way some fishermen catch fish is by the tale.
I do what the voices in my tackle box tell me.
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DENNIS
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 29510
Registered: 9-2-2006
Location: Punta Banda
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Pompano
by the tale. |
Especially the really really big ones.
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Pescador
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3587
Registered: 10-17-2002
Location: Baja California Sur
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Osprey
Well, well, well. Seems there are several kinds of pangas. You were unaware perhaps? Very heavy ARCA Shroyer old 22s like mine won't hurt your back
in any kind of weather -- rather fish in mine than in any 34 ft cruiser in certain kinds of water. Mag bay crab pangas are true skiffs and will leave
you needing a laminectomy after only a few bay miles in a little chop. Todos Santos 24s are for 90HP, rounded and ready for rough seas and hard
landings but buck like the broncos they were modeled after. For every venue there is a style adapted over time by local fishermen. When you judge, be
careful what boat your butt is in before you blame them all. |
Osprey and Skeet are absolutely right. This Arca panga and the Lupe Diaz Super Panga are some of the best designed boats for the water on the Sea of
Cortez. It is a real shame that the Arca boats are no longer being made. The old molds have pretty much disintegrated and are in total disrepair in
La Paz. This was the best riding boat on the least amount of horsepower I have ever seen. When done up in a Center console or a side console there
simply was not a match.
The other day a guy said I have a boat that rides better than than, but he needs a 250 hp motor just to push his over built sled through the water.
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DENNIS
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 29510
Registered: 9-2-2006
Location: Punta Banda
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Pescador
The old molds have pretty much disintegrated and are in total disrepair in La Paz. |
Wonder why someone hasn't used an existing hull for a plug and made new molds off of it.
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Skipjack Joe
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8088
Registered: 7-12-2004
Location: Bahia Asuncion
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Pompano
The way some fishermen catch fish is by the tale. |
One of my earliest memories in life was trying to capture a tortoise who wanted no part it. My dad's advice: "sprinkle some salt on it's tail". I was
about 5 at the time and went home to get some. He had so much fun with that.
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pascuale
Nomad
Posts: 224
Registered: 2-20-2005
Location: Somewhere South
Member Is Offline
Mood: Lets fish!
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Osprey
I wouldn't be too harsh on us Old Timers -- try to remember how you got here, to this place where you can touch the keyboard -- I'll exempt all you
issues of parthenogenic generation. |
Glad I have a dad and i wasnt developed from an asexual fertilization. Anyways
I love old timers. That is where we learn things from, good and bad. How to catch fish good, how to kill em all so my kids dont have any, bad. Thank
you for your wisdom and knowledge. Thank you for all the great stories on this board. Thank you for the knowledge about Baja that has kept me out of
trouble and made me llve the place. I dont listen to Nirvana when I drive down 1, I listen to the Eagles man!
I hope you understand the ignorance of saying "Ive caught more fish than any of you will ever see". Thats just Stupid, young or old.
[Edited on 3-28-2008 by pascuale]
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Bajafun777
Super Nomad
Posts: 1103
Registered: 9-13-2006
Location: Rosarito & California
Member Is Offline
Mood: Enjoying Life with Wife In Mexico, Easy on The Easy
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Pascuale, I really doubt that Skeet fished all the fish out to where there are not as many left today. I think if you look out over the horizons from
the beach you will see the Ships from Japan dropping there nets and having no regard for any size fish or type of fish they pull in . Skeet is probably right in regards to his fishing experiences and his past
fun of the catch with friends which probably mades the catch just better to remember.
Never let the little things take your time up with firing back at someone that has a love or passion for something they have done all their life. I
had been a hunter for years, since the age of 6, with memories of so many dove and quail that you had to really had to be a poor shot not to get a few
when you went out hunting. So, in the past probably some things were better but that is just my opinion. Skeet and I will eventually meet up and we
will definately pop a cold one together. Hopefully, one day you and I will do the same Pascuale. "No Hurry No Worry Just Fun." Take care and may
your "lines" always get a tug for you to pull one in !!!!!
Later-------bajafun777
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